Old Yesterday, 12:25 AM   #1
Bombs'n'Away
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Default Zoom R16 & Klinke MCU help needed

Hi,
I want my Zoom R16's faders to control only folder tracks in Reaper. I read it on the web that with Klinke's MCU protocol there was a sort of MCU editor included where the selection of 'folder mode' could lead me to exactly what I need.

However, no matter how I assign the Klinke actions, I cannot open any such editor or MCU options.

Furthermore, nobody ever reported back on this particular problem after 2017 or so throughout a dozen of different message boards.
Does folder mode do the trick in the end, after all? How can I select it in Reaper using a Zoom R16?

Does anyone have a decent custom Keymap for the Zoom R16 they can share with a newbie?

Thanks!

P.S.: I have read the Wiki entry on Zoom controllers + Klinke manual, yes ;-)
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Old Yesterday, 02:55 AM   #2
nightscope
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Klinke's .dll is written for the Mackie Universal controller, which has SHIFT, OPTION, CONTROL & ALT buttons. Not the Zoom. These buttons do various things with Reaper. The Zoom R16 doesn't, as far as I know, have these buttons whilst still having MCU protocol built in, apparently. However, the .dll does allow for keyboard modifiers to be substituted for the ALT & OPTION buttons.

From manual:-

2.1 Control Surface Settings Options[read Zoom for Behringer BCF]

• Use keyboard modifier: The Behringer BCF does not have OPTION/CONTROL and ALT modifier buttons. When this option is selected, the keyboard modifier can be used instead. The left ALT key substitutes the ALT button, the right ALT key the OPTION button.


7.1.1 Folder-Mode
By default the folder structure of REAPER is not reflected on the MCU. However, it is possible to change this via the Folder-Mode Property in the Pan-Mode Options. When the Folder mode is activated, the tree-like structure of the tracks in REAPER is reflected on the MCU and you only see the children of a track and, if desired, the parent of these children. The idea behind this is that the folder structure corresponds to sub-mixes, and you can easily select and work on a single sub-mix or go back a step and mix only on the level of the sub-mixes. This can improve track navigation a lot.

When you switch to Folder-Mode, only tracks are shown that have the Master track as their root. For all tracks that have children, the LED below the VPOT is illuminated. You can select these tracks as a new root track by pressing the corresponding SELECT button for longer than one second. To move back to the root track, press the GLOBAL VIEW button.


Refer to Table 1 at the bottom of page 13. Basically, you hit OPTION button on the Mackie and the various Folder Mode options come up in the LCD and you pick one with a V-Pot. You haven't got the OPTION button on the Zoom so you'll have to use the keyboard modifier.

I have never laid eyes on a Zoom so this is just the theory.

ns
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Old Yesterday, 03:01 AM   #3
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Many options like the folder mode are changed via the Mackie Control itself, so it would be useful, if you have a MCU display emulation active.

When you press the Option button, the MCU display will show up to four options in the MCU display (depending on the current mode), and you can change them with the VPots. From the manual:

The Plug-, Action- and Pan-Mode also come with mode specific options 9 that can be changed with the VPOTS while pressing the OPTION button (SHIFT + OPTION displays additional options).
While you press the OPTION button you will see that the MCU display switches. It will show you up to four properties. In the upper row you will see the behavior you can change, in the lower row you will see the current behavior. You can select the behavior with the VPOTS. Pressing the VPOT on the left below an option selects the previous option, pressing the VPOT on the right below selects the next option. Alternatively, you can just turn the VPOTS. These options work on a global, not a project-dependent basis.

The folder mode option is the second in the Pan-Mode, so it can be changed via VPOT 3 and VPOT 4 (see also section 7.1.7. in the manual).

Last edited by Klinke; Yesterday at 03:03 AM. Reason: Removed wrong information
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Old Yesterday, 04:38 AM   #4
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@ nightscope: Thanks a lot, I have read through all this before though and assigned keyboard shortcuts already to those MCU buttons which are not existing on my R16. However, when I hit my Options shortcut nothing would happen. Probably because of this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klinke View Post
Many options like the folder mode are changed via the Mackie Control itself, so it would be useful, if you have a MCU display emulation active.
In short: I need an MCU display emulation first. I assign a custom Options key and I assign custom V-Pot keys. Then I can change to folder mode via the display emulation, right?

Folder mode would then enable me to control only Reaper's folder faders through my R16's track faders, while child tracks would not be touched, correct?

Thanks for your help!
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Old Yesterday, 05:42 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombs'n'Away View Post
@ nightscope: Thanks a lot, I have read through all this before though and assigned keyboard shortcuts already to those MCU buttons which are not existing on my R16. However, when I hit my Options shortcut nothing would happen. Probably because of this:



In short: I need an MCU display emulation first. I assign a custom Options key and I assign custom V-Pot keys. Then I can change to folder mode via the display emulation, right?

Folder mode would then enable me to control only Reaper's folder faders through my R16's track faders, while child tracks would not be touched, correct?

Thanks for your help!
I think a MCU display emulation is really useful, but if you think that you don't need track names etc., you can also try to switch the folder mode blindly. Activate the "Use keyboard modifier" in the control surface settings, assign a keyboard key to the "VPot push 3" and then pressing Alt+the assigned key should (I have not tested it) toggle thru the three folder modes.
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Old Yesterday, 05:44 AM   #6
nightscope
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombs'n'Away View Post
In short: I need an MCU display emulation first. I assign a custom Options key and I assign custom V-Pot keys. Then I can change to folder mode via the display emulation, right?
Yep. When you hit OPTION or a keyboard OPTION it all shows up in the LCD on a Mackie or LCD emulation on a non-Mackie and you'll see wot to do on the V-Pots, which I assume are the same as pans on yer Zoom. I didn't think that yer Zoomer did not have a display. I did use a LCD emulator with a BCF2000 before I got me MCU proper.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombs'n'Away View Post
Folder mode would then enable me to control only Reaper's folder faders through my R16's track faders, while child tracks would not be touched, correct?
Correctamundo. All you need is to see wot's going on in the LCD when you hit the OPTION keys modifier.

ns
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Old Yesterday, 05:59 AM   #7
nofish
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BC Manager has a MCU display emulation I use with Klinke's plugin (amongst others).
You also need a virtual MIDI ports app to get it going, I use loopMIDI, both free.
https://mountainutilities.eu/bcmanager
https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/loopmidi.html
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Old Yesterday, 11:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nofish View Post
BC Manager has a MCU display emulation I use with Klinke's plugin (amongst others).
You also need a virtual MIDI ports app to get it going, I use loopMIDI, both free.
https://mountainutilities.eu/bcmanager
https://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/loopmidi.html
Thanks, I was just about to ask here where to get an MCU display emulation after my search on that topic wasn't all too satisfying.
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Old Today, 04:25 AM   #9
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Thanks for all your help. I got it runnin'. However, I realized I didn't like folder mode mainly because of the limitations of the Zoom R16 (only two banks of 8 faders, can't see which one is active, always need to switch modes for child tracks and so on).
I now set up a new project template with 8 final busses to be controlled by the R16. Furhermore, starting Midi Loopback, then BC Manager and then Reaper is a bit of a hassle to me.

I have one more question now:
I have my set of 8 mixbusses to be controlled by the R16 now.
Can I assign the same fader set to the 8 busses' respective volume envelopes but only in write mode? Like, if write mode = OFF then fader controls track volume. If write mode = on, same fader controls automation envelope? Couldn't figure this out.
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Old Today, 05:46 AM   #10
nofish
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombs'n'Away View Post
Furhermore, starting Midi Loopback, then BC Manager and then Reaper is a bit of a hassle to me.
I guess one could write a batch script to start them all at once, but yeah, doing the same when using my BCR with Reaper/Klinke's plugin or CSI.
I additionally have midiOx in between for some MIDI conversion, so that's another one but I got used to it eventually.

(I have no answer to your question though, sorry.)
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