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02-19-2016, 01:06 PM
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#321
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Scottish refugee in Germany
Posts: 4,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hamish
The REAPER example would look a lot better if it had the Bb Keysig too, wouldn't you say? Why is that? MuseScore doesn't guess keysigs as far as I know.
Durations shown are based on display quantization settings in REAPER, and the Preferences> Import > MIDI 'Shortest note:' setting in MuseScore.
Don't mean to sound dismissive here, but I AM questioning your methodology
The thing you might not be aware of here bob, is that in the forseeable future you could put that REAPER part on the appropriate stave and keysig (which of course REAPER can do already), export in MusicXML and have that open in MuseScore with the bulk of your formatting intact, where you can quickly optimise that for reading and print. Exciting!
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It was not too scientific I'll admit.I was just curious to see how the two programms interpreted the same midi file.
Ive no idea why musescore put the keysig in.I simply dropped the file into musescore to see what it came up with.
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02-19-2016, 08:28 PM
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#323
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Beam bug
The highlighted beam extension are redundant. The extra side beam isn't needed if beams connect.
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02-19-2016, 08:40 PM
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#324
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Triplet - unexpected results
The triplet function seems to give some unexpected results.
First, I added three eighth notes:
Then used the 3:2 tuplet feature. I expected this:
But I got this:
It looks like triplet values expand into their values as converting sixteenths into triplets got the desired result:
but this doesn't seem intuitive to me. In my mind, a 3:2 triplet means "take 3 of these notes and cram them into the space of 2". So the notes should shrink into the triplet and not expand.
Thoughts?
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02-20-2016, 07:50 AM
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#325
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Also, only the outer articulation is needed when connected by a stem. The articulations between the noteheads is unnecessary and muddies the visual.
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02-20-2016, 11:55 AM
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#326
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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I mentioned these before but they got swallowed up in the flow of the thread and I can't see them in the FR list on the first page so thought I'd give them a bump (and a little more info)
Actions to:
Set length of next to be inserted or selected notes to dotted
Set length of next to be inserted or selected notes to triplet
-It would be good if these could toggle with the straight version. So dotted/straight, triplet/straight. In general it would be good if all of the articulation actions could have a toggle version as well. So a single key could be used to add and remove a staccato mark for example.
Move cursor to previous note or rest
Move cursor to next note or rest
-These two I thought I had managed to solve using a custom action but it doesn't work well at all.
@pcartwright: I noticed that some of the FRs have now been implemented, did you intend to update the FR list to show this?
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02-20-2016, 12:07 PM
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#327
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddiesel41264
Actions to:
Set length of next to be inserted or selected notes to dotted
Set length of next to be inserted or selected notes to triplet
[...]
@pcartwright: I noticed that some of the FRs have now been implemented, did you intend to update the FR list to show this?
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The length of the next note can be dotted and triplet from actions:
1/4. is for a dotted quarter note. Etc.
And yes, I intend to update the list as FR are added and bugs fixed, but it's rather lengthy. Any help would be appreciated.
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02-20-2016, 12:23 PM
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#328
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Regarding triplets and tuplets - Would it make more sense to have a dialogue box open where users can insert the tuplet ratio instead of having a drop down list?
Just a thought.
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02-20-2016, 12:58 PM
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#329
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcartwright
The length of the next note can be dotted and triplet from actions:
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This is okay but then I need a key assigned to set the next note to quarter note, and I need two more keys for quarter dotted, and quarter triplet - and more keys for all the other durations. It would be simpler to have one key that just takes whatever note length is already selected and make it dotted or triplet, and if pressed again it will return to just the straight time. I don't think this is currently possible. This is the same kind of toggle action that would speed up entering articulation markings.
Quote:
Any help would be appreciated.
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Of course!
#6: I think is redundant as it was discussed that setting at the project level isn't very helpful since the key can change throughout a piece and we now have the ability to set the key signature per measure.
#20: We have this now
#22: We've got this too
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02-20-2016, 01:30 PM
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#330
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Norway
Posts: 7,318
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btw: Really looking forward to the official release,
as I'm in a composing-phase of a song.
Reaper seems much better than Musescore in adjusting notes across bars and moving things around a little.
__________________
Reaper x64, win 11
Composer, text-writer, producer
Bandcamp
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02-20-2016, 03:17 PM
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#331
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,030
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddiesel41264
This is okay but then I need a key assigned to set the next note to quarter note, and I need two more keys for quarter dotted, and quarter triplet - and more keys for all the other durations. It would be simpler to have one key that just takes whatever note length is already selected and make it dotted or triplet, and if pressed again it will return to just the straight time. I don't think this is currently possible. This is the same kind of toggle action that would speed up entering articulation markings.
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Perhaps. I'll add it to the FR, but I think modifiers would work equally as well.
I've modified my MIDI entry to be similar (not exact) to Notion's input.
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02-20-2016, 03:33 PM
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#332
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcartwright
Perhaps. I'll add it to the FR, but I think modifiers would work equally as well.
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Thanks Yes, modifiers are one solution, but I think a more complicated and slower one.
We need to be able to do three things: turn a selected straight note into a dotted note, turn a dotted note back to a straight note, and make the next note entered a dotted note.
Don't you think it would be easier to have one action that could do all three things. - and the separate actions we already have for those who prefer them.
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02-20-2016, 05:15 PM
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#333
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,409
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Sun
Reaper seems much better than Musescore in adjusting notes across bars and moving things around a little.
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IMO the true measure of a score editor is how easy it is to fix things when you don't enter the notes perfectly the first time: inserting time in between notes, adjusting values and rests and ties, moving things around, inserting a measure with a different time signature than the others, ensuring that things don't go haywire when notes temporarily overlap each other, etc.
I personally support any and all energies toward that end. :-)
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02-21-2016, 03:33 AM
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#335
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 22,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clepsydrae
IMO the true measure of a score editor is how easy it is to fix things when you don't enter the notes perfectly the first time: inserting time in between notes, adjusting values and rests and ties, moving things around, inserting a measure with a different time signature than the others, ensuring that things don't go haywire when notes temporarily overlap each other, etc.
I personally support any and all energies toward that end. :-)
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So true!
__________________
Ici on parles Franglais
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02-21-2016, 06:52 AM
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#336
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: España
Posts: 102
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Congratulations! The editor is being intuitive and agile. Brilliant!
I think it would be nice if the durations of the notes displayed in the Score Editor may be independent of the Piano Roll. Get cleaner scores.
Last edited by Iu.Gob; 02-21-2016 at 08:05 AM.
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02-21-2016, 10:06 AM
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#337
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iu.Gob
Congratulations! The editor is being intuitive and agile. Brilliant!
I think it would be nice if the durations of the notes displayed in the Score Editor may be independent of the Piano Roll. Get cleaner scores.
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Maybe as an option
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02-21-2016, 10:40 AM
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#338
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: España
Posts: 102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memyselfandus
Maybe as an option
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That would be ideal. Often you have to adjust the length of the sound of the notes. This changes the quantization and dirties the score.
Last edited by Iu.Gob; 02-21-2016 at 10:49 AM.
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02-21-2016, 10:52 AM
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#339
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iu.Gob
I think it would be nice if the durations of the notes displayed in the Score Editor may be independent of the Piano Roll. Get cleaner scores.
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That may or may not be beyond the intended scope of the notation editor in REAPER. At present, the notation editor provides a view of persistent MIDI data, which you can edit. But the usual purpose of written notation is to provide a guide for the performer to interpret. Should we provide a faithful* view of the data, or let the user make individual cosmetic edits that only affect the notation view without changing the underlying data? For now, we are focusing on getting the faithful view correct.
* There is already display quantization, to prevent freely played MIDI as being displayed as an endless series of tied 256th notes, so one could argue that we're already not displaying the underlying data faithfully.
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02-21-2016, 10:54 AM
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#340
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
That may or may not be beyond the intended scope of the notation editor in REAPER. At present, the notation editor provides a view of persistent MIDI data, which you can edit. But the usual purpose of written notation is to provide a guide for the performer to interpret. Should we provide a faithful* view of the data, or let the user make individual cosmetic edits that only affect the notation view without changing the underlying data? For now, we are focusing on getting the faithful view correct.
* There is already display quantization, to prevent freely played MIDI as being displayed as an endless series of tied 256th notes, so one could argue that we're already not displaying the underlying data faithfully.
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I'm a fan of the notation being tied to the piano roll like it is. People don't realize how powerful the midi editor is in reaper. Would be really nice if we could select the number of bars in the notation to match the length of the midi item. So if you have a 1 bar midi item it would show 1 bar in the notation. Start out that way then if you want can add more bars to the midi item within the notation view. Just like in the piano roll view. Just the option.
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02-21-2016, 11:02 AM
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#341
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Also. Right now if you add a item on say bars 5-7 and click on the item it shows 2 bars. When you switch to notation view it shows previous bard. Which makes sense. But it would be awesome to have a option set for per midi item view on both the midi editor and the notation editor. There are some good uses for this.
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02-21-2016, 11:06 AM
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#342
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Scroll bug? or I'm not using the mouse wheel
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02-21-2016, 11:24 AM
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#343
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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How do you hide the yellow background and color on the notes? If you want
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02-21-2016, 11:27 AM
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#344
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Should probably add a tracklist view option in the notation view as well. Otherwise if you want to work just in notation view you have to select notation view every time you go to another take in the same midi item.
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02-21-2016, 11:35 AM
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#345
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memyselfandus
Should probably add a tracklist view option in the notation view as well. Otherwise if you want to work just in notation view you have to select notation view every time you go to another take in the same midi item.
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There is a track list, the button to show it is the first one in the editor's menu - if you can't see it just look for the track list action. The yellow background shows the area selected in the arrange window.
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02-21-2016, 11:51 AM
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#346
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: España
Posts: 102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memyselfandus
But it would be awesome to have a option set for per midi item view on both the midi editor and the notation editor. There are some good uses for this.
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So is. It would be an option that significantly increases the flexibility of the Score Editor and music would be easier to read for musicians to be cleaner. Also composers could work faster and more efficient. This is my opinion. Regards!
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02-21-2016, 12:05 PM
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#347
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 1,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddiesel41264
There is a track list, the button to show it is the first one in the editor's menu - if you can't see it just look for the track list action. The yellow background shows the area selected in the arrange window.
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I was mentally connecting it to individual take views in midi items. disregard. thanks
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02-21-2016, 12:31 PM
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#348
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
That may or may not be beyond the intended scope of the notation editor in REAPER. At present, the notation editor provides a view of persistent MIDI data, which you can edit. But the usual purpose of written notation is to provide a guide for the performer to interpret. Should we provide a faithful* view of the data, or let the user make individual cosmetic edits that only affect the notation view without changing the underlying data? For now, we are focusing on getting the faithful view correct.
* There is already display quantization, to prevent freely played MIDI as being displayed as an endless series of tied 256th notes, so one could argue that we're already not displaying the underlying data faithfully.
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IMHO, the notation view should faithfully display and edit MIDI data, with the added feature of display quantization for cleaning up the display. Any cosmetic changes which would deviate from the event time, duration, or pitch of the original MIDI events within Reaper should only be allowed outside of Reaper, in a graphical notation publishing program.
I've been waiting for years for a MIDI notation editor in Reaper, especially one which handles tuplets without arbitrary limitations regarding emedded rests or ties. But I strongly feel that it should be a MIDI editor first. Having said that, I'm all for rudimentary printing and music xml export/import. (Along with other FR's already mentioned.)
I am knocked out by what Schwa has accomplished and continues to tweak. I'm certain there are some large, well funded DAW companies who would have given a left body part for his talents.
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02-21-2016, 12:40 PM
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#349
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13,333
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I've noticed it some pre-s ago: when I open updated version(I install the new version over the existing one) and click Alt+4 in Midi editor, I should wait 10-15 seconds when Notation editor is opening(and the computer is hanging up for this time). So is it a bug?
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02-21-2016, 01:03 PM
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#350
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vitalker
I've noticed it some pre-s ago: when I open updated version(I install the new version over the existing one) and click Alt+4 in Midi editor, I should wait 10-15 seconds when Notation editor is opening(and the computer is hanging up for this time). So is it a bug?
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For me it's instant
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02-21-2016, 01:17 PM
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#351
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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@pccartwright
These FRs have now been implemented: #23, #25, #33
FR #7 and FR #27 are essentially the same I think - it's the second #27 btw (I just realised there's an error in the numbering)
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02-21-2016, 01:28 PM
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#352
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Banned
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,650
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Buglike issue: Editing a note length by handle results in handle never being shorter than the Quantize Display setting, even though the note is shortened.
Quantize Display calculation needs looked at too. Draw a whole note at bar start with snap and QD set to 1/8th. Reduce length of note by 1/8th. No 1/8th rest drawn.
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02-21-2016, 01:29 PM
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#353
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snooks
Buglike issue: Editing a note length by handle results in handle never being shorter than the Quantize Display setting, even though the note is shortened.
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Turn snapping off.
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02-21-2016, 01:36 PM
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#354
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Banned
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,650
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It's not related to snap or grid visibility here. Off or at 1/128th, the length of the beam still sticks at the QD length. The note length is changed though. Changing QD value results in the beam changing size if the note length is smaller than QD.
Are you getting a different result? (this is pre 7, I'll check 8)
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02-21-2016, 01:43 PM
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#355
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snooks
It's not related to snap or grid visibility here. Off or at 1/128th, the length of the beam still sticks at the QD length. The note length is changed though. Changing QD value results in the beam changing size if the note length is smaller than QD.
Are you getting a different result? (this is pre 7, I'll check 8)
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I think I'm misunderstanding the problem. Do you have a GIF?
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02-21-2016, 02:55 PM
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#356
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Banned
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,650
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Sure, here it is...
See the orange beam length is always the QD length if the note length is smaller. It might be intentional, but I thought the beam represented the length of the note and if it's to stop the handle being too small perhaps a different colour could be used for the "quantized" section of the beam so the length is still clear.
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02-21-2016, 02:59 PM
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#357
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13,333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddiesel41264
For me it's instant
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For me too, but it happens only once, after installation.
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02-21-2016, 03:08 PM
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#358
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: North East UK
Posts: 493
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snooks
See the orange beam length is always the QD length if the note length is smaller. It might be intentional, but I thought the beam represented the length of the note and if it's to stop the handle being too small perhaps a different colour could be used for the "quantized" section of the beam so the length is still clear.
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Thanks. Yes, it's the same for me - I think it's intentional but maybe there's a better way it could be done.
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02-21-2016, 03:19 PM
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#359
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Banned
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 1,650
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Thanks for checking, I need to add that if the note is very small and you get an 1/8th beam handle, the length adjustments are absolute. So one pixel to the right turns a 1/128th note to a 1/8th+ note.
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02-21-2016, 03:27 PM
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#360
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The Reflection Free Zone
Posts: 3,026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clepsydrae
IMO the true measure of a score editor is how easy it is to fix things when you don't enter the notes perfectly the first time: inserting time in between notes, adjusting values and rests and ties, moving things around, inserting a measure with a different time signature than the others, ensuring that things don't go haywire when notes temporarily overlap each other, etc.
I personally support any and all energies toward that end. :-)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Sun
btw: Really looking forward to the official release,
as I'm in a composing-phase of a song.
Reaper seems much better than Musescore in adjusting notes across bars and moving things around a little.
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The entry/edit method in REAPER is already heaps better than MuseScore, for the basic note pitch and duration.
Thanks to the 'hybrid score' activists over the years
Also, I'd like to say at this point, that I'm NOT for any floaty note cursor. The way it is now you get 1) audition of your note by clicking on a space/line. 2) instantly draggable note pitch/postion if you WERE off by a pixel or two.
So I for one would really be happy not to have that really quite annoying floating note cursor that MuseScore has, and which I would happily turn off. (As an option, of course...)
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