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04-22-2019, 04:24 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Does anybody rent out their studio?
I have a small "project" studio. I have a day job so I only get to work part time in the studio. However I get at least 1 inquiry per month about renting the entire space. I'm curious if anybody here does this?
If so, how do you address:
- Separate login to the OS etc?
- Data security? I have all projects on a separate HDD, I would like to restrict access to this drive.
- Internet security? I need to be connected for VST authorization, but I don't want anyone using "my" internet, I want it to be a separate "blank" internet..?
- Some also ask if they can just plugin their laptop to my "setup". I use a desktop, a USB audio interface, several hardware controllers (all usb) and 3 monitors. Is that even possible?
- Any other advice or things to consider?
Thanks in advance.
dave
Last edited by poetnprophet; 04-22-2019 at 04:33 PM.
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04-22-2019, 04:41 PM
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#2
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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The computer part is the tricky thing for me too, not sure how to handle it...Supposed to be doable with windows 10 pro, but mine is home and it was tricky to get it anywhere near setup
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04-23-2019, 02:32 AM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Belgium
Posts: 5,246
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Simple solution: use a second computer...
I don't have a studio, so nothing to rent out there. I do however lend gear to others. But never my computer. In case they need a complete setup, I have a second one that's anonymised. Doesn't contain my info, or password, or licenses.
__________________
In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
George Orwell
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04-23-2019, 11:59 AM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio
The computer part is the tricky thing for me too, not sure how to handle it...Supposed to be doable with windows 10 pro, but mine is home and it was tricky to get it anywhere near setup
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I setup an account (Guest, not in the family section), then went into my project folder and changed permissions to just my account and the admin account, had to remove USERS from permissions. When I log in as guest, there is no access to the project folder. GREAT! Also the internet apps are clean, no history/etc.
But, when I run reaper, it will read/etc from that project drive...which is what I do not want as I don't want guests to mess with my projects.
Seems like I would have to setup another portable install of reaper with some modified file destination settings, but I still have risk if someone manually tries to load/save to that drive.
A second comp is not really feasible unless you have recommendation on a way to connect everything, see my original post.
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04-23-2019, 12:18 PM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 2,423
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If you don't want guests into that drive at all, you can change permissions at the drive level. But like Pipeline said, when using Windows Home it gets a little tricky. The other thing is messing around with permissions at the drive level isn't always a good idea.
Can you set up folder on that drive for guest projects, give your guests access to that folder, but lock them out of the folder with your projects.
Also, when doing permissions make sure you look for the box that sets the permissions to update permissions on all child objects in that folder.
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04-23-2019, 12:40 PM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poetnprophet
I setup an account (Guest, not in the family section), then went into my project folder and changed permissions to just my account and the admin account, had to remove USERS from permissions. When I log in as guest, there is no access to the project folder. GREAT! Also the internet apps are clean, no history/etc.
But, when I run reaper, it will read/etc from that project drive...which is what I do not want as I don't want guests to mess with my projects.
Seems like I would have to setup another portable install of reaper with some modified file destination settings, but I still have risk if someone manually tries to load/save to that drive.
A second comp is not really feasible unless you have recommendation on a way to connect everything, see my original post.
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You can place an explicit deny for your secondary user account in the NTFS security settings for that project folder. Right-click the folder, properties, permissions tab, edit.
Just make sure you don't accidentally deny yourself.
You can actually do pretty much all of this manually aka forget the windows home/guest stuff, create a user that isn't an admin, then a group that is for guest users, put the user in that. then you control everything that user can do via the group. If you are using home instead of pro - mistake #1 cuz that's not a home use and you could run into issues or end up hacking solutions that don't need to be.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-23-2019, 12:41 PM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Belgium
Posts: 5,246
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I see. 3 screens and several controllers. Yep, that makes it hard. Didn't consider that. I only use portables' built-in screen and one firewire connection.
__________________
In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
George Orwell
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04-23-2019, 01:13 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Thanks everyone. I think I have windows 10 Pro, and so far the permissions work great: no access to the drive directly from windows explorer.
But, if I open Reaper from the guest account, then there is access to that folder.
I will try Karbo's suggestion of making totally separate groups, put myself in 1 and the guest account in another. I'm not at the desk now, but I think maybe the admin permissions have authority over all others, and reaper must be running as admin in both accounts.....more of a question?
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04-23-2019, 01:26 PM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 2,423
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If you have Pro then setting permissions by groups is your best bet. However, you need to watch for other inherited group permissions like Users and Authenticated Users.
Doing it by groups will also allow you to create separate user accounts for each user so they can keep their user profiles separate, if you want to take it to that level.
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04-23-2019, 01:37 PM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Posts: 2,779
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I'd be very careful about renting it out when you're not there.
"Physical security" can be an issue too. Your mics & cables (or other equipment) can get damaged or stolen or they might spill coffee on the rugs/furniture or burn something with whatever they are smoking, etc. And, would they have access to the rest of your house?
I read an article once (probably in Recording Magazine) about all the ways that studios get scammed. I don't remember much about it but there was one scheme where a producer & singer would request that a special vintage Neumann mic be rented for session. Then the producer & singer would stage an argument then the producer would ask the engineer/studio owner if they could have some privacy to discuss the issue... When you come back, they are gone and the mic is gone.
If you are renting to only close friends & family that you trust, you probably wouldn't be "renting" it and you probably should still be there.
And it's a good idea to mark/identify/inventory all of your cables, mics, mic stands, etc., so it doesn't get accidently packed-up and taken-away with the band's equipment. (I've never had a studio to rent out but I used to put a band of green tape around both ends of my cables so I knew which cables were mine.)
There also may be some liability if someone gets hurt as part of any "business activity" or if your client's equipment gets stolen or something. Probably not a big concern but check with your homeowner's insurance provider.
Last edited by DVDdoug; 04-23-2019 at 01:49 PM.
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04-23-2019, 02:02 PM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DVDdoug
There also may be some liability if someone gets hurt as part of any "business activity" or if your client's equipment gets stolen or something. Probably not a big concern but check with your homeowner's insurance provider.
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Hmm, I didn't think of this. I will have to consider liability as I do own my biz and it's a self-proprietorship.
this studio is not at my house (I would never at my own house haha), I rent a space elsewhere. There are cameras throughout the property (like, a LOT!), and I know all the neighbors, they know me. I'm not too concerned with my physical stuff (which I own everything, and can all be replaced), I'm more worried about my content and the content of my clients....as well as liabilities in the legal sense.
Given all of that, I would create a contract that outlines the do's and don'ts, will require some personal information/verification of the guest, an NDA of some sort, as well as a deposit. And a waiver to reduce or eliminate liability on my part.
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04-23-2019, 03:11 PM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poetnprophet
Thanks everyone. I think I have windows 10 Pro, and so far the permissions work great: no access to the drive directly from windows explorer.
But, if I open Reaper from the guest account, then there is access to that folder.
I will try Karbo's suggestion of making totally separate groups, put myself in 1 and the guest account in another. I'm not at the desk now, but I think maybe the admin permissions have authority over all others, and reaper must be running as admin in both accounts.....more of a question?
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Do this... FYI the reaper folder below contains my reaper projects, it is not the actual reaper app folder!
Add the group you created, which contains the locked down user you created, then click deny. This is setting deny explicitly for anyone in that group for that folder. That's the safest way since users and authenticated users are pseudo/computed groups and if you deny one of those, you may deny yourself by accident since deny always overrides any allows.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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04-23-2019, 03:20 PM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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renting out while not on the premises....
I think that is a bit foolish.
More than that actually.
Need the money? you may loose more than you ever thought.
I would have to have a very valid reason to let anybody use mine
only one family member I would let do that but people you do not know
very very well...
suicide.
Grinder
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04-23-2019, 03:39 PM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinder
renting out while not on the premises....
I think that is a bit foolish.
Grinder
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it's no secret, I'm an idiot
thanks for your input
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04-23-2019, 03:40 PM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Do this... FYI the reaper folder below contains my reaper projects, it is not the actual reaper app folder!
Add the group you created, which contains the locked down user you created, then click deny. This is setting deny explicitly for anyone in that group for that folder. That's the safest way since users and authenticated users are pseudo/computed groups and if you deny one of those, you may deny yourself by accident since deny always overrides any allows.
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Yup, I learned that last bit the hard way. Luckily I took screenshots before so I could put things back, since there's no undo button for this stuff.
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04-23-2019, 09:58 PM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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I am sure you are no idiot I just would not like to any of us
loose what we worked so hard for.
I have been a long time alive the things you borrow and then have accidents with then there are the people you would sweep the ground for and then find out they just used you.
You have to be there.
No you are not an idiot, just putting your foot in shark infested waters and thinking about it.
All success to you anyway whatever you do poetnphrophet.
Grinder
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04-23-2019, 10:02 PM
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#17
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Mortal
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 14,047
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I need to upgrade to pro really.
Take toleolu's advice, he came over to set my computer up specifically for this purpose, its still a pain in the ass, even with the guest account and all that. in the end i started moving all of the stuff I dont want people messing with over to google drive, but even still it would be easy to wreck my computer or other peoples' projects...i still havent gotten it all figured out
Second computer is really not an option, the setup to switch everything between them would be the ultimate in ridiculous pain and downtime
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04-23-2019, 10:38 PM
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#18
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Australia
Posts: 489
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinder
I just would not like to see any of us loose what we worked so hard for. Grinder
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Have to agree. While you may say they can be replaced, that may be so. If your like most musicians I have come across you will have gear that isn't commonly available - be a shame to loose it.
I agree with with Grinder, not being present just opens you up to theft, trashing and all sorts of problems. If they screw up (upset the neighbors), you're the one the neighbors will be looking too for answers and to vent their frustrations.
__________________
♫ C. Emu ♫
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04-24-2019, 09:47 AM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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thanks, I really do appreciate the support
I haven't totally ruled out my absence in this regard, however I am too hyper active to be there and not doing anything, haha.
Nobody is more paranoid about my space than I am, believe me. If I go down this path, I will be taking extra precautions, I would probably get a surveillance system like Arlo and watch it closely.
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04-24-2019, 09:55 AM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio
I need to upgrade to pro really.
Take toleolu's advice, he came over to set my computer up specifically for this purpose, its still a pain in the ass, even with the guest account and all that. in the end i started moving all of the stuff I dont want people messing with over to google drive, but even still it would be easy to wreck my computer or other peoples' projects...i still havent gotten it all figured out
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The permissions are not set correctly if the guest account/group can access files you don't want accessed FYI. What's the "stuff" you are talking about exactly? It's also possible to set a GPO for a specific user which gives a myriad of options to set - but if on the home version, you may not be able to do much of this properly in a pro scenario, which this is. I considered helping you do this via remote share but there are two items that matter first:
1. You need Win10 Pro.
2. I don't do things like this until I do a complete run through in a lab first - cuz I'm thorough.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 04-24-2019 at 10:04 AM.
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04-24-2019, 01:13 PM
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#21
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 2,102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poetnprophet
Nobody is more paranoid about my space than I am, believe me. If I go down this path, I will be taking extra precautions, I would probably get a surveillance system like Arlo and watch it closely.
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Have you thought of making your drive (or set of drives) removable and getting a second drive (or set) to use for clients?
You should be able to clone the drive(s) , then remove everything you don't want them to access from the clone(s).
After that, set up the secure user on the clone(s) and lock the original drives some where safe while not in use.
Do you use any dongles for plugins or other software?
you will need to secure them and that likely means putting the PC in a lockable enclosure or closet.
I agree with others about not allowing clients to use the studio without you being there.
you are asking for unnecessary headaches and theft with that policy.
.
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04-24-2019, 03:37 PM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucas_LCS
Have you thought of making your drive (or set of drives) removable and getting a second drive (or set) to use for clients?
You should be able to clone the drive(s) , then remove everything you don't want them to access from the clone(s).
After that, set up the secure user on the clone(s) and lock the original drives some where safe while not in use.
Do you use any dongles for plugins or other software?
you will need to secure them and that likely means putting the PC in a lockable enclosure or closet.
I agree with others about not allowing clients to use the studio without you being there.
you are asking for unnecessary headaches and theft with that policy.
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Ah I didn't even think about my iLok, that would surely ruin some things if anything happened to it.
You all sure are smart, maybe I should listen and not even bother. it's not that I need the money, just seems like a waste of space when not being used, and I get the chance to help somebody (indirectly) with their project...and even make a few bucks.
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04-25-2019, 05:04 AM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 3,202
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Nope, never. If something is being recorded it is because I'm there recording it. I'm not desperate enough for money to risk my gear to anyone else.
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04-25-2019, 01:33 PM
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#24
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 693
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yeh, i do - to travelling salesmen for 1 hour at a time
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