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Old 03-26-2023, 02:33 AM   #1
splitting_ears
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Default Option to add silence at the beginning of files in render window?

Hi,

I regularly render projects for various formats (digital, vinyl, ...).
For some of them (like cassette) it is required (according to the manufacturer's specs) to add at least 1s of silence at the beginning of each side to ensure proper reproduction.
My workaround so far has been to move media items, markers and regions to export a different file, but this is prone to user error and also a bit tedious.

My reasoning is that since we already have an option in the render window to add silence at the end (tail), could it make sense to have the opposite?
Maybe it could also help with DDP exports, which require 2 seconds of silence at the beginning?

As this idea comes from a very specific background, I'd like to know if it would help other people with different use cases.

Thanks for your attention!
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Old 03-26-2023, 08:18 AM   #2
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workaround:
Insert a Delay plugin to MASTER track,
set it for example to 300ms and add this 300ms also to your render tail settings... (to compensate the difference).


..there are other similar threads, where you can also read e.g. why using negative start time may not be the final solution as it does not take in account any sound generators or midi step sequencers which are not part of timeline (they are playing continuously even in negative time line part...), etc.:
- Rendering: A few milliseconds silence before the track starts - Possible?
- intro tail?
- Adding custom leading silence to rendered items

Last edited by akademie; 03-26-2023 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 03-26-2023, 10:00 AM   #3
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Thanks, I didn't know about negative start times! Although in my case, delay would work for the A side, but not for the B side as it would include audio from the previous track...
Here's an example of what I mean by that:

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Old 03-26-2023, 10:39 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitting_ears View Post
Thanks, I didn't know about negative start times! Although in my case, delay would work for the A side, but not for the B side as it would include audio from the previous track...
Here's an example of what I mean by that:

Just separate them a bit.
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Old 03-26-2023, 10:55 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlprod View Post
Just separate them a bit.
I had already thought of this, but I want to keep the timings consistent when exporting tracks separately via markers too in the same project. Adding an extra second between tracks 5 and 6 would work with regions, but not when rendering each track separately.
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Old 03-26-2023, 11:16 AM   #6
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I'd reverse them and use tail, then import and reverse back
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Old 03-26-2023, 12:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fergler View Post
I'd reverse them and use tail, then import and reverse back
Interesting idea! Unfortunately it doesn't help in my case as I want to avoid opening projects and files multiple times.
I simply would like to be able to export multiple formats (individual tracks via markers + sides via regions) from the same project.

If a 'leading silence' option were added to the render dialogue window (like tail already is), I could simply save a render preset for cassette exports with it, and be done very quickly without moving anything on the timeline. Surely I'm not the only one who would benefit from this?
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Old 03-26-2023, 07:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitting_ears View Post
Thanks, I didn't know about negative start times! Although in my case, delay would work for the A side, but not for the B side as it would include audio from the previous track...
Here's an example of what I mean by that:
<image removed>
The "Master track Delay" workaround is pretty bulletproof.
It works like a charm (except you have to unbypass the Delay JSFX/VST before rendering and bypass after, plus correctly extend Tail value. Other than that it is perfect.

I tried it now (just to be sure) with kind of your scenario:
3 tracks (no silence on start or end of items) one after another with blank spaces (1 second and 0.5 second), created regions for each item (= 3 regions).
Added ReaDelay on Master track, set its Dry slider to -inf, Delay length (musical) = 0, Delay length (time) = 5000.0 ms.

Rendered as 3 regions (all project regions), Tail = 6000ms.

After render I got 3 wav files, each with 5 seconds silence at the beginning and 1 second silence at the end of the files as expected (Tail 6000 - 5000 = 1000 . No other audio from pre or post the correct region rendered into it.

Try it for yourself.
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:25 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akademie View Post
The "Master track Delay" workaround is pretty bulletproof.
It works like a charm (except you have to unbypass the Delay JSFX/VST before rendering and bypass after, plus correctly extend Tail value. Other than that it is perfect.

Try it for yourself.
Thanks for your help. Your solution does indeed work as demonstrated, but then any cue markers I want to embed won't be in sync with the audio.
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:46 AM   #10
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Quote:
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Thanks for your help. Your solution does indeed work as demonstrated, but then any cue markers I want to embed won't be in sync with the audio.
Well as what you are asking for isn't possible you need to adjust your workflow to do it. For example using regions for songs as well as sides.
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:20 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlprod View Post
Well as what you are asking for isn't possible you need to adjust your workflow to do it. For example using regions for songs as well as sides.
But that's why I'm posting a feature request, as I thought some more users than just me might benefit from this option

Using more regions might do the trick, but I still need to figure out the least convoluted way to render, say, two sides for cassette with 1s of leading silence with cue markers, two other normal sides for vinyl with cue markers too, separate digital tracks, plus maybe a DDP for CD. And then keep the metadata consistent between exports...
So far I've managed this with many different workarounds, but it takes quite a bit of time and none of my solutions are sufficiently immune to user error. But that is a very different conversation, I suppose.
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Old 03-27-2023, 01:20 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitting_ears View Post
But that's why I'm posting a feature request, as I thought some more users than just me might benefit from this option

Using more regions might do the trick, but I still need to figure out the least convoluted way to render, say, two sides for cassette with 1s of leading silence with cue markers, two other normal sides for vinyl with cue markers too, separate digital tracks, plus maybe a DDP for CD. And then keep the metadata consistent between exports...
So far I've managed this with many different workarounds, but it takes quite a bit of time and none of my solutions are sufficiently immune to user error. But that is a very different conversation, I suppose.
Fair enough about the FR.
I'd start with regions, meta data wildcards and even scripts. It is very much doable with a thoughtout workflow.
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