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Old 04-04-2020, 01:03 PM   #1
Peevy
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Default [SOLVED] Midi keyboards No longer work with Alsa on Window Managers

So I don't know what's caused this but none of my usb connected midi keybpards will work with Reaper While using Alsa. It seems to be fine with jack but the really weird thing is it seems to work fine within a desktop environment like Gnome & Xfce, but not i3wm or awesomeWM.

I couldn't tell you when this started happening because I've been mostly using my keyboards in Renoise lately & only mixing in Reaper. Alsa midi works fine in Renoise with i3wm & awesomewm. Is there any way to fix this as I prefer to work in tiling wm's than DE's??
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Old 04-04-2020, 02:28 PM   #2
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uhm there is something else going on here, I'm using a obscure WM myself. And I can't imagine how a WM could hinder detection of midi devices in programs.
Can you confirm they are enable in Reaper midi settings and lsusb is picking up your devices? also is Reaper the only running while this occure?
This just does not compute
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:25 PM   #3
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I know it's a strange one, ive been using i3wm for about a year now without any midi problems at all with alsa. Both midi keyboards are being picked up & enabled in settings & are working in gnome & xfce but no longer work in i3wm. The only thing ive done recently is install awesome which is a lua based wm. Jack is working fine with midi but I'd prefer to stick with alsa which is easier to configure within reapers settings.
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:31 PM   #4
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the only thing that strikes me is the devices are somehow busy.
Like with the audio device, which ever audio application i launch first, Reaper can't initialize inn/out util I quit and vice versa.
Any interesting output running Reaper from terminal?
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Old 04-05-2020, 01:56 AM   #5
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I was supposed to investigate further last night but we had a power outage in my area. I'll check it in a terminal shortly to see if there are any clues. it's also strange that my midi devices work fine in Renoise when run on the wm's, so it looks like it's also something to do with how Reaper handles midi input compared to renoise. I'm on manjaro which gets a lot of updates so something might have been updated lately that may have caused this when running in a wm.
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Old 04-05-2020, 07:59 AM   #6
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So I just checked in a terminal & here's what I'm getting: ALSA lib rawmidi_hw.c:235snd_rawmidi_hw_open) open /dev/snd/midiC3D0 failed: Device or resource busy.
So Definitely a connection problem that's only happening in Wm's & not DE's. I'll investigate further but If anyone has anything to add please do.
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Old 04-05-2020, 03:07 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biopsin View Post
the only thing that strikes me is the devices are somehow busy.
Like with the audio device, which ever audio application i launch first, Reaper can't initialize inn/out util I quit and vice versa.
Any interesting output running Reaper from terminal?

So I've done some further digging & it's definitely only happening when I run i3wm & awesomewm. Here's the output when I run amidi --dump -p hw:3,0,0

ALSA lib rawmidi_hw.c:235: (snd_rawmidi_hw_open) open /dev/snd/midiC3D0 failed: Device or resource busy
cannot open port "hw:3,0,0": Device or resource busy.

When I run that command on Gnome the midi device is available & producing output. But If I use awesomewm before running the Gnome DE then the problem persists until I restart the computer. I've even tried removing awesome & its dependencies but it didn't make a difference in i3wm. I'm at a loss to what could be causing this, I've done a lot of googling & can't find a solution. I've been using i3wm for ages without a problem (well only some freezing when using some win vsts with linvst but that's another story). I really don't want to have to abandon tiling wm's as I really do prefer working in them.
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Old 04-05-2020, 07:16 PM   #8
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Nice, at least some output. Might be Gnome loads the pulseaudio server on demand, so that's why it works. And since you are running several midikeyb one is blocking the other.
However how to further massage alsamidi with relevant tools; some hints might be here https://stackoverflow.com/questions/...pback-on-linux

I don't have pulseaudio/jack, but I use only one usb midicontroller for now.


~/Downloads $ aconnect -lio
client 0: 'System' [type=kernel]
0 'Timer '
1 'Announce '
client 14: 'Midi Through' [type=kernel]
0 'Midi Through Port-0'
client 24: 'VMini' [type=kernel,card=2]
0 'VMini MIDI 1 '
1 'VMini MIDI 2 '
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Old 04-05-2020, 11:44 PM   #9
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Thanks I'll check that out, i have a few other areas today with a fresh head. I normally only use one midi keyboard & was only testing the other one to make sure it wasn't a problem with my main keyboard.
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Old 04-08-2020, 07:06 AM   #10
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Maybe the lsof command can show you what process has the device open.
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Old 04-08-2020, 02:28 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Winter View Post
Maybe the lsof command can show you what process has the device open.
Thanks for chiming in Jack. I've tried the lsof command but I'm not getting any output, I've also tried the fuser command without any success. It's definitely a strange one because, I haven't had this problem before with i3wm, & cant tell whats running differently when using gnome or xfce.
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Old 04-11-2020, 03:19 PM   #12
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Okay latest update.
I haven't fixed things yet but I have been getting more used to the in's & outs of jack thanks to Cadence. And finally I can get simultaneous audio from firefox (pulseaudio) & Reaper. This may not feel like a big deal to some but now I can play along with backing tracks from youtube (I was able to do this on mac & logic without any configuration), among other things that jack can provide when it comes to integration from other apps. So I guess you could say a bit of a blessing in disguise.
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Old 04-13-2020, 10:21 PM   #13
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KVR User: sth - seems to have tracked down the issue, works for me on Manjaro KDE.

Try this in the Terminal

systemctl --user stop pipewire.socket
systemctl --user stop pipewire.service

Hope it was the same issue so you also are up & smiley'ing again.
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Old 04-14-2020, 02:29 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmajjL View Post
KVR User: sth - seems to have tracked down the issue, works for me on Manjaro KDE.

Try this in the Terminal

systemctl --user stop pipewire.socket
systemctl --user stop pipewire.service

Hope it was the same issue so you also are up & smiley'ing again.
THANKS!! You're a STAR! That did it. Something must have changed in an update that made this startup & affect WM's but not DE's. So I can now have the simplicity of alsa + the extra features of jack when needed BIG SMILES ALL ROUND. Although this problem did allow me to get more into jack lately & have the added bonus of being able to play along with backing tracks on youtube while running reaper simultaneously, don't think this is possible with alsa alone. I'm going to do something with running Renoise & Reaper together via Jack too.
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Old 04-14-2020, 03:31 AM   #15
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So I just made a small script that runs those commands at startup of i3WM & AwesomeWM & all seems to be good now. Thanks again SmajjL
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Old 04-15-2020, 02:05 AM   #16
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You - are - welcome!

For example, a new install of manjaro-kde-19.0.2-200311-linux54.iso works fine, it is after you do the update, so it was, not, our, fault/something we did per say.

I think we will need this user command for a while until they got that service sorted.

I am all ALSA of simple myself, but i'm also Jack2/Cadence-curious and want to try out all the native Linux stuff that i still have not, will finish setup my stuff to "perfection" first and then do a Timeshift and Then.. play/mess around with Jack & stuff, but not a second before a Timeshift LoL .

Good to see you smile again
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Old 04-15-2020, 03:48 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmajjL View Post
I am all ALSA of simple myself, but i'm also Jack2/Cadence-curious and want to try out all the native Linux stuff that i still have not, will finish setup my stuff to "perfection" first and then do a Timeshift and Then.. play/mess around with Jack & stuff, but not a second before a Timeshift LoL .

Good to see you smile again
Oh Definitely do a Timeshift, I do especially before a major update with Manjaro & it's saved the day once or twice for me especially when I've been doing something a bit more experimental.
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Old 05-09-2020, 07:41 PM   #18
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Looks like the latest update sorted out the pipewire issue on Manjaro KDE
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Old 05-10-2020, 02:27 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmajjL View Post
Looks like the latest update sorted out the pipewire issue on Manjaro KDE

Thanks for the heads up, I'll see if i can run midi without my script later
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Old 05-11-2020, 09:04 AM   #20
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What way/how are you doing this with pipewire as an example?
I think even i've seen a Widget that is a script based ON/OFF button, but my ReaSearch on this topic is thin.. lol
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Old 05-11-2020, 12:34 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmajjL View Post
What way/how are you doing this with pipewire as an example?
I think even i've seen a Widget that is a script based ON/OFF button, but my ReaSearch on this topic is thin.. lol
Well since I was running awesomewm I just set it up to auto run a simple script at startup:

Code:
#!/bin/sh

#This script is used to stop pipewire from hogging the midi connections

 systemctl --user stop pipewire.socket && systemctl --user stop pipewire.service
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Old 05-11-2020, 01:23 PM   #22
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That did it!

In my Manjaro KDE case, system settings > startup and shutdown > autostart > add script > test.sh with your magic, thank you!
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