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Old 04-15-2021, 04:04 AM   #1
robbert-vdh
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Default [ANN] yabridge 3.2.0, with greatly reduced VST2 bridging overhead and a lot of fixes

The latest release post can be found here:

[ANN] yabridge 3.2.0, with greatly reduced VST2 bridging overhead and a lot of compatibility improvements and bug fixes

The original release post for yabridge 3.1.0:

[ANN] yabridge 3.1.0, with 32-bit bitbridging for Windows VST3 plugins

yabridge is a modern and transparent way to use both 32- and 64-bit Windows VST2 and VST3 plugins on Linux as if they were native Linux VST2 and VST3 plugins.

I realize I've never done a proper release announcement for yabridge here outside of the call for testers before yabridge 3.0's release, so here is one! This is mostly a bugfix update, but this release does add a few small features and it also adds support for using 32-bit Windows VST3 plugins. The other important fix is a workaround for a bug present in Wine 6.5 and Wine 6.6 that would prevent yabridge from exiting.

A full changelog with an exhaustive list of changes, improvements and fixes can be found here:

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabridge/releases

Last edited by robbert-vdh; 05-03-2021 at 05:58 AM. Reason: yabridge 3.2.0 release
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Old 04-15-2021, 05:53 AM   #2
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A fabulous work you're doing with this, Robbert! I'll update it... Thanks for the reminder.
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Old 04-16-2021, 05:11 AM   #3
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A fabulous work you're doing with this, Robbert! I'll update it... Thanks for the reminder.
Apparently this change, which was meant as a workaround for a bug in the Algonaut Atlas 2.0 beta, also ended up fixing the loading and saving in Reason Rack. I don't think you've tried using Reason Rack but I know a few others that have, so it's good to know that that now also works! (I don't own the plugin, so I haven't checked it out myself yet)
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:35 AM   #4
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Yes, indeed I haven't been affected by the recent Wine bugs since I was on v6.0 for some months and only recently switched to 6.4 after I wrote to you.



One thing : in the AUR repo, the "normal" yabridge is still 3.02. Version 3.1 is yabridge-bin... Is it the same to update with yabridge or yabridge-bin?
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:43 AM   #5
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Yes, indeed I haven't been affected by the recent Wine bugs since I was on v6.0 for some months and only recently switched to 6.4 after I wrote to you.



One thing : in the AUR repo, the "normal" yabridge is still 3.02. Version 3.1 is yabridge-bin... Is it the same to update with yabridge or yabridge-bin?
The yabridge and yabridgectl packages are at version 3.1.0!
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:53 AM   #6
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Alright... me and my insistence with pamac! Back to yay, then...
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Old 04-16-2021, 08:55 AM   #7
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Alright... me and my insistence with pamac! Back to yay, then...
If you Pamac to just update/install those two packages, then it should also work.
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Old 04-16-2021, 01:28 PM   #8
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Yes, you're right... Whenever you have it installed, it shows you the current version and you rather have to look in the update section... Those little details that count...


Thanks!
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Old 04-22-2021, 02:14 PM   #9
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So I messed with Yabridge a little bit today, and while I've locked my WINE at 6.0 stable, it appeared to work. I did see it toss out a message that it didn't like me deciding what WINE I'm running.

Anyway, all my projects with Windows plugins seemed to load up and play fine, so I decided to try a plugin that has never worked with LinVST which is the Leslie FX portion of Native Instruments B4 Organ.

To my surprise, it loaded up with it's interface, and clicking the onscreen Fast/Slow switch worked, so I then linked the switch to midi CC64 which is damper pedal, and again it worked.

Lastly I recorded a short test playing guitar through the Leslie, and switching from slow to fast several times through the recording.

This is where there might be some kind of issue because it is a VST audio plugin that can be controlled by midi. On playback the midi CC64 is not seen at all by the plugin. It sees it when I press the pedal, and I see CC64 in the recorded data, but the plugin only sees live pedal presses and not recorded ones.

Using the VSTi which is The Leslie and the organ as an instrument plugin, the pedal works as do sliders I have assigned to the drawbars, so I know Yabridge can see recorded midi CC data, but evidently not with the VST audio FX Leslie section of the B4. One other item I noticed is that there is a hesitation between hitting play and the counter to start running when using this audio plug that also uses midi data.
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Old 04-22-2021, 04:10 PM   #10
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I'm not a REAPER expert, but maybe that Leslie FX MIDI CC thing is related to how REAPER normally prebuffers audio processing? If it works with live MIDI then it should work with recorded MIDI, and it could just be that the plugin just has some compatibility issues with the way REAPER handles processing (since REAPER did not even exist yet when the plugin came out).

As for FM7, it seems like the plugin expects the last played MIDI event to stay alive indefinitely. I can't think of a reason why this could be, but the plugin segfaults during an audio processing cycle if there have not been any new MIDI events and the last sent MIDI event (from a previous processing cycle) has already been deallocated. I added a fix for this bug in FM7 in this commit. If you're on Arch or Manjaro, then you can build yabridge from this commit using the yabridge-git AUR package. Otherwise you can grab a binary from the automated builds page. Don't forget to rerun `yabridgectl sync` to finish the upgrade!

Last edited by robbert-vdh; 04-22-2021 at 04:21 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 04-22-2021, 04:44 PM   #11
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Native Instruments FM7 crashes Yabridge, but not LinVST.
Try the latest commit! It should work there (or at least it does on my machine). Links and instructions are in my last post.
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Old 04-22-2021, 04:55 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by robbert-vdh View Post
I'm not a REAPER expert, but maybe that Leslie FX MIDI CC thing is related to how REAPER normally prebuffers audio processing? If it works with live MIDI then it should work with recorded MIDI, and it could just be that the plugin just has some compatibility issues with the way REAPER handles processing (since REAPER did not even exist yet when the plugin came out).

As for FM7, it seems like the plugin expects the last played MIDI event to stay alive indefinitely. I can't think of a reason why this could be, but the plugin segfaults during an audio processing cycle if there have not been any new MIDI events and the last sent MIDI event (from a previous processing cycle) has already been deallocated. I added a fix for this bug in FM7 in this commit. If you're on Arch or Manjaro, then you can build yabridge from this commit using the yabridge-git AUR package. Otherwise you can grab a binary from the automated builds page. Don't forget to rerun `yabridgectl sync` to finish the upgrade!
Thanks Robbert. I'm running Xubuntu 20.04. I went to this page,

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabri...ranch%3Amaster

but couldn't find the link to the zipped up binary.

Edit: I see this, "yabridge-3.1.0-10-gafefb72.tar.gz 4.6 MB"

after clicking into the Postpone Clearing link, but it is only text on the screen and not a clickable link to the file.
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Old 04-22-2021, 05:04 PM   #13
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Thanks Robbert. I'm running Xubuntu 20.04. I went to this page,

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabri...ranch%3Amaster

but couldn't find the link to the zipped up binary.
On that page you just have to select the latest commit, scroll down to the build artifacts, and download the correct binary (which would be yabridge-3.1.0-10-gafefb72.tar.gz at the time of writing). GitHub does require you to log in in order to download build artifacts like this. If you're not logged in to GitHub and don't want to create an account, then I can also upload the archive here.
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Old 04-22-2021, 05:19 PM   #14
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On that page you just have to select the latest commit, scroll down to the build artifacts, and download the correct binary (which would be yabridge-3.1.0-10-gafefb72.tar.gz at the time of writing). GitHub does require you to log in in order to download build artifacts like this. If you're not logged in to GitHub and don't want to create an account, then I can also upload the archive here.
Thanks Robbert. I have no account at GitHub and don't really want to give them any of my contact info. If it's a small enough archive to upload here, I'd be happy to grab it and verify that it fixes the issue.
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Old 04-22-2021, 05:32 PM   #15
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Thanks Robbert. I have no account at GitHub and don't really want to give them any of my contact info. If it's a small enough archive to upload here, I'd be happy to grab it and verify that it fixes the issue.
The file was too large to upload here on the forum, so I've uploaded it here instead (the link will expire after 24 hours). Oh and I also tried inserting B4 II FX and sending some MIDI with modwheel and expression pedal data to that from some other track and that seems to play back just fine! (I haven't tried that before this change, so maybe it's related)
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Old 04-22-2021, 05:45 PM   #16
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The file was too large to upload here on the forum, so I've uploaded it here instead (the link will expire after 24 hours). Oh and I also tried inserting B4 II FX and sending some MIDI with modwheel and expression pedal data to that from some other track and that seems to play back just fine! (I haven't tried that before this change, so maybe it's related)
Thanks again Robbert. That does indeed make the FM7 work as expected. I have the older original B4 and the organ/Leslie VSTi works, but the B4fx.dll VST still doesn't respond to recorded midi, but does respond to live midi, and it is processing the audio signal.
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Old 04-22-2021, 07:15 PM   #17
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The file was too large to upload here on the forum, so I've uploaded it here instead (the link will expire after 24 hours). Oh and I also tried inserting B4 II FX and sending some MIDI with modwheel and expression pedal data to that from some other track and that seems to play back just fine! (I haven't tried that before this change, so maybe it's related)
Just an update Robbert. I've found that I can get B4fx to read midi CC64 if I use "MIDI Link" rather than going into the FX Parameters List and using Learn. That makes it not function live any more, but if the midi track that will be recording the midi pedal data is in record, it will pass it on through to the B4fx.
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Old 04-23-2021, 04:39 AM   #18
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Thanks again Robbert. That does indeed make the FM7 work as expected. I have the older original B4 and the organ/Leslie VSTi works, but the B4fx.dll VST still doesn't respond to recorded midi, but does respond to live midi, and it is processing the audio signal.
Awesome! And yeah B4 probably just doesn't like the way REAPER processes audio. I'm not a REAPER expert so I'm not quite sure where to look for the correct setting, but when you right click on a track and go to performance options, there's a 'Prevent anticipative FX' option. Does that help? I know REAPER has had some compatibility issues with plugins in the past because of how it tries to prefetch audio to process things in advance when it can (e.g. when not processing live audio or MIDI), so that may be at play here. And if that also doesn't work, could you check if the plugin does work correctly in Ardour or Bitwig? If it does, then it must be related to REAPER itself (and if it does not, then your current workaround is probably the best solution at the moment).
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:08 AM   #19
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Awesome! And yeah B4 probably just doesn't like the way REAPER processes audio. I'm not a REAPER expert so I'm not quite sure where to look for the correct setting, but when you right click on a track and go to performance options, there's a 'Prevent anticipative FX' option. Does that help? I know REAPER has had some compatibility issues with plugins in the past because of how it tries to prefetch audio to process things in advance when it can (e.g. when not processing live audio or MIDI), so that may be at play here. And if that also doesn't work, could you check if the plugin does work correctly in Ardour or Bitwig? If it does, then it must be related to REAPER itself (and if it does not, then your current workaround is probably the best solution at the moment).
Thanks again Robbert for all your help. The VSTi B4 Organ with Leslie seems fine, and this morning after a fresh boot, the lagginess of startup when using the B4fx VST (Leslie Only Part) seems almost non-existent.

I suspect that all the attempts of my trying to get the Leslie part of the plugin to read recorded midi CC64 might have exacerbated the issue. Lots of trying things and then undoing them.

I still see a very slight hesitation on the counter in REAPER to get rolling, but it is an insignificant amount now.
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Old 04-27-2021, 04:38 PM   #20
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Doesn't affect the bridging of plugins, they are all working fine, but I was getting an error at the end of running "yabridgectl sync" with winhq-stable so I installed winehq-staging.

Running it now with winehq-staging, I get this message which I believe is the same message as before, but now saying wine 6.7 (staging) instead of 6.0 (stable).

Quote:
Finished setting up 47 plugins using copies (0 new), skipped 0 non-plugin .dll files

Warning: Could not run 'yabridge-host.exe'. Wine reported the following error:

00a4:err:rpc:I_RpcReceive we got fault packet with status 0x1c010003

This can happen when using a version of Wine that is much older than the version that has been used to compile yabridge with. Your current Wine version is '6.7 (Staging)'. See the troubleshooting section of the readme for more information on how to upgrade your installation of Wine
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Old 04-27-2021, 04:51 PM   #21
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Doesn't affect the bridging of plugins, they are all working fine, but I was getting an error at the end of running "yabridgectl sync" with winhq-stable so I installed winehq-staging.

Running it now with winehq-staging, I get this message which I believe is the same message as before, but now saying wine 6.7 (staging) instead of 6.0 (stable).
Are you by any chance using PipeWire? Yabridgectl will warn you when running ~/.local/share/yabridge/yabridge-host.exe fails, and it will print the warning you're seeing along with the last line of Wine's output. That's the warning you're seeing right now. It seems weird that running yabridge-host.exe would fail when running standalone when it runs just fine during actual plugin bridging though. Can you try running just ~/.local/share/yabridge/yabridge-host.exe (without wine in front of it) to see if that prints any errors? If everything's working correctly, the output should contain a line starting with 'Usage: yabridge-host.exe '. The reason I asked if you were using PipeWire is because I've only seen these 00a4:err:rpc:I_RpcReceive errors from PipeWire users. PipeWire/rtkit sets a limit on the amount of time a real time thread may spend without yielding to the scheduler, and certain plugins will thus get killed by the scheduler when they take too long to initialize from the audio thread. This is probably not what's happening here, but I've only ever seen those particular errors in the context of PipeWire. So I'd just try running yabridge-host.exe in a terminal to see if that prints the usage string as expected, and if you're using PipeWire then you could also try to see what happens when you disable that.
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Old 04-27-2021, 05:28 PM   #22
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Are you by any chance using PipeWire? Yabridgectl will warn you when running ~/.local/share/yabridge/yabridge-host.exe fails, and it will print the warning you're seeing along with the last line of Wine's output. That's the warning you're seeing right now. It seems weird that running yabridge-host.exe would fail when running standalone when it runs just fine during actual plugin bridging though. Can you try running just ~/.local/share/yabridge/yabridge-host.exe (without wine in front of it) to see if that prints any errors? If everything's working correctly, the output should contain a line starting with 'Usage: yabridge-host.exe '. The reason I asked if you were using PipeWire is because I've only seen these 00a4:err:rpc:I_RpcReceive errors from PipeWire users. PipeWire/rtkit sets a limit on the amount of time a real time thread may spend without yielding to the scheduler, and certain plugins will thus get killed by the scheduler when they take too long to initialize from the audio thread. This is probably not what's happening here, but I've only ever seen those particular errors in the context of PipeWire. So I'd just try running yabridge-host.exe in a terminal to see if that prints the usage string as expected, and if you're using PipeWire then you could also try to see what happens when you disable that.
No PipeWire installed here. Running yabridge-host.exe by itself is producing the following. I am on Xubuntu 20.04.2 and WineHQ's 6.7 staging.


Quote:
002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk wine-staging is a testing version containing experimental patches.
002c:fixme:winediag:LdrInitializeThunk Please mention your exact version when filing bug reports on winehq.org.
0034:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0034:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0068:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0068:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0084:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0084:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
007c:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
007c:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
00a8:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
00a8:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
002c:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
002c:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
002c:fixme:actctxarse_depend_manifests Could not find dependent assembly L"Microsoft.Windows.Common-Controls" (6.0.0.0)
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwRegisterTraceGuidsA (01B8379F, 01BC1CF8, {0cfe0455-93ba-440d-a3fe-553973d0b723}, 1, 0066E918, (null), (null), 01BC1D00): stub
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwRegisterTraceGuidsA (01B8379F, 01BC1D18, {797fabac-7b58-4796-b924-d51178a59ce4}, 1, 0066E918, (null), (null), 01BC1D20): stub
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwEventRegister ({43d1a55c-76d6-4f7e-995c-64c711e5cafe}, 01BACE28, 00000000, 01BC1500) stub.
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwEventRegister ({9e3b3947-ca5d-4614-91a2-7b624e0e7244}, 01B83C41, 01BC3258, 01BC3180) stub.
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwEventEnabled (deadbeef, 01B3B3C0): stub
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwEventEnabled (deadbeef, 01B30688): stub
002c:fixme:ver:GetCurrentPackageId (0066FEA4 00000000): stub
002c:fixme:ntdll:EtwEventUnregister (deadbeef) stub.
0024:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0024:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0104:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0104:fixme:font:get_name_record_codepage encoding 20 not handled, platform 1.
0024:errrocess:NtCreateUserProcess 64-bit application L"\\??\\H:\\.local\\share\\yabridge\\yabridge-host.exe.so" not supported in 32-bit prefix
Application could not be started, or no application associated with the specified file.
ShellExecuteEx failed: File not found.

0104:fixme:ver:GetCurrentPackageId (0068FEA4 00000000): stub
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Old 04-28-2021, 03:24 AM   #23
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No PipeWire installed here. Running yabridge-host.exe by itself is producing the following. I am on Xubuntu 20.04.2 and WineHQ's 6.7 staging.
Ah, yes, that was the other possibility haha. You've (accidentally) set WINEARCH=win32 when you created your default Wine prefix over at ~/.wine. WINEARCH=win32 should not be needed anymore in recent years, but it forces your prefix to behave as if it was a 32-bit installation of Windows and you thus cannot run 64-bit applications, like yabridge-host.exe. Do you actively use the 32-bit applications/plugins installed in ~/.wine? If not, then you can move/remove it and Wine will create a fresh 64-bit prefix there. Otherwise you can just ignore the warning for now (or alternatively, run yabridgectl with WINEPREFIX pointing to a 64-bit prefix).
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Old 04-28-2021, 07:02 AM   #24
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Ah, yes, that was the other possibility haha. You've (accidentally) set WINEARCH=win32 when you created your default Wine prefix over at ~/.wine. WINEARCH=win32 should not be needed anymore in recent years, but it forces your prefix to behave as if it was a 32-bit installation of Windows and you thus cannot run 64-bit applications, like yabridge-host.exe.
It was no accident. When I setup Kontakt, Superior Drummer and all my other Windows plugins almost three years ago, 64 bit WINE was buggy and not recommended.

Quote:
Do you actively use the 32-bit applications/plugins installed in ~/.wine? If not, then you can move/remove it and Wine will create a fresh 64-bit prefix there. Otherwise you can just ignore the warning for now (or alternatively, run yabridgectl with WINEPREFIX pointing to a 64-bit prefix).
Every plugin and the two actual Windows apps I run are all 32 bit. There is not one 64 bit Windows thing on my machine. Sounds like I should just leave it alone since it is working. I don't want to trip the triggers on copy protection which evidently happened to my copy of EZ-Drummer after switching to Yabridge.

I tested every Windows plugin I have and they all work but EZ-Drummer needed to re-authorize, and Toontrack only lets you do that 4 times before you have to contact them.
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Old 04-28-2021, 07:05 AM   #25
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It was no accident. When I setup Kontakt, Superior Drummer and all my other Windows plugins almost three years ago, 64 bit WINE was buggy and not recommended.
Ouch. Yeah in the past (like five years ago)) WINEARCH=win32 was a good idea when running 32-bit applications, but Wine's WoW64 implementation now works flawlessly. But of course, if it ain't broke don't fix it. You can disable these warnings permanently by running `yabridgectl set --no-verify=true` (without the backticks of course).
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Old 04-28-2021, 07:11 AM   #26
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Ouch. Yeah in the past (like five years ago)) WINEARCH=win32 was a good idea when running 32-bit applications, but Wine's WoW64 implementation now works flawlessly. But of course, if it ain't broke don't fix it. You can disable these warnings permanently by running `yabridgectl set --no-verify=true` (without the backticks of course).
Thanks Robbert. I'm guessing Yabridge must be making two passes through plugins then. Once for 32 bit and a second pass for 64 bit or something, and mine fails the second pass since there is no 64 bit WINE.

It doesn't bother me to see the error at the end of doing a sync, especially since I'll never buy or download any free Windows plugins ever again. All the Windows plugins I need are already working, and any new plugins I get will only be native Linux.
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Old 04-28-2021, 07:14 AM   #27
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Thanks Robbert. I'm guessing Yabridge must be making two passes through plugins then. Once for 32 bit and a second pass for 64 bit or something, and mine fails the second pass since there is no 64 bit WINE.

It doesn't bother me to see the error at the end of doing a sync, especially since I'll never buy or download any free Windows plugins again. I have all the Windows plugins I need, and any new plugins I get will only be native Linux.
No, yabridgectl just runs a couple of checks after the sync to check for common issues, so you can fix those before opening your DAW (and then having to spend an hour pulling your hair out trying to understand what's wrong haha). And one of those checks is to make sure that yabridge-host.exe runs correctly. If your default Wine prefix is 32-bit, then running a 64-bit yabridge-host.exe in that prefix will of course fail. But if everything's already working fine anyways, then it doesn't hurt to just disable those checks.
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Old 04-28-2021, 07:25 AM   #28
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No, yabridgectl just runs a couple of checks after the sync to check for common issues, so you can fix those before opening your DAW (and then having to spend an hour pulling your hair out trying to understand what's wrong haha). And one of those checks is to make sure that yabridge-host.exe runs correctly. If your default Wine prefix is 32-bit, then running a 64-bit yabridge-host.exe in that prefix will of course fail. But if everything's already working fine anyways, then it doesn't hurt to just disable those checks.
Okay, I went ahead and set the option and now running sync just comes back with this.

Quote:
Setting up VST2 and VST3 plugins using:
- /home/glennbo/.local/share/yabridge/libyabridge-vst2.so
- /home/glennbo/.local/share/yabridge/libyabridge-vst3.so

Finished setting up 47 plugins using copies (0 new), skipped 0 non-plugin .dll files
At some point I plan to stick an M.2 Gen4 NVMe in my machine and give Manjaro a try again. When that finally happens, and it's not very urgent, I'll try setting up a 64 bit WINE only and see how it goes. I'm not loading sample sets are ever going to exceed the confines of running in 32 bit, and there's no real performance difference, so it might be a cool minute before I change anything.

I'd rather be working on music than working on my computer.
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Old 05-03-2021, 04:42 AM   #29
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Default [ANN] yabridge 3.2.0, with greatly reduced VST2 bridging overhead and a lot of fixes

(I'll just reuse this thread for new major release announcements)

This was supposed to be a small bug fix update, but here we are. First and foremost, this update considerably reduces the overhead of bridging VST2 plugins. If you have the choice I would still recommend preferring the VST3 version of a plugin over the VST2 version for the additional features and better out of the box scaling, but especially when using plugin groups VST2 plugins should outperform VST3 plugins by a decent margin now. I'll take a look at further optimizing VST3 plugin bridging in a next update. This update also comes with a lot of compatibility improvements and bug fixes, particularly concerning plugins that don't quite implement the plugin spec correctly or that make false assumptions about their environment. In addition, VST3 plugin compatibility with Ardour and Mixbus has also improved greatly.

On a side note, it may be a good idea to be aware of the fact that Wine 6.7 has broken the Spitfire LABS and BBC Symphony Orchestra Discover plugins (wine bug #51063). I would recommend pinning Wine Staging 6.4 for the time being.

A full changelog with an exhaustive list of changes, improvements and fixes can be found here: (and yes, this time the list sure is exhaustive)

https://github.com/robbert-vdh/yabridge/releases

Last edited by robbert-vdh; 05-03-2021 at 04:49 AM.
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