Old 04-14-2008, 05:13 AM   #1
manning1
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Default how bout this gui idea.

i might get shot down in flames.
but oh well.....i believe in laying it all my ideas out there.
but heres the background to the idea thats been floating around
in my mind.

1. there are lots of people that know a little programming.
mebe a little basic language for example.
2. how to make it easy for people to experiment with their own
plug in ideas for reaper.
the objective of this being to attract even more people to reaper.
3. some compilers have a form developers use (eg VB)
to quikly set up user displays/gui's.

another option is to have a simple programming language.
for example.
G = create gui.
S = slider.
B = button
C = circular button (for audio ?)
T = text.
I = image.(eg skin).
* = comments.
let me give an example of a simple theoretical language.
a program to display a gui.
GUI START.
G(DAFT DSP). <<dsp name.
*purpose of this dsp is to do daft mucking up of audio material*
S(14,16)
*slider positioned at x cordinate 14 and y 16*
B1(FILE OPEN)(23,44)
*button labelled file open with coordinates*
C(AMOUNT OF DAFTNESS)(26,47)
*puts a circular button at the coordinates*
DISPLAY
*displays the gui*
GUI END

its a very simple example of course.
but just wanted to float the idea.

then once the form was done , then one would link in the
logic.
mebe something like.
DSP START.
GUI START.
GUI END
.......

.......


........
*dsp code logic above*
DSP END.

in summary a simple language concept for people to experiment with. with no need for external run times.
the main aim being to find some way for people to easily create
their own little gui's /programs.
just an idea n feel free to shoot me down .nicely.
(oh the pain.lol.)

Last edited by manning1; 04-14-2008 at 05:49 AM.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:18 AM   #2
Deric
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Do you mean like a sort of 'GUI Wizard' ?
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:25 AM   #3
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Uhm, manning1, you do know there is JesuSonic (for DSP/MIDI and simple GUIs) in Reaper already? Granted, it only really works well for realtime audio and MIDI streams and thus is not so great for every situation...

Jesusonic could maybe be expanded to work with the Reaper APIs, then, I believe, many people's problems about experimenting with Reaper Extensions development would be solved.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:45 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenakios View Post
...Jesusonic could maybe be expanded to work with the Reaper APIs, then, I believe, many people's problems about experimenting with Reaper Extensions development would be solved.
For sure, if something that already exists (in REAPER) could be usefully extended to cover this, then that would seem to make a lot of sense.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:45 AM   #5
manning1
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XEN.
the problem that i was wrestling with in my mind was,
lots of people have probs dealing with the C language.
thus i was pondering if it was possible to come up with
a simple english like language approach.
but mebe i'm wrong.
DERIC.
re wizard.
well one option might be per my example of PGM START /END,
or sorry......mebe i should have used GUI START, and GUI END.
that the user would then press a display button , and the gui would be displayed to see what it looks like on screen ,
so i guess sorta a wizard idea.
i'll amend the code example with the word display.

feel free anyone to suggest your own ideas.

main theme in my mind was how to incorporate a mini compiler/gui creator that was simple and very english like.

the reason i started the OP was i see tons of people on various forums itching (lol.) to do their own likkle plug in programs,
but find things like vst sdk's etc too much it seems to understand.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:50 AM   #6
Deric
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I think, ideally, it shouldn't involve ANY user programming skills (C++, VB, whatever)...

This way anyone can contribute stuff... This has to be the most accessible way.

So, maybe, some sort of 'REAPER GUI-Designer Wizard' preferably that then allows MIDI assignment to each of the controls...?

Just suggesting...
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:54 AM   #7
manning1
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Deric.
hmm...i think there should be an option for those thast ARE hot shot programmers. so its extensible for those that want it and so the hot shots arent turned off.
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Old 04-14-2008, 06:29 AM   #8
charles.monteiro
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manning1,

an accessible GUI dev environment would be Flash or their new FLEX framework. I believe there's a way of hooking up ActionScript i.e. Flash scripting to C, C++, so it should not be too hard to setup the glue so that pretty Flash screen values and events are hooked to the respective Reaper API i.e. Flash can be the pretty interface that simply captures and passes values to Reaper and triggers actions in Reaper.

If you have not played with Flash, its got a wizard and painter i.e. quite friendly, its not meant for the hard core developer per se.

Just a thought,
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Old 04-14-2008, 03:36 PM   #9
manning1
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charles.
do you have a link to the flash etc ?
i'm just curious mate.

but a bit of a sceptic, cos everything i look at these days has a lock in cost.
one of the probs i always felt with VB for example was the run time need/size.

i guess ive also been wondering conceptually if its possible
to build a gui plus dsp processing language which was very english based. (but still allow linking to C and ASM modules for the hard core gurus.).
i'm thinking here purely of people with some coding background,
and how it might make it fun for them simply.
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Old 04-14-2008, 03:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post
charles.
do you have a link to the flash etc ?
i'm just curious mate.

but a bit of a sceptic, cos everything i look at these days has a lock in cost.
one of the probs i always felt with VB for example was the run time need/size.

i guess ive also been wondering conceptually if its possible
to build a gui plus dsp processing language which was very english based. (but still allow linking to C and ASM modules for the hard core gurus.).
i'm thinking here purely of people with some coding background,
and how it might make it fun for them simply.
Synthmaker is one approach to this that allows rapid prototyping as well as optimising. not surprisingly it still needs development, but is very good for some things already
http://synthmaker.co.uk/
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Old 04-14-2008, 04:24 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post
...

but a bit of a sceptic...
You should see a pysician, mate.
That can be deadly.

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Old 04-15-2008, 03:45 AM   #12
manning1
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greg.
yes i'm aware of synthmaker.
but it has its technical bounds from what i can see.

the sorta concept i was trying to get across, but mebe failed is
a very communicative english like language for personal plug ins.
that lets one build small fast elegant dsp programs/plug ins.

the problem with a lot of products out there,
and the same goes for programming code compilers is either
they are very high level , but have operational bounds technically. or are difficult to learn for some.
for example VB while on the surface is very english like ,
do while etc etc , theres a ton of statements n rules in it
to understand. and the big run time which renders the idea of
small elegant programs moot. VB is rather bloated.
then at the other end is asm. some would say arcane , but a lot of hard core guys love it. partly because of the ability to
generate small elegant programs. but asm is rather difficult for the beginner.

my overriding thinking was, theres a new generation going to be growing up , and from what i see they dont want things that are a "hassle". and are often not interested in the down n dirty coding technicalities.
to them , if they look at source code often it seems arcane to them.
various attempts have been made over the years to produce accessible programming languages. with varying degrees of success.
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:01 AM   #13
gregh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by manning1 View Post
greg.
yes i'm aware of synthmaker.
but it has its technical bounds from what i can see.

the sorta concept i was trying to get across, but mebe failed is
a very communicative english like language for personal plug ins.
that lets one build small fast elegant dsp programs/plug ins.

the problem with a lot of products out there,
and the same goes for programming code compilers is either
they are very high level , but have operational bounds technically. or are difficult to learn for some.
for example VB while on the surface is very english like ,
do while etc etc , theres a ton of statements n rules in it
to understand. and the big run time which renders the idea of
small elegant programs moot. VB is rather bloated.
then at the other end is asm. some would say arcane , but a lot of hard core guys love it. partly because of the ability to
generate small elegant programs. but asm is rather difficult for the beginner.

my overriding thinking was, theres a new generation going to be growing up , and from what i see they dont want things that are a "hassle". and are often not interested in the down n dirty coding technicalities.
to them , if they look at source code often it seems arcane to them.
various attempts have been made over the years to produce accessible programming languages. with varying degrees of success.
the problem is ambiguity manning - in the end the semantics of a programming language will be (much) more constrained than natural language
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Old 04-15-2008, 05:05 AM   #14
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I thought that's what SynthEdit was? Despite all its flaws...
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