Old 03-13-2010, 10:40 AM   #1
musicbynumbers
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Default Pitch detection to automation challenge :)

Calling all nerds! Need your help with finding the right vst for the below job or the right settings on the best one I've found so far.

For a long time now I have been trying to find a perfect way to link pitch detection via a plug in (best I've found so far is "blue cat's Freq analyst Pro") straight to any parameter on another vst fx.

Freq Analyst allows you to link it's pitch detection output (via the new parameter modulation linking) straight to say the frequency of an eq.

Why would you want to do this i hear you say?

well, Apart from lots of cool synth style stuff what it can also do is allow you to set up an eq so that each band of the eq follows a different harmonic of say a vocal (from the fundamental upwards) thus allowing you complete control over the tone of the vocal (something that static normal eq cannot do). If you set up your eq for your vocalist just right to say boost the rough area of where the fundamental is and then they sing an octave higher for a few notes (as an extreme example) the eq no longer matches at all with the vocal timbre and you loose all the body that you have added with the eq.

This is where pitch tracking could really help and with a little bit of clever sidechaining to multi band passes and parameter modding the output of each of these to the gain of individual bands whilst using the parameter mod offset to pick out individual harmonics..

..You can have an eq that allows you compress and adjust individual harmonics of the monophonic instrument (mainly vocal) and completely control the timbre in ways that are very different to what we can do now.

I'm hoping if I can get it just right I can save it as a fxchain and pop it one any monophonic instrument to have complete control over harmonics and there individual compression and level.

This would not replace static eq as there is still a need to statically fit things within there optimum range but for sound design from what I've managed to do already (by manually automating the first eq band to follow the fundamental and then offsetting the rest) it's been very cool sounding!

so If any of you want to get the Blue cat's freqanalyst pro demo and join me or feel like making a JS effect that can do this OR if the devs give us pitch as well as volume detection feel free to join me!

Thanks.
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Old 03-13-2010, 11:43 AM   #2
BenK-msx
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when this was talked about before i tried out reatunes pitch midi-note output followed by a miditocc note plug (pizmidi convertor here)to control eq bands etc, worked quite well. and with tweaks to the ranges etc you can prob get it accurate enough - a start point perhaps..

native param mod pitch detection would be far cooler of course.

mentioned here-
http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...4&postcount=13
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Old 03-13-2010, 12:07 PM   #3
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I have tried reapitch and "midifier" (which is the best plug in for midi to pitch since it does pitch bend as well) but they still suffer from only a 128 possible places and this is not accurate enough.

That's why I'm trying the bluecat plug in because you don't have to output as midi you can just directly link your two parameters and it works quite well just not had time to work out the non-linearities in matching an eq to the automation output plus the fact that sometimes bluecats output seems to jump to the second harmonic no matter what settings I have tried.

There's so many uses for the ability to track a monophonic items pitch (or even the average frequencies of a polyphonic sound)
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Old 03-13-2010, 12:48 PM   #4
oej
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Default the ultimate ducking tool?

Immediately, I love this idea.
seems to me this could be a good idea to continually
follow the freq. of a lead track,and use that to
adjust the centre freq. of an eq.
thus obtaining a freq. correct narrowband ducking of
other freq. offending tracks in the mix.

I would really like to learn more,and hear ideas
about the many uses for such a parameter modulation consept.
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Old 03-13-2010, 01:35 PM   #5
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You couldn't use it for ducking sibilance but you could send it to say a buss which has everything BUT the vocals going through it and then use the vocal pitch to set up a group of negative gain eq bands tracking the vocal frequency and cutting a place for the vocal to fit.

This technique mainly just allows you to get rid of any sidebanding caused by critical frequency bands "beating" with your vocals
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Old 03-13-2010, 04:47 PM   #6
Analogy
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The desired application seems a bit flawed in its premise to me because the tone of a vocal doesn't really come from harmonics that move around, it comes from formants that don't move around at all. If someone's voice is losing the qualities that you're dialing in with EQ as they move their voice around, I think it's more likely that they are shifting the register of their voice in a way that is making the EQ not work anymore... This isn't something that's pitch dependent, it's something that is dependent on the singer's ability to control their voice.
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Old 03-13-2010, 05:15 PM   #7
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The formants only statically boost the harmonics that are there as the singer shifts the fundamental and related harmonics around if you could detect the level of each harmonic (inc fundamental) and compress them separately (within reason say the first 8 harmonics and then use a harmonic peak filter for the other ones like the new gliss eq has) you could do some interesting things with this especially if could also link these harmonic levels into the fundamental so you could keep the harmonics (no matter what note was sang) relevantly the same.

I'm not saying it replaces eq (as mentioned in previous posts) I'm just saying from the tests I've done with drawing it in manually (using time selection looping and the trim faders) it has been quite effective.

Just by being able to boost or cut harmonics I have managed to eq / shape voices to sound much more solid and forward and consistent over their whole range then I could with a static eq.

Even just being able to make your eq just follow the fundamental instead of being static makes a massive difference. Compressors suffer similar problems hence eq in the sidechain.

It might not make your vocal fit in a mix but it could work wonders with certain vocalists etc..
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Old 03-13-2010, 05:51 PM   #8
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Default better reasoning in this post ;)

Even if you don't want to track all the harmonics if you want to give a voice more "body" (or make the vocal sound more forward due to the semi psycho-acoustic way we observe the bass proximity affect as being closer in the mix) then you can only be so affective even with a broad eq boost at the fundamental as any reasonable deviations in pitch mean that your static eq is now acting just like a formant would and is boosting frequencies and changing the timbre relationship in the vocal.

When you track the pitch of your vocalist, the fundamental boost gets carried with it. You could even set it up (using the new parameter linking) so that the increase in frequency is tied to an increase in that eq's gain as you go up in pitch.

In my tests I've found it actually works really well even just for the fundamental. I ahve tested upto about 5 harmonics with just plain eq boosting and cutting and it gives interesting results but it's tying it to being able to compress these harmonics that interests me

and anyway, that's only one use for pitch following, there are tons of good stuff it could do!
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