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11-05-2019, 11:02 AM
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#41
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chip mcdonald
You'll note I wasn't responding to you or your example.
Your use is different than the poster I was replying to.
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If you saw Swi's template size, he's probably got one of the larger templates in Reaper-land (at least that I am aware of). Same use case applies.
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11-06-2019, 10:45 AM
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#42
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NA - North Augusta South Carolina
Posts: 4,294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klangfarben
If you saw Swi's template size, he's probably got one of the larger templates in Reaper-land (at least that I am aware of). Same use case applies.
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In his example he tracked a single guitar track, moved the cursor and tracked again. How big his template is has nothing to do with doing that as a process.
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11-21-2019, 12:46 AM
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#43
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 169
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+1
and +2 for friends using Reaper but not present here who are also frustrated with splits.
I like the zones idea so we can nudge and stretch takes
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11-21-2019, 01:27 AM
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#44
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 425
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+1, this would be great to have.
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11-24-2019, 09:39 PM
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#45
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Salvador, Brazil
Posts: 51
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Yesssss!
Please make that fix, and while you're at it make a "playlist" kind of complement, just so much better!
I think Reaper 6 is going to come with this, it's to many people talking about this to not do it...
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11-25-2019, 07:06 AM
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#46
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juliansader
If you use the recording modes "Time selection auto-punch" or "Auto-punch selected items", REAPER will know what the intended endpoint of the recording is. Then, if you press stop while recording, REAPER will not split items. Instead, the partial recording will be extended with silence to the end.
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That's very limiting and time consuming,especially if you are the engineer in the studio controlling REAPER, and the client isn't there to show you where he/she wants to punch in and out.
I'm used to the current takes system now, but that doesn't mean it can't be better. I'm all for non-splitting takes. +1
Yesterday was another 8 hour session, comping vocals and guitars for a client. I just have to keep things as clean and tidy as I can while I'm recording to avoid issues later. You have to in a studio setting... time is money and clients don't want to wait around for you to get things in order.
Last edited by citizenkeith; 03-16-2020 at 07:44 AM.
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11-30-2019, 01:38 AM
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#47
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2019
Posts: 425
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Just bumping this thread as i still run into this issue everyday.
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12-02-2019, 11:23 AM
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#48
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
Did some careful consideration of how to improve the current Takes system.
I think the biggest issues come from the use of Splits as active-take boundaries, for a task that Splits really are not intended for.
I present...
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why to have zones (or any other concept to be understood) if we could have just some option to turn the splits off - simple, straight forward and clear to everybody. I really don't mean this answer to be b*tching or anything like that - just thinking the way to keep reaper simple and manageable (peace)
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12-02-2019, 11:27 AM
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#49
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chip mcdonald
Why don't you have an empty, muted track below it and every time you stop the transport you just put what you just did there?
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because that would be the rape to workflow and creativity flow
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12-02-2019, 11:33 AM
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#50
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcslaam
+1
and +2 for friends using Reaper but not present here who are also frustrated with splits.
I like the zones idea so we can nudge and stretch takes
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As I said this was the first thing that moved me away from reaper every time I tried it before. To be honest I am quite disappointed that I don't see any attention from devs..I know too many things going on on but it really sounds so simple to implement. I would be really curious to see the reason why not..
If there could be only one thing I can wish for in Reaper 6 or any near future it would be this.
however no positive news, nor here nor in the pre-release
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12-02-2019, 12:55 PM
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#51
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 853
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Yes - the zones idea is a good one but obviously more complex to implement.
A simple preferences option to NOT create splits, and instead extend all takes to the length of longest take in the item, would be good enough for me for now.
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12-02-2019, 01:19 PM
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#52
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Yes - the zones idea is a good one but obviously more complex to implement.
A simple preferences option to NOT create splits, and instead extend all takes to the length of longest take in the item, would be good enough for me for now.
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In a lot of cases (can't go into them now) you can just delete all the "end pieces" in one delete operation, then drag the item back out and not lose any takes provided all takes exist to the left - I'm a bad example though because I love splits because they are so handy. That includes wildly doing takes at any position, still love 'em.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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12-02-2019, 01:37 PM
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#53
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 853
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
In a lot of cases (can't go into them now) you can just delete all the "end pieces" in one delete operation, then drag the item back out and not lose any takes provided all takes exist to the left - I'm a bad example though because I love splits because they are so handy. That includes wildly doing takes at any position, still love 'em.
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Thanks for the info. If anyone has a nice clean custom action for this that works like karbo is describing then I'd love to hear about it. Especially if it works for cycled midi takes too. I've got one that I posted earlier, but it's not elegant.
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12-02-2019, 01:40 PM
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#54
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Thanks for the info. If anyone has a nice clean custom action for this that works like karbo is describing then I'd love to hear about it. Especially if it works for cycled midi takes too. I've got one that I posted earlier, but it's not elegant.
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Well when it's the use case I'm speaking of its faster to delete it and drag it than to run a script but again, I'm a bad example and the one everyone loves to hate when it comes to the takes system. I can't comment fully on MIDI though, just audio. I rarely do that delete/drag thing though because if a split is there, chances are a different take is that I want to switch between so I just keep them 99% of the time (and I do as advanced splitting/sloppy/takes as anyone best I can tell).
I do tend to clean up messy ends though but that's one drag and one click.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 12-02-2019 at 01:45 PM.
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12-02-2019, 01:50 PM
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#55
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
In a lot of cases (can't go into them now) you can just delete all the "end pieces" in one delete operation, then drag the item back out and not lose any takes provided all takes exist to the left -
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This is what I currently do, but would prefer full takes without splits and auto-length to item length. The problem I have with deleting the short items and dragging the end to the right, is that if a take was shorter than the others it will auto-repeat (unless there's a setting somewhere that I've never discovered).
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12-02-2019, 01:56 PM
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#56
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
The problem I have with deleting the short items and dragging the end to the right, is that if a take was shorter than the others it will auto-repeat (unless there's a setting somewhere that I've never discovered).
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Not sure, I'd need to check the conditions. Obviously the setting to loop vs extend would affect it but I have that enabled, not sure why mine does the below so never complained - keep in mind the empty lanes there are supposed to be empty, it's the extended short takes that don't loop that I recorded the animation for:
I'm probably just too busy to pay attention.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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12-02-2019, 02:13 PM
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#57
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Not sure, I'd need to check the conditions. Obviously the setting to loop vs extend would affect it but I have that enabled, not sure why mine does the below so never complained
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I'll have to make a clip next time it happens.
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12-02-2019, 03:31 PM
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#58
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2019
Posts: 853
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
This is what I currently do, but would prefer full takes without splits and auto-length to item length. The problem I have with deleting the short items and dragging the end to the right, is that if a take was shorter than the others it will auto-repeat (unless there's a setting somewhere that I've never discovered).
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Preferences/loop source for recorded items, is this checked?
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12-02-2019, 03:35 PM
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#59
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Preferences/loop source for recorded items, is this checked?
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That might be it, I don't have that one enabled but I do have loop source enabled for glued items enabled because that's the only time I need the source looped.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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12-02-2019, 04:18 PM
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#60
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 1,343
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Yes - the zones idea is a good one but obviously more complex to implement.
A simple preferences option to NOT create splits, and instead extend all takes to the length of longest take in the item, would be good enough for me for now.
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Agreed!
__________________
Magnus Lindberg Productions - VRTKL Audio - Redmount Studios
magnuslindberg.com
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12-02-2019, 04:21 PM
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#61
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe90
Preferences/loop source for recorded items, is this checked?
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Well, look at that...
I'll have to make sure that's checked at the studio too.
I wouldn't have expected that one to be third on the list after imported media and new MIDI items. I would have expected that to be first!
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12-15-2019, 01:24 AM
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#62
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 791
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+1. Please pretty please? Splits are the pits! They give me fits. I don't want to take them away from anyone else, I just don't want to be forced to have them.
In the meantime, I'm trying to start a constructive making the best of the Reaper takes system thread, to try to get good practical information for dealing with this in one thread with a minimum of noise. If anyone would like to help that would be much appreciated. The upside for going over this yet again would be to have all the best info for working with this problem in one place for reference and referral, for the next hundred times this comes up.
TIA!
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=228763
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03-15-2020, 02:28 PM
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#64
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oblh
Just crying as I see no attention regarding this topic, but wanted to note this quick research for future "cryers"
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I guess we should just jump straight to playlists and start requesting that instead?
Oh wait...
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03-15-2020, 04:59 PM
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#65
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Portugal
Posts: 54
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Agreed 100%
if you record over the midi it splits the record like the midi
__________________
Sonic Core Scope / UAD 2
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03-15-2020, 07:17 PM
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#66
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
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Just like I said in every other thread.
The "takes" system works as it is designed. Based on Items.
What most people want is "playlists". Which is based on Tracks.
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03-15-2020, 07:25 PM
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#67
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia
Just like I said in every other thread.
The "takes" system works as it is designed. Based on Items.
What most people want is "playlists". Which is based on Tracks.
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But why split takes into items to begin with?
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03-16-2020, 05:48 AM
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#68
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia
Just like I said in every other thread.
The "takes" system works as it is designed. Based on Items.
What most people want is "playlists". Which is based on Tracks.
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Hi Kenny!
thanks for steppin in! Just a question(s)
a) would it be hard to implement some settings (basically checkbox) to turn the split function off? I understand it takes every end of the item as some stop mark to end the new item created undeline. cant we just use the project alenght as boundaries instead as a "dummy parent item"? It would make much more sense and with the setting (switching old way (parent item) and new way (parent project leght) it will make everybody happy and reaper flexibility above stars.
b) if old way should stay - because I understand it sounds easy from my view but technically it might be near impossible rework from behind the scene - would it be possible to update at least autoheal function to be able to heal (pool of) midi as well? Technically eg remove all item parts and keep only the very first one and then "rec over" it back to initial lenght (sum of all items in selected track). Would it make sense to you?
c) if playlists are "What most people want" why to not move that way?
Thank you! And thanks for all your amazing content!!
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03-16-2020, 06:13 AM
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#69
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
But why split takes into items to begin with?
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As we constantly debate they are incredibly useful for many if not most of us; it's far better to just ask for playlists or additional options, but not understanding they work for others is a moot point.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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03-16-2020, 07:42 AM
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#70
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
As we constantly debate they are incredibly useful for many if not most of us; it's far better to just ask for playlists or additional options, but not understanding they work for others is a moot point.
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Sigh, karbo, I'm sorry we keep having this debate. But every time it pops up i have to tell you that I understand how they work. Please stop telling people that they don't understand. You're just adding noise to this valid FR.
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03-16-2020, 07:46 AM
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#71
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
But why split takes into items to begin with?
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Because takes need to all be the same size.
The size of the item.
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03-16-2020, 07:50 AM
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#72
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia
Because takes need to all be the same size.
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Then why not auto size the take to the size of the item after hitting stop?
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03-16-2020, 07:51 AM
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#73
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oblh
Hi Kenny!
thanks for steppin in! Just a question(s)
a) would it be hard to implement some settings (basically checkbox) to turn the split function off? I understand it takes every end of the item as some stop mark to end the new item created undeline. cant we just use the project alenght as boundaries instead as a "dummy parent item"? It would make much more sense and with the setting (switching old way (parent item) and new way (parent project leght) it will make everybody happy and reaper flexibility above stars.
b) if old way should stay - because I understand it sounds easy from my view but technically it might be near impossible rework from behind the scene - would it be possible to update at least autoheal function to be able to heal (pool of) midi as well? Technically eg remove all item parts and keep only the very first one and then "rec over" it back to initial lenght (sum of all items in selected track). Would it make sense to you?
c) if playlists are "What most people want" why to not move that way?
Thank you! And thanks for all your amazing content!!
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The best way to use takes, as it currently works is to be really neat with your recordings and try to keep them all the same length. Or clean them up after each pass. Or don't use the take system and just record how you like on multiple tracks.
Why haven't they added playlists?
I don't know.
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03-16-2020, 07:51 AM
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#74
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
Then why not auto size the take to the size of the item after hitting stop?
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In which direction? Smaller or bigger?
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03-16-2020, 07:58 AM
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#75
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia
In which direction? Smaller or bigger?
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Bigger, to the size of the longest take.
Currently, if I record a 20 second take, then record a 30 second take, the shorter take is extended to conform to the longer one. Why not the opposite too? And preferably without splits.
The cool thing about the above method... I believe it can just be a preference change. Everybody could still use the current method if that suits them.
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03-16-2020, 08:04 AM
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#76
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 169
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I must agree with citizenkeith here Kenny and Karbo. Dont assume most agree with you. You guys may be long time forum members and Reaper users and I appreciate your input and wisdom over the years. But it seems like you have a direct line, or at least stronger influence over the developers than the MANY who have wanted this simple feature for a long time. On and off the forum. I know several colleagues who dont get on this forum that are frustrated by this issue to the point of leaving Reaper.
We dont want to pre-define the time selection of what we record on the same track because sometimes in the moment we want to record onward further or indeed stop earlier for workflow reasons. We dont want to create extra tracks or long winded multi-actions that dont work properly on MIDI.
Why are you so intent on stamping it out? You are all over the topic every time its mentioned.
We dont want to change what you like, we just want the option to turn off splits. So, if it doesnt affect you, let us appeal to the developers in peace.
Be fair and please get off the thread. Others have asked you to do the same. I'm now joining the chorus.
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03-16-2020, 08:14 AM
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#77
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcslaam
I must agree with citizenkeith here Karbo. Dont assume most agree with you and Kenny. You guys may be long time forum members and Reaper users and I appreciate your input and wisdom over the years. But it seems like you have a direct line, or at least stronger influence over the developers than the MANY who have wanted this simple feature for a long time. On and off the forum. I know several colleagues who dont get on this forum that are frustrated by this issue to the point of leaving Reaper.
We dont want to pre-define the time selection of what we record on the same track because sometimes in the moment we want to record onward further or indeed stop earlier for workflow reasons. We dont want to create extra tracks or long winded multi-actions that dont work properly on MIDI.
Why are you so intent on stamping it out? You are all over the topic every time its mentioned.
We dont want to change what you like, we just want the option to turn off splits. So, if it doesnt affect you, let us appeal to the developers in peace.
Be fair and please get off the thread. Others have asked you to do the same. I'm now joining the chorus.
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FWIW, I have zero influence or input to the devs. I have near-zero interaction and often completely different ideas than Kenny. Please note I mentioned additional options and my beef was the inference that no one likes splits, that's completely incorrect and I will call it out anytime I see it.
You must have missed the part where I said sure "add options" and again, I said the assumption that no one likes or find splits valuable, a faulty conclusion, and it is. I'll chime in anytime I wish as I have no more influence than you do and pretty sure I've not had a single FR answered in 12 years so take that.
That said, I find less and less use being in the forum, so keep your hopes up, you might get lucky.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 03-16-2020 at 08:21 AM.
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03-16-2020, 08:15 AM
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#78
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
Sigh, karbo, I'm sorry we keep having this debate. But every time it pops up i have to tell you that I understand how they work. Please stop telling people that they don't understand. You're just adding noise to this valid FR.
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You aren't reading my posts either, I didn't disagree with a damn thing you said other than to point out that assuming others don't find splits a good thing, is an incorrect/faulty statement. Please stop putting words in my mouth for this reply and start reading closer. That may not be what you meant, but asking the question begs misunderstanding...
Reminder...
Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith View Post
But why split takes into items to begin with?
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Because for a huge number of user's they are valuable, that's why. I even mentioned adding options to satisfy you guys was fine? Are you guys so blinded by your need that you won't even digest comments that aren't = "hell yea" ? However, if you truly you understood, you might not be asking that question.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 03-16-2020 at 08:22 AM.
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03-16-2020, 08:18 AM
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#79
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 169
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I didnt mean get off the forum, just this thread. I meant it when I said your input is valued. I've certainly gained from it.
But mann...this impasse is just ridiculous.
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03-16-2020, 08:24 AM
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#80
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcslaam
We dont want to change what you like, we just want the option to turn off splits. So, if it doesnt affect you, let us appeal to the developers in peace.
Be fair and please get off the thread. Others have asked you to do the same. I'm now joining the chorus.
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It's not about changing what I like. I don't really have a preference nor am I fighting for one. (Other than to add playlists as a separate feature to make people happy)
From what I can tell, everyone is trying to change the take system to behave like a playlist feature. And Justin has made changes to accommodate that.
But at some point, it feels to me that you're trying to change your car into behaving like a boat. I'm simply arguing to keep the car AND get a boat.
If I misunderstand the problem, I apologize.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcslaam
I didnt mean get off the forum, just this thread. I meant it when I said your input is valued. I've certainly gained from it.
But mann...this impasse is just ridiculous.
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Don't worry about it. I understood what you meant and it has very influence over what I intend to do.
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