Some Help Diagnosing a BSOD

SabbathFan0220 · 09-05-2011, 07:31 PM

Hi everyone, this is my first post here. I'm having a problem with my computer crashing (BSOD) while using Reaper and I can't figure out what the problem is. I've been in touch with Reaper's email support about it and they recommended I come here for additional opinions. They seem to think the problem is with my hardware. I've also been in touch with the manufacturer of my computer, who thinks the problem is with the software (Reaper). I can't prove/disprove either at this point.

I've been using a PC to record/mix music through a USB 2.0 audio interface. The interface is a Tascam US-1800.

The crashes happen when I try to do more demanding tasks in Reaper, such as opening multiple projects at once or rendering tracks. The Windows crash report tells me that two things crash simultaneously each time: "ntoskrnl.exe" and the audio interface driver.

I've tried a few different things to fix this problem, none of which have helped at all...
I tried reinstalling the drivers.
I tried using a different audio interface altogether (I also tried an M-Audio Fast Track Pro)
I tried reinstalling Windows and Reaper.
I ran a test of the memory using Memtest86+, no errors were found.
I ran a test of the CPU using Prime95, no errors were found.
I tried upgrading my PC with a more powerful PSU.

My system is running Windows 7 x64 on an Intel Core i7 processor and 12GB RAM.

I'm new to Reaper, but I'm fairly tech savvy. Any help to point me in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. I can give more details about my hardware if needed. Thanks guys.

karbomusic · 09-05-2011, 07:35 PM

Do you have the complete crash report and which version of Reaper? 64bit 32bit or both?

duojet · 09-05-2011, 07:55 PM

I would try to check the disks and fix errors (chkdsk /f)

Then make sure you have the latest tascam drivers, and the latest motherboard bios and chipset drivers.

JGrabowMST · 09-05-2011, 08:14 PM

not to be nitpicky, but "chkdsk /r" would be better if you suspect a failing disk, or corrupt filesystem.

Are you using ASIO drivers? WDM? Kernel Streaming?

What specific file does the BSOD mention other than NTOSKRNL.exe?

Are your chipset drivers up to date, USB ports all functioning correctly? Try a different USB cable?

SabbathFan0220 · 09-06-2011, 11:21 AM

Thanks for the replies, I appreciate it. Hopefully we can get this problem sorted out. I'll answer one by one...

Quote:

Originally Posted by karbomusic

Do you have the complete crash report and which version of Reaper? 64bit 32bit or both?

I have the crash report, is there other information on it that would help decipher what's wrong? I've been using both the 64bit and 32bit versions of Reaper and have gotten crashes on both.

Quote:

Originally Posted by duojet

I would try to check the disks and fix errors (chkdsk /f)

Then make sure you have the latest tascam drivers, and the latest motherboard bios and chipset drivers.

I'm using the latest drivers, I reinstalled everything from scratch when I reinstalled Windows. How do you recommend I check the disks for errors?

Quote:

Originally Posted by JGrabowMST

not to be nitpicky, but "chkdsk /r" would be better if you suspect a failing disk, or corrupt filesystem.

Are you using ASIO drivers? WDM? Kernel Streaming?

What specific file does the BSOD mention other than NTOSKRNL.exe?

Are your chipset drivers up to date, USB ports all functioning correctly? Try a different USB cable?

I'm using ASIO drivers. Where do I look find out what file the BSOD mentions, the crash report? The chipset drivers are up to date. I've tried using a different USB port (they all seem to be working fine). I tried using a different interface altogether (and a different cable with it) and had the same crash happen.

JonD · 09-06-2011, 12:11 PM

Before you start troubleshooting every subsystem on your PC, I'd suggest first making sure there aren't any known issues/conflicts with the current Tascam drivers. Have you visited their user forums?

duojet · 09-06-2011, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

Thanks for the replies, I appreciate it. Hopefully we can get this problem sorted out. I'll answer one by one...

I have the crash report, is there other information on it that would help decipher what's wrong? I've been using both the 64bit and 32bit versions of Reaper and have gotten crashes on both.

I'm using the latest drivers, I reinstalled everything from scratch when I reinstalled Windows. How do you recommend I check the disks for errors?

I'm using ASIO drivers. Where do I look find out what file the BSOD mentions, the crash report? The chipset drivers are up to date. I've tried using a different USB port (they all seem to be working fine). I tried using a different interface altogether (and a different cable with it) and had the same crash happen.

Open a command prompt as administrator and type chkdsk /r

With regards to drivers, I meant the latest for your chipset. The ones windows installs as part of a new install are from 2009 when it was released. Also see if you can update the bios.

You have tried another interface, and tested the ram and cpu, so it's possibly a motherboard or disk issue.

n0rd · 09-06-2011, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonD

Before you start troubleshooting every subsystem on your PC, I'd suggest first making sure there aren't any known issues/conflicts with the current Tascam drivers. Have you visited their user forums?

^^^^ This

SabbathFan0220 · 09-07-2011, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonD

Before you start troubleshooting every subsystem on your PC, I'd suggest first making sure there aren't any known issues/conflicts with the current Tascam drivers. Have you visited their user forums?

No, I haven't, but doesn't the fact that the same crash has happened with two different interfaces remove the Tascam as a suspect?

SabbathFan0220 · 09-08-2011, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by duojet

Open a command prompt as administrator and type chkdsk /r

With regards to drivers, I meant the latest for your chipset. The ones windows installs as part of a new install are from 2009 when it was released. Also see if you can update the bios.

You have tried another interface, and tested the ram and cpu, so it's possibly a motherboard or disk issue.

Thanks for the suggestions.

I ran a check of the drive and it found no errors.

I recently reinstalled all the latest chipset drivers. There is one update available for the BIOS, but I've never updated a BIOS before...is this worth trying?

duojet · 09-09-2011, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

Thanks for the suggestions.

I ran a check of the drive and it found no errors.

I recently reinstalled all the latest chipset drivers. There is one update available for the BIOS, but I've never updated a BIOS before...is this worth trying?

I would, but be careful. follow the directions carefully. do it in dos, not windows. if you are not comfortable dont do it. You could render your pc unbootable if you screw it up.

search around for bsod issues related to your motherboard.

karbomusic · 09-09-2011, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

I have the crash report, is there other information on it that would help decipher what's wrong?

I don't know, I haven't seen the crash report.

rods · 09-10-2011, 04:39 AM

Hi, I had a problem similar to this a month ago but with Fireire. After lots of internet searching I solved the problem. I went from "hell" to "heaven" in a few hours.

I have an ASUS i7 Laptop with Fireface 800 with a "Texas Instruments chipset" Firewire adapter. I had constant random BSOD anb Windows Freezes. I use windows 7 64bit, Reaper and Samplitude.

What I did: I updated my bios (without any problem), I updated the Hard Drive "bios" too and some software related to the Hard Drive (this made a big difference I think), updated all the other drivers and changed the Firewire Driver mode (windows 7) to "legacy Driver".
I had the same problems with different Audio Interfaces. Both were used with firewire. I think I understand that you used both with USB, right?

I also installed the OS but I think this would not be necessary.

I used to have several BSOD with this computer when working with audio. After this I had one BSOD when installing some specific drivers/hardware. Just one. It never crashed again.

Hope this helps.
Rods

SabbathFan0220 · 09-10-2011, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by karbomusic

I don't know, I haven't seen the crash report.

Haha, fair enough. Is there a way to upload it here?

Rods, thanks for the suggestions. I think the only thing I haven't done on your list is updating the BIOS. I was afraid of doing it wrong and making things worse, but it looks like it might be the only thing left to do.

Fabian · 09-10-2011, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

Haha, fair enough. Is there a way to upload it here?

It is plain text, Just copy'n'paste

SabbathFan0220 · 09-10-2011, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fabian

It is plain text, Just copy'n'paste

Right...should've been able to crack that one myself. Here it is, you can see the two items crash simultaneously:

On Sun 8/28/2011 5:47:22 AM GMT your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\Windows\Minidump\082811-14820-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: ntoskrnl.exe (nt+0x7FD00)
Bugcheck code: 0x50 (0xFFFFFFFFEF3481F0, 0x0, 0xFFFFF80002EFB358, 0x2)
Error: PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA
file path: C:\Windows\system32\ntoskrnl.exe
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: NT Kernel & System
Bug check description: This indicates that invalid system memory has been referenced.
This appears to be a typical software driver bug and is not likely to be caused by a hardware problem.
The crash took place in the Windows kernel. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver which cannot be identified at this time.

On Sun 8/28/2011 5:47:22 AM GMT your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\Windows\memory.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: tus1800u.sys (tus1800u+0x36EA3)
Bugcheck code: 0x50 (0xFFFFFFFFEF3481F0, 0x0, 0xFFFFF80002EFB358, 0x2)
Error: PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA
file path: C:\Windows\system32\drivers\tus1800u.sys
product: TASCAM US-1800 Driver
company: TASCAM
description: TASCAM US-1800 Audio Driver
Bug check description: This indicates that invalid system memory has been referenced.
This appears to be a typical software driver bug and is not likely to be caused by a hardware problem.
A third party driver was identified as the probable root cause of this system error. It is suggested you look for an update for the following driver: tus1800u.sys (TASCAM US-1800 Audio Driver, TASCAM).
Google query: tus1800u.sys TASCAM PAGE_FAULT_IN_NONPAGED_AREA

Fabian · 09-11-2011, 02:53 AM

There's not much else to say about this than what it already says. It's your Tascam driver that crashes, and then takes the NT kernel down. Could be HW related but most probably it's the driver. Is there a newer version available (latest version is 2.02 http://tascam.com/product/us-1800/downloads/)? Have you checked the Tascam web site for solutions? Or maybe better look here http://tascamforums.com/.

In your OP you say that the same crash occurs with another audio interface. Does it give the same crash report? Most likely not. Tell us more about that, could be related or not...

Do these crashes happen even when you open the projects with all FX off-line? There's a switch on the Open Project dialog for that.

SabbathFan0220 · 09-11-2011, 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fabian

In your OP you say that the same crash occurs with another audio interface. Does it give the same crash report? Most likely not. Tell us more about that, could be related or not...

Thanks Fabian. When I use the other audio interface, the crash report looks the same but with the other interface's driver in the place of the Tascam. That's why I don't think the Tascam is really causing the issue, there must be a problem elsewhere. And yes, my Tascam drivers are up to date.

What do the FX have to do with this?

Fabian · 09-11-2011, 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

What do the FX have to do with this?

Well, very little probably, but you never know... some rouge FX may mess up memory so bad windows believes the crash happens in the driver. Not likely, still... worth a check.

But it is really strange that the same type of crash happens irrespective of what interface you use. Those are both USB interfaces, right? Could it be your USB? If you look into windows event viewer, are there any other issues that could be related?

SabbathFan0220 · 09-13-2011, 02:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fabian

Well, very little probably, but you never know... some rouge FX may mess up memory so bad windows believes the crash happens in the driver. Not likely, still... worth a check.

But it is really strange that the same type of crash happens irrespective of what interface you use. Those are both USB interfaces, right? Could it be your USB? If you look into windows event viewer, are there any other issues that could be related?

I'll test it without FX and let you know.

I was surprised to find that the same crash happened with a different interface as well. I actually bought the second interface because I was sure that was the problem. Both are USB. I updated the motherboard chipset drivers though, and I've never had any other USB related issues.

SabbathFan0220 · 09-14-2011, 03:03 PM

I don't see any way to open the project without FX. What's the Open Project dialog?

Ollie · 09-18-2011, 10:28 AM

Open REAPER with a new/empty project via the Start Menu, then load the project with the "recovery mode" checkbox (in the File-Open dialog) checked.

SabbathFan0220 · 11-06-2011, 07:19 PM

I've been back to troubleshooting this problem after giving up on it for a while, and I think I might be on to something. I took Fabian's suggestion and opened a bunch of projects with the plugins disabled. Even with 6 or 7 projects opened simultaneously, I was unable to get the computer to crash like before. Is there a way to narrow down which plugin is causing the BSOD?

Thanks guys.

Fabian · 11-07-2011, 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SabbathFan0220

I've been back to troubleshooting this problem after giving up on it for a while, and I think I might be on to something. I took Fabian's suggestion and opened a bunch of projects with the plugins disabled. Even with 6 or 7 projects opened simultaneously, I was unable to get the computer to crash like before. Is there a way to narrow down which plugin is causing the BSOD?

Thanks guys.

OK... so now comes the tedious process of enabling the plugins one by one and fiddling with the projects in-between to find the one that generates the crash. I guess there are some known suspects, so maybe if you list the plugins common to the projects that do crash, someone here may be able to help you out.

SabbathFan0220 · 11-07-2011, 10:22 PM

Thanks for keeping up with this, Fabian, I appreciate the help. Is there a quick way to enable/disable a plugin across all the tracks in a project, or do I have to go track-by-track and uncheck the box next to that plugin?

SabbathFan0220 · 11-16-2011, 05:26 AM

Anyone know how to enable/disable a plugin across all the tracks in a project?

Fabian · 11-16-2011, 08:21 AM

I don't know of any way to enable a plugin on several tracks at once. The mixer would seem to be the easiest way since there you can simply click and enable.

SabbathFan0220 · 12-27-2011, 02:08 AM

I disabled each VST one by one, track by track, and wasn't able to find the problem. I did find something new though...if I open the projects in 64-bit Reaper, the crashes don't happen. I've been using 32-bit Reaper because some of my plugins aren't 64-bit compatible. Could I be on the right track? Why would 32-bit cause a crash but 64-bit run smoothly?

ivansc · 12-27-2011, 03:23 AM

At a guess I would say one of the plugs that runs natively in 64bit version doesn't like running bridged into 32bit Reaper.

Seem to recall having a problem with this and one of my plugs, which went away when i uninstalled the 64bit version and ran 32 bit one instead.

And of course I am in the same oat as you in that I hae a couple of plugs that are still 32bit only that I like to run, so I stick to 32bit reaper in 64bit win7

Ollie · 12-27-2011, 07:15 AM

^^ What he said, maybe the chain of events was kicked off by hitting the per-process memory limits in 32-bit in first place. You mentioned demanding stuff like loading multiple projects in the OP so that's not unlikely. I don't know why that shoots off the audio driver at the end but that happens sometimes.

SabbathFan0220 · 12-30-2011, 03:06 AM

Huh...I guess when I find some 64x compatible plugins to replace the others I'll know for sure. Thanks guys.

antiClick · 01-02-2012, 04:32 AM

Faulty RAM uses to turn into BSOD crashes.

Try to google for ramtest

bluzkat · 01-02-2012, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antiClick

Faulty RAM uses to turn into BSOD crashes.

Try to google for ramtest

Windows7 has a built in RAM tester, you will find it in the 'Administrative tools' folder.