Old 06-19-2012, 01:14 AM   #81
serr
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Originally Posted by quartermoonpro View Post
I wanted to report in. Did a show this weekend for 6 hours, no problems with reaper and this inluded using a VSTi for DJ purposes between sets. I'll also mention that venue's a/c was on the fritz, so it was hot conditions to say the least. For my rig I have:

Quad Core QX6850 (3.0Ghz)
4GB Ram
XP Pro 32bit
16 inputs, 4 outs (Stereo FOH and 2 monitor sends)
Maudio Profire Lightbridge
ASIO Buffer - 64 samples
Mackie Control Universal

Latency was a non factor (imperceptible to the human ear). I had eq,gate, compression on 8 channels, eq, compression on the other 8 channels. I had 3 different reverbs and 2 different delays set up on the aux for choices and 3 main vocal channels with different effects processing just to test the box.

Monitors had eq on every channel, plus an overall 32 band eq on the monitor masters.

Total CPU usage ranged between 30-40%

I can see why others might get "butt hurt" about the sound. We were previously using an A&H GL2400. The sound difference was dramatic. This is going to be our live rig from now on and I'll just keep the GL2400 and the FOH rack in the truck just in case.

Thanks to everyone that has been in this forum and for all their help with my questions.
Nice going quartermoonpro!
I've got to say you're a brave man to try this with windows though! Scarey... More props to Reaper then I guess.

Yeah, the sound quality of the little and medium size boards... Not good.
Reaper really feels (sounds) more like an SSL (SSL channel strips on every channel probably help - that's my starting point anyway). The difference is just as dramatic as using a real SSL or Neve compared to any of these "club" boards.

Being able to move around in a club and not tied to some awkward FOH location is just huge too. You can now go into those places with the FOH 'upstairs' in the back corner (where it is almost 100% impossible to mix) and have your band sound like an album.

Last edited by serr; 06-19-2012 at 02:29 AM.
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Old 06-19-2012, 10:20 AM   #82
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I've never had much problem with Windows, to be honest. This new live rig is XP Pro (tweaked for audio) and it doesn't go on the 'net. My recording rig at home is Win 7 Home Premium 64bit. I've only had windows crash because of a plug-in problem or one time with a bad stick of memory in all the years I've used a windows machine. I think one of the keys is to use only Intel MB's. I still have a machine running windows 2000 and i've used it to mobile record on dozens and dozens of shows. I do think Reaper has a lot to do with the stability, though. It seems to be coded well.
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Old 06-20-2012, 11:04 PM   #83
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Hi,

We use Reaper in our band for live and bandroommix too.

I have an old dualcore intel PC with 2GB RAM and Win7 32Bit.

a RME HDSP 9265 Soundcard and a Focusrite Octopre MkII Dynamic.
and a 6 Channel Headphone Mixer for Monitormixes.


I use Hardware Sends (pre Fader/PostFX, mono) per Channel to do the Monitormixes, FX, like EQ,Comp,Verb on most of the channels.

the drummer plays a Roland TD20 an the guitars come from Line6 Pods. no amps on stage. the loudest one on stage is the singer...

We play really heavy rock, and this is a really unusual setup for a rockband, haha..

We can have a Buffersize of 32!!! on our system (but we use 64 only for security reasons). All works fine, no dropouts or clicks.
The trick is to optimize Win7 for Audio with this guide (it´s in german...):
http://www.timos-welt.de/win7/

...sorry for my bad english
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Old 06-21-2012, 01:17 AM   #84
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is it possible to add a Send from one project-tab to another?

the solution with project-tabs for every monitormix is amazing, but you need a lot of FX.

With PreFader/postFX Sends from your Main-Mix-Tracks to the Monitortracks you wouldn´t need FX in the monitorprojecttabs (but you got the possibility, if you want). this would save a lot of PC RAM Power.

is this possible, or may it be a feature request...??
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Old 06-21-2012, 04:06 AM   #85
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Oh, I found something...do you know this?

http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...on_the_Toolbar

you can use this Multiview to switch between your monitormixes...

you don´t need project tabs.
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Old 06-21-2012, 08:08 AM   #86
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You can add multiple tracks with the same physical input, so there is no reason why you can't just add a second group of tracks for all of your monitor mixes in the case where you wanted to add different VST's to them, or just have different strip EQ settings. You can add all of these into a folder, and just minimize the folder view so they are out of your way until you want to use them. It also gives you a quick mute or volume level on the folder fader if you should need it.

I use multiple tracks on the same input all the time when dealing with more than one front person or backline that are using the same physical mics.
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Old 06-21-2012, 09:15 AM   #87
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The input buffering is completely dependent on the plugins you use. I can record 32 tracks at 24/96 at a 32 sample buffer size with no plugins or just the Reaper stock light plugins and have zero errors or dropped samples. Obviously I like to use the nicer plugins and record multitrack though. With tons of Waves and other stuff (SSL channel strips on most inputs, deessers here and there, 4 H-delays, couple verbs and so forth, L2 on the master) I need to go to 128 samples and 48k. If I run at 64 samples I'll get a buffer-full or 2 of dropped samples about once an hour. You'll hear a click or crackle. It should be mentioned though that even when you push Reaper too far like this it just keeps on running. It just does not crash for any reason. (My system test is to record 32 channels with the full plugin setup for 6 hours - and do this 6 times. There must be zero errors.)

So if you want to use the nice sounding plugins and go home with multitrack you'll need to go to 128 sample buffer size and cut your sample rate down to 48k (still 24 bit).

Plugin minimum input buffer requirement would be a spec I'd like to see published.

Last edited by serr; 09-07-2012 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 06-21-2012, 10:32 AM   #88
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On my mixrack I only record the inputs so Anything I do during the show isn't recorded. This allows me to remix it in the studio, without having to compensate for what I had to do live.
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Old 06-21-2012, 11:06 AM   #89
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On my mixrack I only record the inputs so Anything I do during the show isn't recorded. This allows me to remix it in the studio, without having to compensate for what I had to do live.
I record the inputs as well (in case I wasn't clear). Same reason. I record the track output from fx I run live so I have those tracks as well. (I do dub delay fx with this reggae band I work with for example, so it's part of the performance.) I record track automation so I can go back and use it if I have some useful volume rides or pan moves or something.
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Old 07-24-2012, 10:17 PM   #90
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Hi,

I have done some tests with reaper as a FOH mixer and it has an issue : when a fx is inserted, the sound breaks a little with a 10-15ms blank. This happens sometimes when a windows is opened. Any idea ? Thread-related thing ?

Thx
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Old 07-25-2012, 05:35 AM   #91
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Hi,

I have done some tests with reaper as a FOH mixer and it has an issue : when a fx is inserted, the sound breaks a little with a 10-15ms blank. This happens sometimes when a windows is opened. Any idea ? Thread-related thing ?

Thx
I've never had this happen. I've inserted fx plenty of times live. I open plugin windows all the time. Never had to even trouble shoot anything like this. This stability is one of the Reaper features I rave about.

Maybe it's a specific plugin?
I'm running mostly Waves stuff. Started with Reaper v3.something and have the current version at present. Still running OSX 10.6.8

The only fault I've found with Reaper is cosmetic stuff like the spaces bug. That's the other thing I really like about Reaper. They put nuts and bolts functionality first and looks second.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:17 AM   #92
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Hi,

I have done some tests with reaper as a FOH mixer and it has an issue : when a fx is inserted, the sound breaks a little with a 10-15ms blank. This happens sometimes when a windows is opened. Any idea ? Thread-related thing ?

Thx
What vst are you inserting or opening? I've been using the cockos vsts, karma eq, and a few of the voxengo freebies. The cockos vsts are great, use little in the way of resources and the interfaces make perfect sense. Unless you have licenses for waves or some other plugins, I personally don't see any need for them. If you do decide to use third party plugs, test them as you have been doing as they can be problematic.
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Old 07-25-2012, 06:53 AM   #93
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I don't suppose anyone has tried mixing backstage to a wireless flat-response mic out front...? That seems like the next Bold Step..
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Old 07-26-2012, 10:44 AM   #94
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I don't suppose anyone has tried mixing backstage to a wireless flat-response mic out front...? That seems like the next Bold Step..
Absolutely not!
Besides, there's no front of house anymore. You couldn't realistically set up a mic in the middle of the audience. The beauty of this system (one of them) is that there's no static front of house location that you're tied to anymore. You can move about the venue wherever you choose to mix from. And in difficult rooms where the sound can vary from spot to spot you can actually find a happy balance by being able to move around.
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Old 09-06-2012, 03:44 AM   #95
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Hi guys. I'm buying a small Firewire Mixer/Audio-Interface this week. I mistakenly bought a similar mixer about 12 weeks ago, except it was USB, so it was 8/2. The Firewire, I'm assured, gives me 8 individual tracks in Reaper, and much better latency handling. Hopefully I will then have the chance to test it in the coming weeks - some friends in a small "Electronica" band have just re-united and I'm trying to "get in there", to get my hands dirty with Reaper Live. Synths, drum mashine, real bass, Vox. So a Waves SSL strip on each of the 8 channels, and maybe some wriggle room to get a bit adventurous.

I was thinking too, might the little Mixer cum AudioInterface also solve those grab the pot moments? I'll run it flat of course, with possibly the occasional tweak. If I set my gain staging nicely, any feedback is going to light up the channel LED, I know instantly where the trouble is!

Question for Johnny G, and I'm not being flippant, I was studying your project template last night, great work btw, and I noticed in the "VoxRev" buss there are 'receives' from the "Drum Overheads" L/R. Was this a slip of the i/o drop or was it deliberate?

Also, sorry something else just came to mind. To "DI" Bass or not, that is the question? That is two questions actually.

Cheers Brian

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Old 09-06-2012, 06:28 AM   #96
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Hi guys. I'm buying a small Firewire Mixer/Audio-Interface this week. I mistakenly bought a similar mixer about 12 weeks ago, except it was USB, so it was 8/2. The Firewire, I'm assured, gives me 8 individual tracks in Reaper, and much better latency handling. Hopefully I will then have the chance to test it in the coming weeks - some friends in a small "Electronica" band have just re-united and I'm trying to "get in there", to get my hands dirty with Reaper Live. Synths, drum mashine, real bass, Vox. So a Waves SSL strip on each of the 8 channels, and maybe some wriggle room to get a bit adventurous.

I was thinking too, might the little Mixer cum AudioInterface also solve those grab the pot moments? I'll run it flat of course, with possibly the occasional tweak. If I set my gain staging nicely, any feedback is going to light up the channel LED, I know instantly where the trouble is!

Question for Johnny G, and I'm not being flippant, I was studying your project template last night, great work btw, and I noticed in the "VoxRev" buss there are 'receives' from the "Drum Overheads" L/R. Was this a slip of the i/o drop or was it deliberate?

Also, sorry something else just came to mind. To "DI" Bass or not, that is the question? That is two questions actually.

Cheers Brian
It's sad to reply to one's self but I was wondering too. Have any of you wizards tried ReaTune's auto correction on live vocals? Or sending a ReaPitch from the lead vox raised to the third or fifth to simulate "harmonies" or lowered or raised by a full octave as "a second singer" on another track with contrasting EQ and Delay [if needed, a little latency might do the trick]? I know i'm gonna need it :-)

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Old 09-07-2012, 01:51 AM   #97
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It's sad to reply to one's self but I was wondering too. Have any of you wizards tried ReaTune's auto correction on live vocals? Or sending a ReaPitch from the lead vox raised to the third or fifth to simulate "harmonies" or lowered or raised by a full octave as "a second singer" on another track with contrasting EQ and Delay [if needed, a little latency might do the trick]? I know i'm gonna need it :-)
I haven't tried this at a venue, but I've played with it at my studio in a "live" test and the latency for ReaTune's auto correction was too great. Perhaps there is a way to configure it so it is usable, but I didn't figure it out.
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Old 09-07-2012, 01:55 AM   #98
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I'm very interested in trying Reaper as my PA mixing setup, but I'm not quite sure I understand how people are communicating from the mix location to the main computer. I assume the main computer (running Reaper) and the audio interface are on/by the stage (eliminating the snake - I love it).

But how are you controlling that computer from some appropriate location? Is it with an ipad and something like V Control? Or do you use a 2nd computer (laptop)? How do you get a control surface to work remotely?

Thanks!
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Old 09-07-2012, 07:40 AM   #99
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I'm very interested in trying Reaper as my PA mixing setup, but I'm not quite sure I understand how people are communicating from the mix location to the main computer. I assume the main computer (running Reaper) and the audio interface are on/by the stage (eliminating the snake - I love it).

But how are you controlling that computer from some appropriate location? Is it with an ipad and something like V Control? Or do you use a 2nd computer (laptop)? How do you get a control surface to work remotely?

Thanks!
Some people are using MIDI (wireless), iPad, etc. I prefer to use a second laptop (netbook) with Team Viewer and my own wireless network
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Old 09-07-2012, 11:27 AM   #100
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Some people are using MIDI (wireless), iPad, etc. I prefer to use a second laptop (netbook) with Team Viewer and my own wireless network
Aha the penny has finally dropped!

And thanks TexaCali, Im just trying it now, see what you mean! I sent the ReaTune out on 3/4 and brought it up on another track. There's a fair old echo all right! Using Elastique Pro with Attack Time = 0 and Stereo Correction = Off - Not Bad Actually! I unticked 'master send' on track 1 and tried it in the mix with the retuned track - Not bad at all! Probably needs a closer inspection later!

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Old 09-07-2012, 11:33 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by TexaCali View Post
I'm very interested in trying Reaper as my PA mixing setup, but I'm not quite sure I understand how people are communicating from the mix location to the main computer. I assume the main computer (running Reaper) and the audio interface are on/by the stage (eliminating the snake - I love it).

But how are you controlling that computer from some appropriate location? Is it with an ipad and something like V Control? Or do you use a 2nd computer (laptop)? How do you get a control surface to work remotely?

Thanks!
MIDI controllers with real knobs and faders over wireless USB and then an iPad on a 2nd wifi channel running a remote desktop app to control the whole computer. See my signature.
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Old 09-07-2012, 12:53 PM   #102
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MIDI controllers with real knobs and faders over wireless USB and then an iPad on a 2nd wifi channel running a remote desktop app to control the whole computer. See my signature.
I would love to see a video demonstrating this! (wink, wink)
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Old 09-15-2012, 12:06 PM   #103
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Anyone seen or used one of these?

http://frontierdesign.com/Products/TranzPort
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Old 09-15-2012, 06:17 PM   #104
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Anyone seen or used one of these?

http://frontierdesign.com/Products/TranzPort
I'd rather use an iPad and custom OSC!
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Old 09-15-2012, 07:04 PM   #105
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I'd rather use an iPad and custom OSC!
Everyday's a schoolday here! Thanks, just read about OSC and watched a couple of Missing Link demos.

http://www.wifimidi.com/
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Old 09-15-2012, 08:14 PM   #106
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Everyday's a schoolday here! Thanks, just read about OSC and watched a couple of Missing Link demos.

http://www.wifimidi.com/
That's incredible! But you wouldn't need it to control reaper! It has OSC capabilities.
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Old 09-19-2012, 03:44 AM   #107
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Anyone seen or used one of these?

http://frontierdesign.com/Products/TranzPort
Yes, I do, with a 7 years old Windows XP home laptop and 2 pieces of MOTU Traveler (Mk. I), for live sound, somteimes also for live recording.

Distances of 10 to 15 meters are no problem, if the USB transmitter ist raised on a stand, 15 to 25 meters may work with a little trick: don't use your left hand to hold the TranzPort, the antenna is on the left side of the body and should not be covered

Advantage is in adjusting the soloists or singer and/or monitor levels right on stage or in the audience with your own ears, and moving around in the venue to check or even correct the sound. And you can mute any channel to avoid the typical sounds of "hot plugging" even when you are not at your main console (or talking to the guitarist who's going to unplug:-))

Installation is quite easy. TranzPort has to be active (drivers loaded, "link" LED on) when reaper starts

Last edited by Allmoeh; 09-19-2012 at 03:47 AM. Reason: forgot an advantage
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Old 09-19-2012, 08:27 AM   #108
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Anyone seen or used one of these?

http://frontierdesign.com/Products/TranzPort
Looks pretty restrictive. Someone said they only got 25 yards away with it. Then you are limited to the control set of the device.

The WiRanger gives me over 100 yards and I can use any USB MIDI device I choose.

Cool to see more products like this but this one looks wimpy. Cheap though if you just need something simple and don't need distance like in a live sound setting.

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Old 09-19-2012, 01:20 PM   #109
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I guess I missed the boat on the OSC thing, MIDI has always worked for me.

I use this: http://www.tobias-erichsen.de/software/rtpmidi.html

and there is no extra hardware involved at all. I already have the MIDI interface on the laptop out front, and on my smaller rig I use a BCF2000 which is USB. The whole thing works over the existing wireless network.

Been dabling in the web interface to get a monitor console up at a different mix position, but I think it would rarely get used in my case as if there was a monitor world, I likely wouldn't be using my walk in rig out front anyway.
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Old 09-21-2012, 09:17 AM   #110
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I've been checking out the Touch OSC stuff...

iTeleport works better and is much faster for me. I can have different things in different spaces and flip between them with a hot corner 'all spaces' gesture much much quicker than switching over to OSC. Maybe if we actually get multitasking (not just 'quick app switching') on the iPad this could work.

I might use it to get the guys running their own in-ear mixes with their iPhones though. That's either a great innovation or the worlds worst idea depending on the musician in question I suspect. There's an updated scene for Spinal Tap in here somewhere...
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Old 09-21-2012, 02:30 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by TexaCali View Post
I'm very interested in trying Reaper as my PA mixing setup, but I'm not quite sure I understand how people are communicating from the mix location to the main computer. I assume the main computer (running Reaper) and the audio interface are on/by the stage (eliminating the snake - I love it).

But how are you controlling that computer from some appropriate location? Is it with an ipad and something like V Control? Or do you use a 2nd computer (laptop)? How do you get a control surface to work remotely?

Thanks!
I'm controlling the PC in two ways. I made a 100' KVM cable that goes from the stage to the FOH position and then using a tablet wireless to control Reaper. Eventually, I'll end up losing the wiring all together and use a Blutooth key/mouse and wireless VGA. There are plenty of options available, including KVM over Cat5 as well. Keep in mind that this situation is for one band only, so after I set the pre-amps, I don't have to touch them again. If I'm doing a show for other talent, then I end up running the snake back to the FOH.
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Old 09-22-2012, 11:02 AM   #112
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I'm controlling the PC in two ways. I made a 100' KVM cable that goes from the stage to the FOH position and then using a tablet wireless to control Reaper. Eventually, I'll end up losing the wiring all together and use a Blutooth key/mouse and wireless VGA. There are plenty of options available, including KVM over Cat5 as well. Keep in mind that this situation is for one band only, so after I set the pre-amps, I don't have to touch them again. If I'm doing a show for other talent, then I end up running the snake back to the FOH.
The idea of a static FOH position and running wires to it seems so far in the past now...

I suspect blutooth will be severely underpowered. I had to bump up my wifi signals a bit to combat hostile situations (room full of cell phones, competing wifi, etc*). The WiRanger is a champ. Fantastic product. I replaced the original antenna on the radios with 13db antenna and I get zero lag moving faders 300' away from the stage. I can turn up a send for a fraction of a second and send a single word to a delay for example. Linksys G router with a 1W booster for the iPad channel brings the wimpy iPad in line (they built it with an anemic radio to save battery life).

* If I ever figure out what that "etc" is that comes up 3% of the time, I'll let you know.
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Old 10-03-2012, 02:42 PM   #113
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Default Using Anologue GSR24M with Reaper as a FOH PA

Hello to anyone that want to know
I have been studying this whole scenario some time now
Recently used my GSR24m with Reaper live in a Variety show with fast changing acts and bands. and especially singers moving from mic to mic for different lead positions. 5 live Mics in total (i use M88 for this kind of work)

I use a MacBook Pro and 2 large screens set up in front of the Mixer side by side with a mixer looking interface i have been using as i come from thre old world of large format mixers.

For anyone interested i brough the mixed busses back into the ST1 & ST2 so i had a little more control and iof required could send any data back to the 4 monitor sends.
I ran 6 effects using the midi controllers into return of the midi channels 31 & 32 and on this desk that has its own volume knob and also switch for return to FOH

My next test will be using the valves for return and this will free up the ST1 & ST2 for full stereo returns for diffent instruments.

There was latency of which was a slight problem because of the type of venue
It was a small concrete venue theatre arrangement and sso quite a bit of the live band sound off the stage.

I still used 9 31 Band EQues for FOH and 4 F/Bk and sub Aux 6 send and an EQ over each of the ST1 & ST2 into groups with good old DBX1066 compression
However i see the day when i can do away with some of this.

I am just so used to dialing up inserted comps and out board EQues etc...

I have not got my head around the TABs thing yet so i could have preset other sound checked other acts or bands in there but im working on it.

Ultimately i think Serr is onto it
I can see the day of small A-D convertors sitting off to the side of stage being controlled from a touch screen

Although the latency scenario to some musicians especially the folk type musicians could be a problem.

In this sceanrio i can see the likes of a GSR24 being on the side of stage for fold back with its most amazing EQue being used as a desk and converting to Digital the data for a FOH mixed sound using Reaper

anyhow this is one of my first posts and hopefully some one will gleen some info from this?

Cheers and thanks for the great reading from the likes of Serr and Quartermoonpro
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:09 PM   #114
FKAB
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Ok report.

I'm not a power-user in the mould of serr but here's where I'm at.

I finally got the little 8 channel Alesis mixer which also doubles as a Firewire Audio Interface 8/2. After install, Reaper found it no problem.

Hooked up my PodXT Live to channel one on the mixer [I could have used stereo out into 2 channels but decided to keep it simple]. Fired up Reaper brought up a track, hit record, checked my input was from Mic Channel-1, inserted an SSL strip with a guitar preset from this bundle http://www.waves.com/content.aspx?id=9251 - which has 4 such guitar presets. Then I made three more tracks, one with each of the presets [ I know, yep will kill me]. Four tracks in all, one panned hard left, two panned right and one about 10:30. I'll come back to this in a second.

Dialled in my my favourite PodXT patch played a chord! Reaper sends it back to the Mixer via Firewire - only two out unfortunately, and then into a small home PA.

*I had set my EQ and gain nicely on the Mixer before I inserted the SSL strips in Reaper, two went over and two didn't, but not dramatically! Should I trim my input gain on the mixer to ensure zero overs, or is a little acceptable? Oh and I put the SSL strips on as Input FX! Right or Wrong?

Now I'm still having a little trouble with latency and a bit confused about bringing up the faders, they are way down on the board with the Master at "Normal". Sorry bit of a noob but I'm getting there!

When I bring up my card options I have Asio Buffers which I set to 2048 and Latency Compensation at 32 samples. Good Bad? - Right Wrong?

Performance-wise, with a backing-track brought in on another track, the four guitar tracks bussed out on another track with a Classic Comp and "stock" ReaEQ and with a JS Limiter on the Master, the CPU nearly reached 7%.

Thanks for getting me this far.

Did I mention that my hair is still standing from playing that first chord? And I'm bald :-)

Last edited by FKAB; 10-06-2012 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:35 PM   #115
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My buffer is set to 128 and I don't have any detectable latency at 24 bit 48K.
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Old 10-07-2012, 08:02 AM   #116
serr
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Same here. 24/48. Buffer at 128 samples. I have 11ms total round trip latency from analog mic input to analog output (stereo or quad) with all the plugins.

Fun fact: Drums are often about 10 or 11 feet behind the main speakers on a typical stage. How's that for serendipity?

As for the main out fader level, you find you don't always turn the mains all the way up just like in real life (analog mixer). And you should run this like you would an analog board - set channel mix levels with the channel faders and set your output level with the master fader. If possible you can trim the PA system to accept full output. If not, having the master low isn't the end of the world. You would need to go lower than -48db before you reduced your audio quality to CD level.
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Old 11-16-2012, 09:57 AM   #117
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Sorry to harp on about this:

For LIVE use I've tried my "SSL's" as Input FX and Output FX, personally I favour them as Input. I'm just reading Yep's amazing "book" again, and I see a sort of Crystal Palace + Fatback analogy in using them as Input, as I'm using the little Alesis Firewire Audio interface/Mixer, which has it's own preamp (gain-stage).

Basically the question is would it be WRONG to use them in this way? And for what reason?

Thanks in advance!!

PS Could someone recommend a headphone or speaker monitoring solution for layered recording, as I only have two outputs!

Last edited by FKAB; 11-16-2012 at 07:41 PM.
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