Go Back   Cockos Incorporated Forums > REAPER Forums > REAPER General Discussion Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-19-2019, 06:46 AM   #1
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default Did Studio One Pro drop its price substantially because Reaper 6 incoming?

Did Studio One Pro drop its price substantially because Reaper 6 incoming?

I feel they dropped the price very hard and I read/hear somewhere that WT is working on Reaper 6's interface new design so maybe Reaper 6 will be super awesome? Not that it isn't already (performance wise).

In other words, I can get it for even a lower price, but if Reaper 6 is coming out soon, then what's the point? Financially that is.

Cheers.
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.

Last edited by sightlessness; 03-19-2019 at 08:05 AM.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 06:49 AM   #2
EvilDragon
Human being with feelings
 
EvilDragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 24,790
Default

I doubt it.
EvilDragon is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 06:59 AM   #3
_Stevie_
Human being with feelings
 
_Stevie_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Black Forest
Posts: 5,054
Default

I doubt that, too. Presonus doesn't really care for other DAWs (only in terms of crossgrades )
And I don't think they regard Reaper as a "threat".
They are very confident in their product.
__________________
My Reascripts forum thread | My Reascripts on GitHub
If you like or use my scripts, please support the Ukraine: Ukraine Crisis Relief Fund | DirectRelief | Save The Children | Razom
_Stevie_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 08:06 AM   #4
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

I doubt it too, wait... lol. Yeah, I doubt it too, that's why I asked, lolol. Still I find weird they dropped the price so significantly.
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 08:07 AM   #5
_Stevie_
Human being with feelings
 
_Stevie_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Black Forest
Posts: 5,054
Default

St. Paddy sale!
__________________
My Reascripts forum thread | My Reascripts on GitHub
If you like or use my scripts, please support the Ukraine: Ukraine Crisis Relief Fund | DirectRelief | Save The Children | Razom
_Stevie_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 08:46 AM   #6
dupont
Human being with feelings
 
dupont's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: France
Posts: 919
Default

perhaps due to a stiff competition
dupont is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 08:48 AM   #7
_Stevie_
Human being with feelings
 
_Stevie_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Black Forest
Posts: 5,054
Default

No, St. Paddy sale...
__________________
My Reascripts forum thread | My Reascripts on GitHub
If you like or use my scripts, please support the Ukraine: Ukraine Crisis Relief Fund | DirectRelief | Save The Children | Razom
_Stevie_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 03:44 PM   #8
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

Oh, nice. Only today ? Or till when? Thanks.

If I have Reaper already, and like SO4 "elements"... should I pull the plug?
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 04:03 PM   #9
nofish
Human being with feelings
 
nofish's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: home is where the heart is
Posts: 12,096
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Stevie_ View Post
Presonus doesn't really care for other DAWs (only in terms of crossgrades )
Haha, well put.
nofish is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 04:14 PM   #10
vsthem
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 652
Default

Can any long time users attest to how different V6 will be compared to V5.99? Do they tend to throw in a lot of new features at once? It seems like they're all about incremental updates. Were there many new features in V5 vs 4.99?
vsthem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 04:20 PM   #11
Coachz
Human being with feelings
 
Coachz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,769
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vsthem View Post
Can any long time users attest to how different V6 will be compared to V5.99? Do they tend to throw in a lot of new features at once? It seems like they're all about incremental updates. Were there many new features in V5 vs 4.99?
Incremental with a few nice bumps.
__________________
Track Freezing Scripts

Coachz Repo
Coachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2019, 05:50 PM   #12
jinotsuh
Human being with feelings
 
jinotsuh's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 185
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
should I pull the plug?
Most certainly, even at full price for that matter.
jinotsuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 12:35 AM   #13
azslow3
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 797
Default

As most other companies, Presonus "play" with prices. Since they also have hardware, they have even more freedom in the price range (Apple style).

It is funny to see such discussion on this forum, the forum about the DAW which (a) never goes "on sale", but does not has ridiculous declared price (b) does not use (limited) online authorization (c) has open extensions (vs. artificially locked features of Presonus eco-system).

PS. during Cakewalk shutdown, crossgrade was like a half of current sale. And I am glad I have not wasted my money
azslow3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 12:51 AM   #14
brainwreck
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,859
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
I read/hear somewhere that WT is working on Reaper 6's interface new design
Where did you read/hear that? If it is true, I hope that it is as functionally well-designed as the v3 theme was.
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
brainwreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 04:10 AM   #15
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

I know what REaper is and what it offers. There is no contest for me. But I hate its looks to death, even so good of a third party plugin can't make it less clunky. I need in my life something pretty and I don't have songs with 100000 tracks so performance shouldn't be an issue.

You know what was a waste of money? Cubase Elements.... for me it's garbage... can't believe 2019 and these DAW's companies can't make something decent and Reaper has been ages ahead of them...
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 04:17 AM   #16
Coachz
Human being with feelings
 
Coachz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,769
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
Did Studio One Pro drop its price substantially because Reaper 6 incoming?

I feel they dropped the price very hard and I read/hear somewhere that WT is working on Reaper 6's interface new design so maybe Reaper 6 will be super awesome? Not that it isn't already (performance wise).

In other words, I can get it for even a lower price, but if Reaper 6 is coming out soon, then what's the point? Financially that is.

Cheers.
Don't make any decisions based on what you think Reaper six might be. Make your decisions on what Reaper is now and how it addresses your needs. At this exact moment Reaper does absolutely everything I need. There are dozens of changes I would make to improve it but at this moment there's not a single thing keeping me from making hit records in a fast efficient way.
__________________
Track Freezing Scripts

Coachz Repo
Coachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 06:02 AM   #17
Skijumptoes
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Norfolk, UK
Posts: 350
Default

Whats the point? Studio One has a very clean 'ready to go' environment, unique workflow, included sound library, step sequencer, chord track and vocal tuning via melodyne which is included with the pro version.

If those features interest you then, then that's the reason (or point) of why you may go for it. Reaper 6 won't be anything ground breaking in regards to interface and general use as Cockos have a large community to support and vast majority of users have custom setups/third party tools running that they wish to maintain - This will always be the biggest ball and chain that they have to drag with them.

As for price drops, marketing/managing teams will have a budget which allows them to do price drops based on strategic periods in the year. Version 4 must be coming up to a year old now, Cubase 10 is probably their biggest focus and Cubase has seen a lot of love/new users flocking towards it for the past couple of years.

Studio One is fantastic, if it wasn't for a few minor issues (MCU support is lacking, No SysEx) it would be my choice. But right now Reaper is great for me - even if it is a little odd at times.
Skijumptoes is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 06:48 AM   #18
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

Awesome then. I got a GREAT deal for it. Under 200 bucks, that's all I'll say, lol.

@Skijumptoes Good to know you find it fantastic. I know all DAWS have cons and pros. Now I am realizing this comes with even a Strings, Brass and Winds sets (among several instruments) that I guess at least will be useful for beds.

@Coachz Alrighty, then yes, I had to buy Studio One.

@brainwreck I am too lazy to remember atm, but I am not trolling. And if ain't true, I was trolled. But I read it somewhere where there was a link to a youtuber who has guides and stuff about Reaper and he mentioned something about it.
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 07:35 AM   #19
Jimmy James
Human being with feelings
 
Jimmy James's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 761
Default

Doubt it. I always thought their DAW was way over priced. But I think that most are. I always felt it should cost way less.
Waves has dropped their prices WAY down and constant sales practically giving their plugins away. They now do sale prices and deals for what I consider a very fair price.

Studio One might be doing the same thing. I still say it is over priced. But I also think Reaper is a better DAW (for me) and the price was 100% fair.

Down the road I think we will continue to see companies dropping the price of their software. Especially when you consider the profit margin on software and for vendors.
Jimmy James is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 09:18 AM   #20
azslow3
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 797
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmy James View Post
Down the road I think we will continue to see companies dropping the price of their software. Especially when you consider the profit margin on software and for vendors.
I hope not...

Music software is drastically under-priced. That was triggered by Apple and discussed many times. I do not think any DAW vendor is driven by profit (from the DAW). Also it is known that "entry" level versions bring more money then "pro".
REAPER is a bit special. "Normal" commercial companies can not do the same. Also note that REAPER price for real studio is on pair with other DAWs (taking into account it delivers almost no "content") and Cockos special way has some consequences (designers? marketing? support? hardware integration?)

It can be general concept will change toward "free" DAWs. At least that is what mr. Meng predict. Such approach can work for monster companies (Apple, Google, MS, BandLab, etc.). But I doubt that is a good move for end users.
azslow3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 10:26 AM   #21
DVDdoug
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Posts: 2,779
Default

Of course, I have no idea what's going-on in the Presonus marketing department...


But, it's also common to offer a discount before an upgrade is released. If you play full-price for Studio One today and a new version comes-out next week and you have to pay for an upgrade, you are going to feel screwed.


But if you get a $100 discount today and you have to pay $100 for an upgrade next week, that's fair.


Of course there are lots of other reasons to have a sale or adjust the price. And software is unique because virtually all of the costs are fixed (except for some small costs related to boxed-retail distribution and support costs*).


...With no variable costs, it costs nothing to make & sell 1000 (or more) extra copies. If you an sell those to people who wouldn't have otherwise purchased it for $10 each that's an additional $10,000 in pure-profit. But of course if you pull a stunt like that there are some $10 customers that would have paid full price and in the future everybody will be holding-out for the next sale.






* In the real world, you can't really ignore support costs...
DVDdoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 10:26 AM   #22
brainwreck
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,859
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
Also it is known that "entry" level versions bring more money then "pro".
REAPER is a bit special. "Normal" commercial companies can not do the same.
Why not?
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
brainwreck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 11:10 AM   #23
Skijumptoes
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Norfolk, UK
Posts: 350
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
Music software is drastically under-priced. That was triggered by Apple and discussed many times. I do not think any DAW vendor is driven by profit (from the DAW). Also it is known that "entry" level versions bring more money then "pro".
The lower price of the high end software attracts a much wider userbase. And also becomes appealing to those who previously pirated software because of the "its too expensive" reasoning.

Personally speaking, i've never seen so many people running legit software than i have in the last 2-3 years. Now, that may be with growing up so the people around me are more mature and understand the value of software more.

But i put much of it down to better, more affordable pricing/options.

Look at Adobe when they went monthly subscription with creative cloud - so many people are on the photography bundle who previously torrented photoshop and adobe are making billions from it. Adobe suite was something horrendously expensive and out of reach for many.

Presonus too have great revenue and growth based around their audio software, as good as v4 is it's not a huge jump from v3 yet many people happy to move with the upgrade because of their great pricing. Steinberg are the same with Cubase, which other than Avid is probably the most expensive out there, if you want to stay up to date?
Skijumptoes is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:07 PM   #24
TonE
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Reaper HAS send control via midi !!!
Posts: 4,031
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
... and I read/hear somewhere that WT is working on Reaper 6's interface new design so maybe Reaper 6 will be super awesome?
Who is WT?
TonE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:09 PM   #25
Skijumptoes
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Norfolk, UK
Posts: 350
Default

White Tie - who does the themes i'm guessing?
http://www.houseofwhitetie.com/reape..._imperial.html
Skijumptoes is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:14 PM   #26
poetnprophet
Human being with feelings
 
poetnprophet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 1,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skijumptoes View Post
as Cockos have
what's a cockos???





haha sorry couldn't resist
__________________
https://www.kdubbproductions.com/
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpC...2dGA3qUWBKrXQQ
i7 8700k,4.9Ghz,Win10,Reaper 6,Motu 828es, Cranborne ADAT500
poetnprophet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:17 PM   #27
Kenny Gioia
Human being with feelings
 
Kenny Gioia's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 4,105
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
Did Studio One Pro drop its price substantially because Reaper 6 incoming?
The opposite. REAPER 6 is coming because Studio One Pro just dropped their price.

Also, REAPER 6 Pro is coming because it sounds better!!!
Kenny Gioia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:33 PM   #28
Pashkuli
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: United Kingdom, T. Wells
Posts: 2,454
Default

I own Reaper (recording, mixing, portability), Studio One 4 Pro + Notion 6 (27GB sound library, mixing), Reason 9.5 (for the 2000s projects compatibility), Samplitude Pro Suite X4 (70GB sound library is phenomenal).

Although they might seems to be competitive products, actually they are not - simply just different tools to record, mix, master, produce music in general.

Reaper 6 I hope to be more focused on the GUI (I am a big advocate for a vector based GUI). Nevertheless I think that even today Reaper 5.9xy has a plethora of features of which I would use around 40% for my work.

The only thing I miss a lot is... time to spend on making Music. I wish I were 20 now.
Pashkuli is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 02:39 PM   #29
Skijumptoes
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Norfolk, UK
Posts: 350
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by poetnprophet View Post
what's a cockos???
Do i look really bad/thick/stupid if i say i don't get this joke lol. It may come to me in the night... i hope...

And as above, a vector based UI would be fantastic. And i guess it's something they can add in a modular fashion while still retaining the raster/pixel approach as now so no-one gets upset.

Utilising more of the GPU for UI would also be most welcome, not sure how that works cross platform tho!
Skijumptoes is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 03:07 PM   #30
vdubreeze
Human being with feelings
 
vdubreeze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 2,613
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
Oh, nice. Only today ? Or till when? Thanks.

If I have Reaper already, and like SO4 "elements"... should I pull the plug?
You mean pull the trigger on the purchase? Pulling the plug means something else to me

Anyway, PreSonus is heavily vested in hardware, so who can say why they're doing what they do with sales. They bundle the lite version with their interfaces, an inexpensive upgrade to the full version, so the economics are a bigger picture than looking at Reaper's development. They very likely are practically ceding the new DAW user market among those who are not in the market for a new interface and heavily working on selling interfaces and getting people started on using the Studio line that way.

Or not.
__________________
The reason rain dances work is because they don't stop dancing until it rains.
vdubreeze is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 03:20 PM   #31
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia View Post
The opposite. REAPER 6 is coming because Studio One Pro just dropped their price.

Also, REAPER 6 Pro is coming because it sounds better!!!
I like how that sounds "Reaper 6 PRO". You nailed it.
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 03:22 PM   #32
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vdubreeze View Post
You mean pull the trigger on the purchase? Pulling the plug means something else to me

Anyway, PreSonus is heavily vested in hardware, so who can say why they're doing what they do with sales. They bundle the lite version with their interfaces, an inexpensive upgrade to the full version, so the economics are a bigger picture than looking at Reaper's development. They very likely are practically ceding the new DAW user market among those who are not in the market for a new interface and heavily working on selling interfaces and getting people started on using the Studio line that way.

Or not.
Oh, so true, hahaha, what was I thinking?
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 03:25 PM   #33
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by adXok View Post
I own Reaper (recording, mixing, portability), Studio One 4 Pro + Notion 6 (27GB sound library, mixing), Reason 9.5 (for the 2000s projects compatibility), Samplitude Pro Suite X4 (70GB sound library is phenomenal).

Although they might seems to be competitive products, actually they are not - simply just different tools to record, mix, master, produce music in general.

Reaper 6 I hope to be more focused on the GUI (I am a big advocate for a vector based GUI). Nevertheless I think that even today Reaper 5.9xy has a plethora of features of which I would use around 40% for my work.

The only thing I miss a lot is... time to spend on making Music. I wish I were 20 now.
Awesome. I guess I am not that crazy wanting to own other DAWS because they offer something different than REaper. Samplitude library seems has a good value for you. Sweet.

And yes, I hope finally they nail the GUI thing. If they manage that, I perhaps will stick with Reaper most of the time.
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 03:38 PM   #34
Coachz
Human being with feelings
 
Coachz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,769
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sightlessness View Post
I like how that sounds "Reaper 6 PRO". You nailed it.
Reaper 6 Llama edition !
__________________
Track Freezing Scripts

Coachz Repo
Coachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 04:45 PM   #35
azslow3
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 797
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by brainwreck View Post
Why not?
It is like "one man band". Possible, but unusual and has limits (I have already listed some in my post).
azslow3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 04:59 PM   #36
X-Raym
Human being with feelings
 
X-Raym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: France
Posts: 9,875
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Stevie_ View Post
I doubt that, too. Presonus doesn't really care for other DAWs (only in terms of crossgrades )

Don't you remember the "Tired of REAPER" Presonus Social Media campaign ? (there was also version about CUbase if I remember well)


I made a comic strip about it :P
(and another about its resolution)
X-Raym is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 07:28 PM   #37
sightlessness
Human being with feelings
 
sightlessness's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,002
Default

version 5.1000000 omg, hahahahaha, nice
__________________
I want to live PEACEFULLY PLEASE WORLD "LEADERS" GET THIS DONE/LET IT BE FOR GOOD AND MAKE HISTORYYYYYYY! Thanks.
sightlessness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 11:14 PM   #38
zookthespook
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: India Mumbai
Posts: 816
Default

Who said reaper 6 was coming ?
zookthespook is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-2019, 11:22 PM   #39
Edgemeal
Human being with feelings
 
Edgemeal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: ASU`ogacihC
Posts: 3,913
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zookthespook View Post
Who said reaper 6 was coming ?
Justin,

"we might go to 6.0 before 5.99, or we might get to 5.99 and 5.991, anything could happen!"

https://www.askjf.com/?q=4060s
Edgemeal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2019, 12:28 AM   #40
Slapclap
Human being with feelings
 
Slapclap's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 124
Default

Who cares?
Slapclap is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.