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04-17-2018, 09:45 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Help Please - How Do I Remove/MInimize Lead Guitar To Make Backing Track?
Hi,
I would like to remove, or more likely minimize the presence of centre positioned lead guitar tracks so that I can practice along to backing tracks at home.
I have two questions about this
1.My meagre knowledge about how to go about this is mostly 'theoretical', and I may be misuderstanding this,but I think one
(a) splits a stereo track into two mono tracks,
(b) phase reverses/inverts the right mono track, and
(c) mixes the mono signals together (getting rid of the original stereo track, of course).
Is this correct? If not, what is the correct method?
2. And how would I go about this in Reaper (I am using 5.79)?
I can split the stereo track into mono signals, but get lost from there in terms of how to invert the polarity of the right mono track.
I do understand that any reverb or other effects or artifacts that are not mono or centre-panned will still exist.
Thanks in advance for your help.
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04-17-2018, 10:13 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: WALES, UK
Posts: 811
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__________________
"I started out with nothing & i still have most of it left"(seasick steve)
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04-17-2018, 11:06 PM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jiff 41
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Hi Jiff 41,
Thank you for this link.
I would, though, like to know the procedure in Reaper to accomplish what I was discussing above.
I have actually found quite a few places where I can find backing tracks, but have not found what I want (exactly - close, but that is why I would like to remove the lead guitar).
So, if you are aware of how to do this in Reaper, I would be grateful if you would let me know.
Thanks again.
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04-18-2018, 12:01 AM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Hi,
I figured this out.
So, for anyone else wanting to try this in Reaper, please see the attached Track panel jpg, and the step-by-step explanation below.
1. Create a track for the stereo version of the file in which you want to remove or minimize whatever is mixed in the centre on the track (i.e., drag the stereo file into the Reaper window so that this creates the first track).
2. Hover your mouse over the waveform, Right Click and choose 'Item Processing'
3. In the menu that next opens, choose 'Explode Multichannel audio or MIDI Items to New One-Channel Items'.
This will create two separate audio files, each on individual, new tracks.
So, now you will have three tracks (the original Stereo, plus each of the new tracks).
A new folder will also have been created, with the two newly-created tracks as the 'children' of the 'parent' stereo track.
Visually, you can tell that there is a folder by looking in the Track panel (see attached photo) at the two slight indents that the two newly-created tracks will have on their left edges (the Stereo track will not have one of these, and is positioned 'on top of' the new tracks).
4. Hover the mouse underneath the '1' in the Stereo track (located at the far right side of the Track panel area), and a small + (plus) sign will appear, along with the description 'Track is folder'.
5. Click the + (plus) sign, and the folder 'indents' will disappear, leaving the tracks as individual entities.
6. Choose ONE (and ONLY ONE) of the newly created tracks, and, again in the Track panel (not waveform) area, click on the small circle with a diagonal line through it. This circle is located between the 'power button' icon of the 'FX', and the upside down, almost-triangular icon next to the word 'Trim'.
7. Mute the original, stereo track.
8. Set BOTH of the circular 'Pan' controls on the newly-created tracks (in the Track panel area) to the far left, or the far right.
9. Play the two tracks and notice that whatever has been mixed to the centre has now been drastically minimized in volume.
Unfortunately, a significant part of the rest of the track also gets taken out, or lowered in volume, but the results can still be useful.
I hope that this was helpful.
Last edited by gvdv; 04-18-2018 at 12:07 AM.
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04-18-2018, 07:36 AM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,969
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Or,
JS: Center Canceler
Note, since the bass is usually central, this is one of the things that can be missing (and missed if you're wanting to play along)
__________________
it's meant to sound like that...
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04-18-2018, 10:12 AM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrk
Or,
JS: Center Canceler
Note, since the bass is usually central, this is one of the things that can be missing (and missed if you're wanting to play along)
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Hi jrk - or Center Canceler (ha!),
You make a really good point.
Many thanks for pointing that out.
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04-18-2018, 07:07 PM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 3,201
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If you can isolate the freq range of the lead guitar, add an EQ to just pass those freqs in the channel with inverted polarity. That should leave the bass, and maybe some of the highs, untouched. It'll still sound bad, but maybe less bad.
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04-18-2018, 08:02 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Hi Philbo King,
Thanks for that.
Actually, my relative luck of success in previously trying to eliminate the frequencies of the lead guitar is what led me to wanting to try the phase inversion.
And I was thinking of trying both, but had got a bit lazy about things, so thanks for the suggestion - I will have a go.
Take care
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04-19-2018, 03:40 AM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,969
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philbo King
If you can isolate the freq range of the lead guitar, add an EQ to just pass those freqs in the channel with inverted polarity. That should leave the bass, and maybe some of the highs, untouched. It'll still sound bad, but maybe less bad.
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I'm not campaigning for Center Canceller :-) but if you go 3band spliter (fiddle with the crossover freqs) -> center canceller (on the mid band only) -> 3 band joiner, it seems to work a bit better.
__________________
it's meant to sound like that...
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04-19-2018, 11:54 AM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrk
I'm not campaigning for Center Canceller :-) but if you go 3band spliter (fiddle with the crossover freqs) -> center canceller (on the mid band only) -> 3 band joiner, it seems to work a bit better.
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Hi Philbo King,
Many thanks for your suggestion.
I had not actually realized that Center Canceler is a program - thanks for mentioning that.
I also just came across a thread here - called, appropriately enough, 'Center Canceler' - which discusses various methods and programs for accomplishing this.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=37864
Thanks, once again.
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04-19-2018, 02:53 PM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 3,201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gvdv
Hi Philbo King,
Many thanks for your suggestion.
I had not actually realized that Center Canceler is a program - thanks for mentioning that.
I also just came across a thread here - called, appropriately enough, 'Center Canceler' - which discusses various methods and programs for accomplishing this.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=37864
Thanks, once again.
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Well, that was JRK's suggestion. I just suggested only passing the lead guitar freqs to the inverted channel. Like album covers, credits can matter, sometimes...
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04-20-2018, 12:09 PM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philbo King
Well, that was JRK's suggestion. I just suggested only passing the lead guitar freqs to the inverted channel. Like album covers, credits can matter, sometimes...
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jrk,
So sorry to have got this wrong, and a big 'Thank You' for suggesting Center Canceler.
Philbo King, you are absolutey right, and it is important to me to acknowledge help from the correct people!
Thanks for pointing out my mistake, as it gives me a chance to correct it.
All the best to you both
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04-21-2018, 10:01 AM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 2,969
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No worries. We all just want you to figure out the easiest / best way to do what you need to do. There's usually more than one way to do it. Rolling your own usually means getting to understand what's going on. Just sticking a plugin on (like I suggested) isn't as educational. Have fun.
__________________
it's meant to sound like that...
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04-22-2018, 07:21 PM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrk
No worries. We all just want you to figure out the easiest / best way to do what you need to do. There's usually more than one way to do it. Rolling your own usually means getting to understand what's going on. Just sticking a plugin on (like I suggested) isn't as educational. Have fun.
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Hi jrk,
I completely agree with you about there usually being more than one way to accomplish this, and I also agree that doing this oneself, rather than simply using a plug in to sort of 'automate' the process, is a much better learning experience.
And I really do appreciate the help from yourself, and all of those here.
Take care.
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