Old 09-28-2019, 11:49 AM   #1
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Default v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019

v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019

  • + Dynamic split: improve gate handling
  • + Dynamic split: overhaul of algorithm
  • + Dynamic split: retain settings after canceling the window
This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode
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Old 09-28-2019, 11:50 AM   #2
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Nice stuff!
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Old 09-28-2019, 12:17 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019

  • + Dynamic split: overhaul of algorithm
Does this affect the algorithm to the action: Item: Auto trim/split items (remove silence)... ?

Do they used a shared algo?

Thanks.
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Old 09-28-2019, 01:01 PM   #4
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Does this affect the algorithm to the action: Item: Auto trim/split items (remove silence)... ?
No, that should not be affected.
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Old 09-28-2019, 01:05 PM   #5
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No, that should not be affected.
Phew... thanks. One less thing to worry about

Thanks for all these awesome updates.
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Old 09-28-2019, 01:27 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019
  • + Dynamic split: improve gate handling
  • + Dynamic split: overhaul of algorithm
  • + Dynamic split: retain settings after canceling the window


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Old 09-28-2019, 03:36 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019

  • + Dynamic split: improve gate handling
  • + Dynamic split: overhaul of algorithm
  • + Dynamic split: retain settings after canceling the window
This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode
I just did some simple tests and I’m really surprised. Great results so far! Thanks a lot devs.
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Old 09-28-2019, 04:18 PM   #8
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Thanks guys!

Been using dynamic split a lot lately so any improvements are very welcome!
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Old 09-29-2019, 02:40 AM   #9
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I am really glad you improved this! Previous issue with slices being ignored instead of merged is now gone.

There are still some minor issues and improvements to be done:

glitch under this text (Win7)


----------
use "Remove silent areas"
Problem: the very first slice before the first gate opening is not removed
Expected: it should be removed because it does not meet the gate threshold

----------
set Leading or Trailing pad to a negative value
set Fade pad on
Problem: the fade is not created.
Expected: item edges are not moved and a fade is created in a length of a particular leading/trailing pad.

----------
move cursor in the Gate frame (Win7)
Problem: the help text at the bottom of the window flickers


----------
FR: add presets
reason: one time I want to split drums to hits, the other time I want to remove silences from voice, currently I need to readjust all parameters each time for each different task


----------
texts: some texts seems unpolished and neglected, also in relation to the overall nomenclature

"Min slice length:"[/B] and [B]"Min silence"
->either "Min. slice:", "Min. silence:" (notice dots and colons)
->or "Min. slice length:", "Min. silence length:"
->or "Min. slice len.:", "Min. silence len.:"
->or "Slice limit:", "Silence limit:"

"Gate threshold"
-> "Threshold"
("Gate" is already in the frame name, will match "Hysteresis")

"Write stretch markers to selected items"
-> "Add stretch markers to selected items"
(you use "Add" in other places; in the action list)

"Write stretch markers to selected items and add to grouped items"
-> "Add stretch markers to selected and grouped items"
(there is no difference between writing and adding here)

"Add transient guide markers to items"
-> "Add transient guides to selected items"
(you use "Transient guides" elswhere in the program; make clear it is now only to selected items)

"Set new items forced to beat timebase"
->"Set items timebase to beats (position only)"
(much more clearer, much less thinking needed, same as used in the action list)

"Auto-adjust snap offset to peak value within first:"
->"Set snap offset to peak value within first:"
(clearer, same as used in the action list)


----------
UI:

transient threshold:
add controls for transients to the main dynamic split window (makes it much faster to set, gate threshold is already there)
controls to add: sensitivity, threshold, zero-crossing, display threshold in items
remove button "Set transient sensitivity"


gate:
add option to display gate threshold in media items, both for threshold and hysteresis, similarly to how transient threshold is displayed

(note: there could be just one checkbox to toggle display of threshold in items both of transients and gate)


order of frames/controls within the window to mirror workflow:
1 - choose split points (transient, gates)
2 - set transient sensitivity
3 - set gate sensitivity
4 - tweak splits, silences
5 - set action to perform


All this would make using this tool much more bio-CPU-efficient, while those saved brain-cycles could be used on the music itself.
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Old 09-29-2019, 12:20 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
v5.983+dev0928 - September 28 2019
  • + Dynamic split: improve gate handling
  • + Dynamic split: overhaul of algorithm
  • + Dynamic split: retain settings after canceling the window
Wow! This is great! Unfortunately, I am away and I cannot test it Can't wait to return home next week and check it out!

Devs, have you seen this?

PS. Could someone test the new algorithm with strummed/arpeggiated guitar and bass guitar? The previous algo was not working good with such audio. Thanks!

Last edited by amagalma; 09-29-2019 at 12:33 PM.
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Old 09-29-2019, 03:54 PM   #11
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It was a pleasant surprise to see Dynamic Split here in the pre-release.

In which ways does the new algorithm improve on the previous one?

Minimum slice length:
As soon as "Min slice length" is increased above the smallest slice length, it seems that some transients are skipped, even though they are further away from the previous transient than the minimum length. For example:

The transients that are skipped, are affected (in a seemingly random way) by the Transient Detection Settings.

Item edges:
When inserting stretch markers into items via Dynamic Split, the setting "Treat media item edges as transients" is ignored, and no stretch markers are inserted at item edges. (Perhaps "Treat media item edges as transients" should be an option in the Transient Detection Settings windows, rather than in Preferences?)
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Old 09-29-2019, 06:51 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by juliansader View Post
As soon as "Min slice length" is increased above the smallest slice length, it seems that some transients are skipped, even though they are further away from the previous transient than the minimum length.
The algorithm looks for strongest transients to base the minimum split length off of, because for example you wouldn't want one weak transient near the beginning of the content to throw off a set of regular, strong transients. In this contrived example, all of the transients are the equivalent, so the ordering ends up being random. We'll adjust this so that splits of roughly the same value are ordered by time.
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Old 09-29-2019, 10:01 PM   #13
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I must say that UX-wise, I feel that all transient detection settings should be merged into the dynamic split dialog, for ease of use and less context-switching. Also I would remove the "Transient detection" frame from Preferences->Editing Behavior and just make all that a part of dynamic split menu, maybe?


It would also be great since you're working on this part, to also make that dialog follow the theme colors
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Old 09-29-2019, 10:15 PM   #14
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I must say that UX-wise, I feel that all transient detection settings should be merged into the dynamic split dialog, for ease of use and less context-switching.
Please, no! Many times when I want to set a noise gate or a compressor I use the transient detection settings as a visual indicator of the threshold. If you merge the two dialogs it will slow things down for me, since whenever I would like to make such a use I would have to wait the dynamic split to finish its calculations. Thanks!
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Old 09-29-2019, 10:29 PM   #15
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The separate small dialog could still be available via the action, then? But I'd really like to see all those options in one place when dynamic splitting, without requiring me to open a new dialog to tweak the detection settings...
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Old 09-29-2019, 11:31 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
The algorithm looks for strongest transients to base the minimum split length off of, ....
Is it viable / possible to insert (e.g.) ReaEQ in the detection path to allow for filtering a dominant frequency for the detection ?

-Michael
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Old 09-30-2019, 01:12 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by juliansader View Post
When inserting stretch markers into items via Dynamic Split, the setting "Treat media item edges as transients" is ignored, and no stretch markers are inserted at item edges. (Perhaps "Treat media item edges as transients" should be an option in the Transient Detection Settings windows, rather than in Preferences?)
Yes, I was hoping for such a feature and didn't know it was on the preferences ! Confusing.
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Old 09-30-2019, 01:26 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
Is it viable / possible to insert (e.g.) ReaEQ in the detection path to allow for filtering a dominant frequency for the detection ?

-Michael
Totally sold on this!
This is especially useful when dialing with bass heavy/softer material
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Old 09-30-2019, 06:22 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
The separate small dialog could still be available via the action, then? But I'd really like to see all those options in one place when dynamic splitting, without requiring me to open a new dialog to tweak the detection settings...
I agree, would be great if it was all in one place and still available as seperate window for use cases like amagalma mentiond.
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Old 09-30-2019, 08:39 AM   #20
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I would also vote for a box that has both Dynamic split/Transient Detections settings in it.

I've had a custom action with both windows and a toolbar that has a few useful options when these windows are open. It would be nice to only have to close one window when I was done.

Thanks for all the great stuff lately.
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Old 09-30-2019, 11:34 AM   #21
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Regarding zero crossings:

* Analysis seems to be much faster when "Use zero crossings" is ENabled, which surprised me, since I presumed that finding zero crossings would involve additional calculations.

* When separating notes by transients, it is usually important that the entire transient falls within the part to the right. It may therefore be a good idea if the "Use zero crossings" setting favors zero crossings to the left of the transient.


(+1 to embedding the Transient Settings popup in the Dynamic Split window.)
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Old 09-30-2019, 01:44 PM   #22
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Definitely improved .specially working witb percussive stuff it will be a way better experience but still with even things like pizzicato lines the slicing is not hitting the desired mark even though I was battling with the transient threshold , sensitivity , split hystersis , on some count the split will happen with softer strikes and clearly ignores the larger ones. Regardless thank you for looking into this devs !
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Old 09-30-2019, 03:01 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by zookthespook View Post
Definitely improved .specially working witb percussive stuff it will be a way better experience but still with even things like pizzicato lines the slicing is not hitting the desired mark even though I was battling with the transient threshold , sensitivity , split hystersis , on some count the split will happen with softer strikes and clearly ignores the larger ones. Regardless thank you for looking into this devs !
Cheers
Yep, unfortunately, I noticed that as well. Guitars are still problematic.
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Old 10-01-2019, 07:06 AM   #24
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loosely related to the subject of dynamic split, i think it'd be incredible to have tonal splits -- split a monophonic instrument (cello, say) at each note change.
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Old 10-01-2019, 08:02 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by mccrabney View Post
loosely related to the subject of dynamic split, i think it'd be incredible to have tonal splits -- split a monophonic instrument (cello, say) at each note change.
That would be pretty straightforward to do via a reascript that uses spectral peaks data...
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Old 10-01-2019, 04:54 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
That would be pretty straightforward to do via a reascript that uses spectral peaks data...
Taking notes...
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:43 AM   #27
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Quote:
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Regarding zero crossings:
(+1 to embedding the Transient Settings popup in the Dynamic Split window.)
Yes, please! They're all part of the same tool set required to do the job.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:50 AM   #28
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Hey guys, I've been having a strange problem lately where enabling during playback View: Toggle auto-view-scroll during playback doesn't work anymore. If you enable during stop-mode, it follows cursor during play.

I noticed this in 5.983 and updated to +dev0928

At first I thought I might have been doing something differently, but I've been watching my actions and it's not that.

This is fine in 5.982.
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Old 10-02-2019, 05:52 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bFooz View Post
FR: add presets
reason: one time I want to split drums to hits, the other time I want to remove silences from voice, currently I need to readjust all parameters each time for each different task
Yes, this would be great, too.
Plus some deafult presets for common tasks would be nice!
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Old 10-02-2019, 09:38 AM   #30
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Unfortunately, the new algorithm still does not work well with guitars. As you can see in the gif, it misses obvious transients and finds transients where they do not exist.

(click here for full size image)



P.S. The good thing is that it seems to be a lot faster than the previous one, especially for items longer than 30 seconds.

Last edited by amagalma; 10-02-2019 at 09:46 AM.
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:13 AM   #31
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Default potential bug with new dynamic split

Not had a chance to look through the whole posts here yet to see if this has been mentioned sorry but there seems to be one tiny bug I noticed with it.

It would split everything perfectly except for the first split would keep the start of the item on it as well.

So if you did a recording of say the words "1, 2, 3 ,4" but left a few seconds at the start of the audio file and then used the below settings

-"Split selected items"
-"When gate opens"
-"when gate closes"

It would nicely top and tail the words "2, 3 and 4" but the word "1" would be cut correctly on the right side but the left side would be the start of the audio file rather than the start of the word "1"

Hope that makes sense!
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:26 AM   #32
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Quote:
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It would nicely top and tail the words "2, 3 and 4" but the word "1" would be cut correctly on the right side but the left side would be the start of the audio file rather than the start of the word "1"
There is a setting in Preferences, "Treat media item edges as transients", which may be causing the issue that you noticed.

(As I suggested above, this setting can be moved from Preferences to the Dynamic Split / Transient Detection Settings window, to make it more obvious and accessible.)
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Old 10-02-2019, 10:53 AM   #33
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I've noticed playback time offset is active for all tracks even if the offset is +0 for tracks that I haven't modified it or new tracks.

questions:
1) Does it use more resources if all tracks offsets are not bypassed even with +0 offset?
2) Would it make more sense to have it bypassed as default?
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Old 10-02-2019, 11:03 AM   #34
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If I want to adjust the track delay, I wanna do it as fast as possible, so having it enabled by default is preferrable.

I don't think that setting of 0 impacts CPU, it's just one extra "if" happening.
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Old 10-02-2019, 11:58 AM   #35
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heh I understand ... to minimize clicks is always good. we already have to open the routing window.
but maybe then it is a display issue and the checkbox should be checked only when bypassing the time offset. well it's ok.


I have an issue with the API.
I have a track with -2000 samples offset and I run this
Code:
reaper.SetMediaTrackInfo_Value(track, "I_PLAY_OFFSET_FLAG", 0)
because I want to switch it to ms instead of samples. Now the track has -2000000 ms instead of -41.7 ms which is what it should have when I do it from the UI.
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Old 10-02-2019, 12:07 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juliansader View Post
There is a setting in Preferences, "Treat media item edges as transients", which may be causing the issue that you noticed.

(As I suggested above, this setting can be moved from Preferences to the Dynamic Split / Transient Detection Settings window, to make it more obvious and accessible.)
Thanks, will try that next time I'm editing and agree, it should move or maybe be in both places at once?
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Old 10-02-2019, 12:19 PM   #37
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The playback offset doesn't use any resources unless it is enabled and nonzero.

Quote:
Originally Posted by heda View Post
I have a track with -2000 samples offset and I run this
Code:
reaper.SetMediaTrackInfo_Value(track, "I_PLAY_OFFSET_FLAG", 0)
because I want to switch it to ms instead of samples. Now the track has -2000000 ms instead of -41.7 ms which is what it should have when I do it from the UI.
If you're changing the units via the API, you'll have to do the conversion yourself and change the value too.
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Old 10-02-2019, 03:51 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amagalma View Post
Unfortunately, the new algorithm still does not work well with guitars. As you can see in the gif, it misses obvious transients and finds transients where they do not exist.

(click here for full size image)



P.S. The good thing is that it seems to be a lot faster than the previous one, especially for items longer than 30 seconds.
I'm experiencing the same, unfortunately. Most of the time, the obvious hit points are not hit.

And +1 for presets!
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Old 10-02-2019, 04:59 PM   #39
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presets for dynamic split would be amazing!
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Old 10-03-2019, 02:33 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin View Post
That would be pretty straightforward to do via a reascript that uses spectral peaks data...
Nice , and it will improve the Analysers

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=199474

Thx
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