Old 01-03-2020, 06:13 AM   #5801
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post

Not shure, if itīs correct but tried it like this:
- downloaded and put the “reaper_csurf_eucon64.dll” into the RRP/userplugin folder
- copied the most recent CSI .dll into RRP/plugin folder
- copied the most recent CSI folder into the ReaperResourcepath (RRP)
If RRP means Reaper Resource Path, then that could be the issue. There's the Reaper Resource Path where things like Colorthemes and the CSI folder goes, and the separate Reaper "application install path" (for lack of a better term).

For instance, here, the Reaper Resource Path (RRP) is c:\Users\Username\AppData\Roaming\Reaper. That's where the CSI folder goes. No .dll's from CSI go anywhere in the RRP.

Here, the Reaper "application install path" is c:\program files\Reaper (x64)\. Put the standard CSI and CSI Eucon .dll's both in your equivalent: c:\program files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\. Not "user plugins." Not anywhere in the RRP folder. Windows will almost certainly ask you to provide Admin approval to copy the .dlls here, which is normal. So be logged in as Admin when you do this.

Does that fix it?

Last edited by Funkybot; 01-03-2020 at 06:28 AM.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 06:39 AM   #5802
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
If RRP means Reaper Resource Path, then that could be the issue. There's the Reaper Resource Path where things like Colorthemes and the CSI folder goes, and the separate Reaper "application install path" (for lack of a better term).

For instance, here, the Reaper Resource Path (RRP) is c:\Users\Username\AppData\Roaming\Reaper. That's where the CSI folder goes. No .dll's from CSI go anywhere in the RRP.

Here, the Reaper "application install path" is c:\program files\Reaper (x64)\. Put the standard CSI and CSI Eucon .dll's both in your equivalent: c:\program files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\. Not "user plugins." Not anywhere in the RRP folder.

Does that fix it?
Ok, I begin to understand what you and Geoff mean, thanks.

My Reaper is not installed on C:\, the plugin folder is in the ReaperResourcePath which apperas to be also the install path (itīs not a portable install though)

Apart from this, CSI is installed according to the read me.

The csurf...dll is in the plugin folder and read upon start up.

CSI works - but ONLY with the build of 14th Dec 2019, so it shouldnīt be an installation issue? Or is CSI function now depending on a standard C:\ install?

in my pre-previous post, I refer to the install of the csuf_eucon_64.dll to check for dependencies as you suggested and for this I put the csuf_eucon_64.dll into the plugin folder. (for completeness also into the userplugin folder)

Unfortunately, this did not change anything for the better;
none of the CSI builds after the 14th are recognized by Reaper.

The plugins are loaded on Reaper start up but the controller remains dead.

When I set up CSI using the 14th build and save the project, the controller is recognized and in working order upon reload of the project.

If I replace the build .dll from 14th with any build .dll released afterwards, the controller stays dead, the previously
(under 14th version) working CSI pages are not shown and the CSI plugin is not listed in the control surface mode pull down.
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 07:01 AM   #5803
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

So whenever you install a Reaper update, you install it to the RRP? So the Reaper installer points to...

C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\Reaper

Is there a reason you do that? I think there is at least the possibility that atypical install location could be contributing to the issue. Over the years, I've learned the hard way that when you do weird sh*t, weird sh*t happens. So I gave up some control, stopped getting cute trying to manage where everything goes, and let more and more things go to default folders (except VST2 plugins). Worst case, I'll move things with Symlinks (mlink in Windows), which trick the OS into thinking everything is where it's supposed to be.

Anyway, if you're interested in trying (and I understand why you might be reluctant to), I'd back up a Reaper configuration with everything I needed including themes, uninstall Reaper, and then reinstall it using the default install location of C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\. At that point, your folder setup should look like mine. Then, after doing that, install CSI exactly like I outlined above, Restart Reaper, import your configuration, setup your CSI. Then report back here about whether or not that works.

Again, totally sympathetic if you don't want to go through all that, but if you're willing to be a guinea pig in this experiment, it might help diagnose the issue.

Note: I'm also not Geoff, and he may not think it matters for all I know. I'm just suggesting it because we're both Windows users running the same version of Reaper and getting wildly different results, with the only obvious difference being our different install paths.

Last edited by Funkybot; 01-03-2020 at 07:09 AM.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 07:34 AM   #5804
Finow79
Human being with feelings
 
Finow79's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Brandenburg
Posts: 54
Default Behringer X Touch One

Downloaded the last version of CSI alpha and installed it like i did it many times before - and it worked well.

But ...

my device (Xtouch one Behringer) is not recognized in the current version.

Im running WIN 10 and the last official reaper Version (6.02) 64 bit in portable Mode.


Solution:
reinstalled CSI ...now everything works! (Sorry!)

Last edited by Finow79; 01-03-2020 at 08:20 AM. Reason: Solved!
Finow79 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 07:41 AM   #5805
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
So whenever you install a Reaper update, you install it to the RRP? So the Reaper installer points to...

C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\Reaper

Is there a reason you do that? I think there is at least the possibility that atypical install location could be contributing to the issue. Over the years, I've learned the hard way that when you do weird sh*t, weird sh*t happens. So I gave up some control, stopped getting cute trying to manage where everything goes, and let more and more things go to default folders (except VST2 plugins). Worst case, I'll move things with Symlinks (mlink in Windows), which trick the OS into thinking everything is where it's supposed to be.

Anyway, if you're interested in trying (and I understand why you might be reluctant to), I'd back up a Reaper configuration with everything I needed including themes, uninstall Reaper, and then reinstall it using the default install location of C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\. At that point, your folder setup should look like mine. Then, after doing that, install CSI exactly like I outlined above, Restart Reaper, import your configuration, setup your CSI. Then report back here about whether or not that works.

Again, totally sympathetic if you don't want to go through all that, but if you're willing to be a guinea pig in this experiment, it might help diagnose the issue.

Note: I'm also not Geoff, and he may not think it matters for all I know. I'm just suggesting it because we're both Windows users running the same version of Reaper and getting wildly different results, with the only obvious difference being our different install paths.
When updating, the installer points to D:\REAPER(x64)
You just tell it the first time where to install to and it remembers it.

The Reason is simple: avoiding this mutiplesubfolder deep user..roaming folder stuff, having everything in a folder without admin restrictions and far from the OS drive which, as many Windows users get to know over time, occasionally has to be re-formatted for various reasons...

Well, yes, Iīm, letīs say, curious enough to test this out, but before I risk my working environment I will give this a try on another Win10 PC with a standard install of Reaper. I know itīs not the same, but before I touch my working system, I will have to clone my drives.

I wouldnīt hesitate to blame it on Windows, but no (major) Windows update was installed since then and it all worked nicely until 26th of Dec.
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 08:24 AM   #5806
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DTx View Post
Do you have the timeframe for the beta in mind?
Been around too long to speak in timeframes, timelines, etc.

Seriously, the major tasks remaining before we proceed to beta:
1) EuCon integration -- Win10 sufficient to proceed -- Mac not there yet
2) Gathering of as many .mst/.ost/.zon files as possible such that the out of the box beta experience is at least reasonable for most.
3) Improve the Learn Mode Window to the point where it is usable -- it's VERY experimental right now

Then the beta phase begins.

Fixing bugs
Tweaking feature set
...
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki

Last edited by Geoff Waddington; 01-03-2020 at 08:39 AM.
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 08:34 AM   #5807
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
When updating, the installer points to D:\REAPER(x64)
You just tell it the first time where to install to and it remembers it.

The Reason is simple: avoiding this mutiplesubfolder deep user..roaming folder stuff, having everything in a folder without admin restrictions and far from the OS drive which, as many Windows users get to know over time, occasionally has to be re-formatted for various reasons...

Well, yes, Iīm, letīs say, curious enough to test this out, but before I risk my working environment I will give this a try on another Win10 PC with a standard install of Reaper. I know itīs not the same, but before I touch my working system, I will have to clone my drives.

I wouldnīt hesitate to blame it on Windows, but no (major) Windows update was installed since then and it all worked nicely until 26th of Dec.
All of this triggered a ten year old memory of a similar experience on Win 7.

Try this -- remove all the copies of EuCon dlls(you really shouldn't need this at all anyway), CSI dlls', make sure to leave the CSI folders alone.

Start Reaper -- what happens ?

Does it load, if so, this is the thing we ran into == there were some "ghosts" of the roaming dirs for some reason -- tres bizarre indeed.

We never did find a fix, it just resynched at some point and was never a problem again.

On the other outcome -- if it doesn't work anyomore, go ahead and install the latest, maybe removing everything will change the equation somehow.

I know this sounds a bit crazy, but hey, its Windows right ?
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 09:01 AM   #5808
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
All of this triggered a ten year old memory of a similar experience on Win 7.

Try this -- remove all the copies of EuCon dlls(you really shouldn't need this at all anyway), CSI dlls', make sure to leave the CSI folders alone.

Start Reaper -- what happens ?

Does it load, if so, this is the thing we ran into == there were some "ghosts" of the roaming dirs for some reason -- tres bizarre indeed.

We never did find a fix, it just resynched at some point and was never a problem again.

On the other outcome -- if it doesn't work anyomore, go ahead and install the latest, maybe removing everything will change the equation somehow.

I know this sounds a bit crazy, but hey, its Windows right ?
Will do. Got to get this running. Standard mcu is not an Option with the nano
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 11:06 AM   #5809
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
When updating, the installer points to D:\REAPER(x64)
So if you're installing to D:\Reaper (x64), I would expect the relevant CSI locations to be:

1. reaper_csurf_integrator64.dll goes to D:\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\

2. reaper_csurf_eucon_64.dll also goes to D:\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\

3. CSI [the folder] goes to C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Reaper\

If you haven't done that exact combo of locations yet, try that. If you've already done that a hundred times and it doesn't work, then disregard.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 11:36 AM   #5810
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
Will do. Got to get this running. Standard mcu is not an Option with the nano
Purged the folders of CSI and eucon files, started, no reaction,
put in CSI 02012019 not working.
(version from 14th works)

I guess that would have been too easy
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 11:54 AM   #5811
RobinGShore
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 557
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Sorry to keep bugging you with this, there is yet another a new Eucon build up, could you check this one at your convenience ?

Thanks.
Still no luck Happy to keep trying until you figure it out
RobinGShore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 12:40 PM   #5812
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
So if you're installing to D:\Reaper (x64), I would expect the relevant CSI locations to be:

1. reaper_csurf_integrator64.dll goes to D:\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\

2. reaper_csurf_eucon_64.dll also goes to D:\Reaper (x64)\Plugins\

3. CSI [the folder] goes to C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Reaper\

If you haven't done that exact combo of locations yet, try that. If you've already done that a hundred times and it doesn't work, then disregard.
Thanks for your efforts, very much appreciated.

when I use the show reaper resource path action, it shows me D:\REAPER(x64).

I looked for the user/.../appdata/reaper folder but there is none for this install.

Tried a portable install but did not work either;
shown resource path is again the install folder.


Installed Reaper on a win10 pc without any previous Reaper installations.

Standard install produced a resource path (users\user\appdata\roaming\reaper)

Put CSI in there; copied the .dll to the plugin folder and.... nothing.

Doesnīt show in the menu. Not even the version from 14th.

adding the eucon .dll does not help either.

The 14th version still works on the other PC but not on the clean standard install?

Iīm afraid, that I do not know what else to do,
especially since the clear install did not work.

Thought itīs a rights problem but doesnt work in admin mode either.
last idea: itīs a german win10; may this be the cause?

My last hope is that the next CSI version will reconstitute function.
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 01:26 PM   #5813
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
Thanks for your efforts, very much appreciated.

when I use the show reaper resource path action, it shows me D:\REAPER(x64).

I looked for the user/.../appdata/reaper folder but there is none for this install.

Tried a portable install but did not work either;
shown resource path is again the install folder.


Installed Reaper on a win10 pc without any previous Reaper installations.

Standard install produced a resource path (users\user\appdata\roaming\reaper)

Put CSI in there; copied the .dll to the plugin folder and.... nothing.

Doesnīt show in the menu. Not even the version from 14th.

adding the eucon .dll does not help either.

The 14th version still works on the other PC but not on the clean standard install?

Iīm afraid, that I do not know what else to do,
especially since the clear install did not work.

Thought itīs a rights problem but doesnt work in admin mode either.
last idea: itīs a german win10; may this be the cause?

My last hope is that the next CSI version will reconstitute function.
Did you try disabling anti-virus temporarily ?
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 01:27 PM   #5814
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Still no luck Happy to keep trying until you figure it out
Thanks -- will keep bashing away.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 01:30 PM   #5815
DTx
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 4
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Seriously, the major tasks remaining before we proceed to beta
...
and that's exactly why I was asking about your github :-). If it's closed we can only help with bug reports (and donations of course).
But I guess this's been discussed here. So keep doing amazing job! hope to see meters one day.
DTx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 01:37 PM   #5816
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Did you try disabling anti-virus temporarily ?
did that just now, no luck

version 14th works on the old install, others donīt and none does on the fresh install

really strange this.

Last edited by WaveTrans; 01-03-2020 at 01:43 PM.
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 02:00 PM   #5817
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DTx View Post
and that's exactly why I was asking about your github :-). If it's closed we can only help with bug reports (and donations of course).
The coding assistance idea you have in mind is great !!

In fact, CSI started life open source.

But, instead of contributions to the code base, folks just wanted to use it as a starting point to head out in their own direction -- and I mean this thing was primitive at the time .

The result would have been -- a mess.

Open Source, such a beautiful dream, such a harsh reality
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 02:31 PM   #5818
DTx
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 4
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
But, instead of contributions to the code base, folks just wanted to use it as a starting point to head out in their own direction -- and I mean this thing was primitive at the time .
Yeah, that's why people sometimes opensource somewhat mature software, to set clear direction. OTOH, nothing prevents maintainers to pull things to upstream themselves from cool forks.

Among other pros - "normal" project management like issue/bug tracker, releases, wiki - non-linearity and orthogonality one forum thread can't give anyway. So if open source fits monetization strategy I would strongly suggest to give it one more try.

Oh and also that discomfort of having some "random" and unsigned dll in the system. Maybe a good point from project management perspective too.
DTx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 04:56 PM   #5819
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DTx View Post
Yeah, that's why people sometimes opensource somewhat mature software, to set clear direction. OTOH, nothing prevents maintainers to pull things to upstream themselves from cool forks.

Among other pros - "normal" project management like issue/bug tracker, releases, wiki - non-linearity and orthogonality one forum thread can't give anyway. So if open source fits monetization strategy I would strongly suggest to give it one more try.

Oh and also that discomfort of having some "random" and unsigned dll in the system. Maybe a good point from project management perspective too.

Well... I have considered a model -- well down the road after everything else stabilizes -- something like how Reaper allows extensions -- allow external Action definition.

Here is the actual CSI code for Play:

Code:
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
class Play : public Action
/////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
{
public:
    Play(string name, WidgetActionManager* manager, vector<string> params) : Action(name, manager, params) { }

    void RequestUpdate() override
    {
        int playState = DAW::GetPlayState();
        if(playState == 1 || playState == 2 || playState == 5 || playState == 6) // playing or paused or recording or paused whilst recording
            playState = 1;
        else playState = 0;
        SetWidgetValue(widget_, playState);
    }
    
    void Do(double value, WidgetActionManager* sender) override
    {
        if(value == 0.0) return; // ignore button releases

        DAW::CSurf_OnPlay();
    }
};
As you can see Actions are dead simple:

Do() handles input from the surface.
RequestUpdate() handles feedback to the surfaces.

Maybe provide a mechanism in the spirit of a Reaper extension -- some kind of registration of an externally supplied Action def ?

Anyway, nice food for thought.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki

Last edited by Geoff Waddington; 01-03-2020 at 05:04 PM.
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 04:01 AM   #5820
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Thanks for your help and advise.

Unfortunately, there is only sad news to tell after a night of installing and testing.

Only reproducible fact seems that CSI works till build 14th dec and then stops lthough all builds appear to load upon reaper startup,

This is the same, regardless of the install (my original one, clean portable and standard). Even tried older Reaper versions.

So I really wonder whatīs the difference between those builds?


Apart from all kinds of install-variations I tried :

- different methods to unzip CSI.

- to delete/manipulate Reaper.ini.

- to find some indication of internal errors/crash of the CSI driver

- uninstalling all plugins and software since 14th december 2019

result remains the same.

last ideas
- a win10 language version issue (german version installed)
- some repostories missing?
- some indirect issue with some of the many .ini files in the reaper folder

This is very frustrating, since I already got used to the nice workflow using CSi and the fader and since I donīt know what else to do Iīll wait for a new build and hope the best

Thanks again for help and advice
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 04:59 AM   #5821
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
Thanks for your help and advise.

Unfortunately, there is only sad news to tell after a night of installing and testing.

Only reproducible fact seems that CSI works till build 14th dec and then stops lthough all builds appear to load upon reaper startup,

This is the same, regardless of the install (my original one, clean portable and standard). Even tried older Reaper versions.

So I really wonder whatīs the difference between those builds?


Apart from all kinds of install-variations I tried :

- different methods to unzip CSI.

- to delete/manipulate Reaper.ini.

- to find some indication of internal errors/crash of the CSI driver

- uninstalling all plugins and software since 14th december 2019

result remains the same.

last ideas
- a win10 language version issue (german version installed)
- some repostories missing?
- some indirect issue with some of the many .ini files in the reaper folder

This is very frustrating, since I already got used to the nice workflow using CSi and the fader and since I donīt know what else to do Iīll wait for a new build and hope the best

Thanks again for help and advice
I think we need to go back to basics here.

I will look into what changed on Dec 14.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki

Last edited by Geoff Waddington; 01-04-2020 at 05:25 AM.
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 05:00 AM   #5822
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Still no luck Happy to keep trying until you figure it out
New eucon build is up...
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 11:40 AM   #5823
RobinGShore
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 557
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
New eucon build is up...
Still crashing...
RobinGShore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 12:55 PM   #5824
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Still crashing...
Yet another is up to try...
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 01:15 PM   #5825
RobinGShore
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 557
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Yet another is up to try...
Still no good. Have you been able to reproduce the crash on your end? I'm starting to wonder if if maybe I am doing something wrong.
RobinGShore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 02:13 PM   #5826
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Still no good. Have you been able to reproduce the crash on your end? I'm starting to wonder if if maybe I am doing something wrong.
No, there's not even a tiny hint of trouble here, unfortunately.

The lack of a crash log is making me think rights/permissions/signing, etc., because it never even seems to get to the load stage, but I could be totally wrong.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 02:37 PM   #5827
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

I had an empty project loaded, tried setting up the new Eucon, and got a EuCon crash while closing Reaper. I don't know if it will be helpful but attached are the EuCon Crash Logs and .dmp file. Hopefully this is in some way related.

Last edited by Funkybot; 01-25-2020 at 08:54 PM.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 03:13 PM   #5828
pane.valentin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 26
Default

Hello!

Imma gonna cut in a bit here to report that I have the same occurance as WaveTrans and that the "reaper_csurf_integrator64.dll" does not appear to work and does not update the Control Surface List in the Options menu.

I have renamed one of the working .dll files to be 100% positive that the folder is the right one. The Surface list updated accordingly so there is no doubt that the integrator64.dll is in the right folder.

Sadly I don't have any previous builds on this machine to test as I have just started writing a setup for a Allen Heath GSR24M

Last edited by pane.valentin; 01-04-2020 at 03:14 PM. Reason: Forgot to say "Hello". What a jackass!
pane.valentin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 03:24 PM   #5829
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pane.valentin View Post
Hello!

Imma gonna cut in a bit here to report that I have the same occurance as WaveTrans and that the "reaper_csurf_integrator64.dll" does not appear to work and does not update the Control Surface List in the Options menu.

I have renamed one of the working .dll files to be 100% positive that the folder is the right one. The Surface list updated accordingly so there is no doubt that the integrator64.dll is in the right folder.

Sadly I don't have any previous builds on this machine to test as I have just started writing a setup for a Allen Heath GSR24M
Hi, welcome to the thread. Just to maybe help speed up the troubleshooting process, would you be able to answer these questions. Might be helpful to get this stuff out of the way:

What Operating System+build #?
What language are you using on your operating system (e.g. English, German, etc.)?
What version of Reaper (version number and bit depth)?
Portable or standard Reaper install?
What is your Reaper install path (like when you update Reaper, what folder does it install to?)
Which folder specifically did you install the integrator64.dll to?
Which folder specifically did you install the CSI folder to?
Are you using the Eucon builds/dll's also?
If you have it, does the build from December 14th work?
If CSI isn't appearing or crashing, did you try temporarily disabling any anti-virus software when installing the .dll's and/or running Reaper just to rule that out?

EDIT
To answer my own questions, because it works here and maybe it'll prove useful...

What Operating System+build #? Windows 10 Home. x64. Build 18362.
What language are you using on your operating system (e.g. English, German, etc.)? English.
What version of Reaper (version number and bit depth)? Reaper 6.02+Dev1228
Portable or standard Reaper install? Standard.
What is your Reaper install path (like when you update Reaper, what folder does it install to?): C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)
Which folder specifically did you install the integrator64.dll to? C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins
Which folder specifically did you install the CSI folder to? This should be your Repaer Resource Path. C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\Reaper\
Are you using the Eucon builds/dll's also? Sometimes. I go back and forth between the new Eucon to test it out, and the old one for actual work. They are also installed to C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins.
If you have it, does the build from December 14th work? Never had a problem with any of the CSI builds not showing up.
If CSI isn't appearing or crashing, did you try temporarily disabling any anti-virus software when installing the .dll's and/or running Reaper just to rule that out? Not applicable here. It's always worked. I do get asked to grant access as an Admin when installing the .dll's in Program Files.

Last edited by Funkybot; 01-04-2020 at 03:39 PM.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 03:42 PM   #5830
pane.valentin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 26
Default

Right my bad

WIN 10 x64 - build 1903
English
Reaper V6.02
Standard install
C:\Program Files\REAPER (x64)
C:\Program Files\REAPER (x64)\Plugins\ - the same folder as reaper_csurf.dll is
C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\
I'm not using EuCon.dll but I've also copied it can't see that one either in the list.
I don't have the build from December 14th. I don't mind that one to troubleshoot. Can't find it though.
I also installed VC_redist.x64 as per the wiki page
pane.valentin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 07:05 PM   #5831
Funkybot
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,482
Default

After that initial crash, the new Eucon seems to work better. Faders still don't initialize when at unity gain, but if I load an empty project and just add tracks, the Artist Mix picks them up as expected [as soon as I move a fader anyway].

What still doesn't work is opening Reaper, then using File -> Open to open an existing project. That new project doesn't get picked up at all.

Also, in Geoff's original Eucon implementation, I had a master fader that would show up but it's missing here.
Funkybot is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 12:08 AM   #5832
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pane.valentin View Post
Right my bad

WIN 10 x64 - build 1903
English
Reaper V6.02
Standard install
C:\Program Files\REAPER (x64)
C:\Program Files\REAPER (x64)\Plugins\ - the same folder as reaper_csurf.dll is
C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\
I'm not using EuCon.dll but I've also copied it can't see that one either in the list.
I don't have the build from December 14th. I don't mind that one to troubleshoot. Can't find it though.
I also installed VC_redist.x64 as per the wiki page
Sorry to hear you have the same issues.
I attached the .dll from 14th which works for me.

Please let us know what happens if you use it in your setup/system...
Attached Files
File Type: zip reaper_csurf_integrator64_build 14th_Dec_2019.zip (203.7 KB, 51 views)
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 12:20 AM   #5833
WaveTrans
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Forest City
Posts: 195
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
Hi, welcome to the thread. Just to maybe help speed up the troubleshooting process, would you be able to answer these questions. Might be helpful to get this stuff out of the way:

What Operating System+build #?
What language are you using on your operating system (e.g. English, German, etc.)?
What version of Reaper (version number and bit depth)?
Portable or standard Reaper install?
What is your Reaper install path (like when you update Reaper, what folder does it install to?)
Which folder specifically did you install the integrator64.dll to?
Which folder specifically did you install the CSI folder to?
Are you using the Eucon builds/dll's also?
If you have it, does the build from December 14th work?
If CSI isn't appearing or crashing, did you try temporarily disabling any anti-virus software when installing the .dll's and/or running Reaper just to rule that out?

EDIT
To answer my own questions, because it works here and maybe it'll prove useful...

What Operating System+build #? Windows 10 Home. x64. Build 18362.
What language are you using on your operating system (e.g. English, German, etc.)? English.
What version of Reaper (version number and bit depth)? Reaper 6.02+Dev1228
Portable or standard Reaper install? Standard.
What is your Reaper install path (like when you update Reaper, what folder does it install to?): C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)
Which folder specifically did you install the integrator64.dll to? C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins
Which folder specifically did you install the CSI folder to? This should be your Repaer Resource Path. C:\Users\[UserName]\AppData\Roaming\Reaper\
Are you using the Eucon builds/dll's also? Sometimes. I go back and forth between the new Eucon to test it out, and the old one for actual work. They are also installed to C:\Program Files\Reaper (x64)\Plugins.
If you have it, does the build from December 14th work? Never had a problem with any of the CSI builds not showing up.
If CSI isn't appearing or crashing, did you try temporarily disabling any anti-virus software when installing the .dll's and/or running Reaper just to rule that out? Not applicable here. It's always worked. I do get asked to grant access as an Admin when installing the .dll's in Program Files.
Youīre right.
Here is a summary of my setup info for convenience

WIN 10 x64 - build 1909
German
Reaper V6.02
D:\ install but not portable
D:\REAPER (x64)
D:\REAPER (x64)\Plugins\
D:\REAPER (x64) (indicated by "show Reaper resource path" action)
I'm not using EuCon.dll but I've also copied it and can't see it in the list.

Build from December 14th is the last that works; never any issues before.

Tested clean portable and standard install with the same result.
WaveTrans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 06:23 AM   #5834
pane.valentin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 26
Default

I have tested with WaveTrans 14th december.dll and can confirm that the Control Surface integrator appears in the Control Surface Mode list now.
pane.valentin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 08:40 AM   #5835
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
After that initial crash, the new Eucon seems to work better. Faders still don't initialize when at unity gain, but if I load an empty project and just add tracks, the Artist Mix picks them up as expected [as soon as I move a fader anyway].

What still doesn't work is opening Reaper, then using File -> Open to open an existing project. That new project doesn't get picked up at all.

Also, in Geoff's original Eucon implementation, I had a master fader that would show up but it's missing here.
Thanks for testing.

Yes, I fixed the easy part first, more to come...

The Master Fader is done bit differently in CSi, will have to think of how to best apply that to EuCon.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 08:41 AM   #5836
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WaveTrans View Post
Youīre right.
Here is a summary of my setup info for convenience

WIN 10 x64 - build 1909
German
Reaper V6.02
D:\ install but not portable
D:\REAPER (x64)
D:\REAPER (x64)\Plugins\
D:\REAPER (x64) (indicated by "show Reaper resource path" action)
I'm not using EuCon.dll but I've also copied it and can't see it in the list.

Build from December 14th is the last that works; never any issues before.

Tested clean portable and standard install with the same result.
Thanks for all the testing, we will eventually sort this out.
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 08:49 AM   #5837
sivert_h
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Tromsø, Norway
Posts: 29
Default

I have now updated to 2nd of January dylib. I've updated my .zon file, so the faders are now working. I do however have some issues:
1. When I press play the faders all (including master fader) pop up to the middle position. That happens in both my .zon file and in the default MCU.zon file, so not sure if it's the .zon file or something in the driver itself.

2. Master fader does not work anymore, both for my .zon file and the MCU.zon

3. Love the new slower acceleration for pan encoders, but it's perhaps a tad to slow now, have to turn several times in order to pan from left to right. Is there anyway to somehow scale this?

.zon file attached for fun.
Code:
Zone Home
	OnTrackSelection MapSelectedTrackSendsToWidgets
	IncludedZones
		MasterButtons|
		Channel|1-8
	IncludedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

Zone MasterButtons|
	Flip ToggleMapSelectedTrackFX
	ChannelLeft TrackBank -1
	ChannelRight TrackBank 1
	BankLeft TrackBank -8
	BankRight TrackBank 8
	Rewind Rewind
	FastForward FastForward
	Play Play
	Stop Stop
	Record Record
	Cycle CycleTimeline

	Mixer Reaper 40078
	Read Reaper _RS1fcf3fcd541b9e07c39a6740feb04c4370f53922 //Cycle Read modes script
	Write Reaper _RSe3f1cb97ca1d272b089f230db6475443ebf92938 //Cycle Write modes script

	MasterFader MasterTrackVolume

	JogWheelRotaryCW Reaper 40647
	JogWheelRotaryCCW Reaper 40646

	ZoomHorizLeft Reaper 1011
	ZoomHorizRight Reaper 1012
	ZoomVertUp Reaper 40112
	ZoomVertDown Reaper 40111
ZoneEnd

Zone Channel|
	TrackNavigator
	DisplayUpper|  TrackNameDisplay
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanDisplay
	TrackTouch+DisplayUpper|  TrackVolumeDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone PanWidth|
	Rotary| TrackPan 0
	RecordArm|  TrackRecordArm
	Solo|  TrackSolo
	Mute| TrackMute
	Select|  TrackUniqueSelect
	Shift+Select|  TrackRangeSelect
	Control+Select|  TrackSelect
	Shift+Control+Select| TogglePin
	Option+Select| TrackFolderDive
	Fader|  TrackVolume
	TrackTouch+Fader|  TrackVolume
	FaderTouch|  TrackTouch
ZoneEnd

Zone Pan|1-8
	TrackNavigator
	Rotary| TrackPan 0
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone PanWidth|
ZoneEnd

Zone PanWidth|1-8
	TrackNavigator
	Rotary| TrackPanWidth 1
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanWidthDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone Pan|
ZoneEnd

Zone Send|1-8
	SelectedTrackNavigator
	DisplayLower|  TrackSendNameDisplay
	DisplayUpper+TrackTouch|  TrackSendVolumeDisplay
	Mute| TrackSendMute
	Fader|  TrackSendVolume
	Rotary| TrackSendPan
	RotaryPush| NoAction
	TrackTouch+Fader|  TrackSendVolume
	FaderTouch|  TrackTouch
ZoneEnd

Zone FXMenu|1-4
	SelectedTrackNavigator
	DisplayUpper|  FXNameDisplay |
	RotaryPush| GoFXSlot |
ZoneEnd
sivert_h is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 09:23 AM   #5838
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sivert_h View Post
I have now updated to 2nd of January dylib. I've updated my .zon file, so the faders are now working. I do however have some issues:
1. When I press play the faders all (including master fader) pop up to the middle position. That happens in both my .zon file and in the default MCU.zon file, so not sure if it's the .zon file or something in the driver itself.

2. Master fader does not work anymore, both for my .zon file and the MCU.zon

3. Love the new slower acceleration for pan encoders, but it's perhaps a tad to slow now, have to turn several times in order to pan from left to right. Is there anyway to somehow scale this?

.zon file attached for fun.
Code:
Zone Home
	OnTrackSelection MapSelectedTrackSendsToWidgets
	IncludedZones
		MasterButtons|
		Channel|1-8
	IncludedZonesEnd
ZoneEnd

Zone MasterButtons|
	Flip ToggleMapSelectedTrackFX
	ChannelLeft TrackBank -1
	ChannelRight TrackBank 1
	BankLeft TrackBank -8
	BankRight TrackBank 8
	Rewind Rewind
	FastForward FastForward
	Play Play
	Stop Stop
	Record Record
	Cycle CycleTimeline

	Mixer Reaper 40078
	Read Reaper _RS1fcf3fcd541b9e07c39a6740feb04c4370f53922 //Cycle Read modes script
	Write Reaper _RSe3f1cb97ca1d272b089f230db6475443ebf92938 //Cycle Write modes script

	MasterFader MasterTrackVolume

	JogWheelRotaryCW Reaper 40647
	JogWheelRotaryCCW Reaper 40646

	ZoomHorizLeft Reaper 1011
	ZoomHorizRight Reaper 1012
	ZoomVertUp Reaper 40112
	ZoomVertDown Reaper 40111
ZoneEnd

Zone Channel|
	TrackNavigator
	DisplayUpper|  TrackNameDisplay
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanDisplay
	TrackTouch+DisplayUpper|  TrackVolumeDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone PanWidth|
	Rotary| TrackPan 0
	RecordArm|  TrackRecordArm
	Solo|  TrackSolo
	Mute| TrackMute
	Select|  TrackUniqueSelect
	Shift+Select|  TrackRangeSelect
	Control+Select|  TrackSelect
	Shift+Control+Select| TogglePin
	Option+Select| TrackFolderDive
	Fader|  TrackVolume
	TrackTouch+Fader|  TrackVolume
	FaderTouch|  TrackTouch
ZoneEnd

Zone Pan|1-8
	TrackNavigator
	Rotary| TrackPan 0
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone PanWidth|
ZoneEnd

Zone PanWidth|1-8
	TrackNavigator
	Rotary| TrackPanWidth 1
	DisplayLower|  TrackPanWidthDisplay
	RotaryPush| GoZone Pan|
ZoneEnd

Zone Send|1-8
	SelectedTrackNavigator
	DisplayLower|  TrackSendNameDisplay
	DisplayUpper+TrackTouch|  TrackSendVolumeDisplay
	Mute| TrackSendMute
	Fader|  TrackSendVolume
	Rotary| TrackSendPan
	RotaryPush| NoAction
	TrackTouch+Fader|  TrackSendVolume
	FaderTouch|  TrackTouch
ZoneEnd

Zone FXMenu|1-4
	SelectedTrackNavigator
	DisplayUpper|  FXNameDisplay |
	RotaryPush| GoFXSlot |
ZoneEnd
Yes, .zon files are a bit of a mess right now, hang in there...

MasterFader now needs to be in a Zone with a MasterTrackNavigator:

Code:
Zone MasterButtons|
    ...
    IncludedZones
        MasterFader|
    IncludedZonesEnd
    ...
ZoneEnd

Zone MasterFader|
        MasterTrackNavigator
	MasterFader TrackVolume
ZoneEnd
Acceleration is on the to do list, most definitely !
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki

Last edited by Geoff Waddington; 01-05-2020 at 09:45 AM.
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 10:31 AM   #5839
MixMonkey
Human being with feelings
 
MixMonkey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: London, England.
Posts: 1,633
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Haha, here I am, constantly extolling the vitrues of handling things in the .zon files as opposed to the Widget definitions, and I go ahead and do the exact opposite

You are exactly right, and yes, I can't think of a use case outside of FX parameters.

So, instead how about a new action SteppedFXParam ?

Code:
Zone SomeFX
    Widget1 FXParam 0
    Widget1 FXParam 7
    Widget3 SteppedFXParam 3  0.0  0.3  0.6  1.0
ZoneEn
Been giving a bit of thought to the whole encoder/FX paramater situation regarding the need for both stepped values and upper and lower bounds.

I think it might be a better approach to define the SteppedFXParam using 3 values: LowerBound / UpperBound / StepSize.

So, your example would be:

Code:
Widget3 SteppedFXParam 3 0.0 1.0 0.34
The advantages of doing it this way would be:

i) The bounds issue is inherently resolved; the intervening code never outputs a value above 1.0 or below 0.0 (or whatever bounds are set between 0.0 and 1.0). The inc/dec ticks from the encoder are no longer sent directly to the plugin, pnly the absolute values from the intervening code.

ii) It effectively allows control scaling on a per parameter basis; if I set a step size of 0.34, I get 3 steps. If set a step size of 0.005, I get two hundred.

What do you think?
MixMonkey is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-05-2020, 10:56 AM   #5840
Geoff Waddington
Human being with feelings
 
Geoff Waddington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Dartmouth, Nova Scotia
Posts: 5,192
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
Been giving a bit of thought to the whole encoder/FX paramater situation regarding the need for both stepped values and upper and lower bounds.

I think it might be a better approach to define the SteppedFXParam using 3 values: LowerBound / UpperBound / StepSize.

So, your example would be:

Code:
Widget3 SteppedFXParam 3 0.0 1.0 0.34
The advantages of doing it this way would be:

i) The bounds issue is inherently resolved; the intervening code never outputs a value above 1.0 or below 0.0 (or whatever bounds are set between 0.0 and 1.0). The inc/dec ticks from the encoder are no longer sent directly to the plugin, pnly the absolute values from the intervening code.

ii) It effectively allows control scaling on a per parameter basis; if I set a step size of 0.34, I get 3 steps. If set a step size of 0.005, I get two hundred.

What do you think?
Oh the surface it looks great, and indeed I've tried this in the past, but then you run into your favourite and mine -- 3rd party manufacturers

It turns out you need to be able to specify exactly whatever nutso thing they provide
__________________
Beta software https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip Donate GeoffWaddington.ca
Installation / documentation / source https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...ntegrator/wiki
Geoff Waddington is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:14 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.