Old 12-23-2014, 09:54 AM   #1
chas51
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hey gang,

am posting looking please for advice/thoughts on what drum VST to get.

I have it narrowed down to:
-Native Instruments Studio Drummer
-Superior Drummer 2.0 with NY Legacy 2.0
-FXpansion BFD 3 with Percussion Expansion.

the first choice has the advantage of being cheaper.

here's my situation. I am an amateur level dude that loves to sing, play guitar, key and record myself (mostly singing and playing guitar, but I love it all.
I am in my late 50's.
recently, I played a Vdrum kit. I loved it. I am new to drumming, though. I bought a Vdrum kit.
now I want to get a VST to use with it.
I have done that, for digital pianos, and it is awesome.
for the drum VST, I really only want to get one for now.
thus my post, asking please for any help in choosing.
thanks,
Happiest Holiday ever!!!
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Old 12-23-2014, 09:58 AM   #2
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I suggest you research (and buy!) an option not on your list.....

Addictive Drums

I am in my late 40's and mostly guitarist/bassist/arranger. Addictive Drums has allowed me to do full productions that continuously fool real drummers. Just my opinion, of course.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:14 AM   #3
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The most important aspect is gonna be if a plugin's drum sound speaks to you or not. I bought Superior 2.0 because I really liked the way the Allaire expansion sounded. Avatar, not so much. Like the last guy said, Addictive Drums sounds really good too, and has the advantage of being pre-mixed and pre-processed, unlike Superior. I'd also take a look at EZDrummer 2, which is from the makers of Superior Drummer and doesn't require any mixing or processing to sound good in a mix.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:24 AM   #4
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NI Studio Drummer, EZX Jazz, sometimes NI Battery3or4, but I prefer either using my NI KONTAKT user drums with all kind of drum and percussion samples or I take a wav loop and insert with media Explorer different one shot samples in order to create my own drum loop after having (dynamic) split the loop item

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Old 12-23-2014, 10:29 AM   #5
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I have Native Instruments Studio Drummer and Toontrack Superior Drummer 2 and for playing with a VDrums kit (I have a hybrid kit based on a TD20exp and TD12), SDII wins out. NI Studio Drummer sounds great but the hihats don't work well with VDrums. SDII on the other hand works flawlessly.

I also have the Custom and Vintage SDX and the Twisted EZX. Both add some great sounds to SDII.

I've also heard good things about Addictive Drums but haven't used it personally.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:34 AM   #6
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There are a TON of good drum romplers out therre.
I have a Roland TD8 kit, also one of the original Korg NanpPads and use both regularly in projects.

My go-tos have always been EZDrummer1 and mre recently EZD2, plus a combination of Addictive Drums1/2 and Steven Slate Drums 4 Platinum (currently on sale)

In addition I have many third party drum romplers that use Kontakt and they all have their uses, but the most e-kit friendly ones I have found all seem to be from Toontrack. I ought Superior Drummer on a special sale and I have to say that once I learnt a LOT more about e-drumming, it does have a lot of stellar features if you are looking for realism, but a steep learning curve before you can fool real drummers.
Same goes for every other drum rompler as well.

At this time of year you can usually score a bargain but it would make sense to try the free versions which are available for most of these.

And the hardest part is getting your e-kit really dialled in with whatever software you choose. Just sorting out velocity curves that suit your playing is part art part science. Good luck.

Oh - and I am still a crap drummer!
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:39 AM   #7
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Steven Slate Drums. Tried several over the years and always end up using this.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:48 AM   #8
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thank you to all who replied so far.
ReaDave, I am now thinking very seriously about getting Superior Drummer 2.0 with Expansion kits you posted.
I have a TD15KV, that I will be using with whatever VST I get.

would you please (if you feel like it), tell me a little more?

-can you possibly compare it to BFD3?
-with regards to Superior Drummer 2.0 Expansion choices: do you have any thoughts about the NY Legacy expansion?

hey gang, of course still looking for any more thoughts/advice on all possibilities.
I have a few days, before I have to decide.
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Old 12-23-2014, 10:55 AM   #9
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just saw last 2 posts.
thank you both of you guys.
Ivan, any thoughts about BFD3?
I might have this narrowed down to BFD3 or Superior Drummer now.
and you haven't heard poor drumming til you've heard me.
I am just starting. I have the freakin time of my life messing around.
but I have got to buckle down and learn how to just keep a steady consistent beat.
I have a huge new respect for drummers man.
I just had no clue.
after chuckling smugly inside all these years at all the drummer jokes, like "what do you call a guy that hangs around with musicians?"
"a drummer."
hahahhahaha.
hey, guess what, so far this sometimes seems like brain surgery to me.
you have to do 4 things at once. (and thats if you're not a singing drummer. yowwwwww!!!!!)
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Old 12-23-2014, 11:39 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
thank you to all who replied so far.
ReaDave, I am now thinking very seriously about getting Superior Drummer 2.0 with Expansion kits you posted.
I have a TD15KV, that I will be using with whatever VST I get.

would you please (if you feel like it), tell me a little more?

-can you possibly compare it to BFD3?
-with regards to Superior Drummer 2.0 Expansion choices: do you have any thoughts about the NY Legacy expansion?
I did pretty much the same thing you did as far as learning to play drums is concerned. I started with the TD12 module and a fairly basic setup and just played and played to learn and improve, having heaps of fun along the way.
As I went along, my kit somewhat expanded (slight understatement) and I went from custom module sounds to Superior Drummer II which I have been using now for a few years. I don't have the NY Legacy expansion. I have the NY Avatar kit which comes with SDII which is great and also have the aforementioned Custom and Vintage SDX which has some really nice snares, toms and ride cymbals and the Twisted EZX (lots of cool stuff in there).

I've also never used BFD3 but plenty of VDrummers use it successfully. I've just found that SDII works with minimal tweaking (you can get great results out of the box with a V kit), sounds great and is reliable and very configurable if you want to dig in and tweak things.
The most important things are that the hihats are super responsive in SDII and things like cymbal chokes work properly without needing to jump through hoops.

If you want to hear a couple of fairly elaborate tracks I've recorded using SDII, C&V SDX and my V Drums, there's two tracks on an album I'm still working on below. These tracks are a mix of prog rock, acoustic and Berlin 70's electronic with vintage synths, Hammond/Leslie cab, 30 piece choir (in Lion of Judah), vocoder (Lion of Judah), trumpet (Day of the LORD), electric and acoustic guitar, drums, bass and Yamaha acoustic grand piano (end of Lion of Judah). They are Christian tracks so be forewarned that there's plenty of stuff about God in the lyrics!!

The Day of the LORD - mp3 downloads
  • The Day of the LORD - V Drums start at 3:13
  • Lion of Judah - V Drums start at 4:06


and here's a photo of my kit at it's largest iteration:



and a recent scaled down version:


Last edited by ReaDave; 12-23-2014 at 11:46 AM.
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Old 12-23-2014, 11:42 AM   #11
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Another old guy checking in.

I was in your position a few years back and picking drum software was one of the hardest decisions I had to make. After much research I went with BFD (version 1.5 actually). BFD2 was even better and BFD3 is the cat's pajamas. ()

I've got Studio Drummer and some other drum software, but for me BFD does it!

It is also on sale at the moment (till the end of the year, I believe) bundled with the percussion expansion.


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Old 12-23-2014, 11:51 AM   #12
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... and of course Sennheiser´s Drum Mic´A, love the different microphone settings and the very specific drum sound.

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Old 12-23-2014, 12:12 PM   #13
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hey you guys, really super grateful for all of your replies and very helpful info.

ReaDave, super psyched to listen to your tracks. you are amazing. the pictures of your drum sets..........wow.....I'm just blown away.....(that term does not begin to cover the level of my awe.
drums, man......who knew that it would this fun and cool??


thank you again Giano.

bluzkat, (fellow old guy. hahahahahahhaa),
if you feel like it, please, I am all ears for any more thoughts at all about BFD3.
I will have to choose eventually, between it and Superior Drummer.
have you used Superior Drummer 2.0?
so, could you compare it to BFD3?
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Old 12-23-2014, 12:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
....
drums, man......who knew that it would this fun and cool??
..
Now THAT I can relate to!! Be prepared to lose vast amounts of time behind your kit (and possibly some $$ too)! Your comments and enthusiasm sounds a lot like mine when I first started in 2007.

I haven't posted there for a while but I was a regular contributor on the vdrums.com forum for a few years. Lots of helpful folk there and some great DIY info too. You might want to have a look around. Be forewarned though, you may get a bout of GAS!

Thanks heaps for the compliments too. Glad you like the tracks.
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Old 12-23-2014, 12:52 PM   #15
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you rock ReaDave.
I joined that forum.
yeah, very cool, nice people there too.
roger all you said.
one thing I have noticed about playing drums is that it warms me up. I live in the Great Frozen North.
for me, warm is good.
also, I have some pains in this aging body. I have found that drumming is helping with that too. thank heavens!!

wishing for you the Merriest Christmas ever!! thank you for all your great replies.
still very much on the fence.
BFD3 looks really cool. so does Superior Drummer 2.0.
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Old 12-23-2014, 12:54 PM   #16
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Here's a photo of the recording session for the 30 piece choir (Tides of Welcome Gospel Choir) I used for Lion of Judah. That's REAPER running on my old laptop with one of my Mackie Onyx desks. The mics are set up in a surround sound variation of the Decca Tree configuration. Mics are 2x Rode NT2a, 1x AKG C414eb (CK12 capsule), 2x Crown PZM's and 1x AKG C451e.

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Old 12-23-2014, 12:57 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
you rock ReaDave.
I joined that forum.
yeah, very cool, nice people there too.
roger all you said.
one thing I have noticed about playing drums is that it warms me up. I live in the Great Frozen North.
for me, warm is good.
also, I have some pains in this aging body. I have found that drumming is helping with that too. thank heavens!!

wishing for you the Merriest Christmas ever!! thank you for all your great replies.
still very much on the fence.
BFD3 looks really cool. so does Superior Drummer 2.0.
Same wishes for you too!

Whichever VSTi you go for, you're in for a fun ride!

I have many pains in this body of mine too. If you haven't already tried it, I highly recommend Krill oil. I take 1000mg in the morning and 1000mg at night and most of my joint and tendon pain has gone completely. It is wonderful stuff!
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Old 12-23-2014, 01:01 PM   #18
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you are just awesome, man.
thank you so much again.
Decca Tree. I read that term yesterday regarding mic'ing stuff. I totally forget. I have to look it up now.
how totally freakin cool, your recording a 30 piece choir!!!
thank you for the Krill oil suggestion. I will check it out right now.
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Old 12-23-2014, 01:10 PM   #19
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Decca Tree is a really cool mic technique that gives some very detailed imaging and great sound stage depth. I'm a bit of a geek when it comes to that sort of thing but then again, I dare say most of us here fit that category. This is a forum all about audio after all.

As for the Krill oil, this is the best one I've found. It isn't the cheapest but it works and when you suffer chronic joint and tendon pain, it is worth every cent...
http://www.swisse.com/au/vitamins-an...ill-oil-1000mg
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Old 12-23-2014, 01:21 PM   #20
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thank you ReaDave.

I have nerve pain from operations. it is brutal. I will check out that Krill oil link.

hey, I thought of a question. I am looking for a VST that has awesome presets.
so I can just click on different presets, and play.

how is Superior Drummer 2.0 for that?
and anyone else out there familiar with BFD3 and presets?

I love the idea of being able to tweak sounds. but I also super like the idea of having awesome presets, that were designed by someone with expertise in drumming and getting a good mic'ed drum sound.

I'm reading this thread now:

http://www.fxpansion.com/forum/viewt...36523732ef2132

Last edited by chas51; 12-23-2014 at 01:28 PM.
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Old 12-23-2014, 02:15 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
I love the idea of being able to tweak sounds. but I also super like the idea of having awesome presets, that were designed by someone with expertise in drumming and getting a good mic'ed drum sound.
You might want to take a look at the videos on this page...

http://www.fxpansion.com/index.php?page=205&tab=494.

There is also a demo available on that page (if you're interested).

I can't compare Superior, it wasn't around when I bought BFD. I've never had a desire for anything else (drum software that is )


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Old 12-23-2014, 02:49 PM   #22
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Superior drummer 2 is hands down the best drum rompler I have used as far as integration with a E-kit is concerned.
You have a very decent kit - much better hihat implementation than mine.
But if you are looking for serious integration and flexibility SD2 is the way to go.

It comes with NY Avatar/volume one but the cool thing is that you dont HAVE to use just the SDX addons, all the EZ drummer EZX kits (of which I have a ton) can be used but with added capability you ant access in EZD1.
Too new to EZD2 to be able to comment, but people are saying it offers 90% of the functionality of SD2 for less money.
I have BFD Eco and also the version that came with the Zidjian Cymbal K pack, but haven't bonded to it in the same way as I did the others.
Like I said, demos and free versions first, THEN buy. There are always good sales on one or other of our leading contenders.
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Old 12-23-2014, 03:00 PM   #23
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you rock bluzkat. hahahaha
thanks alot!!!
I have watched a couple videos. I will watch and listen to more.

ivan, thanks again. your comments are very helpful. roger all you said. looking at the EZX kits now too. what are your favorite EZX kits?
ok, thats a very strong vote for SD2.

but do you have any experience with BFD3?
could it be even better?
37 presets (which is what it comes with), if they're good, actually is probably plenty.
I looked over the Percussion Expansion set that comes with the current promotion.
it includes a Rubbermaid garbage can being struck with a soup ladle. hahahahaha.
you can listen to all the instruments in the kit on FXpansion's website.
anyway, continuing to read up and listen up to videos on both.
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Old 12-23-2014, 04:12 PM   #24
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Hi chas51

Well, another on and off the wagon Drum VSTi junki here

I have Superoir 2.0, EZ Drummer 1 & 2 ( and EXpansion packs ), BFD Eco, Jamstix 3.?, Steven Slate drums 3.5, MT Power Drumkit as well as numerious other Sample sets mapped in either Kontakt or Shortcircuit.

I don't own an E-Kit but 2 of my friends do, one of which bought BFD 2.0 when it came out ( around the same time i got SD2.0 ) i remember he had all sorts of trouble getting BFD to work well with his Kit, Roland TD9 i think, anykow he ended up bringing his e-kit over and hooked it into my daw and used SD2.0 and it just worked, straight up no problems.
My other mate has had his TD12 kit here as well and we had zero problems with recording drums while monitoring through SD2.0.

I'm not trying to say SD2 is better than BFD, im sure there are many people using BFD and getting great results, i'm just sharing my experience with e-kits and BFD, SD2.

I use all the drum vsti i have at different times ( except Steven slate drums ) which is just not the sound i like, but i can say that about 80 - 90% of the time SD2.0 with one of the many EZX's SDX's i have will end up on the track.

If i had the benifit of hindsight right now and didn't own a drum VSTi i'd buy SD2.0, get some Expansion packs and forget about drum vsti


Also, i recently bought Aerodrums and i've been having a blast just messing around with that. I'm not a drummer either and l don't know if learning to play air drums is harder than real drums but either way hats off to all you hot drummers out there !!


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Old 12-23-2014, 04:14 PM   #25
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chas,

Did you hear the 'preset' demos? See here...

https://soundcloud.com/fxpansion/sets/bfd3-preset-demos.


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Old 12-23-2014, 04:20 PM   #26
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you rock Wolffman.
thank you for your super helpful generous post.
have been listening to tons of demos and reading about both VST's.
right now I'm checking out a video on youtube, where a dude is going through many of the sounds in BFD3, including presets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0q07KTTioU

I like it. alot.


bluzkat, that is slamming. checking it out now.
I am getting more interested in BFD3 now.

Last edited by chas51; 12-23-2014 at 04:30 PM.
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Old 12-23-2014, 04:47 PM   #27
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This is a cool vid showing how well SD2 and V-Drums work together.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giFEKDweJss

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Old 12-23-2014, 04:53 PM   #28
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awesome.
thank you man.
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Old 12-23-2014, 07:26 PM   #29
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Can anyone comment on the sound quality of SSD Platinum vs BFD3 vs Addictive Drums?

From the sound samples on the site, SSD Platinum seems to sound more natural and usable than Ezdrummer 2.

I probably don't know how to get the most out of Ezdrummer, but I haven't been able to get a good natural sound out of it.

Anyway, the SSD (from the demos) sound good to my ears. Curious about the others.

Also, do all of the above mentioned work well with Reaper? (I Know Ezdrummer does)
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Old 12-23-2014, 08:29 PM   #30
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Quote:
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Can anyone comment on the sound quality of SSD Platinum vs BFD3 vs Addictive Drums?

From the sound samples on the site, SSD Platinum seems to sound more natural and usable than Ezdrummer 2.

I probably don't know how to get the most out of Ezdrummer, but I haven't been able to get a good natural sound out of it.

Anyway, the SSD (from the demos) sound good to my ears. Curious about the others.

Also, do all of the above mentioned work well with Reaper? (I Know Ezdrummer does)
never had trouble with superior 2 in reaper
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Old 12-24-2014, 01:24 AM   #31
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Quote:
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...hey, I thought of a question. I am looking for a VST that has awesome presets.
so I can just click on different presets, and play.

how is Superior Drummer 2.0 for that?...
To be honest, I haven't played around with the presets in SD2. I'm more of a 'create a preset as I need it' kind of guy. There are a number of presets included between the NY Avatar, C&V and Twisted kit though. I've just never played around with them.

There's quite a few presets available from Toontrack (not free though) and there's a thread on vdrums.com specifically dedicated to SD2 presets which are free.

vdrums.com thread here - http://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced...presets-thread

Toontrack presets here - http://www.toontrack.com/product-cat...ducer-presets/

As far as SD2 with REAPER is concerned, it works flawlessly here even running two instances together on different MIDI channels with my V Drums kit (and this runs faultlessly on my laptop with only 4GB of RAM too).
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Old 12-24-2014, 02:36 AM   #32
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Addictive Drums 2 and the Artists Bundle at less that half price looks oh so tempting.

http://www.xlnaudio.com/products/
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Old 12-24-2014, 04:16 AM   #33
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thank you guys.

hey ReaDave, awesome man. super thanks again.
I've been leaning towards BFD3, after watching a couple pretty cool videos on youtube.
but, I am going to check those vdrum forum links you posted.
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Old 12-24-2014, 06:36 AM   #34
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Dave - what have you got the cat tuned to?

OP: I have had the chance to test AD and SD2 AND Slate 4 platinum extensively, but not BFD3, a I decided I didn't like it enough to pay the money for the full version.
Slate has a large selection of very usable drum sounds but there again so does AD2 and SD2.

There are two things you have to decide here - am I looking mostly of ease of use with my e-kit, or quality and variety of sounds?

I have a feeling you will wind up like myself and many others who are "picky" about their drum sounds and buy a LOT of romplers & soundsets.
One to try out is AnalogueDrums dot com's Big Mono which is free but you do need Kontkat free to try it out and the full version of kontakt if you want to use any non-authorised 3rd party kontakt libraries.
I wound up buying kontakt 3 on super special sale and it now forms such an integral part of what I do, it was a no-brainer.

ALL my horn parts re done with Kontakt instruments, for instance.
So not just good for drums.
If you go this route, check out Analogue Drums Splitsticks kit. cheap and really good.

This is a really shit quality demo, but listen to the drums and see if you like them. That is ezd1 with the classic rock kit playing a very basic loop I programmed in for the demo. Final track is going to be real players and 2" tape (I hope)

https://soundcloud.com/wasplollies/j...here-rough-mix
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Old 12-24-2014, 06:51 AM   #35
chas51
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roger all of that.
thank you very much ivan.
listening now.
like it. alot.
is that you singing?
really cool song, man.

I think you're right. I am looking for positively best bang for my buck, super great sounds.
I somehow have it in my head, that the answer (for me), is BFD3.
but I am continuing to check youtube videos about BFD3 and Superior Drummer 2.0.

I am now sure that both are excellent. just gotta get as much info as I can, and then pick.
will check out Analogue Drums now too.

and I've heard it said that "you can't tune a fish",
but if you properly "tune a cat",
methinks it would make it easier to make a "cat"-chy tune.
hahahahhahaha
oh, the things that amuse the simple wanna-be drummer's mind.......

Last edited by chas51; 12-24-2014 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 12-24-2014, 07:14 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Dave - what have you got the cat tuned to?
Definitely C# ('c' for 'claws').
Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
and I've heard it said that "you can't tune a fish",
but if you properly "tune a cat",
methinks it would make it easier to make a "cat"-chy tune.
hahahahhahaha
oh, the things that amuse the simple wannbe drummer's mind.......
You and I have the same bent sense of humour!!
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Old 12-24-2014, 07:19 AM   #37
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Chas, one thing I cannot stress highly enough is the issue of hihat responsiveness. This may not seem like a biggie to you right now, especially when just starting out, but it will drive you nuts once you get the basics down if the VSTi you choose does not work well with e-kits. Hihat response is one of the biggest differentiating things between VSTi's when it comes to e-kit playability.

The only thing holding me back from using the Kontakt drum libraries I have here is the hihat response with my kit. It is all over the place and makes it unplayable which is a big pity because the libraries are great.
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Old 12-24-2014, 07:25 AM   #38
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A HUGE plus one for that. I am saving up my money for a TD12 and a VH11 hihat for exactly that reason.

And YES SD2 is by far the most responsive out of the 3rd party Kontakt kits, SD EZD AD, BFD Eco, Battery, Slate4, MDrummer, Volko Alaturq, which is all the drum romplers I own, for cymbals and Hihats.
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Old 12-24-2014, 07:27 AM   #39
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hahahahaha
awesome Dave.

I'm gonna PM you.
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Old 12-24-2014, 07:31 AM   #40
chas51
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Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
A HUGE plus one for that. I am saving up my money for a TD12 and a VH11 hihat for exactly that reason.

And YES SD2 is by far the most responsive out of the 3rd party Kontakt kits, SD EZD AD, BFD Eco, Battery, Slate4, MDrummer, Volko Alaturq, which is all the drum romplers I own, for cymbals and Hihats.

thank you ivan.

do you know if BFD3 would work as good in this respect, as SD2?

and I checked out Analogue Drums a little. the first expansion I checked, said I needed full version Kontakt. its $399. I don't know that I'll ever be mixing horns (I think its awesome and amazing that you do. also saw in another thread that you teach Bass. man, you do it all!!)
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