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Old 06-27-2019, 03:31 AM   #1
aviel
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Default Audio Quantize with "Strength" option

Hey,
I think reaper is the only software that doesnt allow you to choose the "strength" of the quantize (0-100%) when quantizing audio items (for example drums allignment). i know that the midi quantize does allow this.

it is a really big down for drums quantization.
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Old 06-27-2019, 04:29 AM   #2
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https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=165672
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Old 05-09-2020, 07:39 AM   #3
jormal
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I have tried mpl QuantizeTool, and it is definitely not the correct tool for editing drums.

As you have mentioned in the tool's forum thread as well, it doesn't work with grouped tracks, which is fundamental for editing drums, recorded with multiple microphones.

Also, a native, simple, stable strength/percentage level of quantization is something a modern DAW should have, and users should not have to resort to using third party tools that some smart people, like yourself, have to develop in their own free time, just because of the DAW's shortages.
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Old 02-02-2021, 12:02 AM   #4
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Yikes! This is pretty critical to my workflow. Hope it may arrive in the not-too-distant future.
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Old 07-02-2021, 12:15 PM   #5
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I get asked to edit drums with the feel intact all the time so this feature is absolutely crucial for my workflow. Hope it gets added as well. Sucks having to use other DAWs to achieve this.
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Old 07-02-2021, 09:06 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jormal View Post
I have tried mpl QuantizeTool, and it is definitely not the correct tool for editing drums.

As you have mentioned in the tool's forum thread as well, it doesn't work with grouped tracks, which is fundamental for editing drums, recorded with multiple microphones.
(saw this today)
Yes, this doesn`t work for grouped items (not TRACKS right?). However, when you edit stretch markers by hand, it links markers DURING drag. This is really complex to implement in automatic way. Which DAW can handle this?

Here is gif showing what REAPER for items with totally different stretch markers position (items not at same positions):


That case give me feeling it is enough to
1) align stretch markers of grouped items to first one
2) align stretch markers of first item
3) align stretch markers of grouped items to first one (that second pass reduce possible difference of aligned markers)
Here is a gif how it looks like from Quantize Tool:


So if the question is kind of "2nd pass quantize", then yes it is possible to simulate. But that is too clunky for Quantize Tool, I would rebuild it as a different script.
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Old 08-15-2021, 12:43 PM   #7
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I am speaking about quantize tools like beat detective in Pro Tools or the quantize tools in Studio One (and others in other DAWs), where you can group tracks, split them on transients (from selected tracks) and then have them quantized (0% to 100%) and have the gaps created from the quantizing filled automatically.

The quantizing and filling gaps can be done in Reaper, however it's impossible to quantize items by percentage, and the whole dynamic split/quantize interface is extremely outdated and not streamlined.

All other DAWs seem to be addressing this editing/quantizing workflow as one of the basic features they support. Reaper's take on it has not changed at all since I started using Reaper v4.
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Old 08-15-2021, 02:31 PM   #8
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+1. I would love to get this feature in the future updates.
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Old 08-15-2021, 11:18 PM   #9
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Quote:
The quantizing and filling gaps can be done in Reaper, however it's impossible to quantize items by percentage, and the whole dynamic split/quantize interface is extremely outdated and not streamlined.

Like this?
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Old 08-22-2021, 02:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpl View Post

Like this?
The way I do it, is:
1. splitting the grouped tracks with dynamic split into separate items (the end result is multiple items for all grouped tracks).
2. quantizing all of them to the grid.
3. The final step is SWS's "fill gaps" command, which would fill the created gaps.

What I miss, is an option in step 2, where instead of always quantizing 100% to the grid, I could choose a percentage.

I wish Reaper had a streamlined tool, which combines Dynamic split, Quantize (with grid options and strength percentage option) and the Fill gaps into one intuitive, easy to use package. Fill gaps is not even part of base Reaper, but an SWS tool, so I'm not sure if that means this feature request is even further away from being a reality.
However, since I don't care too much about what the tools look like, I'd be happy with just the added quantize strength percentage when quantizing items.

When editing drums, I don't use stretch markers, but move the whole items to the grid. I am not sure if instead of using stretch markers, the same effect of quantize strength percentage can be done on split items.
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Old 08-23-2021, 02:05 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jormal View Post
What I miss, is an option in step 2, where instead of always quantizing 100% to the grid, I could choose a percentage.
QuantizeTool also can do this (anchor points: grid, target:items positions, action: position-based alignment).

However, you can use stretch markers without destroying transients:
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=1729864

But if you fill gaps (by stretching , right?) you anyway ruin your transients. It is same thing as if you use stretchmarkers. Just not neat and old-fashioned (just like before stretch markets were invented).

Last edited by mpl; 08-23-2021 at 05:10 AM.
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Old 08-24-2021, 03:02 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpl View Post
QuantizeTool also can do this (anchor points: grid, target:items positions, action: position-based alignment).

However, you can use stretch markers without destroying transients:
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=1729864

But if you fill gaps (by stretching , right?) you anyway ruin your transients. It is same thing as if you use stretchmarkers. Just not neat and old-fashioned (just like before stretch markets were invented).
I might revisit the mpl tool when I get the chance in a few weeks, but the last time I tried it, I definitely couldn't do what I wanted to do, and using it was not very time efficient for me.

Regarding Fill gaps, I have the "stretching if necessary" option ticked off, so no, I never stretch to fill gaps. Editing recorded drums is a subtle operation, the idea of quantizing is to just make them sound a bit tighter if needed, and not to magically make a bad performance into a good one. So all gaps that are filled are very small, and can easily be done by using some of the ends of the items, without affecting the main transients. Having the quantize percentage is just a means to make those gaps even smaller, if the drum performance is not good enough. At least from my experience, stretching, even the tinniest of bits, always sounded weird in a multi-mic drum recording, so I avoid it all together. Another reason for having quantize strength is that some people would want to make the drum performance tighter, but not 100% quantized, for subjective/artistic reasons.

Again, I really appreciate that you are making tools that help a lot of people, but in this case, I think a lot of Reaper users would benefit from a quantize strength option (for items) baked in Reaper, which is the point of this feature request. That way, Reaper stays competitive against all other DAWs that already support all of this.
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Old 08-24-2021, 06:27 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jormal View Post
I might revisit the mpl tool when I get the chance in a few weeks, but the last time I tried it, I definitely couldn't do what I wanted to do, and using it was not very time efficient for me.

Regarding Fill gaps, I have the "stretching if necessary" option ticked off, so no, I never stretch to fill gaps. Editing recorded drums is a subtle operation, the idea of quantizing is to just make them sound a bit tighter if needed, and not to magically make a bad performance into a good one. So all gaps that are filled are very small, and can easily be done by using some of the ends of the items, without affecting the main transients. Having the quantize percentage is just a means to make those gaps even smaller, if the drum performance is not good enough. At least from my experience, stretching, even the tinniest of bits, always sounded weird in a multi-mic drum recording, so I avoid it all together. Another reason for having quantize strength is that some people would want to make the drum performance tighter, but not 100% quantized, for subjective/artistic reasons.

Again, I really appreciate that you are making tools that help a lot of people, but in this case, I think a lot of Reaper users would benefit from a quantize strength option (for items) baked in Reaper, which is the point of this feature request. That way, Reaper stays competitive against all other DAWs that already support all of this.
No problem, and good luck with a request.
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Old 12-28-2021, 09:22 PM   #14
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Just thought I’d bring this up again here. Quantize strength by percentage for items is sorely missed.
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Old 12-29-2021, 03:19 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jormal View Post
As you have mentioned in the tool's forum thread as well, it doesn't work with grouped tracks, which is fundamental for editing drums, recorded with multiple microphones.
Last week I updated the script so the latest version support grouping for items and stretch markers. It is expected to behave just like what you do by hand.
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Old 03-31-2022, 12:37 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTaylorMusic View Post
Just thought I’d bring this up again here. Quantize strength by percentage for items is sorely missed.
Same. Would like to bump this for all drum editing guys and girls out there.
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Old 06-26-2022, 09:02 AM   #17
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Just the other day I used REAPER’S quantize on some MIDI drums and couldn’t help but think again how great it would be to simply have this exact same window work with items as well. I love all the options (especially limiting to move right/left only).

@MPL I certainly appreciate (and have donated towards) all your hard work to make REAPER better. When I tried this script last, it didn’t seem to handle well the amount of data I was trying to work with, which I assume is a limitation/requirement of the API.
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Old 06-26-2022, 09:56 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTaylorMusic View Post
Just the other day I used REAPER’S quantize on some MIDI drums and couldn’t help but think again how great it would be to simply have this exact same window work with items as well. I love all the options (especially limiting to move right/left only).

@MPL I certainly appreciate (and have donated towards) all your hard work to make REAPER better. When I tried this script last, it didn’t seem to handle well the amount of data I was trying to work with, which I assume is a limitation/requirement of the API.
Depending on data and how processing is implemented I think? Reaper internally also uses API. Would be nice to see how it natively do the same things QuantizeTool do with big anount of data.

Actually under the hood QuantizeTool do calculations slightly more deep than need (mostly this is grouping related), so you can send project to test, I try to think how to improve performance. Although I did huge amount of work for caching data, various performance improvements, etc.

Last edited by mpl; 06-27-2022 at 04:49 AM.
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