Old 04-29-2015, 07:55 PM   #41
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+1

ANY DAW in the world can handle MIDI better than Reaper. It's so dilettante and ignorant that the devs do not fix such basics

Makes me angry
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Old 04-30-2015, 03:45 PM   #42
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All that needs to happen is for you to describe the problem that you have, and the developers can fix it. These guys are no dummies. If you can't describe the problem exactly so it is reproducible, then how can the coders tweak the code and fix it? It's really that simple.
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Old 04-30-2015, 06:18 PM   #43
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All that needs to happen is for you to describe the problem that you have, and the developers can fix it. These guys are no dummies. If you can't describe the problem exactly so it is reproducible, then how can the coders tweak the code and fix it? It's really that simple.
Unfortunately it isn't quite that simple. I have reported similar issues quite a long time ago (see All-notes-off MIDI command sent regardless of preference), the devs are obviously aware of them (since Justin responded to the bug report), but we're still waiting for a fix.
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Old 05-02-2015, 06:00 AM   #44
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Unfortunately it isn't quite that simple. I have reported similar issues quite a long time ago (see All-notes-off MIDI command sent regardless of preference), the devs are obviously aware of them (since Justin responded to the bug report), but we're still waiting for a fix.
I see your point, but to be fair I'm sure Justin knows how to fix it. I guess there is a queue of things to do that's all. TBH, I would rather have loads of new features than fix the old nagging problems. Some problems are so old that they will just get phased out when everybody starts using Midi 3.0 I guess.
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Old 05-02-2015, 06:11 AM   #45
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... Midi 3.0 ...
and that should be what? no findings on the internet for this. and how ould a new standard (backwards-compatile of course) fix issues in the software that implements it?

sorry, but that is blowing hot air that leads to nothing ...
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Old 05-02-2015, 07:28 AM   #46
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and that should be what? no findings on the internet for this. and how ould a new standard (backwards-compatile of course) fix issues in the software that implements it?

sorry, but that is blowing hot air that leads to nothing ...

"HD-MIDI"

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIDI#The_future_of_MIDI
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Old 05-02-2015, 08:04 AM   #47
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Yes of course the new protocol maybe 2045:
http://www.midi.org/aboutus/news/hd.php

but that thing has really nothing to do
that REAPERs chase routine is wrong.
REAPER never stop to chase for an event, if there is already one at exact the play/edit cursor position..

The result is:
if there is one event at the loop or playback start position; REAPER send double messages at the same time.
The wrong chase event before and the correct event at the play/edit start position.

And for REAPER all used events has a value of 0 at timeline start.
So it also can result in an: for example loop/play start 2.0.00; Portamento Event at 2.0.00
1: B0 05 00 [CC5 Portamento MSB] chan 1 val 0
2: B0 05 6A [CC5 Portamento MSB] chan 1 val 106

Value of 0 and a value of 106 at the same time for the same event...

Or maybe one chased value before 2.0.00 or whatever (if there is one)
example Porta ch1 at 1.1.00 with a value of 78 and the correct value at the same time.
example play Position 2.0.00
1: B0 05 4E [CC5 Portamento MSB] chan 1 val 78
2: B0 05 61 [CC5 Portamento MSB] chan 1 val 97

And double messages for the same event can be a problem and is of course a bug.....
that should be normally easy to fix.
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Old 05-02-2015, 08:30 AM   #48
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HD MIDI is the HalfLife3 of the DAW world
Even if it surprisingly came into existence within our or our grandchildren's lifespan, HD MIDI would not magically "phase out" any of Reaper's reset spam issues. Rather gives room for even more of them.
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Old 05-02-2015, 09:08 AM   #49
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This bug is known for years, in fact it is one of the oldest reaper bugs...
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Old 05-02-2015, 09:16 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by reapercurious View Post
All that needs to happen is for you to describe the problem that you have, and the developers can fix it. These guys are no dummies. If you can't describe the problem exactly so it is reproducible, then how can the coders tweak the code and fix it? It's really that simple.
Never ever in this World or another ....
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Old 05-02-2015, 09:37 AM   #51
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TBH, I would rather have loads of new features than fix the old nagging problems.
I couldn't disagree more.
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Some problems are so old that they will just get phased out when everybody starts using Midi 3.0 I guess.
You sound quite naive about how standards work. In a world where everybody speaks the same language, uses Linux and Dvorak keyboards, sure, I could wait for MIDI 3.0. In this world, though, many people and software/hardware will still be using plain old MIDI for quite a while.

And as long as REAPER doesn't handle MIDI properly, with these obvious issues getting so old, it's my use of REAPER rather than MIDI that will just get phased out.
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Old 05-02-2015, 05:24 PM   #52
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In fact MIDI is much more than the old MIDI communication protocol seems to be, today!
MIDI is the only realtime language to speak with all Soft- and Hardware Instruments.
That´s the fact, or does anybody know only one DAW or any other software
that speak/use an other language to trigger notes etc.pp. from for example items to a synth or whatever?

Of course there is OSC but..... did you ever create OSC messages in an piano roll or event list?

The only problem that MIDI today has, is the old 5-POL serial interface speed at fixed 31250Baud for all older Hardware...and also newer. That´s all.
For me, MIDI HD should/must have the option/specs to set different speeds for IN/OUT/THRU interfaces. So old hardware can communicate with compatible 31k and newer with much more of that speed without to overflow..

So for really every DAW, fixing important MIDI bugs/faults should have first prio! Otherwise it´s not a DAW it´s only an -derogatory remark- "Sample Baukasten".
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Old 05-04-2015, 10:51 AM   #53
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Dave Smith, the creator of MIDI really is the one to ask how to fix this problem. If he were a Reaper user I bet he would sort Mr. Justin out real fast.

Edit: I also think that speculation would be the best way for us grass roots types to approach things. My intuition tells me that there are 2 lines of code telling Reaper to do the same thing, and if they take one of those redundant lines out, MIDI will have more bugs. The only problem is that it will require simply too much time to delve deeper and find out why MIDI 'sort of works' right now, and this is because of the very problem itself. And once that very problem is discovered, then it can easily be fixed due to it being known concisely. If everyone speculates the way I just did, we will have things all hashed out and debugged in a jiffy.
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Old 05-04-2015, 04:33 PM   #54
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Midi in reaper was obviously a hack. No we suffer from that not being "designed" as properly as audio.

But we have to be aware that users of external midi are a minority amongst the reaper users. While some people are fighting hard to tweak two or three msec out of the midi clock, a vastly bigger group of reaper users is trying to find out how they get reaper running on a tiny laptop with or without asio4all. These are two worlds, and reaper will have to support both.

About midi 3.0 . As long as midi is mostly implemented on USB devices, a first step would be to have the current version aka the basics running except reaching out for new features. Sometimes this reminds me of lotus notes, the mail program which could do anything but mail.
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Old 05-04-2015, 04:49 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reapercurious View Post
Dave Smith, the creator of MIDI really is the one to ask how to fix this problem. If he were a Reaper user I bet he would sort Mr. Justin out real fast.

Edit: I also think that speculation would be the best way for us grass roots types to approach things. My intuition tells me that there are 2 lines of code telling Reaper to do the same thing, and if they take one of those redundant lines out, MIDI will have more bugs. The only problem is that it will require simply too much time to delve deeper and find out why MIDI 'sort of works' right now, and this is because of the very problem itself. And once that very problem is discovered, then it can easily be fixed due to it being known concisely. If everyone speculates the way I just did, we will have things all hashed out and debugged in a jiffy.
We don't need Dave Smith to tell Cockos how MIDI should be used - the specs are sufficiently clear, and the rest really is a matter of common sense (which is exactly why the rest of the world got all this stuff right decades ago). We simply need Cockos to care about it enough to make some changes to REAPER's code.

And our speculations about that code aren't going to help - only actual coding will, and none of us can do that - only Cockos can.
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Old 05-04-2015, 05:14 PM   #56
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But we have to be aware that users of external midi are a minority amongst the reaper users.
Fwiw: these problems also affect users without any external MIDI - since MIDI is used with most if not all instrument (and many effect) plug-ins, too.

But indeed, users who care about a decent MIDI implementation are very likely a small minority. And perhaps even a shrinking number in absolute terms - since there are plenty applications that do a better job in this respect, they might just leave REAPER for what it is (and is not) and move on.
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About midi 3.0 . As long as midi is mostly implemented on USB devices [...]
There are still millions of MIDI devices out there that don't use USB at all. And I'd bet you a beer that MIDI 1.0 will still be used when hardly anybody uses USB anymore.
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Old 05-04-2015, 05:40 PM   #57
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There are still millions of MIDI devices out there that don't use USB at all. And I'd bet you a beer that MIDI 1.0 will still be used when hardly anybody uses USB anymore.
I was on PC/Mac as sequencer, you are right, next time when I am in Amsterdam I will pay the beer ...
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Old 05-05-2015, 06:56 AM   #58
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We don't need Dave Smith to tell Cockos how MIDI should be used - the specs are sufficiently clear, and the rest really is a matter of common sense (which is exactly why the rest of the world got all this stuff right decades ago). We simply need Cockos to care about it enough to make some changes to REAPER's code.

And our speculations about that code aren't going to help - only actual coding will, and none of us can do that - only Cockos can.
I think getting Reaper 5 is fiscally more important. It's probably fixed in one of the secret builds. It's simply an added value to those who will need to upgrade their license. It really is Reaper's business I agree.
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Old 04-17-2016, 10:42 AM   #59
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Well, I'm currently using the last v4 Reaper 4.78 and the bug is still here. I just recently decided to revert to a whole hardware setup and this bug is ruining my whole MIDI hardware "scheme". Aside from still being very annoyed by not having true mono audio tracks and I have to fiddle with the pins unnecessarily losing time and creativity in the process.

I will test the newest Reaper v5 and if the bug is still there I'm changing my DAW for the one that works with my setup properly. I don't use neither score edit, nor video. New, and for me unnecessary features keep coming, but the old and very irritating bugs are piling up never to be resolved. And I was just considering renewing my Reaper license for v5. Good that I haven't done it yet. I somehow think it won't happen and I'll just stay with v4.78 and use it... for something.

I feel really sad and angry because I've been with Reaper since 2007... left Cubase for it.
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Old 04-17-2016, 10:49 AM   #60
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Should be all fine in v5.
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Old 04-17-2016, 11:00 AM   #61
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IT WORKS! This is really really important to me. A game changer. What a relief that it works! Smiling from ear to ear! I'm trying to recreate the workflow of a hardware sequencer in Reaper and this bug was ruining the whole experience. I mean, I'm trying to work with Reaper without using a mouse at all for MIDI tracking.

I'm sorry for being so sceptical before but I thought this bug had just been put aside like many other remaining and quite annoying bugs in Reaper.
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Last edited by DuX; 04-17-2016 at 03:00 PM. Reason: grandmar ;)
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