Old 07-08-2021, 10:53 AM   #1
ErBird
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Default Faking bass parts with ReaPitch

How does the bass sound? Would you know it was a guitar pitched down if I didn't say so?

I started doing this to prototype songs faster & now I like working this way so much I'm wondering if this bass part sounds OK enough as is to not re-record it.
I used my normal guitar chain including a 4x12 cab sim, but the low end doesn't feel to me like it's suffered.

Here are a couple parts I'm trying to make into a song:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Fpb...m9w0u1Pwp/view
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Old 07-09-2021, 01:17 PM   #2
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I'm not sure if I'd know there was anything different about the bass if you didn't mention it, and maybe it's just my imagination because I'm specifically listening for a problem, but the bass seems to lack a certain weight if that makes sense. I guess that's literally true because the strings on your guitar are lighter than bass guitar strings even though you've pitched the recording down. The sound seems a little cleaner than a bass to me, because the strings on a guitar are not as loose as the bass guitar strings. BUT, I might not be thinking any of these things if you hadn't mentioned it. I don't know. I suspect most casual listeners wouldn't have a clue how you recorded the bass.

I like the music. I also like how the bass dropped out then came back in. That's an effective way to keep things sounding fresh. When the bass comes back in, it sounds new. Classic technique. (I'd insert a thumbs up emoji here if I could)
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Old 07-09-2021, 04:21 PM   #3
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I used the octave shift a couple of times but ended up feeling like I could get a more convincing sound using Ample Bass P Lite.

http://www.amplesound.net/en/pro-pd.asp?id=19
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Old 07-09-2021, 06:35 PM   #4
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Seems ok but needs to come way up in the mix
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Old 07-09-2021, 06:50 PM   #5
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Thanks for all the input.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pbattersby View Post
the bass seems to lack a certain weight if that makes sense.
Yeah, the cab IR I'm using drops off fast below 80 kHz, so there's a def. lack of sub frequencies. Kind of nice to have them out of the way, actually.

I put pretty thick strings on this guitar (Strat) so that helps solidify the tone I think.

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I like the music. I also like how the bass dropped out then came back in.
Thank you. That was initially to compare with and without bass then I liked how it was working.
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Old 07-09-2021, 06:58 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fuzzball View Post
I used the octave shift a couple of times but ended up feeling like I could get a more convincing sound using Ample Bass P Lite.

http://www.amplesound.net/en/pro-pd.asp?id=19
How did you do the octave down? I tried a frequency divider which was, of course, awful for this purpose. Maybe there's something better than ReaPitch.

I've tried Ample Bass, but it always seems out of tune to me. And I don't like how it round-robins. Playing the same note repeatedly makes it obvious you're using samples.

I prefer 4Front Bass which doesn't even round-robin, though its fidelity is poor.

I even tried audio-to-MIDI, but it's not reliable.
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Old 07-09-2021, 07:01 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fergler View Post
Seems ok but needs to come way up in the mix
Interesting. Like just louder, or more present?


Here's the first part before and after pitching, if anyone is interested.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1JN9...q6JEfRMRg/view
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Old 07-09-2021, 08:03 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErBird View Post
How did you do the octave down?
I just used JS: Pitch an Octave Down. The guitar was a Taylor 317e using the internal pickup. Strings are Martin light 12's.

As I recall I wasn't happy with the sound, though it's been a long time and I'm not really sure what it was exactly that I didn't like.
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Old 07-10-2021, 04:19 AM   #9
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Great how you preserve the pick sound. I had big problem with that and had to use soft finger picking in this song https://soundcloud.com/mikaelsundh/unfrozen
But that another kind of bass.
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Old 07-11-2021, 01:29 AM   #10
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On my laptop I cant even detect an actual bass part.

Having used Ample, I would agree that with the right phrasing it would give you a more believable sound.
In any case, the biggest issue for ANYone trying to integrate a good solid bass part with a distorted/overdriven guitar sound is that.
The distortion creates such a wide frequency wash of sound across everything that even a real bass part tends to get buried behind the guitar. Try pulling back the overdrive & see if the bass comes through better.
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Old 07-11-2021, 09:45 AM   #11
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Try waves Submarine. If you don’t have it, link a short 10 second section of the guitar piece on Google drive if One drive or Dropbox and I can test that plugin for you for this application. I wanna say it was like $29 on sale and actually synthesizes 1 or 2 lower octaves. Sounds surprisingly musical for deep stuff, especially if you are generating subwoofer frequencies from an actual bass guitar. Never tried it for your application but might be interesting to try it since it’s recreating frequencies vs pitch shifting them…
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Old 07-11-2021, 10:42 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abraham Liftin' View Post
I think even the cheapest bass will get you better results than all the dumbfuckery you have to go through just to make a guitar "almost" sound like a bass.
I agree. I only use a real bass nowadays, but it was fun doing it.
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Old 07-12-2021, 12:07 AM   #13
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@ErBird: Shame you live in LA.

I have a very playable, good-sounding el-cheapo full scale bass guitar lying around that you could have for $40, but the postage on top would make it way too expensive!
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Old 07-12-2021, 10:00 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
@ErBird: Shame you live in LA.

I have a very playable, good-sounding el-cheapo full scale bass guitar lying around that you could have for $40, but the postage on top would make it way too expensive!
heheh the musician's version of a nah nah-nah nah-nah post
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Old 07-13-2021, 06:30 AM   #15
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Sounds OK when everything is playing but struggles in other contexts where the bass needs to be more prominent - near the end. I believe you can make it work eventually.
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Old 07-16-2021, 01:49 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynx_TWO View Post
heheh the musician's version of a nah nah-nah nah-nah post
Not really - I honestly meant it was a shame he lived so far away.
My brother`s family still live in Florida & I am only too aware of what a pain it is to be so far away from each other.
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Old 07-17-2021, 12:40 AM   #17
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No substitute for a real bass have I come across
Tons of cheaper old reliable basses around second third or fourth.
Save and buy one.
A bass is very important for most European music, throb is what it is and gives music a foundation can also be a lead if needed. Either this or get a Tuba... I just threw that in.
Drive drive drive drive drive.

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Old 07-26-2021, 01:06 PM   #18
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Sry all for the delay in responding.

Quote:
Originally Posted by msundh View Post
Great how you preserve the pick sound.
I didn't do anything but pick firmly and use some compression. Must be a good algorithm in ReaPitch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by msundh View Post
I had big problem with that and had to use soft finger picking in this song https://soundcloud.com/mikaelsundh/unfrozen
But that another kind of bass.
Thanks for posting this. The bass sounds pretty passable. Nice guitar work!

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But that another kind of bass.
You mean the style of playing?
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Old 07-26-2021, 01:08 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abraham Liftin' View Post
I think even the cheapest bass will get you better results than all the dumbfuckery you have to go through just to make a guitar "almost" sound like a bass.
Ok. I'll work toward getting a bass, but this does make getting ideas out faster. "Dumbfuckery" is a little extreme. It's basically just ReaPitch.
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Old 07-26-2021, 01:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
On my laptop I cant even detect an actual bass part.
Would you generally expect to hear the bass part through laptop speakers, though?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Having used Ample, I would agree that with the right phrasing it would give you a more believable sound.
My problem with MIDI bass is the lack of, or difficulty in producing, slides and other "style" in the playing. It's hard to create movement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Try pulling back the overdrive & see if the bass comes through better.
That's something I'm unwilling to do . I'm ok with the bass being buried at times. If it was featured, I'd be more worried about the tone, but right now I'm just trying to provide some low end the guitar's can't.
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Old 07-26-2021, 01:20 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
@ErBird: Shame you live in LA.
Yes. A shame in many ways (other than how you mean it).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
I have a very playable, good-sounding el-cheapo full scale bass guitar lying around that you could have for $40, but the postage on top would make it way too expensive!
That's nice of you. I'm looking at a cheap Squier bass, but I wish they had just a straight P, no bridge pickup. Since you're the bass guy around here, what does the bridge pickup offer to the tone that it's worth the added noise?
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Old 07-26-2021, 01:33 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinder View Post
Either this or get a Tuba
You may be onto something. But what about singing while playing? There has to be a way.
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Old 07-26-2021, 05:39 PM   #23
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Ha Ha very good Fab good humour nothing like it...
Ventriloquism did come to mind!

All jokes aside though get yourself a bass it will
really set you up and you will wonder why you did not have one before!

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Old 07-26-2021, 06:23 PM   #24
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When I didnt have a bass, or a vsti good enough, and also just for shits and giggles, the best results I got was an acoustic guitar, with a plate mic (I dont think this is the right word, its a mic literally attached to a flat metal square plate, Tandy used to sell em, they were great, a bit like a contact mic) placed inside the guitar, and pitched down an octave or two.

It genuinely sounded great. Like a real bass? Maybe not, and it would totally depend on the song its in, but I loved the sound of it. Very plucky, and defined.

And a fun experiment.
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Old 07-27-2021, 12:49 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErBird View Post
Since you're the bass guy around here, what does the bridge pickup offer to the tone that it's worth the added noise?
On my Frankenbass, I have a set of the earliest EMG active P/J pickups. I have never used the bridge pickup on its own, but when used with the neck one, it does add a nice Strat-y "dink" to the bass`s tone without losing the bottom end.
Also, I found that with the two single-coil pickups (P and J) it does eliminate any single coil noise. An added bonus. Although my 62 reissue P Bass is super quiet,so maybe the two halves of a P bass pickup are reverse wound? Who knows....
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Old 07-29-2021, 01:28 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
On my Frankenbass, I have a set of the earliest EMG active P/J pickups. I have never used the bridge pickup on its own, but when used with the neck one, it does add a nice Strat-y "dink" to the bass`s tone without losing the bottom end.
Also, I found that with the two single-coil pickups (P and J) it does eliminate any single coil noise. An added bonus. Although my 62 reissue P Bass is super quiet,so maybe the two halves of a P bass pickup are reverse wound? Who knows....
I assumed the point of the split-coil was to make it humbucking, but never looked into it.

I went to GC and tried a PJ. The bridge pickup did add more noise without, for me, a tonal benefit. So I'll stick with the simple elegance of a P bass. Until then, detuned Strat it is.
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Old 07-29-2021, 02:13 PM   #27
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A p Bass is just awesome I have a jazz bass and an aria I had to get a P bass in the end and boy that sound.
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Old 07-30-2021, 04:33 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErBird View Post
I assumed the point of the split-coil was to make it humbucking, but never looked into it.

I went to GC and tried a PJ..
What brand & model was it? Did the P pickup sound good on its own, like it should?
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