Old 05-28-2018, 02:02 AM   #1
adXok
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Default JS FX plugins, Ambisonic ATK for Reaper

Hello, guys
As you probably have no idea, I am one of those idiots who think that stereo mixes sound... well, uncomfortable... especially nowadays when most people listen to music on their headphones.

Not a big deal, of course. 99% of the listeners would not be able to tell the difference... unless it has been advertised to them mostly regarding gaming, movies (and music after all).

A few months ago I found this collection of web-sites which dig deeply into the capabilities of Reaper, free VST, and JS FX plugins.

.: It is about Binaural sound :.


ambiX

Multi-channel for ambiX

JS fx plugin:
ATK for Reaper

VST plugin:
Sonarworks Reference 4 headphone match and correction simulator
~you'll need this if you listen and mix on a set of the listed headphones in that plugin!

The subject is huge. No need for me to try and explain to you what it is all about. Only those interested in it will find it suitable.

I listen and mix 99% of the time on headphones. I use Foobar as an audio player. Please, do yourselves a favour and use it as well. For the standard stereo mixes I use the Dolby Headphone plugin in Foobar and it makes my brain feel comfortable:

Foobar

Dolby Headphone Wrapper

Dolby's dolbyhph library file


-------------------------------


Why is all this so important?
Well, it is not if you have no idea about what is the difference between headphone channel separation and binaural audio (which tries to emulate cross-feed between those channels in order to feel like there are no headphones on your ears... roughly said)

Recently I bought Tesseract's new album "Sonder". It came with a second disc that has been mastered as a 'KLANG 3D' in-ear mixing.

KLANG 3D demo

I wasn't very satisfied with the difference between that and the normal Stereo-mix of the album. Not a big deal. Just wanted to share with you.

Last edited by adXok; 05-28-2018 at 03:55 AM.
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Old 05-28-2018, 03:07 AM   #2
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Impressive demo
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Reaper x64, win 8.1
G-Sun.no - Music Blog - My music
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Old 05-28-2018, 04:11 AM   #3
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This is totally what I'm into these days adXok. I'm mixing everything in third order 3D Ambisonics now. I'm also using the studio edition of Sonarworks Reference 4 and would not want to work without it.

I'm planning to do a major overhaul of the Ambisonic section of my website soon too. That section is at www.AmbisonicMusic.com
There's only one Ambisonic mix on there at the moment but my new double length album is nearing completion and I will have mixes available there in third order Ambisonic format (SN3D, AmbiX, ACN), Binaural, 5.1 and stereo.

One of the tracks on the new album has a short section simulating world war three and I created a military chopper sound using my MU modular (which had grown considerably since I filmed this), Roland System 100 synth, System 700 sequencer and Moog Voyager. I've uploaded a Binaural version of that to my YouTube channel which you'll find here...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxXqCsD5GfE

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Old 05-28-2018, 04:35 AM   #4
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adXok, I'll have to check out your Dolby links for Foobar too. I'll have to wait to next week though because I'm running REALLY low on Internet data right now.

I'm by no means an expert in JSFX code but I do have enough general programming experience to hack my way through some mods on existing plugins and I've been working on some third order Ambisonic bread and butter plugins (EQ, level and a few other things) and will be sharing them soon.
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Old 05-28-2018, 05:37 AM   #5
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ReaDave,
this is insane. I thought the military were coming to get me in my house like bin Laden.
I love that type of mixing. It is so immersive and rich.

Here are some of the best introduction tutorials about "ATK for Reaper":

Trond Lossius - Encoding with ATK for Reaper

Last edited by adXok; 05-28-2018 at 06:42 AM.
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Old 05-28-2018, 07:24 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adXok View Post
ReaDave,
this is insane. I thought the military were coming to get me in my house like bin Laden.
I love that type of mixing. It is so immersive and rich.

Here are some of the best introduction tutorials about "ATK for Reaper":

Trond Lossius - Encoding with ATK for Reaper
Cheers for the thumbs up on the mix adXok.
I had a lot of fun making it. The album has been a work in progress now for a year and a half and is my most ambitious project in 35 years.

I have all of those videos from Trond and have been in touch with him regarding some of the things in the ATK beta releases.
I'm not using the ATK at present mainly because I am now working in third order Ambisonics and the ATK is first order at present. I am considering contacting Trond again to see if he's interested (and has time) to work on third order AmbiX SN3D versions of the ATK. It would probably be quite a big undertaking but I'd be willing to help out wherever possible and hopefully learn a lot more about JSFX coding along the way.

My primary Ambisonic tools right now are from Blue Ripple Sound. I have their upmixers and decoders and also the free core plugins. The Blue Ripple plugins are by far the most effective, efficient and reliable Ambisonic tools I've used and I've tried pretty much everything I can run on Windows in REAPER.

There is one BIG thing I don't like about the Blue Ripple plugins though and that is the requirement to connect to their license server every few weeks to keep the licenses running. I've been in touch with Richard Furse (Blue Ripple plugin creator) about this issue but he seems very reluctant to change this. I've even mentioned to him that I'd prefer iLok to the current scheme and I have so far avoided iLok like the plague!

The Blue Ripple plugins are first class quality wise and the paid suites are quite expensive, especially given British pounds to Aussie dollar conversion.
The only reasons I am still using these plugins is because they are so good and also because I've invested well over AU$1K in them.

I REALLY hope enough people can convince Richard to do something that will allow us to keep using his plugins without the Internet dependency. It is a big sore point for me.
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Old 05-28-2018, 08:01 AM   #7
adXok
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I have to admit that for now I am quite lost in the terminology like Format-A, Format-B, first order 1o, second order 2o, UHJ stereo, HOA > High Order Ambisonic

It has to do with how the recordings were made and the special microphones to capture "spherical" information on the incoming sound,, direct plane, reflections (rear), polar (up-down), etc. it is huge!

I also am trying these little free open source gems:

Ambisonic VST Plugin suite for Reaper
Latest Version v1.3.1, 17th May 2018
quite recent update


Interesting stuff and very knowledgeable!

Last edited by adXok; 05-28-2018 at 08:07 AM.
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Old 06-03-2018, 02:22 PM   #8
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I know what your talking about -- I spent a good few month setuping a workflow to mix in Amibsonic, 3-D, etc.

It sure was interesting and fun.

However, as fun as it was, I concluded that as long I don't actually have a 3d listening environment (i.e. speakers all around me, including below and above) I was getting caught up in something bigger than my capacities. Distracting?

I also used Foobar and setup ReaDave's headphone mixing protocol - which I still use here and there.

I may come back to it, but in the end I concluded that it was keeping me back as far learning the basic mixing skills - especially taking full advantage of the spacial elements of normal stereo mixing (e.g. reverb, delay, EQ, panning, etc.).

Also, while I know that Pink Floyd were experimenting with quadraphonic and other 3d elements in their lives shows, I can't help but remind myself of all the friggin awesome listening experiences I've had throughout the years listening to their songs using normal regular everyday headphones. I sure wish I could mix my songs to recreate the Pink Floyd sonic experience...
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Old 06-07-2018, 12:28 AM   #9
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Default IEM Plugin Suite Ambisonic

Hey there!

I'm a newbie when it comes to ambisonic. I know there's ATK but that is "only" 1st Order Ambi, right?

There's so many options/philosophies out there that I got a little unsecure about which to learn to use.

Does anybody have experiences with that plugin suite that I've discovered just yesterday?

https://plugins.iem.at/
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Old 06-07-2018, 03:01 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adXok View Post
Then the question is, how is Reaper going to implement such "standards" especially with VR (virtual reality) knocking on the door?
I don't think Reaper has to implement any of it. There are so many great tools out there from Companies, Institutes/Universities, and 3D Audio dudes, with a lot of knowledge of spatial audio. Reaper already is one of the most famous DAWs when it comes to 3D audio, as it supports up to 64 channels per bus. In contrast, Logic only supports up to 8 (afaik) which is not even second order Ambisonics (which needs 9).

However, one thing which would be nice is playback of 360° video, combined with VR headsets. Not sure if its already supported in Reaper?


Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaDave View Post
My apologies for that, especially considering how quickly you replied to me. I truly am enthusiastic about your work!

I have the latest updates of your plugins now and will be installing and testing a few things later today.

Great demo by the way! I actually really like your room plugin and have used it on one of the tracks on the new album I'm working on.
No worries, take your time! By the way with the AllRADecoder you can now create your own Decoder very easily Looking forward to getting your feedback! And of course to listening to your new album

Quote:
Originally Posted by skippertag View Post
Does anybody have experiences with that plugin suite that I've discovered just yesterday?

https://plugins.iem.at/
Actually, I have a lot of experience with it ;-)
It's free, supports up to 7th order, and you can combine it with every plug-in which also uses the AmbiX convention (e.g. Blue Ripple plugins, Facebook FB360 suite, AmbiX suite obviously, Peter Stitt's plugins, and many many more).

If you have any specific questions, please, feel free to ask
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Old 06-12-2018, 12:20 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDan View Post


Actually, I have a lot of experience with it ;-)
It's free, supports up to 7th order, and you can combine it with every plug-in which also uses the AmbiX convention (e.g. Blue Ripple plugins, Facebook FB360 suite, AmbiX suite obviously, Peter Stitt's plugins, and many many more).

If you have any specific questions, please, feel free to ask
:-) That's good to know. Thank you very much for that kind offer! It may take a while as we're in the middle of trying to find an apartment in a bigger city and all that stuff that belongs to it...but I will come back to that topic without a doubt :-)
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