Old 07-11-2012, 09:22 AM   #1
Akademix
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Hey guys,

So I have a newbie question regarding BPM.

How exactly does BPM influence a beat? does it determine the speed of the song? For instance a 92 BPM beat being slower than a 120 BPM beat?
Because I've found a few songs that are quite slow and they are around 160 BPM, which confuses me because I'd think that would be fast.

For instance Eminem's "Love Me" seems slow to me, but it's 161.96
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekb-KL8SrBw

Also 2Pac's They don't give a fuck about us.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWH2rYiHSRE

Sorry for this ultra newbie question, I know all the technical details about BPM after some reading, but I find it hard to find any info on how it actually influences one in practice. What does it actually determine with regard to the sound of a song? And how do you choose how many BPM you are going to use, and why?


(Sorry you guys'll be getting questions like this often, I just started the whole music production thing a few weeks ago and I'm digging it a lot!)

Last edited by Akademix; 07-11-2012 at 09:30 AM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:53 AM   #2
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Quote:
How exactly does BPM influence a beat? does it determine the speed of the song? For instance a 92 BPM beat being slower than a 120 BPM beat?
Because I've found a few songs that are quite slow and they are around 160 BPM, which confuses me because I'd think that would be fast
Maybe somebody is counting the beats incorrectly?

Have you tried counting the beats yourself? (It's usually easier if you count the measures... 1,2,3,4 -- 2,2,3,4 -- 3,2,3,4, etc... and, you dont have to count for a full minute.)

Quote:
And how do you choose how many BPM you are going to use, and why?
Traditionally, it's done by whatever "feels right" and what sounds right for the song... The same way you choose what key to use or the same way you create a melody, etc.

But, if you are creating dance beats, you might shoot for some particular BPM target.
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Old 07-11-2012, 10:22 AM   #3
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yeah, for me it depends on the feel. If I have a song that is 92BPM but I feel I'm rushing a part (like on guitar) when recording, I'll up the BPM to 184 (same speed but more clicks) so I hear the clicks on more of the beats to keep me from anticipating out of time..... But if I program Drums, I might want to change back to 92 if it's a slower 4/4 beat, etc. IT all just depends.
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Old 07-11-2012, 12:55 PM   #4
Akademix
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Thanks for your answers, but what I don't get is: how is 92 and 184 BPM the same speed? Isn't 184 BPM twice as fast?

For instance if I have a little sequence in Reaper on 92 and I make it 184 it goes a lot faster
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:02 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Akademix View Post
Thanks for your answers, but what I don't get is: how is 92 and 184 BPM the same speed? Isn't 184 BPM twice as fast?

For instance if I have a little sequence in Reaper on 92 and I make it 184 it goes a lot faster
ah, well yeah, if you item is bound to the bpm, it will change the rate the item is played.
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:04 PM   #6
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That Eminem tune is 81bpm (162 / 2).

Choosing a bpm is often function of the genre you're producing, my non scientific 'rough cut' take on it is something like this.

70 - 80bpm dub step / classic dub
80 - 100 bpm hip hop
120 bpm classic house
135 bpm uk garage
140 bpm techno
150 bpm new skool breaks / acid breakbeat
160 - 170 (break beat) jungle / dnb
160 - 170 (4 to the floor) 'gabba'

You'll note that dubstep is half the tempo of a jungle track, along with the choice of sounds it's on of the reasons their easy genres to interchange. You know that bpm stands for beats per minute, right?

Here's another great sum that comes in really useful. 60 / bpm x 100 converts your bpm in the hz (cycles per second) so you can tweak lfos in processors and you can even use it for setting rhythmically sympathetic attack and release times on dynamics processors or pre-delays on verbs.

Hope this helps you find a way in to understanding more!
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:25 PM   #7
Akademix
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Thanks for the replies guys, it's starting to make make sense, a few more questions though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shemp View Post
ah, well yeah, if you item is bound to the bpm, it will change the rate the item is played.
When I'm working in reaper is the default that it is bound? Because it seems to change the track when changing the BPM. How do I unbound it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rothchild View Post
That Eminem tune is 81bpm (162 / 2).

Choosing a bpm is often function of the genre you're producing, my non scientific 'rough cut' take on it is something like this.

70 - 80bpm dub step / classic dub
80 - 100 bpm hip hop
120 bpm classic house
135 bpm uk garage
140 bpm techno
150 bpm new skool breaks / acid breakbeat
160 - 170 (break beat) jungle / dnb
160 - 170 (4 to the floor) 'gabba'

You'll note that dubstep is half the tempo of a jungle track, along with the choice of sounds it's on of the reasons their easy genres to interchange. You know that bpm stands for beats per minute, right?

Here's another great sum that comes in really useful. 60 / bpm x 100 converts your bpm in the hz (cycles per second) so you can tweak lfos in processors and you can even use it for setting rhythmically sympathetic attack and release times on dynamics processors or pre-delays on verbs.

Hope this helps you find a way in to understanding more!
Thanks for this great post man, gonna keep that list in mind!

Some questions though. Why exactly did that list with the Eminem song choose to show 162 instead of 81? Why divide it by 2? From the other post I understand that it is the same speed if not bound, but still why not just list it as 81?

Also the last paragraph is too difficult to understand for me haha, is that some advanced shit or should I know about that hz, rhythmically stuff?
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:49 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Akademix View Post

When I'm working in reaper is the default that it is bound? Because it seems to change the track when changing the BPM. How do I unbound it?
right click on item, go to source properties. See below. This works on midi items and loop items that follow project tempos. You don't need to do this for regular audio items you record though:

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Old 07-11-2012, 02:05 PM   #9
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Where did you get the info that the eminem track was 162?

It's entirely possible that when they set up the sequencer to program that track they had it set to 162 but programed it at 'half tempo'. Having the sequencer run at 'double tempo' sometimes gives you little bit more nuance in programming (although not really anything you can't gain through understanding quantize, a 16th at 162 is a 32nd at 81 etc)

There's a classic trick you can try to start to get your head around this a bit more. Set a project up at 160bpm and drag in an audio drum loop. drag the same loop in to a new track and pitch it down to half the speed (so it's at 80bpm) you'll notice that when you play them they're perfectly in time with each other (albeit that one's going twice the speed).
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:07 PM   #10
Akademix
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Thanks a lot man, cleared it up for me
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:20 PM   #11
Akademix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rothchild View Post
Where did you get the info that the eminem track was 162?

It's entirely possible that when they set up the sequencer to program that track they had it set to 162 but programed it at 'half tempo'. Having the sequencer run at 'double tempo' sometimes gives you little bit more nuance in programming (although not really anything you can't gain through understanding quantize, a 16th at 162 is a 32nd at 81 etc)

There's a classic trick you can try to start to get your head around this a bit more. Set a project up at 160bpm and drag in an audio drum loop. drag the same loop in to a new track and pitch it down to half the speed (so it's at 80bpm) you'll notice that when you play them they're perfectly in time with each other (albeit that one's going twice the speed).
Thanks a lot for your help man.
Stuff's a lot clearer for me due to the explanations you guys gave me.

I found the info on this site from google: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...8651581&page=1
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Old 07-12-2012, 04:41 AM   #12
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Read "meter(music)" on wikipedia.
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