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Old 08-13-2020, 02:10 PM   #441
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And here is the little problem I posted above. You can see a fresh opened project. I start the pattern and Yutani sounds thin. In my opinion it only plays the second OSC or the sync of both. As soon as I open the GUI, everything sounds as expected.

Here is the vid.
https://mega.nz/file/mu4lVByb#-l6G6Z...c-3uYDLSOth28M
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Old 08-13-2020, 04:38 PM   #442
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Wot!? Saike makes a synth?? Well!! I guess I have to make some synth music this weekend...

Ok well at the risk of eye-rolling, I haven't downloaded this yet, but I already have some ideas.

I've bought a few big-name synths in the past year and only the free Oberhausen (well I got it free during a promo) is getting much use (sounds so damn lush and with non-overwhelming interface). They all boast about having advanced modulation capabilities but all still use the archaic (IMO) mod matrix.

No modulation system I've seen has topped Filther honestly, so I'd hope for similar features here. Mainly, color coding of modulators and mouse-hover-highlights for modulations.

So the thing I always wonder why I don't see in modern synths is good, realtime modulation feedback. Yutani, I can see, already has nice big knobs for everything, and I like the interface already.

So my suggestion is colored dots or bars around the knobs appearing when parameter is modulated and the range is the same color. Different color for each modulator and right-dragging the colored dot/bar changes the range. Looks like you already have range indicators around the knobs. Since the knobs are big, the ranges could appear inside the knobs instead of outside, until all that space is filled.

Maybe to create modulations, there is a colored square in the middle of them, that can be dragged to mod destinations?

When you hover the mouse over a dot or range, the modulator gets highlighted. Right-dragging when a modulator is highlighted changes the range. That's pretty much it. I can't imagine a more intuitive modulation system than that, but rarely have I seen anything close to it apart from Filther.

So basically, with big knobs showing all the modulators and ranges, color coded, with realtime feedback showing the modulations happening within those ranges (with moving color saturation, lines or whatever), you'd have an efficient, ergonomic use of space showing intuitive feedback for modulators. Is that not ideal?

Ok, now I must try the synth... Maybe all my dreams are already real...
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Old 08-13-2020, 04:53 PM   #443
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Trying Yutani, but having some UI issues, see attachment

> https://i.imgur.com/Q4PNwpV.jpg

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Old 08-13-2020, 11:31 PM   #444
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Is there a zip file or something to download this?
EDIT*
Nevermind, found it, doesnt work here

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Old 08-13-2020, 11:36 PM   #445
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Quote:
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Is there a zip file or something to download this?
No you need the reapack installed and Saikes project site in its list. Then you can download every of his effects and plugins automatically within Reaper.

https://reapack.com/

His download page for Reapack =>
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Old 08-14-2020, 12:16 AM   #446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mplay View Post
Trying Yutani, but having some UI issues, see attachment

https://imgur.com/a/zEnnljN
Quote:
Originally Posted by Win Conway View Post
Is there a zip file or something to download this?
EDIT*
Nevermind, found it, doesnt work here

Sorry, seems that I accidentally pushed out a partial commit yesterday. Should be fixed now.

Fixes from yesterday are:
- Added declicking to oscillator reset.
- Add semitone snap (LMB + RMB + Drag).
- Add old broken feedback mode as a "feature".
- Allow vel modulation on feedback.
- Fixed suddenly quiet PWM bug (this was the bug you reported Eliseat).

I'll reply to the other posts tonight. Just wanted to get this breakage fixed quickly.
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Old 08-14-2020, 03:48 AM   #447
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Originally Posted by sai'ke View Post
Sorry, seems that I accidentally pushed out a partial commit yesterday. Should be fixed now.

Fixes from yesterday are:
- Added declicking to oscillator reset.
- Add semitone snap (LMB + RMB + Drag).
- Add old broken feedback mode as a "feature".
- Allow vel modulation on feedback.
- Fixed suddenly quiet PWM bug (this was the bug you reported Eliseat).

I'll reply to the other posts tonight. Just wanted to get this breakage fixed quickly.
Reinstalled from reapack, exactly the same UI issues.
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Old 08-14-2020, 04:21 AM   #448
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Originally Posted by Win Conway View Post
Reinstalled from reapack, exactly the same UI issues.
Hmm. I'm unable to reproduce it here on a fresh install of REAPER. Are you sure you reloaded the plugin and got the latest version? What was the last item on the changelog?

Things to try.

- Synchronize packages in reapack.
- Check again if there isn't a newer version.
- Remove plugin from project.
- In the plugin browser press F5.
- Add plugin again.

If that doesn't work, restart REAPER and repeat those three steps. If that still doesn't fix it, open the plugin, hit the edit button and tell me what version you see there.

Thanks!
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Old 08-14-2020, 04:52 AM   #449
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke View Post
Hmm. I'm unable to reproduce it here on a fresh install of REAPER. Are you sure you reloaded the plugin and got the latest version? What was the last item on the changelog?

Things to try.

- Synchronize packages in reapack.
- Check again if there isn't a newer version.
- Remove plugin from project.
- In the plugin browser press F5.
- Add plugin again.

If that doesn't work, restart REAPER and repeat those three steps. If that still doesn't fix it, open the plugin, hit the edit button and tell me what version you see there.

Thanks!
Its working fine now here, let me try to make some presets today
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Old 08-14-2020, 05:38 PM   #450
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Originally Posted by Eliseat View Post
First things first. Here is the Vel mode play. Its such a nice thing. Really, Saike. So much power from clean to dirty, and everything is there. I wish I would have had this thing back in the nineties. No joke. If you ask me whats the best mono soft synth. The answer is Yutani.

Well done!

https://mega.nz/file/bmhjUZQA#-mXr4R...yzu3LjDSlZNnqA

Many many thanks. And I have no idea why nobody jumps in. Maybe you should open an extra thread for Yutani. But be aware, this would lead into a feature request battle.
Ooh, that's such a chunky sound you got out of it. I really like it when you have the square added and then you change the sync pitch. And the bit where you are making it really chuggy around 2:15. Seeing stuff made with it is quite motivating to keep developing on it

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Originally Posted by foxAsteria View Post
Ok, now I must try the synth... Maybe all my dreams are already real...
All really good suggestions, but I'm afraid the plan is to keep it a bit simpler and not allow fully free routing of modulators etc. This caused a lot of overhead and kludge in Filther, and I want to keep this one a bit lighter. I do fully agree on the visual feedback of the modulators. I will have to see what I can do there.

I am planning to expose one X and one Y control with which you can modulate stuff, but again, only to a limited number of options.


I did some additions today. My brain is pretty fried from the heat atm, so I hope I didn't introduce any new bugs. New stuff:
- Selectable LFO types (right mouse button on the LFO in question).
- The little LFO type preview also shows where in the LFO you are.
- LFO Phase (in addition to LFO pan phase).
- LFO amount and frequency are now linkable by MIDI velocity.
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Old 08-14-2020, 11:02 PM   #451
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Meanwhile I had fun with FM Filter.

https://mega.nz/file/K6IjlQ6A#3tNbeb...XGx3QfSYumX6l0

You can turn the knobs like hell and it colors, colors, colors! Like crazy. Just amazing! Many thanks Saike.
Hi

Great demo. Im hooked And a billion thanks to Saike for this awesome synth <3

Best regards /danerius
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Old 08-15-2020, 03:58 AM   #452
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How wide your screen has to be for Yutani, what if it is a bit smaller, e.g. Feedback knob is not visible?

Thanks for sharing, I am sure this is another bomb, did not test anything yet. Just saw around 1200 new .lua after a few weeks of inactivity here. Plus the saike power tools, cool. Thanks my friends.
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Old 08-15-2020, 08:21 AM   #453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke View Post
I'm afraid the plan is to keep it a bit simpler and not allow fully free routing of modulators etc.
Probably a wise decision. The synth I paid the most for recently (VPS Avenger) gets the least use, probably due to the overwhelming number of options.

One other suggestion is to fully desaturate inactive modules. Darkening the color doesn't quite do enough to de-clutter the interface, imo. That and maybe make the tooltips pop up more quickly with a button to turn them off?

I actually really like the feedback you get from activating the velocity modulation; very intuitive. Visual LFO cycle is great too. You just keep improving your interfaces all the time!

Last thoughts: some plugins I've seen have the ability to "eat" the mouse cursor when changing parameters (cursor disappears, allowing for continuous fine control without ever bumping the edge of the screen). Every time I see it I wonder why it isn't more standard. Can JS do that? If so, the knobs could all be a bit less sensitive.
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Old 08-15-2020, 06:04 PM   #454
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@Fox; That eat the mouse cursor thing sounds pretty useful. I'll investigate whether it's doable with JSFX.
@Tone; If you pop it out of its seat, a width of roughly 1444 should do. None of the placements are really final yet, so some relocating may still happen.

Additions today:

- FM! You can use Osc 1 to FM modulate the rate of Osc 2 now.
- New variant of the MS-20 with asymmetric distortion in the feedback path. This has an effect on the timbre of the resonance as well as the regular sound. Note that while this one sounds a bit grittier on its own, it sounds less good with the FM filter section engaged. Try it with lower gain, high resonance. Where the other MS-20 would normally give you a shrill sine-like resonance, this will give you a more gritty one. Be careful though, it doesn't play nice with feedback (that's a to-investigate)!
- Analog knob in settings. This does a few things. It very slightly detunes the oscillators w.r.t. each other dynamically. This has the effect that they drift in and out of phase and very slightly in and out of key. I'd recommend setting it so the latter effect is actually not noticeable. It also adds some noise to the cutoff as well as a drift effect. I'd recommend keeping it at 50%, the 100% is mostly so you can actually hear better what it's doing, but the effect is exaggerated at 100%.
- Darken/desaturate modules that aren't active (Thanks for the suggestion Fox!)
- Noise oscillator. For adding some tappiness to some sounds.

While these additions might not seem like much, I've noticed while dinking around that they allow quite a bit more combinatorial complexity. I hope there's no unexpected pitfalls
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Old 08-15-2020, 06:10 PM   #455
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I had a fun afternoon today testing Yutani. excellent work as always! I miss pitch wheel support. and also... modulation CC1 to control parameters like velocity does which is so cool. it didn't fit on my 1280 pixels wide monitor. maybe there could be a way to add a horizontal scroll bar to jsfx plugins?
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Old 08-16-2020, 12:04 AM   #456
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke View Post
Hmm. I'm unable to reproduce it here on a fresh install of REAPER. Are you sure you reloaded the plugin and got the latest version? What was the last item on the changelog?

Things to try.

- Synchronize packages in reapack.
- Check again if there isn't a newer version.
- Remove plugin from project.
- In the plugin browser press F5.
- Add plugin again.

If that doesn't work, restart REAPER and repeat those three steps. If that still doesn't fix it, open the plugin, hit the edit button and tell me what version you see there.

Thanks!
Got it working, but its unusable anyway, 1366x768 here on this laptop, its too big for that.
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Old 08-16-2020, 05:21 AM   #457
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Ooh, Yutani is awseome! Thanks Saike
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Old 08-16-2020, 06:39 AM   #458
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Really terrific and useful synth, Saike! I've got a couple questions...

- Does it understand pitch bend/mod wheel? How?

- No release on the envelopes?

Even as it is, it's really useful. Just wondering.
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Old 08-16-2020, 02:59 PM   #459
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Thanks guys

Quote:
Originally Posted by heda View Post
I had a fun afternoon today testing Yutani. excellent work as always! I miss pitch wheel support. and also... modulation CC1 to control parameters like velocity does which is so cool. it didn't fit on my 1280 pixels wide monitor. maybe there could be a way to add a horizontal scroll bar to jsfx plugins?
Glad to hear you like it! Added pitch bend and modwheel support today. Also added UI scaling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TonE View Post
How wide your screen has to be for Yutani, what if it is a bit smaller, e.g. Feedback knob is not visible?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Win Conway View Post
Got it working, but its unusable anyway, 1366x768 here on this laptop, its too big for that.
UI scaling is implemented in the next version.


Quote:
Originally Posted by todd_r View Post
Ooh, Yutani is awseome! Thanks Saike
No prob. Lemme hear sometime if you make some cool stuff with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by juan_r View Post
Really terrific and useful synth, Saike! I've got a couple questions...

- Does it understand pitch bend/mod wheel? How?

- No release on the envelopes?

Even as it is, it's really useful. Just wondering.
Thank you. Pitch bend and mod-wheel support were added today. The choice to omit release was deliberate to save space and simplify the synth. Currently, there is a release phase, it just has the same time constant as decay. You're not the first to ask though. I might have to reconsider that and add a second decay parameter. I haven't decided yet.


So, changelog:
- Feature: Resolution scaling. It won't look as good on smaller resolutions, but hopefully it'll at least be usable.
- Feature: Add pitch bend (+/- 2 semitones).
- Feature: Add vibrato under the pitch mod controls (new name for the panel that also contains glide).
- Feature: Add mod wheel / CC1 modulator options (Please note that not all of the ones that you have with velocity modulation are available for wheel modulation. This isn't a bug, but a limitation at the moment).
- Feature: Add few more Filter FM modulation options (Tri and actual Sqr).
- Bugfix: By accident, the old "Sqr" was actually the absolute of a sine. This one has now been renamed. Note that no presets will have broken because of it (the slider value is still the same).
- Bugfix: stuttering issue hardsync when analog mode is engaged.

This is a fairly big update, so it is possible I introduced some new bugs along the way. I did my best to test my changes, but given that I only really have the weekend to work on this, testing is somewhat limited. Please let me know if something was borked. Thank you!
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Old 08-16-2020, 03:57 PM   #460
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whaaaaaat theeeeeee ?????
I didn't expect it so fast. genius. thank you I'll play with it soon and see if I can find any bug or create some presets
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Old 08-16-2020, 06:14 PM   #461
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@sai’ke
Sweet!!
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Old 08-17-2020, 02:02 AM   #462
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An here we are, Saike.

Great additions. The best synths are those, which make fun to play with. And at the moment there is nothing comparable. The filter drive feeling is the best. Its like pushing the signal thru real hardware to choke the high resonances. That's just unique. I will wait till some of your planned addition have found their ways into Yutani. And than I will do my best to make the best presets for Yutani.
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Old 08-17-2020, 02:35 AM   #463
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Few days ago, Glenn from SpectreSoucdsStudio made a video about how to install reapack and your plugins in particular :P


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Old 08-17-2020, 09:42 AM   #464
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Few days ago, Glenn from SpectreSoucdsStudio made a video about how to install reapack and your plugins in particular :P
Cool, that's awesome

That explains the uptick in visitors I noticed a while back on Github


Thanks for letting me know.

Now I feel like I should start categorizing my plugins into UI vs UI-less ones. Since the former is definitely easier to use. I feel a little embarrassed that he ended up picking the Tanh saturator, which is probably the most user unfriendly thing I made

@Eliseat,
I don't have any concrete plans at the moment for extra features. Is there anything you're still missing?

I mean, one option would be a few inserts like a tiny allpass effect, compressor, widener or a chorus. But I feel like just using dedicated plugins for that stuff is usually better. Then again, might be nice to have them under the same modulators, and this way they can be bundled with the presets.

Yet, there's also something to be said for a small focused thing. Decisions, decisions.
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Old 08-17-2020, 10:55 AM   #465
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Wow, you're working solid days, Saike. And thanks for the detailed response!!
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Old 08-17-2020, 01:58 PM   #466
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Just some random presets. I'll probably boil these down some more since there's quite a few duplicates in terms of sound
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Old 08-17-2020, 10:19 PM   #467
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I feel a little embarrassed that he ended up picking the Tanh saturator, which is probably the most user unfriendly thing I made
Tanh Saturator with anti aliasing is very good for something that's easy to use and as a "make-it-loud" plugin.

"Never Odd or Even" is interesting to me too, as more of a "make-it-squish" plugin.

Sometimes that's all us simpletons are looking for. A super duper modulated distortion box with a lot of options can seem like too much when all a person might want is "just make it loud" or "just squish it".
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Old 08-17-2020, 11:25 PM   #468
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Hi Saike

Are these available for download? I dont care if theyre in beta

Best regards /danerius

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Just some random presets. I'll probably boil these down some more since there's quite a few duplicates in terms of sound
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Old 08-18-2020, 01:18 AM   #469
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Are these available for download? I dont care if theyre in beta
The presets? Yeah, here: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Jo...ss_presets.rpl

But there's a good chance I will update them in the future, so if you like any of them and use them, I would recommend resaving them to a different name, so that they don't get overwritten if I update these.
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Old 08-18-2020, 02:11 AM   #470
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Damn, Yutani sounds amazing!
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Old 08-18-2020, 05:54 AM   #471
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Hi

Big, big thanks. Listened to te clip for the third time. Still awesome

I have one suggestion for Yutani. The option to adjust time based parameters in note values instead of milliseconds. It makes for a more musical approach to tuning parameters plus presets would naturally adjust to different project tempos.

Best regards /danerius

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The presets? Yeah, here: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/Jo...ss_presets.rpl

But there's a good chance I will update them in the future, so if you like any of them and use them, I would recommend resaving them to a different name, so that they don't get overwritten if I update these.
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Old 08-18-2020, 01:48 PM   #472
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Hi
Big, big thanks. Listened to te clip for the third time. Still awesome
Thanks

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I have one suggestion for Yutani. The option to adjust time based parameters in note values instead of milliseconds. It makes for a more musical approach to tuning parameters plus presets would naturally adjust to different project tempos.
Interesting. I think this one should be doable. I've never seen a synth do that before. I'm curious how well it'll work in practice. Should be an interesting experiment. I'll put it on the backlog for next weekend.

I'm still doubting whether omitting an explicit release time constant was either a mistake or a simplification that makes it easier to use. Have any of you missed an explicit release phase?
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Old 08-18-2020, 02:49 PM   #473
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I assume of course that the next thing you're making is a polyphonic synth.
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Old 08-18-2020, 03:13 PM   #474
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I assume of course that the next thing you're making is a polyphonic synth.
Not so likely. These filters are way too heavy as JSFX to go poly.

One possible extension I could still see for this thing is to do something more akin to paraphonic. Where you can hit more than one note on this synth, but you just have one filter + envelope. Then you could play chords but not have those expensive filters run for each voice.
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Old 08-18-2020, 03:52 PM   #475
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Any thoughts about making a synth based on Filther as a JUCE plugin?

You could probably make them more efficient with SSE/AVX and parallelize voices that way.
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Old 08-18-2020, 04:30 PM   #476
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Well that settles it. Saike will be making VST plugins from now on, and porting all previous work to VST. And making Linux VST the #1 priority.
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Old 08-18-2020, 08:25 PM   #477
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Hello Saike,
I agree with you, that effects like chorus or delay are unnecessary in this context. Everything is there in the FX library.

What I think would bring Yutani forward would be mostly things we already have talked about.

- (edit: I just saw it ) a noise OSC (for drum or percussion sounds and more dirt)
- a detuning LFO and/or PWM LFO (first one for sync sounds)
- maybe the possibility to pan the bonus OSCs (for leads or pads)
- maybe a tuning range up to 48 semis (not down)(for more overtone like effects)

I'm aware that an additional LFO system would break the boundaries. This is only wishful thinking because its just to tempting to go crazy with tuning and PWM. (By the way, its all doable with parameter modulation. So ...) The noise OSC was your idea and could enrich the sound especially for percussive sounds and dirty sounding basses. This could open a new little world into Yutani.

But for me Yutani is already the winner of all monosynth contests that I could imagine. The concept, the sound, the creative process and the fun factor are just stunning. So consider just leaving it as it is. Because its already a masterpiece! No joke, Saike.

There is only one downside if you really have to pick one. And that's not your fault. The CPU consumption is high. But its also worth it.
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Old 08-19-2020, 02:17 PM   #478
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Any thoughts about making a synth based on Filther as a JUCE plugin?

You could probably make them more efficient with SSE/AVX and parallelize voices that way.
Have considered it yes. Even started at one point (but w/iPlug2), but it's on hiatus for now. Maybe one day, when I have a lot of time on my hands. It'll be a while though

I wish there was a simple immediate mode UI/VST framework.

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Hello Saike,
I agree with you, that effects like chorus or delay are unnecessary in this context. Everything is there in the FX library.
Couldn't resist adding one effect though. Press this button \/ It's new



It's a bit weirdly placed since it doesn't "activate" the analog knob and doesn't have that much to do with it. But I had no idea where to place it. Guess what it does from how it sounds.

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What I think would bring Yutani forward would be mostly things we already have talked about.
- a detuning LFO and/or PWM LFO (first one for sync sounds)
There's a vibrato in the pitch mod area. I could add an option for only applying it to one of the Oscs. Which one then though? Osc 1? The two bottom controls in the PWM section control the pulse width modulation. Or is that not what you meant? Could you render a sound sample of what it could sound like? And where would I fit the control?

Btw, the analog knob very slightly detunes the oscillators over time.

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- maybe the possibility to pan the bonus OSCs (for leads or pads)
Not a bad idea, but it would require some changes on where I mix the signal. Might have a minor performance impact too.

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Originally Posted by Eliseat View Post
- maybe a tuning range up to 48 semis (not down)(for more overtone like effects)
For the bonus oscs?

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Originally Posted by Eliseat View Post
There is only one downside if you really have to pick one. And that's not your fault. The CPU consumption is high. But its also worth it.
Yeah, the CPU hurts. There's still some small things here and there I can do, but it's not going to be as performant as a proper plugin. I tried swapping out some of the heavy functions like tanh, but it didn't do much at all (I remember it making a big difference in the C++ version of the MS-20 I did a while ago). So then I put them back.

The only recommendation I can give is turn off what you're not using. For instance, disabling the LFO saves a little. If you use only the lowpass of the MS-20, make sure you dial the knob all the way down. Saves half the cost of the filter (most expensive part), as for the MS-20 I really have to simulate the system twice (ouch!). I am looking into making a cheaper version of that filter, but none of my attempts so far sounded as good as the implicitly solved one .

For the moog and 303 that last trick doesn't apply btw. There I get the other modes from a combination of outputs that are computed from a single pass. Which is why they scale less badly when you dial up the mode.
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Old 08-19-2020, 04:46 PM   #479
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I wish there was a simple immediate mode UI/VST framework.
There is, check out HISE, ignore the descriptions etc, they are very out of date.
Superb front end for JUCE development.
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Old 08-20-2020, 01:23 AM   #480
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There is, check out HISE, ignore the descriptions etc, they are very out of date.
Superb front end for JUCE development.
It looks pretty great, but the licensing models are prohibitive to me (even the VST3 one already is). I do not want to release under the GPLv3 and I do not want to pay money or sign contracts for giving stuff away for free. My license of choice would likely be BSD, MIT or maybe even LGPL. I do understand that people developing these frameworks want to get paid and force those that don't pay up to contribute back, but being forced to do things rubs me the wrong way. I also don't like the infectious nature of GPL code, but let's not turn this into a FOSS discussion
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