Old 10-05-2007, 11:45 AM   #1
kenTheriot
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Default "Clean Current Project Directory" EMERGENCY!!

Hellpp!!! I was trying to record a synth part to a song that was eating up too much CPU space, so I created a "slick" version of the song with only guitar in it so I could record the GS3 parts. I used the "Clean Current Project Directory" for that "slick" version of the song to get rid of takes I wasn't using, but I didn't realize the project was in the same folder as the original song. Now all 60+ files that I was using in the ORIGINAL song are GONE!!!! Please tell me there is way to recover these! And if so, how?

Thank you.

Ken

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Old 10-05-2007, 12:04 PM   #2
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Probably the files are gone

look in the recycle bin

But there is a hope..... When you delete a file, it's not physically deleted, only droped from the indexes so that disc sectors are marked as free space. Maybe you could recover the data by using one of this UNdelete tools.

http://www.undelete-now.com/undelete...reenshots.aspx

good luck

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Old 10-05-2007, 12:56 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by antiClick View Post
Probably the files are gone

look in the recycle bin

But there is a hope..... When you delete a file, it's not physically deleted, only droped from the indexes so that disc sectors are marked as free space. Maybe you could recover the data by using one of this UNdelete tools.

http://www.undelete-now.com/undelete...reenshots.aspx

good luck
Oh Man, why doesn't Reaper say something like "this action will permanently delete these files. ARE YOU SURE?" The Reaper prompt doesn't even use the word "delete." It just says "removed." GRRRR.

Also, for some reason, my recycle bin is showing the last file deleted was in September. So even though it is filled with hundreds of files, none of them are more recent than a few weeks ago. What is up with that? Could they have been put into another Recycle bin on another hard drive?

I'm going to have a nervous breakdown right now.

Ken
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Old 10-05-2007, 01:37 PM   #4
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Hi Ken,

Ouch - we all know what that feels like.

Do as little as possible on that computer - to make sure you don't write over your deleted files. Follow the undelete link above.
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Old 10-05-2007, 01:43 PM   #5
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Ken

DO you have backup files in the project directory????....stupid question....but maybe you could open a RPP-Backup, and get back your work....
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Old 10-05-2007, 01:45 PM   #6
kenTheriot
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Hi Ken,

Ouch - we all know what that feels like.

Do as little as possible on that computer - to make sure you don't write over your deleted files. Follow the undelete link above.
I'm going to check that out Mike.

BTW, I knew a Mike Lacey when I was living in England about 15 years ago. You would not happen to be he would you? We did this medieval group thing together.

Ken
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Old 10-05-2007, 02:31 PM   #7
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Ken

DO you have backup files in the project directory????....stupid question....but maybe you could open a RPP-Backup, and get back your work....
Well I certainly did not duplicate my files on the off-chance that I would completely wipe them from my hard drive. Does REaper create backup files by any chance. Because if they didn't get created automatically, I don't have any. What does RPP-Backup mean?

What is really interesting is that Reaper didn't put those deleted files into the Recycle Bin. So if not there, where did they go? Does the Reaper Clean Project Folder command completely wipe these files from existence....without even a prompt?

Ken
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Old 10-05-2007, 02:35 PM   #8
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Oh Man, why doesn't Reaper say something like "this action will permanently delete these files. ARE YOU SURE?" The Reaper prompt doesn't even use the word "delete." It just says "removed." GRRRR.
reaper should scan all projectfiles in the same folder to look if files are still in use in these projects.
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Old 10-05-2007, 02:43 PM   #9
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Agreed...also...

Reaper shouldn't delete any files without the express direction of the operator, and then still prompt and list the files about to be deleted.
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Old 10-05-2007, 02:47 PM   #10
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btw: you even can delete opened and running projectfiles: http://www.cockos.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13278
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Old 10-05-2007, 03:20 PM   #11
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If you look in the pdf documentation, on p165, or at the Wiki here:
http://www.cockos.com/wiki/index.php...ject_Directory

In both cases you will see that the choice to Clean Current Project Directory requires some extra steps on the part of the operator...sorry Lawrence....I agree that it would be nice if it gave a last warning. We are very used to those from other software programs.

Did yoyu delete all files in the popup dialog?? Even then, Reaper should only have shown you files that had no references in the current .RPP project file.

As far as RPP-Backup goes, Reaper should be saving backups of all of your project settings, pan, volume, FX, etc, every 15 minutes....that is the default. However, perhaps Reaper showed the backup files as unnecessary for some reason, and perhaps you deleted them.

It would appear that Reaper does not send files to the recycle bin...many programs do not, even Windows.
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Old 10-05-2007, 03:47 PM   #12
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I understand. The problem is that a daw IMO should never delete anything not associated with the current project. Never.

"Associated" means recorded in or imported to the current project directory. Something that was once in the project and is not now. A file that was never part of the project should be ignored.

At the worst cleaning a project directory should only clean files associated with the project and then place them somewhere else, like a trash bin folder. This is why Reaper needs a facility to identify files that are associated with a given project.

If he accidentally starts a project in a sample directory he would clean and permanently erase $500 worth of samples not even being used in the project? That should be impossible even if you keep clicking yes.

Or maybe I have that wrong.

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Old 10-05-2007, 03:49 PM   #13
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My situation was strange. I decided to create a different version of my project in the same directory. This different version was just a single guitar track. I did it so I would be able to record a GS3 string section into the song, which was choking my primary project due to the number of tracks and plugs running on it. This worked really well, actually. I ported the strings files over to the primary project file and all was well. But I wanted to go back and do something different in the "lean" project. I decided that I needed to get rid of al the extra takes and stuff to keep the folder size down. so I ran the "clean current project folder" option. Well it brought up ALL the files in the folder, which now included two projects. Before it occured to me that the file "not in use" were all the files for my primary project, I had selected and "removed" them. It never occured to me that removing them would completely wipe them from my computer hard drive irrevocably.

What a nightmare. I have spend 2 weeks of my life working on this song.

Ken
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Old 10-05-2007, 04:35 PM   #14
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Sorry about that man. I'm going to FR file housekeeping again.
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Old 10-05-2007, 04:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence View Post
Agreed...also...

Reaper shouldn't delete any files without the express direction of the operator, and then still prompt and list the files about to be deleted.
Lawrence -

I agree with this also, but would add that the user should ALWAYS keep at least one off-line backup (external hard disk, DVD, whatever) of ALL work. It's just plain common sense good housekeeping.

There are many things other than Reaper which can zap your files. Accidents can and DO happen.

I keep at least two off line backups of every project and there's been a few times when it's saved my arse.

I'd say that criticism of Reaper for the way it handles this issue (badly) is fair game, but that doesn't exonerate each user from taking responsibility for their own data security.
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Old 10-05-2007, 04:57 PM   #16
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I'd say that criticism of Reaper for the way it handles this issue (badly) is fair game, but that doesn't exonerate each user from taking responsibility for their own data security.
No doubt. There zilions of ways to zap files into never-never land. In fairness Reaper does exactly what I asked in your quote of me above.

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Old 10-05-2007, 05:20 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence
If he accidentally starts a project in a sample directory he would clean and permanently erase $500 worth of samples not even being used in the project? That should be impossible even if you keep clicking yes.

Or maybe I have that wrong.
no, I think you have that right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken
My situation was strange. I decided to create a different version of my project in the same directory. This different version was just a single guitar track. I did it so I would be able to record a GS3 string section into the song, which was choking my primary project due to the number of tracks and plugs running on it. This worked really well, actually. I ported the strings files over to the primary project file and all was well. But I wanted to go back and do something different in the "lean" project. I decided that I needed to get rid of al the extra takes and stuff to keep the folder size down. so I ran the "clean current project folder" option. Well it brought up ALL the files in the folder, which now included two projects. Before it occured to me that the file "not in use" were all the files for my primary project, I had selected and "removed" them. It never occured to me that removing them would completely wipe them from my computer hard drive irrevocably.

What a nightmare. I have spend 2 weeks of my life working on this song.

Ken
sorry to hear this Ken.

I've lost a few not so important files in the past, it can happen if you don't keep a keen eye on the 'clean folder'. I'm a little surprised you didn't notice one or two crucial files in there that would have made you suspicious.

I have a few projects with suspicious looking 'clean folders' but can't be bothered to sort through them, so I just leave 'em be for now, but it starts getting pretty messy when you start moving stuff around, renaming files, making sub-projects and whatnot......for instance, I had a midi bass track 001-midi-004007bla-bla.. that I renamed using the the song title, that newly named file is now sitting in the 'clean folder' ???

I've harped on this before, but it would be nice if the Remove option just removed the item from the arrangement and plonked it back in the project folder. And an option to 'delete source file' to clean as you go and help avoid the clutter.

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Old 10-05-2007, 05:30 PM   #18
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[QUOTE=nicholas;117091]Lawrence -

I agree with this also, but would add that the user should ALWAYS keep at least one off-line backup (external hard disk, DVD, whatever) of ALL work. It's just plain common sense good housekeeping.

Man, I always backup to external storage when working on someone else's material, however, I usually fail to be as diligent when developing my own projects. That's why, I sit quitely tonight with tears in my eyes as I prepare a new hard drive to replace my (not so old, maybe 1 year) dead hard drive that contained 6 months worth of my own personal endeavors. Oh well, no reason to cry over spilt milk. I'm an optimist. So I will simply enjoy re-recording 20+ songs using a dandy little DAW that I have come to love called REAPER. Oh my wife is gonna love this!!!!!

Blessings
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Old 10-06-2007, 10:35 AM   #19
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What is really interesting is that Reaper didn't put those deleted files into the Recycle Bin. So if not there, where did they go? Does the Reaper Clean Project Folder command completely wipe these files from existence....without even a prompt?

Ken
I feel for ya. I've been there. I made the biggest issue out of this when I first started using RPR. You'll notice Justin added a small notation at the bottom of the Clean project directory window, but it still doesn't prevent accidental loss of data if you aren't aware you might be deleting something by accident. I know how to avoid losing data this way now, but if you haven't got it sorted out in your head you can indeed wipe out everything. The simplest solution for this dilemma would be to send those files to the recycle bin instead of outer space. The BAK files won't help you if you've X'ed the waves.

Maybe this will help in the future:

http://www.cockos.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12058
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Old 10-07-2007, 09:01 AM   #20
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Just as an update on this. I have not recovered any of my files. I tried the UndeleteNow program, but it would get 2 or 3 hours into the scan and give me an error message saying:
"NT_read error
errorno.1117
drv:1 LBA:156301487 blocks:2"

Even after running CheckDisk this occurs. Sooo, since the files are not in my Recycle Bin and not recoverable through the undelete program, I'm hoping I learned enough from my recording sessions for this song to be able to re-create it quickly.

And some have asked why I didn't notice so many files in the "not being used" list, or notice the names of them as being important. There are two reasons: 1. I have gotten used to cleaning folders and it has become a habit not to look too closely at the filenames, and 2. the filenames end up being "05-Lead Vocal 2-glued-00" etc. that they don't stand out. I discard a LOT of takes, so it isn't a surprise to me how many files ar listed, or what they are called.

Anyway....

Thanks for your replies (and sympathy).

Ken
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Old 10-07-2007, 10:53 AM   #21
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no offense, but i make it a point to learn what type of things these functions do, and test them before i use it on a real project.

It would be nice to send to recycle bin tho.
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Old 10-07-2007, 11:08 AM   #22
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i feel very sorry for you, but i think if it's called delete or remove or whatever, as jason says, you need to know what things do and then such things won't happen.

as a general tip for you is: never use "clean current project directory". go finish your recordings and then use "save project as" with "copy media to directory". then you can allways be sure nothing is lost for that song. then backup that folder. when you have done all your recordings and done as told, delete the original folder.
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