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04-04-2011, 08:06 AM
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#81
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Oxford, UK
Posts: 99
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Oh. I thought this was a thread about classic New Orleans funk.
Carry on.
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04-10-2011, 05:49 PM
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#82
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 18
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Haven't read through the entire thread, but I thought I'd throw in my 2c...
While it's important to get some visual clues on what's going on in the audio I believe that too many big meters can be a waste of space. All you are really looking for are the peaks and the averages so everything below the peak/average is pretty much wasted space. A large color filled rectangle...
Why not use some of the space by implementing a running histogram to overlay over the larger meters? It doesn't take too much programming or too many resources to calculate and if it's annoying then it can be disabled... It can also give a lot more information then a plain old VU meter even if it is a thin histogram on the main mixer. If I can write one in C then it can't be that difficult for a skilled programmer.
Maybe that could be added to an FR. IMO, it shouldn't take more then a day of work to add if even that...
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04-21-2011, 08:54 PM
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#83
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Virginia
Posts: 2,067
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I just realized I hadn't reaplied to this thread, so I am now. Reabump.
Already voted yes on day one.
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04-22-2011, 07:46 PM
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#84
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,769
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I would be thrilled if my tcp meters simply were not orange formnormal levels.
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04-25-2011, 05:57 PM
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#85
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachz
I would be thrilled if my tcp meters simply were not orange formnormal levels.
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Just curious... did you make this post from an iPhone?
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04-26-2011, 09:27 AM
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#86
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 297
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Dannii,
Just wanted to let you know I voted.
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05-11-2011, 08:14 AM
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#87
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,231
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Great FR.
Could we also add the possibility to completely turn off all metering? There are workarounds right now, such as turing off the metering channel by channel, or fiddling with the meter colors. But I would like to be able to do this globally, since it would save me a lot of time and hassle.
I for one do better mixes the less flashing lights there are on the screen, and I'm sure many would find this to be true if they actually tried it. It makes the screen so boring you automatically start LISTENING instead.
Try it out for yourselves and see if you would like this implemented.
>>> EDIT <<<
I would still like the possibility to display sample OVER's, to keep the levels under control if that would be possible. Thanks.
>>> END EDIT <<<
Last edited by ramses; 05-11-2011 at 08:16 AM.
Reason: Forgot about sample over's
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05-11-2011, 09:43 AM
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#88
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,769
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05-11-2011, 12:02 PM
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#89
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Miami
Posts: 2,298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ramses
Great FR.
Could we also add the possibility to completely turn off all metering? There are workarounds right now, such as turing off the metering channel by channel, or fiddling with the meter colors. But I would like to be able to do this globally, since it would save me a lot of time and hassle.
I for one do better mixes the less flashing lights there are on the screen, and I'm sure many would find this to be true if they actually tried it. It makes the screen so boring you automatically start LISTENING instead.
Try it out for yourselves and see if you would like this implemented.
>>> EDIT <<<
I would still like the possibility to display sample OVER's, to keep the levels under control if that would be possible. Thanks.
>>> END EDIT <<<
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A WALTER layout (or theme) should be able to remove the meters altogether (and reallocate that space to stuff that's useful to you). That would seem a better way of accomplishing versus just flipping a switch and turning those meters off or into blank space.
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05-12-2011, 05:25 AM
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#90
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ngarjuna
A WALTER layout (or theme) should be able to remove the meters altogether (and reallocate that space to stuff that's useful to you). That would seem a better way of accomplishing versus just flipping a switch and turning those meters off or into blank space.
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Great! Will Walter still make it possible to show sample OVER-indicators? If that's the case I'm happy.
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05-12-2011, 05:53 AM
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#91
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,713
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^^ yes
[IMG]http://img852.**************/img852/690/nometerlayout.png[/IMG]
Just make the meters <=10x10 and they become signal indicators. In Preferences/Theme Editor you can colour all the 'VU indicator' sections the same as your tcp background - that would give you no meters and a 10x10 clip light
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05-12-2011, 06:49 AM
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#92
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,231
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That's awesome! Exactly what I want :-)
Thanks for the info guys, much appreciated!
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07-30-2011, 03:09 PM
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#93
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2008
Location: In Space
Posts: 240
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+1 for the multimeter channels
But i think it's not a good idea to change the metering system into Reaper, why :
in this thread, i see a lot the K-system, and it seems that this system told us that for our audition confort and clarity the good sound level pressure is 83Dbspl. In a theater the sound can be louder to enhance the immersion ( and it's right, a high dynamics classical track, had a lot of sound level variation, and with good speaker system it's very immersive, and films with big sound effects blowing your face is immersive too ) so the K-system metering suggest us that we can peak the sound up to 20Db above the default level... and so one, for home theatre "pop" music, peak level had to be lower 14Db... let's see this... "pop" music isn't as dynamic as the classical music right... broadcast, peak 12Db... ok
I see a lot of complains too about loud music, it's certain that modern music doesn't have a high dynamic ( sometimes less than 5Dbs between the highest level and the lowest ), but if you drive your car, with all the ambient sounds, if your music got a high dynamic, you will touch your level button everytime, so they'd make a compromise, modern music can be listen everywhere...
And for finishing, the soundfiles level is coded on 16bits or 24bits ( or 32bits ), what does it significate ?
IT significate that each samples ( little point when zooming in reaper ) sound level is coded with a value between 0 and 65535 for 16bits files and 0 - 4294967295 for 32bits files. So if on your meter you can see level between 18Db and -62 you've got 80Db scale and now let divide this Db by the bit resolution 80/16=5 so every 1 bit represent 5Db ( maybe strange but logic)... so if the Reaper 0Db meter is lowered ( like a +18Db to -62Db like above ), and if we take care about never going above 0Db, we will code our sound files with ( 18/5=3.6, 16-3.6= 12.4bits ) 12bits for a round number
For conclude, i think that the better for me, is to choose my own X-system metering depending of my sensations ( i prefer with pink noise at 85Dbspl ^^), and the context of my work. But this system is usefull with analogic systems, i've seen an hardware vu meter with a movable Dbs ribbon for placing your 0Db everywhere you want... handy... sometimes
Last edited by egoadsr; 07-30-2011 at 03:30 PM.
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07-31-2011, 01:13 AM
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#94
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Jazz City
Posts: 5,065
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01-21-2012, 01:06 PM
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#95
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: memory
Posts: 633
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EBU R128
the notorious pipelineaudio has brought this to my attention:
http://tech.ebu.ch/docs/techreview/t...ss_Camerer.pdf
EBU R128 appears to be the new european broadcast standard for measuring program loudness.
(the standard may have been slightly revised since that document was published...)
I've noticed that are already some vst plug-in meters available which are calibrated to EBU R128.
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01-21-2012, 05:53 PM
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#96
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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Yes please! or someone make one in JS
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01-21-2012, 06:05 PM
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#97
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,713
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Yeah ... whatever happened to the rest of Dannii's amazing FR?!
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04-04-2012, 04:55 AM
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#98
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 195
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Why Peak Metering??
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicbynumbers
RMS on every channel plus being able to choose the meter position (maybe even to the extent of between plug ins/different sets of sub channels or sends.)
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+1 for RMS on tracks.
There's absolutely no need for peak metering when you mix with enough headroom.
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04-05-2012, 05:55 PM
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#99
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cerberus
the notorious pipelineaudio has brought this to my attention:
http://tech.ebu.ch/docs/techreview/t...ss_Camerer.pdf
EBU R128 appears to be the new european broadcast standard for measuring program loudness.
(the standard may have been slightly revised since that document was published...)
I've noticed that are already some vst plug-in meters available which are calibrated to EBU R128.
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Yep. I'm currently using the meter bridge in Ozone 5 Advanced and it has R128 metering. It would be great to have something like this as an option on the REAPER master meters....
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04-06-2012, 01:21 AM
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#100
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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Yeah, I use the Toneboosters VST plugin for this, but I would prefer that Reaper would just use k-weighting by default, instead of plain RMS and have 400ms and 3 second presets in the config.
I really like the Ozone 5 meters there too, though the Izotope folks didn't think to include a "Show me only the output" switch. I have no use for Ozone 5 otherwise though, so I chose the Toneboosters plugin.
Last edited by airon; 04-06-2012 at 10:00 AM.
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04-06-2012, 02:37 AM
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#101
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon
...I really like the Ozone 5 meters there too, though the Izotope folks didn't think to include a "Show me only the output" switch. I have no use for Ozone 5 otherwise though, so I chose the Toneboosters plugin.
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If any of the other views are displayed along with the R128 meters in O5, it is possible to hide the input meters but I agree that a switch to show only output would be good. I might send the Izotope guys an email about that. They actually listen to customer feedback.
O5 Adv is probably one of my most used plugin suites (advanced also has the individual sections of O5 available as separate plugins to use on individual tracks). It is on almost all of my REAPER projects.
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04-06-2012, 05:35 AM
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#102
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 2,763
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agreed, this STILL needs to make it into Reaper.
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04-06-2012, 08:57 AM
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#103
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon
Yeah, I use the Toneboosters VST plugin for this, but I would prefer that Reaper would just use k-weighting by default, instead of plain RMS and have 400ms and 3 second presets in the config.
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I have the Toneboosters meters in my VST folder but didn't use them because they weren't accurate. However, I noticed your screenshot shows a much later version than what I had so I downloaded the update and all is well. I was running 1.7.0 and now 2.6.0 and the CPU use is much lighter and accuracy is fixed.
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04-06-2012, 09:55 AM
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#104
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 36
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OK time for a free version VST and a bit of information about various aspects of the new EBU R128 on you tube if you got 50 mins
Free Vst https://www.audiocation.de/plugin the plugin is called AC-R128
Gate way to a load of good vids on R128 http://youtu.be/cs0Vq9XrT2U
Now if you are in to using Foobar (Audio Player) as I am, you can also get a dynamic range plugin for Foobar which is a good http://www.dynamicrange.de/de/free-downloads
They may not have all the bells and whistles of some plug-ins mentioned but if you want a start or short on cash you now got the links
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04-06-2012, 10:02 AM
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#105
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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Replaced the screenshot with one of my own. Seems that Jeroen didn't enjoy me linking to his image or it's something automatic.
Funny though, that my registration doesn't show up on the plugin front. Gotta send Jeroen an email about that.
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04-06-2012, 10:05 AM
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#106
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Good stuff LogicMD. I'll check out that YT later.
While we're talking meters, I just purchased the Klanghelm VU meters and these ROCK!!! They are by far the closest to legit VU meters of ANY VU meter plugin I've tried. They're actually a very useful tool and they're less than $10! A no brainer for anyone who has ever used REAL (professional hardware with true VU ballistics) VU meters.
Here's the URL... http://www.klanghelm.com/VUMT.html
and a screen shot...
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04-08-2012, 03:23 PM
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#107
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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I hear lots of positive stories about these meters.
I kinda wish he'd include k-weighted 400 ms RMS metering in that plugin. I'd buy that in a flash .
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04-08-2012, 03:26 PM
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#108
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,713
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^ Ask him to, you never know what might happen Danni, I can vouch for his new compressor(s) as well ... really good stuff!
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04-10-2012, 05:36 AM
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#109
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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That compressor is the bomb. I got this as a gift for a friend of mine. Highly versatile.
You thought JSCompshaper(the free cool compressor) was good, this is another magnitude above it, and still cheap!
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04-18-2012, 12:23 AM
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#110
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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At the moment, I'm actually finding ReaComp does pretty much everything I need in single band compression and Ozone 5 Advanced Dynamics rocks for multiband compression (and expansion). If I get the inspiration to try out another option though, I'll definitely take your recommendations on board guys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by timlloyd
^ Ask him to, you never know what might happen
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Indeed! He seems like the kind of guy who'd take on board such requests. He responded very quickly to a couple of emails I sent him.
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12-10-2012, 10:37 AM
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#111
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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Time for an assessment.
What has Reaper actually implemented of this request. It appears to me that it implemented the multi-track meters, but little else. Am I correct in making this assumption ?
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12-10-2012, 11:23 AM
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#112
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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That sounds like a pretty accurate assessment to me Airon.
I've recently downloaded the update to Ozone 5 Advanced from the Izotope website and they've now added their new metering suite http://www.izotope.com/products/audio/insight/ to O5 Adv. It is now available as an individual plugin that can be added to individual tracks and/or the master and it has full LU metering included.
Whilst this is a very useful plugin, I'd still love to see some of this implemented natively in REAPER. I know a lot of film and broadcast people would take note if REAPER had that natively.
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12-10-2012, 02:25 PM
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#113
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Greece
Posts: 3,553
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon
What has Reaper actually implemented of this request. It appears to me that it implemented the multi-track meters, but little else. Am I correct in making this assumption ?
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Multi-track meters, yes, but only a rudimentary implementation it seems. I don't see any labels on the meters like:
L, R (stereo)
or
1+2, 3+4... (for stereo groups)
or
L, C, R , (etc for surround)
or discrete
1, 2, 3, 4 (for discrete mono channels)
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12-11-2012, 12:18 AM
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#114
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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I'd like to throw some practical options in to the discussion.
Say I want to flip between pre-fx metering, i.e. the source material on the track and post-fader meters.
The requests asks for three options, so this could mean we'd require a toggle that goes through three states.
This could be restricted to apply to all tracks only, maybe even as an override like the automation modes have it, so you can go back to your track-individual metering choices as a fourth toggle state.
This would actually require a four-state toolbar button, or some other funny looking indicator on the tracks themselves which may crowd things a bit. I'm bringing this all up because if we don't talk about it, Cockos is likely to put an option in the context menus, put up some actions and that's it.
Second, traditional peak meters are almost useless. The only interesting thing they'll ever indicate any longer is whether you're hitting the 0dBFS ceiling during recording.
For that reason, the only peak indication we should ever see on tracks would be in the form of a vertical line of single-pixel height. LUFS metering should constitute the filled indicators of the meter. A little like the Dorrough meters, but less twitchy.
What do you think ?
Last edited by airon; 12-12-2012 at 12:58 AM.
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12-11-2012, 07:21 PM
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#115
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Please add midi learn to sends. Nuts and bolts before games!
Posts: 296
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spite
i have a suspicion that these kind of features are being ignored out of pure spite.
__________________
"The Hottest places in Hell are reserved for those who, in time of moral crisis, maintain their neutrality." --Dante, "The Inferno"
and: www.larouchepub.com organize to effect change
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06-22-2013, 11:21 AM
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#116
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Adelaide, South Australia (originally from Geelong)
Posts: 5,598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon
I'd like to throw some practical options in to the discussion.
Say I want to flip between pre-fx metering, i.e. the source material on the track and post-fader meters.
The requests asks for three options, so this could mean we'd require a toggle that goes through three states.
This could be restricted to apply to all tracks only, maybe even as an override like the automation modes have it, so you can go back to your track-individual metering choices as a fourth toggle state.
This would actually require a four-state toolbar button, or some other funny looking indicator on the tracks themselves which may crowd things a bit. I'm bringing this all up because if we don't talk about it, Cockos is likely to put an option in the context menus, put up some actions and that's it.
Second, traditional peak meters are almost useless. The only interesting thing they'll ever indicate any longer is whether you're hitting the 0dBFS ceiling during recording.
For that reason, the only peak indication we should ever see on tracks would be in the form of a vertical line of single-pixel height. LUFS metering should constitute the filled indicators of the meter. A little like the Dorrough meters, but less twitchy.
What do you think ?
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Just bumping this VERY good post, particularly the part I highlighted in blue.
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06-22-2013, 04:22 PM
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#117
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: I'm in a barn
Posts: 4,467
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I am working on a partial solution (workaround) via JS.
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.p...ight=rms+meter
I think it is, in theory, possible to do this. I know my current code is not good, its just a VERY rough approximation, a gross and simple hack into existing code. Didn't really spent much time on this yet, I am just learning JS and this idea popped in my head while working on something else.
So if I can figure this out for RMS, It should work for R128 as well. I'm not the best at maths, hopefully some talent lends a hand to this.
Pre Fader metering would probably not be possible, however if you can get the Fader position via MIDI or some other hack, you could basically inverse the db loss back into the other channel.
Last edited by James HE; 06-22-2013 at 04:29 PM.
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06-23-2013, 12:33 PM
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#118
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 499
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Each time this thread comes up I can't help thinking about the band. Sorry for the offtopic...
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06-24-2013, 12:20 AM
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#119
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Jazz City
Posts: 5,065
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivan.lt
Each time this thread comes up I can't help thinking about the band. Sorry for the offtopic...
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Look-a-ch-uh. Look-a-ch-ah.
__________________
Windows 10x64 | AMD Ryzen 3700X | ATI FirePro 2100 | Marian Seraph AD2, 4.3.8 | Yamaha Steinberg MR816x
"If I can hear well, then everything I do is right" (Allen Sides)
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06-24-2013, 11:42 AM
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#120
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Somewhere Between 120 and 150 BPM
Posts: 7,968
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Since Reaper has great routing capabilities, like Bidule, Scope DSP, etc. Some Matrix possibilites would also be welcome.
I use a custom Meter which is 8 x 8 and often use 4 of them for 32 Channels of ASIO. I can insert them anywhere in the signal path I want, and this even applys to hardware I/Os, mostly AES/EBU, but as hardware engineers know, there's a 6db insertion loss with Analog signals, so a boost on such I/Os would be needed.
Meters for me are crucial since I run a system comprised of hardware DSP, Analog hardware synths, and Native.
[IMG]http://img839.**************/img839/4833/r9f1.jpg[/IMG]
Uploaded with **************
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