V6.13+dev0809 - August 9

[musicbynumbers]

v6.13+dev0809 - August 9 2020

• + Area selection: left-drag on empty track space creates area selection by default (experimental)
• + JSFX: allow image/gfx window dimensions up to 8192 pixels
• + Metadata: support embedding ID3 tag in .wav files
• + ReaScript: allow image/gfx window dimensions up to 8192 pixels
• + Render dialog: improve tab order
• + Render: add option to always embed title/date/time
• + Windows: write INFO metadata as the last chunk in a .wav file so Windows Explorer will see it [t=240957]
• # Area selection: add left-drag mouse modifiers to add to area selection
• # Area selection: add mouse modifiers to move/copy areas horizontally
• # Area selection: fix behavior when first or last track in project is hidden [p=2330056]

This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode

[Vagelis]

Thanks for the area mouse modifiers!
I still wish and appreciate a lot if we had another modifier to copy the hidden envelopes

Originally Posted by musicbynumbers

v6.13+dev0809 - August 9 2020
[list][*]+ Area selection: left-drag on empty track space creates area selection by default (experimental)

Is this behavior by design?

[daniellumertz]

sometimes I have to click twice to move the edit cursor

1click. it changes the track selected
2click. it moves it

I think related to the new area selection in the left click + snaps

[planetnine]

Originally Posted by daniellumertz

sometimes I have to click twice to move the edit cursor

1click. it changes the track selected
2click. it moves it

I think related to the new area selection in the left click + snaps

Confirmed.


>

[daniellumertz]

testing for some minutes I have to say, I prefer area selection in the right click, as it resembles the marquee, I was a bit disoriented using it in the left.... But happy devs are making developing to be a option for those who want in the left.

IMHO I find more organized keep in the right with the marquee.

[bolgwrad]

Originally Posted by daniellumertz

sometimes I have to click twice to move the edit cursor

1click. it changes the track selected
2click. it moves it

I think related to the new area selection in the left click + snaps

Yes. Seems to be the speed you click at; unless you're very crisp, it takes 2 clicks to move the edit cursor (especially noticeable if you click and move the mouse cursor vertically, ie nothing happens).

[planetnine]

Originally Posted by daniellumertz

testing for some minutes I have to say, I prefer area selection in the right click, as it resembles the marquee, I was a bit disoriented using it in the left.... But happy devs are making developing to be a option for those who want in the left.

IMHO I find more organized keep in the right with the marquee.

Yes, but we have options to have AS, MS and TS on the right drag if we want.

As Area has taken over from TS as left drag default on this pre, I’ve put TS on right drag and it comes easily. I might keep it there even if they swap the AS default back.


>

[n997]

Originally Posted by daniellumertz

sometimes I have to click twice to move the edit cursor

1click. it changes the track selected
2click. it moves it

I think related to the new area selection in the left click + snaps

Confirmed also when testing with a pencil (Wacom Cintiq 13HD).
Turning snapping off alleviates this.

In dev0808 and 0809, when snapping is off, clicks which have small movement between mousedown and mouseup - as common when using a pencil - may create tiny Area selections. Latency [between mousedown and mouseup] might be a factor too, I am not quite sure.

When snapping is on, instead of making tiny Area selections, these "imperfect clicks" appear to initiate dragging, thus canceling the click. But snapping settings in turn may cancel the dragging, so that neither click nor drag appear to happen.

Interestingly, with these "imperfect" clicks and "Track/left drag" set to "Area selection", in dev0809 track selection via "Track/left click" now works much more reliably than in dev0808.
But, as stated, in dev0809 a related problem affects the edit cursor.


Is there any way for user to change values which affect these behaviors?
If not, could they be made user-adjustable?

[X-Raym]

Thx for render window tab fixed !

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by musicbynumbers

v6.13+dev0809 - August 9 2020
[list][*]+ Area selection: left-drag on empty track space creates area selection by default (experimental)

This feels pretty natural to me. Left drag to area select, alt+left drag to add to selection, then timeline+left drag for time selection. All very comfortable.

Just hoping to see some of the Time Selection actions expanded to area selections. Example: Ctrl+Shift+Left Drag with an area selection to create and modify an envelope segment. Someone mentioned that in the last thread but just need the last few actions that work on time selection only expanded to Area Selection and I think this Left Drag+AS option would be near-complete.

[daniellumertz]

Originally Posted by planetnine

Yes, but we have options to have AS, MS and TS on the right drag if we want.

As Area has taken over from TS as left drag default on this pre, I’ve put TS on right drag and it comes easily. I might keep it there even if they swap the AS default back.


>

I will test some more in the next dev(I got back to 0808 because of the need of double click) maybe it was because of being to used that I find strange....

[n997]

v6.13+dev0809a - August 9 2020
# Mouse: improve left-click responsiveness when not drawing area selection

Thanks! After some quick testing this appears to have improved the situation. The problem can still happen (as described in https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=2330521) especially with pencil, but considerably less often than on dev0809.



Again, I hope there could be a way to adjust values related to this on user side, so that users of drawing displays and [non-display] drawing tablets with different pencil technologies and movement-to-cursor ratios could try to find optimal settings for their particular devices.
I suppose that such adjustability could be useful also when using trackball mice, though I have no personal experience with those.

[vitalker]

v6.13+dev0809a - August 9 2020

• # Mouse: alt+drag on empty track space selects time by default
• # Mouse: improve left-click responsiveness when not drawing area selection

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode

[planetnine]

We just need AS to select items now

Could we get the box to persist after a clipboard copy please?

Will copy/paste have the same reach and bounds as moving/copying with the mouse? Thinking about copying parts of items and envelopes/EI.

Thank you for all the hard work...


>

[EvilDragon]

Originally Posted by planetnine

We just need AS to select items now

Then it's not AS.

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by planetnine

We just need AS to select items now

It already does it, doesn't it?

[Loulou92]

Is the new area selection going to affect any past workflow ? As of now, I'm fine with Time selection, I hope my config won't break with an area selection overtake.

[EvilDragon]

You just don't use any AS modifiers and you're good.

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

Then it's not AS.

Yeap.

[bolgwrad]

Originally Posted by vitalker

It already does it, doesn't it?

I've tweaked my colours/AS fill blend mode to highlight items in a selected area; a reminder that anything in an AS is selected.

[_Stevie_]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

Then it's not AS.

I think you misunderstood planetnine. What he means is creating an area selection within the boundaries of the underlying item. You can then easily extend the selection downwards/upwards.
Pretty much all major DAWs support that by double clickIng on an item.

[EvilDragon]

Ah, well that is just a new mouse modifier for media item double click context. Two of them - create AS with the length of the item, or add to AS the length of the item.

[lb0]

Originally Posted by musicbynumbers

[*]+ ReaScript: allow image/gfx window dimensions up to 8192 pixels

OMG - I'm yet to test this but if it is what it says it is - thank you so so much!!!

EDIT: It is - awesome - thanks again!!

[planetnine]

AS = Area Selection does it not?

What I mean is sling the box around several items or parts of items, maybe including envelopes and envelope items, possibly across several tracks, then copy, and paste into a different project.

Yes, I know it’s meant to drag, move, copy without splitting. But this AS implementation will be a bit hollow and ineffective if it can’t use the clipboard by the time it’s complete.

With Marquee Select, I can select items with their envelope lanes and a Time Selection at the same time. I can then copy the intersection of the selected items and the TS and paste it into another project, multiple tracks, envelopes and all.

That was the old way with MS and TS. Now with AS, we can select portions of items, a section of multiple tracks and even multiple areas of parts or whole media items. No need for splitting or Time Selections for the bounds. So why can’t we put what we’ve selected on the clipboard and copy or cut to somewhere else?

Nobody wants to drag something 50 tracks down, or four hours down the timeline, and you can’t drag to another project, so why shouldn’t AS be allowed to uh, select?

Now I’m hoping that this is all part of the plan and the Devs just haven’t finished AS yet. Please don’t tell me that there is no intention to use the clipboard with AS and we won’t be able to copy or cut chunks with their automation and item/take FX to other projects...


>

[schwa]

Originally Posted by planetnine

What I mean is sling the box around several items or parts of items, maybe including envelopes and envelope items, possibly across several tracks, then copy, and paste into a different project.

You can do this now.

[planetnine]

It’s not working for me in 0809a, Schwa.

I presumed I was getting ahead of you guys and that part hadn’t been implemented yet. I’ll go back and see if I’m doing something awry. Thank you.


>

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by _Stevie_

I think you misunderstood planetnine. What he means is creating an area selection within the boundaries of the underlying item. You can then easily extend the selection downwards/upwards.
Pretty much all major DAWs support that by double clickIng on an item.

But AS is not selecting the item and i think that's because AS doesn't care about what's underneath, but what's inside the box. How could AS detect the size of the item in order to extend the selection to the size of the item?

Some DAWS, have a left click modifier to extend AS horizontally or vertically relatively to the mouse position. (e.g above,bellow,to the right or left of the selection)

[planetnine]

That's a good idea, Stevie, but it's not what I was trying to say. I was trying to copy the AS as seen to the clipboard and pasting it elsewhere (ie new project).

I've got problems getting it to work, partially due to me right-clicking the AS to copy it (that deletes the AS box) and ending up doing a regular copy, and part something else. A couple of restarts later and realising you have to right-click outside the AS box to "copy selected area" and it's working pretty much as I'd hoped.

An important observation from this is: Can an AS be right-clicked inside the box for it's context menu (eg to copy area) without destroying the AS in the process please?

Many thanks for bearing with me...


>

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by planetnine

An important observation from this is: Can an AS be right-clicked inside the box for it's context menu (eg to copy area) without destroying the AS in the process please?
>

That would be nice to have. A dedicated menu for AS when we right click on the selection.

[schwa]

There is no "copy area" action by default in any context menu. But the main Edit/Copy action will work, or the usual ctrl+C shortcut (or ctrl+X to cut).

[_Stevie_]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

Ah, well that is just a new mouse modifier for media item double click context. Two of them - create AS with the length of the item, or add to AS the length of the item.

Yep, agreed. That would be perfect.

[Vagelis]

Devs regarding modifier "copy one area without copying other areas", when i have a selection including 3 envelope lanes, as shown in the gif below, then when i 'm trying to copy individually each part to another track envelope lane, it works only for the first envelope lane. With the others following, i wasn't able to copy them to the other track lanes. It would be nice if we could choose any of the selected envelopes of the source track and copy each of them to another track's envelope lanes.
I thought i could try the "add to selection" modifier for envelope contexts to see if it could work when the number of selected lanes was the same with the lanes of the destination track, but it wasn't there. (for the case of selecting the 1st and 3rd lane)
EDIT: hmm basically the same thing happens with the "move one area" modifier, can't move areas individually to other track.

[planetnine]

Originally Posted by schwa

There is no "copy area" action by default in any context menu. But the main Edit/Copy action will work, or the usual ctrl+C shortcut (or ctrl+X to cut).

Well there is “Copy selected area of items” in the Arrange View(?) context menu, but I’d now worked out that ctrl-c and ctrl-v work, too. Everything is working as I’d hoped, although not destroying the AS with right click would prevent some user confusion if that’s possible please.

Thanks for preserving item ruler status and take markers on copying these items, this is shaping up really nicely for some of my workflows.


>

[schwa]

Originally Posted by Vagelis

Devs regarding modifier "copy one area without copying other areas", when i have a selection including 3 envelope lanes, as shown in the gif below, then when i 'm trying to copy individually each part to another track envelope lane, it works only for the first envelope lane.

That's a bug, fixing, thanks!

[Yanick]

I believe that the default should be time selection on the left drag. If you make the area selection select all items in the group of items like time selection, then it is convenient for audio editing, but since this is not happening yet, and most likely it is conceptually debatable, it is better to leave TS. If most people like this default setting, good, but I'll leave it as it was.

[Yanick]

And yes, it is necessary that after the update this setting does not get up by itself Then there will be no bad comments

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by schwa

That's a bug, fixing, thanks!

Thanks! I edit the post above, but in case you didn't notice, the same thing happens with "move one area" modifier as well.

[Yanick]

To make it easier for people to master the reaper from scratch, you can make an area selection tool so that there is a button. But then you need to change a lot of sections at once in the mouse modifiers - "track", "media item", "media item bottom half", etc., this is again very difficult, so right drag was a very good idea for AS

[ferropop]

Devs just curious: is there a roadmap to add all the useful Time Selection manipulations to Area Selection? Most of them more naturally fit with AS anyways.

ie:



This operation really has nothing to do with Time Selection, but we've been exploiting TS to do things like that.

And yeah, normally we'd just use the Time Selection And Marquee (no snap) Modifier, but with modifiers being taken up by AS now people are reaching for the Ruler to create Time Selections. This is bad - so often you're just looking to do a detailed off-the-grid operation like above, pertaining to just a tiny item. Trying to accurately draw an off-the-grid time selection without modifiers is really tough. You're interacting with the top of the screen meanwhile your item is elsewhere and should be the actual focus!

AS is really more suited to the above (and a huge handful of other) scenarios; just wondering if it's in the works! Pretty sure Sexan's script handled this, as a blueprint.

[Yanick]

It would be much more correct to make the markuee tool on the left drag and the area selection on the right drag by default. Because for the area selection the place where to start drawing is important, but for the markuee tool it is not so important, and on the left drag it will be good