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Old 02-14-2014, 08:12 AM   #1
metal_priest
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Default ripple editing with item edge

It's the first time i make a FR, so i want to be sure it's needed to or maybe there's something i m missing.
I madea topic about it, but it looks like there isnt.

that's the goal:

in ripple editing you can move all the items from one point to another one by clickin on the first one and move it back or forward.
You can also cut a portion of item, deleting it and all the items on the right will move left next to the just cutted item.
That's great, but, as i work most with voiceovers and speaks in general, often i need to adjust a cut pulling the right edge of an item to recover some cents of seconds of the deleted part.
No problem if i have silence betwen that right edge and the next item, but if i dont have silence and i pull the right edge i have a crossfade were the two items overlap.

This both in ripple mode on and off.

What i want is that in ripple mode on, if i pull the right edge i dont have a crossfade but the next item moves with my pulling.


so the idea could be a mouse modifire on the edge of item that, by ripple editing, does this feature.

i made a gif take from PT (where i took the idea from), and i made an attacched file here, i hope you can see it.


EDIT: ok it doesnt work, i will post it in few minutes
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Old 02-14-2014, 08:25 AM   #2
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Last edited by metal_priest; 02-14-2014 at 08:31 AM.
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Old 02-14-2014, 08:27 AM   #3
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Very good idea indeed. Definitely useful.
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Old 02-14-2014, 08:31 AM   #4
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yey, i posted the gif too
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Old 03-09-2015, 05:05 AM   #5
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THis is nice!!
Any news from this ?
Is there a vote open ?
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Old 03-12-2015, 04:28 AM   #6
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Doesn't this look kinda like the new modifier in 50pre16 ? Perhaps it is.

Metalpriest, head on over to the pre-release forum and try it out on a portable install if you must.
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Old 03-16-2015, 03:18 AM   #7
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@airon
I made a demo of what it looks like:
Devs: Could we have this simple "move item contents" modifier addition for items? - Cockos Confederated Forums

Screenshot:



The mouse modifier in v5 pre 16 is very different :P
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Old 03-16-2015, 03:59 AM   #8
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oh i didn't noticed that this topic was alive

i will take a look to the pre16!

ray, you almost get what i meant...i'd like just your "right offset" as mouse modifier, because i want that the previous items (on the left) are fixed where they are because already synched where they have to be.
so even moving the left edge, the "starting" point of the item should be in the same spot and all the rest at the right (item itself) should moving.

damn, i really don't know how to make a good gif to explain it better.
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Old 03-16-2015, 05:09 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
@airon
I made a demo of what it looks like:
Devs: Could we have this simple "move item contents" modifier addition for items? - Cockos Confederated Forums

Screenshot:



The mouse modifier in v5 pre 16 is very different :P
Also, the same thing would be awesome to have as mouse modifier in MIDI editor!
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Old 03-16-2015, 10:06 AM   #10
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Guys, it is now open to votes! With Midi Editor suggestion too!

Mouse Modifier - Left Click Drag: Ripple Editing with Item Edges / VOTE

Cheers
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Old 03-16-2015, 11:40 AM   #11
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Voted! All these things would be awesome
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Old 03-23-2015, 05:12 PM   #12
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You may be interested by this:

Scripts (Lua): Move L/R edge of item under mouse to edit cursor (with ripple edit)



It is ripple editing, multi tracks, or single track based on item edges, and because it works with edit cursor, it can be "snapped" :P
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Old 03-09-2016, 07:58 AM   #13
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Note that the script posted above doesn't answer the request. They are workarround, and a native solution would be far more flexible.
As a quick resume, here what would be appreciated
  • ability to ripple edit from edges preserving source position (mode 1) and preserving source position relative to edge (mode 2) as two mouse modifiers
Thanks for listening !
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Old 03-09-2016, 09:20 AM   #14
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+1000 for this.

Much of my work is for Radio, and a large amount of time is spent speech editing.

For this, the two functions described here would be incredibly useful, and I believe it would tempt a lot of users away from another workstation which is very common in radio and onto Reaper. Both would need to Ripple items to the right AND to the left of the one being edited.

Function 1 - a mouse modifier to click/drag the edge of an item and have other items on the timeline Ripple relative to the edge.

Eg with two items next to each other on the timeline, and with a short crossfade between them, clicking and dragging the righthand edge (fade out) of the lefthand item would Ripple the items to the right so that the crossfade length remained the same but its position changed. Similarly, if the lefthand edge (fade in) of the righthand clip was dragged, items to the left would ripple to achieve the same effect.

In essence, it would look like X-Rayms demo video (with the offset sliders) above, but by using a mouse modifier to click and drag the item edge instead of the sliders.

Function 2 - another mouse modifier to click and drag the item CONTENTS towards or away from the fade (like Slip edit), and have the other end of the clip remain the same (unlike Slip edit), with all subsequent items (in either direction) Rippling if Ripple mode is on.

This is harder to describe, but it looks like this.... (sorry, I don't know how to embed the video in this post)

https://youtu.be/KCMOk_ZfcIY

It is impossible to overstate how useful these functions would be for Radio use.

Please consider these requests. Many thanks.
Andy
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Old 11-20-2016, 10:37 PM   #15
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+1

Great for spoken word programs, because this will get used 1000 times a day, saving plenty of time and effort.
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Old 12-26-2016, 10:42 AM   #16
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+1

The BBC needs that too.
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Old 01-04-2017, 01:40 PM   #17
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Maybe my TOP 1 feature request for REAPER. Very useful in podcast/videoediting/voice narration kind of work !
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:20 PM   #18
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I'm bumping this again too!

Would be so useful!
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Old 01-25-2017, 12:37 PM   #19
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Count me in !
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Old 01-25-2017, 01:08 PM   #20
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I also like how the Propagate tool works in premiere pro. When you right click left item edge and drag left, it move content and next item to the right, leaving item as its position.

This could be another mouse modifier
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Old 06-11-2017, 10:51 AM   #21
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+1 to this FR. It should be optional of course.
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Old 02-28-2019, 02:34 AM   #22
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This thread is getting old. And It still would be super cool to have this!!!
Particularly for videos
Please please please.
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Old 06-09-2019, 07:42 PM   #23
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Any news on this FR?

I'm working on editing some video which is mostly dialog and requires a lot of edits in the same fashion. This FR would immensely speed up the editing process.
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Old 06-09-2019, 08:02 PM   #24
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I'm midway through a big podcast edit and this feature would be SO useful!
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Old 06-09-2019, 08:16 PM   #25
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Yes, I'm trying to build this one now for ages myself as "RippleDrag" but it's too complicated in ReaScript...

Biggest difficulty is, that we don't have the option to add actions for dragging-mousemodifiers.
With this and an Api-function "get_drag_difftime_items" which would return the itemnumber of the affected item, it's old length/position and new length/position, this would be possible to script.
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Old 06-10-2019, 02:35 AM   #26
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I'm working on this myself.

As mespotine says, it's very difficult (if not impossible) to do this by dragging with the mouse. A native solution would be amazing.

What I'm trying to do is create scripts which Ripple from edges based on a small nudge that is run repeatedly. This could then be assigned to a key or a MIDI controller etc. It's not ideal, but I think will work ok. The logic of what moves when is rather more complex than you might imagine, but I think I've figured that out.... I just need enough time to get stuck into the coding.
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Old 01-07-2020, 04:44 AM   #27
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Still no news on this...
It'd be awesome to have it.
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Old 11-01-2020, 09:25 PM   #28
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+1

I've been after this for ages, tried scripting something but came to naught. Any solution would be brilliant. Lets keep this idea alive!
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Old 11-04-2020, 03:53 PM   #29
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Another thread exploring this issue, with some interesting insight from @amagalma on script limitations.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=244122

Since there doesn't seem to be action/interest from the dev team over more than 5 years now (sadly), anyone able to help explore the size of the task for a c++ extension approach?
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Old 11-09-2020, 04:58 AM   #30
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Hi all

This is something that would also be massively useful to me, although it seems that the devs aren't interested in implementing it yet. I guess it's not so useful for music work as it is for speech, and that's probably more what they use Reaper for themselves.

Anyway, I read the threads about scripting this, and it's a shame that the experienced scripters think it's not viable to make it fast enough.

Can I just share a thought I had when I was thinking about how to script it myself? I haven't had time to make a serious effort at the code yet, and my LUA skills are pretty basic, but maybe this insight might help someone more knowledgeable with coding to have another look. Maybe not, but you never know.

Instead of thinking about moving an edge and having items Ripple accordingly, think about it this way:

----In terms of the content of an item, moving its edge is effectively the same as moving the whole item and then moving the edge back to where it was.-----

So, instead of trying to drag the edge of an item and somehow track with a script where it's moved and Ripple items by the same amount, how about doing this:

Make a script which would run in Defer Cycle so it's "watching" the position of the selected item(s) - specifically the position of the start and end points. When you make or change the selection, it "stores" those values for the selected item(s) and each defer cycle it checks whether they have changed (ie whether you've moved the item). If they have, it simply sets them back to the original position (effectively growing or shrinking the item as if you'd dragged the edge instead).

Now, there are some drawbacks to this compared to dragging the edge instead:

1) The script would have to know which edge (start or end) you wanted to "fix" in position when the item moved. This might mean having two different scripts to create a "fix left edge" mode and a "fix right edge" mode. Or perhaps holding a modifier key down while the script was running could tell it which you wanted to fix at that moment.

2) There'd need to be some error trapping to prevent mayhem if you accidentally dragged an edge instead of moving the whole item while the script was running.

3) There's quite a bit of logic to sort out in deciding what to do if multiple items are selected (basically, I think the first or last selected item on each track should have its edge fixed, depending on which edge you're fixing), and also what to do with items that overlap the item being moved. Also, some mechanism to prevent items being moved so that their length is <0 etc.

However, for the Fix Left Edge, the Ripple function is already built into Reaper, because items further to the right would Ripple according to the movement of the selected item(s). For the Fix Right Edge, everything to the left of the selected item(s) would need to Ripple instead, which would have to be written manually I think.

Is there any mileage in this approach?

Andy
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Old 11-09-2020, 11:09 AM   #31
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+1000

I tried to code it via ReaScript but there are limitations in the Api that forbid that.
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Old 11-10-2020, 06:02 PM   #32
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I actually suspect this WAS in development but for one reason or another has been left by the wayside.

I found a few really bizarre mouse modifiers for left drag on media item...

Media Item > Move item contents > Ripple edit adjacent items
Media Item > Move item contents > Ripple edit earlier adjacent items
Media Item > Move item contents > Ripple edit later adjacent items


These do something similar to what we're talking about. It's so close, just not quite the behaviour I want. It has some very strange effects though. For instance, it doesn't obey the ripple mode referenced by every single other tool labelled with "ripple". All it does is move an adjacent item if the item being edited bumps into it. Stranger still, it seems to fall apart completely if you move the mouse too quickly.

I think I'll also report this as a bug. I think this tool SHOULD work the same way as other ripple tools. That is to say, blank space is accounted for while rippling, and it should work on one track or all tracks depending on ripple state.

What are everyone else's thoughts on this?

https://imgur.com/a/HzEbXIq
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Old 11-11-2020, 02:54 PM   #33
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Agree totally. Those actions are so bizarrely unpredictable I wonder who ever uses them?
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Old 11-12-2020, 08:51 AM   #34
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Guys, I did it! No problems no matter how fast you move the mouse cursor. Items will always be at the correct position when you release the left mouse button.



If I could do it with a script, I am sure the devs can do it natively
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Old 11-12-2020, 11:54 AM   #35
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@amalgama
Wow !
Is it full ripple, like it can works all tracks and move markers and envelopes point ?or just same track item ripple ?

also, can it snap ?
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Old 11-12-2020, 12:43 PM   #36
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Amagalma, that looks amazing.

Does it also work for the Left Edge? And do you plan to release this script?

EDIT - I would happily pay for this if it works reliably from left and right edges. For my Speech/Audio Drama editing workflows this would be a total game changer.

Thanks
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Old 11-12-2020, 02:29 PM   #37
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The left edge is actually the difficult one,which lead me to give up.
The thing is, that you don't want to move the left edge.
If you track the right edge, like Amagalma did, you can apply the changes to the items after.
But the left one, you would need to see the left-sided movement and push the changed item and all the following towards the end of the project.
This is possible but will produce flicker very likely.
And you need to change the mouse cursor(but that's easy to do).

Wouldn't wonder, if Amagalma pulls it off anyway but I think getting rid of the flickering is probably the hard part(I doubt PreventUIRefresh helps here, as you can't monitor when the item is clicked to prevent ui refresh for the click-dragging-time. I once made this item-click-monitoring happen due an SWS-bug but the bugfix got me rid of the clickstate as well. I was so damn close in scripting that...) ).
If it flickers, it makes you nuts. Especially when you want to drag in very fine details.

The dev's power however should make this possible.
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Old 11-12-2020, 03:27 PM   #38
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Thanks Meo-Ada

I guessed the left edge is the tricky one because there's no Ripple Left feature in Reaper (yet!)

I wonder if the idea I described a few posts further up helps here. It seems to me that solves the left edge problem quite simply, by instead moving the item but "fixing" the edge. Ripples will work automatically that way, unless I'm mistaken.

It's beyond my ability to code. But Amagalma, could you maybe consider if this is a way to make a "both edges" script?

Andy
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Old 11-12-2020, 03:31 PM   #39
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Actually there is two different ways to handle left


  • ir could move previous item back in time
  • or it move item content and item item RIGHT edge (this is similiar to the Propagate tool in Premiere Pro, very common in video editing software)



https://forum.cockos.com/showthread....=1#post1482831


THis was the original thread for ripple edit edge I think
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Old 11-12-2020, 04:05 PM   #40
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The first one requires error trapping to prevent items trying to Ripple to before zero time.

But the second, moving the item to the Right when you let go makes it harder to do repeated fine adjustments though, as the mouse is no longer in the right place when the move occurs....

Which is preferable? I think the first one, but either would be a huge improvement over what we have currently available.
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