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03-30-2014, 03:59 PM
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#281
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 4,630
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Here's a subversive thought: Download a Bitwig demo and use it to write PRO Reaper love songs.
It's brilliant, I tell ya, brilliant.
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03-30-2014, 05:18 PM
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#282
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sydney Oz
Posts: 8,480
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I got an answer on syncing Bitwig to Reaper (or other daw) from the nice admin at Bitwigbeats:
Quote:
''There isn't an external sync button yet, you have to add the external midi sync clock via a midi output controller script which is built into the list of scripts, this is how it sends the clock out. Im sure its on Bitwig's agenda however!''
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Ahhh, there is no Midi INPUT Clock sync as yet only OUTPUT, so Bitwig would have to be your Master DAW.''
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Pretty sure I read Jack Transport is slated for inclusion also, can't find that link though...
I wonder how well it syncs to Reaper via the script? Reaper and Live rewired is hard to beat (except Live loses VST support when slaved unlike Reaper, but Rearoute and MTC sync fixes that though) perfect sync with control from both transports. I would have thought syncing to other daws would have been a priority with Bitwig for release, considering how many people rewire Live.
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03-30-2014, 05:28 PM
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#283
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevosss
I would have thought syncing to other daws would have been a priority with Bitwig for release, considering how many people rewire Live.
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Very true. Given that many current buyers probably won't be using it exclusively (and it having no rewire) that should maybe be somewhat high on the near term todo list you'd think.
One puzzling thing to me personally about it, demo wise, is that some of the things you need to even evaluate how well you can maybe integrate it into a multi-application production workflow are disabled. I mean, given that it has no rewire and (apparently) no easy midi sync, the next logical step in a multi-app workflow is stemming, which (afaict) you can't do in the demo.
So...they made some arguably curious practical choices with the demo.
These situations, for developers who are forward thinking, are why (after the dust settles) they should maybe connect with their user base via a live video event chat or something... and reassure them about some of that stuff.
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03-30-2014, 05:36 PM
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#284
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,792
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So today I finally got a chance to play around with Bitwig. I had an issue (curiously the same one I had with Live 9) that the browser indexing takes forever and makes the program nearly unusable, but after deleting the preferences and eschewing a database things were fine.
Aside from all the missing things, which in reality are mostly small things (yet cumulatively make it cumbersome to make full tracks atm) I think the basic interface is great. It feels very "solid" and the program is just as snappy as Reaper.
I totally and completely LOVE the vertical clip launcher. It's so fast to get a basic song skeleton down without stopping playback once, recording everything directly into clip slots.
The Inspector is also a thing of beauty, and the way it provides all information and editing in one spot for whatever you've clicked on (note, track, clip, instruments etc) is extremely elegant. It's night and day better than Reaper's 10 different ways to show information about different things (pop-up note properties, dockable item properties with a popup media properties dialog etc).
The more I use it, the more I like it. I won't be switching from Reaper now, but seeing where things go with Reaper 5 and Bitwig 2 it could be a viable possibility.
So much possibility in this small area. Different clips on different tracks that are different lengths, all playing nicely together in time, with nothing on the arrangement page yet.
[img] https://i.imgur.com/PtNl8jf.jpg [/img]
__________________
FRs: v5 Media Explorer Requests, Global Quantization, Session View
Win10 Pro 64-bit, Reaper 6(x64), AMD 3950x, Aorus X570 Master, 64GB DDR4 3600, PowerColor Red Devil 5700XT, EVO 970 2TB, 10TB HD, Define R6
Last edited by PitchSlap; 03-30-2014 at 06:05 PM.
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03-30-2014, 05:46 PM
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#285
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PitchSlap
The Inspector is also a thing of beauty, and the way it provides all information an editing in one spot for whatever you've clicked on (note, track, clip, instruments etc) is extremely elegant.
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It is.
It's odd when using different Inspectors because they kinda play with your expectations. I generally like the way that one works, but it also does a few small things that feel illogical, like remove the last selected thing when you touch something, or rather, when nothing is selected, go completely blank.
In my view an Inspector panel should never be blank when there are tracks in a song, should always show something, so that one part caused me to pause from time to time.
But other than that, agree, it's a really nice design layout.
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03-30-2014, 06:13 PM
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#286
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Here's an interesting twist on the universal track management
as relates to track to track routing.
Any track can be an aux destination for any other track like
Reaper but you can directly manage which tracks behave that way
by using the lower send section. Moving any track down there
makes it an aux destination.
This greatly reduces visual clutter by not showing every track in the
song as an aux destination, even though any can be...
... and conversely, dragging it back up to the arrange section removes all connections to it,
deletes those aux connection across the entire song. But even when it's down there, it's
still a also a normal track.
Pretty clever way to manage all that.
The only real difference there is that tracks that can receive auxes can't send to auxes.
A better case would be to still be able to send to all other auxes.
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03-30-2014, 06:30 PM
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#287
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,792
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
In my view an Inspector panel should never be blank when there are tracks in a song, should always show something, so that one part caused me to pause from time to time.
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Good point. Perhaps when nothing is selected showing information about the overall project would make sense (most usable aspects of Reaper's project setting, performance window and track manager).
It's been interesting to track the sentiment on forums since the release. I think the consensus is that it has a lot of potential, but is noticeably underbaked. Perhaps the standards for entry in the crowded 2014 DAW market are higher than they used to be.
There are also a lot of disappointed peopled by the looks of things. Whether this reflects the actual status of the program, or merely the expectation/reality ratio is hard to say, but I think it's the latter. It's easy to take every gripe with your current DAW and every feature wish and project it onto some magic upcoming DAW that will solve all your needs, but it's just not realistic.
With that said, they've made some interesting choices that haven't helped.
The demo is too limited, not being able to save is a turn-off from investing time to learn the program, and the lack of a demo song to show off advanced features is also an oversight in my opinion. Few people demoing it will be blown away, and those that paid $400 for what some judge as a public beta, also have reason to be a little unhappy.
I think if paying customers and potential customers who take the time to demo are both turned off it's not a good sign. Then again, music forums might not be an accurate reflection of the real world situation.
It's easy to play armchair developer, but I would suggest they work very hard with fast bug fixes and missing features (basically how Cockos always works), rethink their demo policy, as it will only drive a lot of people to piracy (especially at that price point), and giving those that bought 1.0 a free update to 2.0 to reward early adopters.
Personally I think Bitwig's price point combined with early disappointment could be a great opportunity for Cockos if they care to take advantage of it. I'm pretty sure they could code a kick ass vertical clip launcher and a few other workflow enhancing features a lot quicker than Bitwig can add all of the things they need to add.
"Why pay $400 dollars for this, when I could pay $60 for THIS???"
__________________
FRs: v5 Media Explorer Requests, Global Quantization, Session View
Win10 Pro 64-bit, Reaper 6(x64), AMD 3950x, Aorus X570 Master, 64GB DDR4 3600, PowerColor Red Devil 5700XT, EVO 970 2TB, 10TB HD, Define R6
Last edited by PitchSlap; 03-31-2014 at 01:35 AM.
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03-30-2014, 06:34 PM
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#288
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PitchSlap
Good point. Perhaps when nothing is selected showing information about the overall project would make sense (most usable aspects of Reaper's project setting, performance window and track manager).
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My personal preference for that (mmv as usual) is that the inspector would just continue to show the last selected thing when nothing is physically selected.
I do prefer when it only loads on selection, not unload on de-selection (except to load / select another obviously), so even if you move away that last thing is still there for editing.
The only other thing that I didn't like at first, but kinda got used to it, was the separation. I'd prefer to see both the track and clip inspector data in one Inspector view and there it shows either one or the other, not both at once. But that may be done to save space and to avoid using the resizable vertical panels there like most of the others do.
OTOH, the clip inspector has a relative ton of info so maybe it just wouldn't all fit.
Anyway, it's an interesting design to just kinda look at, study, just for that, for me anyway.
Like some here, no way it could replace or even really supplement the things I use for what I mostly do and don't do so I've never been a target customer.
Last edited by Lawrence; 03-30-2014 at 06:42 PM.
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03-30-2014, 10:37 PM
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#289
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,019
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
I certainly do.
"WTF?!! Reaper 2.x doesn't have elastic audio?"
"WTF?!! Reaper 3.x doesn't have multi-track midi editing?"
"WTF?!? Reaper doesn't have Import Session Data like PT?"
"WTF?!! You can't directly replace plugins in Reaper 4.0 after like, 8 years?!?!?!?".
... and so on. Just about every time a Cubase or Logic user downloads it just to bash it.
Asking for those things in an FR thread and politely wondering if they're on the todo list is pretty normal.
Going "WTF?!" every five minutes is an unfair implication / characterization, pretending that all DAWs should do
everything to make whatever you personally like look superior.
MMV on that.
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REAPER, when it came out, was freeware that categorically did things that no other DAW did at the time, esp with regards to routing and editing. When REAPER started charging for licenses, they were charging WAY less (still are) than any other similarly-capable DAW, and offering significant and substantial features and functionality that nothing else on the market had.
If I may say so, Lawrence, this whole business of "remember, REAPER wasn't always all that great" is both irrelevant and counter-productive. This isn't (or shouldn't be) some kind of philosophical debate about whether/which DAW developer deserves a new car, it's about real products charging real money.
Interface and UI can be worth a lot, as can a whole host of other things. But we're not talking about a freeware science project, we're talking about a $400 piece of commercial software.
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03-30-2014, 11:18 PM
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#290
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 16,031
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So much to cover, I can't possibly quote and respond so we'll leave it alone
Here's a WTF moment: Above it all? Did I miss something? Who's above it?
Again, I'm happy for people who like it. I want everyone to be happy with their daws.
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03-31-2014, 12:42 AM
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#291
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yep
If I may say so, Lawrence, this whole business of "remember, REAPER wasn't always all that great" is both irrelevant and counter-productive. This isn't (or shouldn't be) some kind of philosophical debate about whether/which DAW developer deserves a new car, it's about real products charging real money.
Interface and UI can be worth a lot, as can a whole host of other things. But we're not talking about a freeware science project, we're talking about a $400 piece of commercial software.
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But that's his speciality. He also LOVES to repeat himself at nausea while not really saying anything at all. A magical gift!
Try to give him actual analogies and facts... Will glaze over them and continue to spew the nonsensical catchphrases that have come up countless times already.
Funny stuff. Please continue.
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03-31-2014, 01:27 AM
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#292
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 13
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I agree with a lot of posters, that Reaper and Bitwig aren't comparable. Cockos has an outstanding price policy, a solid user base (subsequently) and superb customization/scripting capabilites.
ATM in my view Bitwig is an overpriced and overhyped imitation of an already overhyped product with no advantages. The only plus over Reaper was the advertised Linux support... till it was released. Now I see, that it is Debian only and that they do not even support LV2. Yaawn.
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03-31-2014, 02:14 AM
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#293
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JosephHighdn
I agree with a lot of posters, that Reaper and Bitwig aren't comparable. Cockos has an outstanding price policy, a solid user base (subsequently) and superb customization/scripting capabilites.
ATM in my view Bitwig is an overpriced and overhyped imitation of an already overhyped product with no advantages. The only plus over Reaper was the advertised Linux support... till it was released. Now I see, that it is Debian only and that they do not even support LV2. Yaawn.
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It's not Debian only, it's just packaged in the .deb format. If you extract the archive you get a binary that you can run. I did it in openSUSE.
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03-31-2014, 04:41 AM
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#294
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: France
Posts: 459
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My favorite feature in Bitwig already exist in Live but not in Reaper:
It is the loop in loop editing ability.
A very important feature for EDM.
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03-31-2014, 05:13 AM
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#295
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonfiremusic
It's not Debian only, it's just packaged in the .deb format. If you extract the archive you get a binary that you can run. I did it in openSUSE.
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Yeah I know. But when I start it, I cannot get past the license agreement. It crashes. Perhaps some dependency issue... Instead of analysing the problem, I choose to run either stable or open source Linux software, thank you.
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03-31-2014, 07:55 AM
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#296
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yep
If I may say so, Lawrence, this whole business of "remember, REAPER wasn't always all that great" is both irrelevant and counter-productive. This isn't (or shouldn't be) some kind of philosophical debate about whether/which DAW developer deserves a new car, it's about real products charging real money.
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I'd agree with that premise except for the fact that the correlation there is directly contextually relevant to the complaints about missing features. It's not philosophical, it's real and demonstrable.
Again, the point I've made repeatedly is that every 1.0 DAW - at any price - is always missing lots of good or subjectively necessary features, from any price range. List price has nothing to do with that part of software delivery, the features in brand new products, the reality of that. We saw that exact same thing happen with Studio One... down to the exact dollar figure of the list price. In fact, I've never seen it not happen in any brand new DAW (in modern times when there are lots of things to compare it to) ... the "missing lots of features from whatever price range it's in" part.
I've said that here like, 1000 times, but nobody still debating all the other stuff has yet to present a single example to the contrary... but some are still surprised or even shocked by it (?)... even though it quite literally always happens... in every single case.
Even Reaper at $60 at 1.0 was missing lots of good features from some other $60 daws like Podium ... right? So the list price of a 1.0 is completely irrelevant to all that... except for everyone having their own different thresholds of what an expensive toy or a bad value is, as relates to real dollars.
Again, in context, I never disagreed with any of the subjective practical / technical impressions. I disagreed with the shock and surprise over something that always happens, wondering why anyone would be shocked or surprised by it, thinking that in some cases the shock isn't actually real, can't be, because it happens in every single case. That's all.
I have no disagreement with anyone saying they personally think it costs too much for what it does, for them. So do I, for me. I wouldn't personally pay $400 for it... MMV on that.
Thanks Yep. I do appreciate your input.
Anyway, I've moved on from all that so, no biggie. The point has been made so I agree, it's not productive to keep saying things that some simply don't want to hear so I agree, let's get off of all that and let it go and talk tech.
Thanks Yep. I'm letting it go so I hope we all can.
Last edited by Lawrence; 03-31-2014 at 08:43 AM.
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03-31-2014, 08:10 AM
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#297
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,355
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JosephHighdn
Yeah I know. But when I start it, I cannot get past the license agreement. It crashes. Perhaps some dependency issue... Instead of analysing the problem, I choose to run either stable or open source Linux software, thank you.
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I think what you highlight is that there are differences between distros that require testing. Though when over 60% of (eg) Steam users on Linux use Ubuntu and nearly 10% use Mint(buntu), how much money/resources should software companies spend on individually supporting the multitude of distros that make up the other 30% (of 2% of total users, using the Steam comparison)?
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03-31-2014, 09:43 AM
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#298
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
I think what you highlight is that there are differences between distros that require testing. Though when over 60% of (eg) Steam users on Linux use Ubuntu and nearly 10% use Mint(buntu), how much money/resources should software companies spend on individually supporting the multitude of distros that make up the other 30% (of 2% of total users, using the Steam comparison)?
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So you think the people, that use Linux for gaming are the same, that buy expensive audio software ? I think many advanced DAW - users choose the Linux-distro with the most customization and easy upgrading capabilities and the pre-installed stuff on Ubuntu/Mint is rather annoying for them.
Moreover there is other commercial audio software (cheaper and more stable) available, that is distribution agnostic and just works. Perhaps I'm spoiled, but when they advertise Linux support for several years they should provide a package-manager-independent install-script. I guess it is possible to find out the dependencies for my distro manually and install them, but why should I do that to install a software, that costs ~400 $ ?
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03-31-2014, 11:01 AM
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#299
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
I think what you highlight is that there are differences between distros that require testing. Though when over 60% of (eg) Steam users on Linux use Ubuntu and nearly 10% use Mint(buntu), how much money/resources should software companies spend on individually supporting the multitude of distros that make up the other 30% (of 2% of total users, using the Steam comparison)?
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True, but Linux distros are community-based, they can provide the binaries and maintainers will include them in their distributions.
But it's a good start anyway.
If it crashes, run the executable in the terminal and see the output it gives.
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03-31-2014, 02:15 PM
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#300
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,355
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JosephHighdn
So you think the people, that use Linux for gaming are the same, that buy expensive audio software ? I think many advanced DAW - users choose the Linux-distro with the most customization and easy upgrading capabilities and the pre-installed stuff on Ubuntu/Mint is rather annoying for them.
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No, of course I don't think that. Even though the Steam figures (in terms of general OS choice) tie in with other more general OS usage stats and approx hardware sales, audio software sales/use skews towards OSX. So there is a difference. How that affect Linux distro share is anyone's guess, but it seems unlikely that 'nuxes that have 100 (or more zeros) times as many users as another would drop to anywhere near equilibrium when you add $$$ audio software into the mix.
Quote:
Moreover there is other commercial audio software (cheaper and more stable) available, that is distribution agnostic and just works. Perhaps I'm spoiled, but when they advertise Linux support for several years they should provide a package-manager-independent install-script. I guess it is possible to find out the dependencies for my distro manually and install them, but why should I do that to install a software, that costs ~400 $ ?
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That's a fair point, but my question would be whether you'd be happy paying the money and not getting official support for your particular distro?
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03-31-2014, 02:16 PM
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#301
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,890
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whats wrong with ableton that being an early adoptor of bitwig solves?
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03-31-2014, 02:17 PM
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#302
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,792
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1.04 Out Today!
So far I like the pace. At this rate in a few months the second beta phase should be over!
Quote:
Known Issues
- Audio Engine Modulation of discrete parameters.
- Can't start bitwig studio on windows if the location contains characters outside the default platform codepage
- Devices Shuffle / Accent have no effect on Arpeggiator or Step Mod while sequencer is - stopped.
- VST Adding a VST effect to a channel should bypass input audio until initiation of the plugin is finished.
- Crash when scanning for some plugins
Changes in Bitwig Studio 1.0.4
Released on 30.03.2014.
- IMPROVED Show automated button in plug-in parameter list now also include modulated parameters
- IMPROVED Keyboard input from VST-windows on windows is now redirected to the main application window
- IMPROVED Automatically close and remember which VST-windows were open when switching tracks, and re-open then when switching back.
- IMPROVED Improved the VST plugin parameter list, including a joker entry which follows the selection in the plug-in GUI
- FXED Engine crash when bouncing/rendering/exporting with buffersizes smaller than 256
- FIXED When modulation mapping mode is active pressing the mouse-wheel on a knob acts as a click
- FIXED Automation and time-info PDC doesn't work as expected
- FIXED Camel Audio Alchemy doesn't remember its data directory
- FIXED Saving an existing project to a new directory doesn't copy over the plugin-states
- FIXED Convert pitch-bend setting doesn't update when adding/replacing the first instrument on a track
- FIXED AHDSR envelope threshold of instant attack was lower than the minimum attack setting on the sampler
- FIXED Crash when starting note drag and drop with an invalid selection.
- FIXED Crash when editing onset time in inspector.
- FIXED GUI glitches on Mac OS X.
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__________________
FRs: v5 Media Explorer Requests, Global Quantization, Session View
Win10 Pro 64-bit, Reaper 6(x64), AMD 3950x, Aorus X570 Master, 64GB DDR4 3600, PowerColor Red Devil 5700XT, EVO 970 2TB, 10TB HD, Define R6
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03-31-2014, 04:30 PM
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#303
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 16,031
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
I'd agree with that premise except for the fact that the correlation there is directly contextually relevant to the complaints about missing features. It's not philosophical, it's real and demonstrable.
Again, the point I've made repeatedly is that every 1.0 DAW - at any price - is always missing lots of good or subjectively necessary features, from any price range. List price has nothing to do with that part of software delivery, the features in brand new products, the reality of that. We saw that exact same thing happen with Studio One... down to the exact dollar figure of the list price. In fact, I've never seen it not happen in any brand new DAW (in modern times when there are lots of things to compare it to) ... the "missing lots of features from whatever price range it's in" part.
I've said that here like, 1000 times, but nobody still debating all the other stuff has yet to present a single example to the contrary... but some are still surprised or even shocked by it (?)... even though it quite literally always happens... in every single case.
Even Reaper at $60 at 1.0 was missing lots of good features from some other $60 daws like Podium ... right? So the list price of a 1.0 is completely irrelevant to all that... except for everyone having their own different thresholds of what an expensive toy or a bad value is, as relates to real dollars.
Again, in context, I never disagreed with any of the subjective practical / technical impressions. I disagreed with the shock and surprise over something that always happens, wondering why anyone would be shocked or surprised by it, thinking that in some cases the shock isn't actually real, can't be, because it happens in every single case. That's all.
I have no disagreement with anyone saying they personally think it costs too much for what it does, for them. So do I, for me. I wouldn't personally pay $400 for it... MMV on that.
Thanks Yep. I do appreciate your input.
Anyway, I've moved on from all that so, no biggie. The point has been made so I agree, it's not productive to keep saying things that some simply don't want to hear so I agree, let's get off of all that and let it go and talk tech.
Thanks Yep. I'm letting it go so I hope we all can.
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I've tried to quit bitwig a couple of times, then there isn't anything else to talk about so I get sucked back in.
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04-01-2014, 03:51 AM
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#304
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
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Well, after a couple of days trying it, i can say that at this moment, bitwig its like an ipad app ,every time a new daw or an existing daw make a big update of is sequencers, after a few days trying them, i go back rapdly to reaper and i allways say the same "there`s nothing like reaper", NOTHING
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04-01-2014, 04:24 AM
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#305
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Cadiz Spain
Posts: 268
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I have been watching Thomann's (The biggest online music store in Europe) DAW sales rankings which should be a fair indication of how BitWig is selling. Last week they were 21 in the DAW sales ranking and this week they are number 2.
Good news for BitWig and despite my complaining about the high price it does look as though they got it right. I shan't be buying but congratulations for hitting the number 2 spot in less than a week.
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04-01-2014, 04:58 AM
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#306
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 15,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
Even Reaper at $60 at 1.0 was missing lots of good features from some other $60 daws like Podium ... right?
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Actually REAPER 1.0 was $40 for a discounted license, and at that time Podium was $90 (see http://web.archive.org/web/200702161.../purchase.html ). Of course, REAPER's commercial license was $200, so uh yeah.
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04-01-2014, 05:39 AM
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#307
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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I stand corrected on that particular example.
I won't keep this debate going by seeking out a $40 example, which certainly existed somewhere, a $40 daw app that did things Reaper 1.0 couldn't do yet... although of course, midi wise, even Acid Free did lots of things Reaper couldn't do yet.
I think everyone gets the point.
Thanks Justin.
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04-01-2014, 05:41 AM
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#308
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 15,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
I stand corrected on that particular example.
I won't keep this debate going by seeking out a $40 example, which certainly existed somewhere, a $40 daw app that did things Reaper 1.0 couldn't do yet... although of course, midi wise, even Acid free did lots of things Reaper couldn't do yet.
Thanks Justin.
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Or Audacity, which is free and does plenty of things that REAPER can't now. Or Wavosaur. Or Paint.NET. Or OpenOffice...
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04-01-2014, 05:45 AM
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#309
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Exactly, that was my point.
If one is inclined to cherry pick like that, especially with a 1.0, it's very, very easy to do.
I've still never seen a 1.0 with multi-track templates like Reaper's current great templates. One may have existed in some universe far away but I've never personally seen it.
Otoh, I've never seen a 1.0 that does the things Bitwig does well, done so well at 1.0, it's other really obvious flaws excluded, so... it's all relative.
Speaking honestly, the only thing missing there that was a semi-surprise to me personally was clip fades, not being able to draw fades. That, for any wanna be pro audio app, to me anyway, is indeed a little unusual.
Last edited by Lawrence; 04-01-2014 at 06:05 AM.
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04-01-2014, 07:10 AM
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#310
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 22,754
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I was left wondering if this was like the "hit parade" They may well have had to only sell ten copies in a week to get that high.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerry
I have been watching Thomann's (The biggest online music store in Europe) DAW sales rankings which should be a fair indication of how BitWig is selling. Last week they were 21 in the DAW sales ranking and this week they are number 2.
Good news for BitWig and despite my complaining about the high price it does look as though they got it right. I shan't be buying but congratulations for hitting the number 2 spot in less than a week.
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04-01-2014, 11:15 AM
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#311
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Zürich
Posts: 1,008
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There is more competition now.
Ableton is in danger to lose the monopoly they had in a certain segment .
That is good.
The cubase fanbots now will not only have to defend their holy grail against : "but it works in reaper" but also against "why don't you do it like bitwig" .
That is even better.
Linux nerds might even rethink whether the Linux audio architecture is feasible for professional audio or just a bit enterprisey (over engineered)
That is good too.
But reaper is still my choice.
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04-01-2014, 11:21 AM
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#312
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 1,972
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerry
I have been watching Thomann's (The biggest online music store in Europe) DAW sales rankings which should be a fair indication of how BitWig is selling. Last week they were 21 in the DAW sales ranking and this week they are number 2.
Good news for BitWig and despite my complaining about the high price it does look as though they got it right. I shan't be buying but congratulations for hitting the number 2 spot in less than a week.
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I thinks its not that obvious. The Bitwig just came out and the dynamic of sells is for sure higher than other daws. Let's see what will happen when the hype will over.
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04-01-2014, 05:16 PM
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#313
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
I stand corrected on that particular example.
I won't keep this debate going by seeking out a $40 example, which certainly existed somewhere, a $40 daw app that did things Reaper 1.0 couldn't do yet... although of course, midi wise, even Acid Free did lots of things Reaper couldn't do yet.
I think everyone gets the point.
Thanks Justin.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
Exactly, that was my point.
If one is inclined to cherry pick like that, especially with a 1.0, it's very, very easy to do.
I've still never seen a 1.0 with multi-track templates like Reaper's current great templates. One may have existed in some universe far away but I've never personally seen it.
Otoh, I've never seen a 1.0 that does the things Bitwig does well, done so well at 1.0, it's other really obvious flaws excluded, so... it's all relative.
Speaking honestly, the only thing missing there that was a semi-surprise to me personally was clip fades, not being able to draw fades. That, for any wanna be pro audio app, to me anyway, is indeed a little unusual.
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Ay Caramba
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04-01-2014, 05:22 PM
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#314
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
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My favorite feature since now in bitwig is that you cant export any midi clip, file or project........, nothing, only in wav format, this incredible feature its not implemented yet in any daw ,without any doubt, its the daw that will master all the rest........
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04-01-2014, 05:35 PM
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#315
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lxm
Ay Caramba
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Let it go man.
I would, if people would stop quoting me.
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04-01-2014, 05:40 PM
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#316
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
Let it go man.
I would, if people would stop quoting me.
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Don't have a cow, Man.
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04-01-2014, 05:46 PM
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#317
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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I won't, if you stop having a cow quoting me, trying to pull me back into the debate when our conversation about that ended a day or two ago already.
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04-01-2014, 05:52 PM
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#318
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
I won't, if you stop having a cow quoting me, trying to pull me back into the debate when our conversation about that ended a day or two ago already.
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I didn't do it
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04-01-2014, 05:53 PM
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#319
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,792
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Another day, another update (1.0.5)...
It must be why Cockos released two updates today, gotta stay ahead of those young whippersnappers!
__________________
FRs: v5 Media Explorer Requests, Global Quantization, Session View
Win10 Pro 64-bit, Reaper 6(x64), AMD 3950x, Aorus X570 Master, 64GB DDR4 3600, PowerColor Red Devil 5700XT, EVO 970 2TB, 10TB HD, Define R6
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04-01-2014, 06:01 PM
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#320
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 21,551
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PitchSlap
Another day, another update (1.0.5)...
It must be why Cockos released two updates today, gotta stay ahead of those young whippersnappers!
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Lol. Yeah, they seem to be fixing a lot of stuff quickly, which is good. They fixed the PDC issue already, which was (apparently) just too low a max delay ceiling or something.
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