What am I doing wrong?? - mic question

TTR · 12-13-2011, 04:28 PM

So here's the setup - my Dad and I are working on a punk song
together, using amps instead of direct in. It sounds awesome
in the room.

But we can't record it worth CRAP.

Here's the setup:

1. Behringer C1 - Phantom power good - mic in front of amps,
about 2 feet away with both amps fully in its pattern.
2. UX2 - great signal on the meters - peaking around -2 or so
3. Great signal in REAPER - all meters as they should be
4. No VSTs at all turned on - just one mic, input set to MONO.
5. Great looking waves....

Yet it just sounds DISTANT - like a million miles away. Like
mass phase cancellation, but with only ONE mic??? The recorded
track sounds like a "reverb return" with zero dry signal, yet
we're not using a reverb VST!

What could we possibly be doing wrong? Everything looks perfect....

Thanks for any input,

Jeremy

dea-man · 12-13-2011, 04:35 PM

Maybe since both amps are going into one mic, they are phase cancelling each other.

Try recording one amp and try various positions with the mic to see what happens.

Experiment, experiment, experiment.

DVDdoug · 12-13-2011, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Try recording one amp and try various positions with the mic to see what happens.

Right! Make sure the front side of the mic is pointed at the amps. I assume that's the side with the LED. You might have the wrong side or the end of the mic facing the amps. (It's a directional a "side address" mic.

)

Quote:

Maybe since both amps are going into one mic, they are phase cancelling each other.

Assmuming there is one guitar going to each amp, that can't happen since there is no phase correlation between the two sound sources. You'll only get phase cancellation if the same guitar/signal is going to both amps, and the amps are phased differently. (You can get "beating" if both guitars play the same note, and that is a phase-related phenomenon.)

TTR · 12-13-2011, 05:13 PM

Thanks for the replies... yes, we have the mic aimed correctly... also
tried a dynamic mic with the same result. The sound into the room of
the 2 amps is excellent - and as I mentioned in the OP, we have oodles
of good signal on all the relevant meters - from the interface to the
TCP and everywhere in between.

Yet the sound is just so DISTANT! It should be right in your face,
as we hear it in the room - but instead sounds like reverb return
with no "dry" signal.

Could there be something in the REAPER routing that could be
creating a weird phase thing somehow??

Jeremy

Fex · 12-13-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TTR

Could there be something in the REAPER routing that could be creating a weird phase thing somehow??

Dunno. What's your routing?

Try breaking the problem down to its component parts, like recording a bit of each amp in isolation, with one mic at a time. Try recording something DI to see if that signal gets messed up. Try inverting phase - in fact, try pushing every available button just to see what happens. Also, try taking a break. - that usually works.

shemp · 12-13-2011, 09:02 PM

Sounds extreme to be reflections but try to minimize the room reflections anyway. Put something behind and around the mics to dampen the reflections.

karbomusic · 12-13-2011, 09:56 PM

Quote:

It sounds awesome in the room.

Put your ears exactly where the mic is to see how sounds to you there since that is what the mic hears. Move your head around till it sounds good, put the mic there. Otherwise, moving it just a couple inches in any direction might help. Hanging a blanket or something behind the mic shouldn't hurt to try either. If it is a small room the mic could literally be sitting in a room mode.

I know there isn't but IF there were three mics & two amps.... I would close mic each amp with each mic being identically spaced from the speaker as the other. Confirming by looking a the two wave files in reaper and moving mics until the waveforms are exactly aligned. Take the third mic high up in the room 6-7 feet away from the amps. Blend it in with the other two to taste.

flakolefluk · 12-13-2011, 11:12 PM

Are you recording with a laptop? maybe you are recording with the built-in mic. You will see the meters moving, but the signal will sound like it's coming from a distant position. You said you set the input to mono and that's fine but maybe you need to check again that you've chosen the right soundcard.

DVDdoug · 12-14-2011, 01:09 PM

Do you have some sealed/isolated headphones, so you can monitor the mic while moving it around, and maybe figure-out what's going on? Maybe try one amp with the mic 6-inches from the speaker? Maybe try speaking into the mic from different distances to see what happens...

What are the acoustics in the room like? Maybe you can try a different room, or deaden the room by hanging-up blankets or rugs, etc.

With your mic 2-feet away from the amps, I don't know why this is happening, or why the problem is so drastic... But, it's normal to hear more "room" in the recording than you hear (or notice) live. I think this is because in the live situation the room sound comes from all-around you and it's natural. When you hear the same sound/reverb coming out of monitors/speakers it can sound "wrong" and unnatural.

Jedi · 12-20-2011, 11:53 AM

Any updates on what you found?

ivansc · 12-20-2011, 12:36 PM

And of course nobody suggested that you might possibly have the wrong side of the mic pointing towards the amps?

A very very common newb trick back in the day with Rode mics.....

JohnnyFlash · 12-20-2011, 01:15 PM

A lot of times if I can't go DI I will lay a mic
Over my amp so it just hangs in front of the speaker
And then throw a blanket over the amp and mic.
It totally seals out room noise and that natural
Room reverb. Its the only way I have on a limited budget to get a nice dry signal.
Or you may just have something set wrong in Reaper. Check your input options and make sure you are using the right sound card/interface option.