Old 03-08-2019, 02:06 AM   #1
Zerododo
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Default Tricky cymbal recording/triggering idea

Hi everybody!

i need some ideas or suggestion to realize a strange idea i have...

i have a low volume cymbals kit (L80 by Zildjan) that i use to practice in apartament.

i would like to transform their sound in real cymbals sound, using samples.

my idea is to use a microphone to capture the sound (i don't use midi triggers) and then replace it with ezdrummer, superior dummer or similar.

generate a midi note from audio is not a problem, reagate is perfect for this purpose, setting it properly i'll have a midi note for every cymbal hit.

My problem is to generate a different midi note if i play the cymbal or the bell of the cymbal.

do you think there is a way to teach to reaper the difference between these 2 sound and generate 2 different midi notes? the frequencies are slightly different, but i think not enough...

any ideas?

thanx!
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Old 03-08-2019, 02:22 AM   #2
foxAsteria
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I don't think it would be possible. There's so little difference in the sound between the two and a cymbal moves too much for 2 mics to work. I think your best bet would be to perform your sample hits manually with a MIDI keyboard or pad.

I'm curious about how you manage to quiet your kick enough to play in an apartment though. Cymbals don't travel through walls and floors nearly as much as a kick.
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Old 03-19-2019, 04:27 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria View Post

I'm curious about how you manage to quiet your kick enough to play in an apartment though. Cymbals don't travel through walls and floors nearly as much as a kick.
i've built a 2 layers floating wooden Platform and put a carpet on it and then drums on it. Vibrations are pretty absent.
Drums has mesh heads as well, so no noise from heads.
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Old 03-20-2019, 05:12 PM   #4
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If you have enough line inputs on your audio device, you could make up some diy piezo triggers pretty easily.

There are some plugins for converting audio to MIDI.
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Old 03-20-2019, 05:49 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zerododo View Post
i've built a 2 layers floating wooden Platform and put a carpet on it and then drums on it. Vibrations are pretty absent.
Drums has mesh heads as well, so no noise from heads.
I want to do a similar thing soon (normal drum heads and cymbals), to minimize drum volume on the floor below the attic. If you have some tips, I'd like to hear them, thx. Thinking to build a riser with some layers of MLV and towels.
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Old 05-24-2019, 10:00 AM   #6
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I've thought about this kind of thing with the concept of a "poor man's drum trigger". The idea is to hit different objects which each have their own tonal character, which can be EQed using high-pass and low-pass filters before going into ReaGate.

I haven't tested it, but the same idea may work with a single cymbal. The bell probably has a higher pitch than the middle of the cymbal, and the edge a warmer sound than those.

I bet some nuanced EQ settings could get you unique signals to feed into ReaGate and treat them as separate sound sources for converting to MIDI output.

Sorry for the half-baked summary. I'm sleepy and haven't thought too much about this. Good luck!
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Old 05-27-2019, 11:47 PM   #7
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[QUOTE=mikeroephonics;2138715]I haven't tested it, but the same idea may work with a single cymbal. The bell probably has a higher pitch than the middle of the cymbal, and the edge a warmer sound than those.

I bet some nuanced EQ settings could get you unique signals to feed into ReaGate and treat them as separate sound sources for converting to MIDI output.

QUOTE]

this was one of my original ideas, but it doesn't work as it should. the difference in pitch between edge and bell is not enough, and all the harmonics generated by the cymbal create a mess, even with ultra narrow eq curves. moreover, hitting the edge there is not a clear hit that software can recognize.
it works only if you hit the cymbals very hard and slow, but it is not a real scenario.
after a few month of research, my solution has been an used Yamaha dtx522. i don't use the pads (because mic triggering works well on my acoutsic drums) and i use cymbals only. they are very sensitive, 3 zone ride, choke… great solution
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