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08-04-2011, 12:03 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 461
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Congrats on 4 but this is a rather glaring omission
4 final is great and all, but how is this still an issue? It seems like it would be a very easy fix:
Rendering times still vary widely based on track mute status
Example:
Start with a project containing let's say 15 tracks, with 4 VSTs and 5 minutes of audio on each.
Case 1. Select and then solo one track and render stem. Render speed might be around 1.9x.
Case 2. Mute all tracks besides the selected track and render. Render speed jumps to 10x +
Basically, just tell render to obey solo state and you've fixed the biggest time suck in the render system (and in Reaper in general IMO).
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08-04-2011, 05:57 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Location
Posts: 5,559
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Thing is, if you solo a track, all other tracks are still processed, if you mute all other tracks, only the left (unmuted) track is processed.
This might seem to be the same, but it isn't. It might look the same if you contemplate a single position in the project, but it can have great differences when the project is playing and passing positions where states are changed, depending on the routing, settings of plug-ins, automation...
-Data
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08-04-2011, 06:00 PM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hungary
Posts: 3,129
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i hope devs gonna find a way to avoid processing the non soloed tracks/busses when it comes to render.
__________________
panda in the desert
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08-04-2011, 06:42 PM
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#4
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 15,721
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I'll look into making unsoloed tracks not processed during renders... might be a touch tricky, though.
You know you can click with modifiers to mute all tracks except the one clicked, etc?
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08-04-2011, 06:44 PM
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#5
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Caracas, Venezuela
Posts: 8,676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
I'll look into making unsoloed tracks not processed during renders... might be a touch tricky, though.
You know you can click with modifiers to mute all tracks except the one clicked, etc?
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Hi Justin,
I think the real solution for this problem is to avoid processing non-selected tracks, folders and tracks sending to the selected tracks when rendering as stems. Unsoloed tracks is just one piece of the puzzle.
[EDIT] Actually, IIRC I had this conversation once with Tycho during v4 pre cycle and the main issue was "render as stems is too slow because REAPER process everything instead of processing selected tracks, folder and offending tracks only"
__________________
Pressure is what turns coal into diamonds - Michael a.k.a. Runaway
Last edited by Mercado_Negro; 08-04-2011 at 06:52 PM.
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08-04-2011, 07:19 PM
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#6
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Administrator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 15,721
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro
Hi Justin,
I think the real solution for this problem is to avoid processing non-selected tracks, folders and tracks sending to the selected tracks when rendering as stems. Unsoloed tracks is just one piece of the puzzle.
[EDIT] Actually, IIRC I had this conversation once with Tycho during v4 pre cycle and the main issue was "render as stems is too slow because REAPER process everything instead of processing selected tracks, folder and offending tracks only"
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OK, so less about whether solo is set, and more about when rendering stems, ignore tracks that are not connected to an output. I think that might be doable with a bit of work.
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08-04-2011, 07:21 PM
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Caracas, Venezuela
Posts: 8,676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
OK, so less about whether solo is set, and more about when rendering stems, ignore tracks that are not connected to an output. I think that might be doable with a bit of work.
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Yes, that's pretty much it.
I think I found that conversation we had, please take a look:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=80048
__________________
Pressure is what turns coal into diamonds - Michael a.k.a. Runaway
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08-04-2011, 10:26 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Location
Posts: 5,559
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Hey Justin,
dunno why, but somehow I got the feeling you would chime in here and consider this as a challenge.
-Data
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08-04-2011, 10:31 PM
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#9
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Caracas, Venezuela
Posts: 8,676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Data
Hey Justin,
dunno why, but somehow I got the feeling you would chime in here and consider this as a challenge.
-Data
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He'll beat it, mark my words...
This will be a game changer for many of us
__________________
Pressure is what turns coal into diamonds - Michael a.k.a. Runaway
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08-05-2011, 03:34 AM
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#10
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Italy
Posts: 4,326
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Isn't all of this really tricky due to solo in place / not solo in place and so on (think about the fact that when there are sends it's difficult to figure what to include and what not to include)?
Or is it the same already done for muted tracks?
- Mario
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08-05-2011, 04:19 AM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 3,955
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
OK, so less about whether solo is set, and more about when rendering stems, ignore tracks that are not connected to an output. I think that might be doable with a bit of work.
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woo!!!
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08-05-2011, 04:34 PM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 461
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Justin-
thanks for chiming in. Yeah, I use the modifier right now, but the problem is that with a lot of my projects there might be some random muted tracks laying around so when I mute all, then unmute, it also unmutes some tracks that were previously muted. Solo just seems like the easiest way.
I guess solo shouldn't even have to be on... if you're rendering stems (selected tracks) it would be cool if reaper just realized I only want to process those tracks and disregarded all others, regardless of solo/mute state.
Thanks
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08-05-2011, 04:38 PM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,713
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Hey Tycho, you might want to head to the pre-release forum and check out 4.02pre1
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08-05-2011, 04:50 PM
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#14
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Caracas, Venezuela
Posts: 8,676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timlloyd
Hey Tycho, you might want to head to the pre-release forum and check out 4.02pre1
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Hell yeah!!!!
__________________
Pressure is what turns coal into diamonds - Michael a.k.a. Runaway
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08-05-2011, 05:08 PM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Down Under
Posts: 396
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To quote Marah Mag - It's good being a Reaper user.™
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08-05-2011, 05:21 PM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Here
Posts: 3,000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n0rd
To quote Marah Mag - It's good being a Reaper user.™
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hehe
And this thread is a perfect case in point.
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08-06-2011, 11:35 AM
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#17
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 461
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Wow, thanks Justin and devs! Much appreciated... Flying through renders now.
Thanks again, so great to see devs listening to users.
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08-06-2011, 11:37 AM
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#18
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Moderator
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Italy
Posts: 4,326
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...Next glaring omission?
- Mario
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08-06-2011, 11:44 AM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Hungary
Posts: 3,129
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im happy for you guys, but i still hope the SOLO thing gonna be implemented too, eventually. this stem thing isnt helping me.. :I
__________________
panda in the desert
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08-13-2011, 03:24 AM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: croydon UK
Posts: 253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
I'll look into making unsoloed tracks not processed during renders... might be a touch tricky, though.
You know you can click with modifiers to mute all tracks except the one clicked, etc?
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what is the modifier, I looked thru the list and tried a good 10 mins worth of random modified track selection clicks (arrrgh my OCD makes me do silly things like this) I can't find it
edit... sorry for the necro
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08-13-2011, 03:28 AM
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#21
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 4,713
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right-click on a mute button
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08-13-2011, 03:36 AM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: croydon UK
Posts: 253
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timlloyd
right-click on a mute button
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awesome... ty
EDIT, wouldn't making an action in addition to a modifier out of this sort the problem at least temporarily ? I mean to say that an action like "mute/un mute all non selected tracks" could be added to existing macros for rendering / freezing etc and that would sort some of the issue (perhaps not returning all the track to their exact state after rendering but it's something)
Last edited by bilsner; 08-13-2011 at 03:46 AM.
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08-13-2011, 05:51 AM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Scotland, The Noo
Posts: 278
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While this doesn't solve the main problem mentioned in the thread, someone mentioned the problem of muting all tracks, then un-muting when you have some tracks that you want to be permanently muted (for example I have a couple of tracks where I dump out-takes and things for later use). What I do to get around this is go into I/O for that track and uncheck parent send. That way, whether the track is muted or not, the audio never gets rendered. It's like a permanent-mute button.
Just for future reference if someone else is trying to solve that particular problem.
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