Old 08-09-2019, 05:10 AM   #3841
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Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
New build is up.

FXMenu is operational, but primitive.

Here's the basic stuff needed:

Code:
Zone Buttons
	Track ToggleMapFXMenu
	Send ToggleMapSends
	Pan ToggleMapFX
        ChannelLeft TrackBank -1
	ChannelRight TrackBank 1
        ...
ZoneEnd

Zone FXMenu|1-4
	SelectedTrackNavigator
	DisplayUpper|  FXNameDisplay |
	RotaryPush| GoFXSlot |
ZoneEnd

ToggleMapFXMenu obviously shows/hides the FXMenu (in a samilar ilk as Sends)

What does ToggleMapFX do (sorry not in studio to try it out)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Why not just try it, I'm pretty sure it will be fine.

You can look at the generated file and make sure your alias is there.

[/code]

Oh never fear, I did and all seems ok, but I'm good at breaking things without knowing Just wondered if there were any provisos.

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 05:16 AM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:15 AM   #3842
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Just wanted to check, Alias, am I going to break anything if i replace the pre-generated (which is a nice touch) with one of my own?
If you replace the pre-generated alias (which is only there to guarantee something will be in the display if you don't type your own) all you will 'break' is the mechanism that auto-generates the alias for that cell.

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Doesn't seem to , but seeing =IF(ISBLANK..((...........))))) when you double click, could be quite unsettling for some, not me tho, i'll just see if I break it.
The code you see auto-generates the alias. If you don't want to see it, don't double click it It gets overwritten by your own alias.
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Originally Posted by Freex View Post
Has anything been finalised about the FxNameAlias for FXmenu?
It would seem to me that the Alias should be in the fx Zone file, and that we should be able to decide it within the C4Fxconfig.
If you type in the purple box under the VST name, that will generate a VST alias for the FX Menu.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:19 AM   #3843
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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post

If you type in the purple box under the VST name, that will generate a VST alias for the FX Menu.
See now there you go, I hadn't even noticed that second box.

Awesome stuff,

I reckon you can sleep easy tonight, your work is done. lol
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:30 AM   #3844
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Originally Posted by Freex View Post
See now there you go, I hadn't even noticed that second box.

Awesome stuff,

I reckon you can sleep easy tonight, your work is done. lol
I'm afraid it's all a bit unfinished. I wanted to get a version out so I could check it was outputting the right stuff for Geoff's new build.

I'm working on smoothing out the wrinkles.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:42 AM   #3845
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Originally Posted by Freex View Post
ToggleMapFXMenu obviously shows/hides the FXMenu (in a samilar ilk as Sends)

What does ToggleMapFX do (sorry not in studio to try it out)
ToggleMapFX toggles the FX mapped by MapSelectedTrackFXToWidgets.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:46 AM   #3846
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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
I'm afraid it's all a bit unfinished. I wanted to get a version out so I could check it was outputting the right stuff for Geoff's new build.

I'm working on smoothing out the wrinkles.
Only other thought I've had, is if there was a way of resetting back to saved version, where any alias were blanked. BUT NOT THE USERNAME
My thinking is, if there is a blank you notice it, but if there is something you don't tend to as much.

I like to use "Bypass" and "Wet" as (push and Rotary resp.) on A8 and use the alias to put the FXName.
I've made the mistake, more than once, of creating without changing that name, yes it's my error rather than the UI, so no biggie.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:54 AM   #3847
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Only other thought I've had, is if there was a way of resetting back to saved version, where any alias were blanked. BUT NOT THE USERNAME
My thinking is, if there is a blank you notice it, but if there is something you don't tend to as much.

I like to use "Bypass" and "Wet" as (push and Rotary resp.) on A8 and use the alias to put the FXName.
I've made the mistake, more than once, of creating without changing that name, yes it's my error rather than the UI, so no biggie.
Make your own template. Set up the sheet as you want it to be (username, FX Name in A8 etc) and save it. Then use that as your starting point.

EDIT: Sorry my bad, the above won't work for the contents of A8, as until a raw FX file is loaded we don't know the index for 'wet' and 'bypass'. It'll work for the username though.

Last edited by MixMonkey; 08-09-2019 at 06:05 AM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:12 AM   #3848
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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
Make your own template. Set up the sheet as you want it to be (username, FX Name in A8 etc) and save it. Then use that as your starting point.

EDIT: Sorry my bad, the above won't work for the contents of A8, as until a raw FX file is loaded we don't know the index for 'wet' and 'bypass'. It'll work for the username though.
Yeah, I guess i've been using C4FX as an in between, the saved rawFx and the saved FXzone, I guess if I loaded the rawFx then I could save the C4FX and delete the raw.
Just don't want to end up with file after file of essentially the same file.

Good suggestion, cheers.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:21 AM   #3849
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I guess if I loaded the rawFx then I could save the C4FX and delete the raw.
This will be okay when I've completed the work to retain the save path. At the moment you'll get into that situation where it says 'Zone Created' but hasn't, unless you reload the raw fx file again.

Hopefully after I've fixed it it will save to the same path that was originally set by the raw fx file. It'll be up to you to make sure that path still exists. I'm tempted to just hardwire the output path to CSI/Zones/ZoneFXFiles and have done with it.

That way it will always have a path to save down and you'll have to move the outputted .zon file into whatever folder structure you've created. What do you think?
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Old 08-09-2019, 07:11 AM   #3850
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This will be okay when I've completed the work to retain the save path. At the moment you'll get into that situation where it says 'Zone Created' but hasn't, unless you reload the raw fx file again.

Hopefully after I've fixed it it will save to the same path that was originally set by the raw fx file. It'll be up to you to make sure that path still exists. I'm tempted to just hardwire the output path to CSI/Zones/ZoneFXFiles and have done with it.

That way it will always have a path to save down and you'll have to move the outputted .zon file into whatever folder structure you've created. What do you think?
I think the way it saves and then you need to move it into the zone is OK. I can see the plus of it adding straight into zone but what if you have more than one variation of the zone. Using the pages option.

I was just thinking of a reset similar to clear.
(the current "clear" function is kind of in between both, a bit more than my idea of "Clear" but not as much as "reset" would be.)
(If i knew anything about coding I'd happily help)

So
"clear" would clear all placement but retain the loaded rawfx
and
"reset" would delete all including any manually input alias. (Excluding username)

Just a thought, to me it's pretty sweet saving to the same directory structure in FXzone as it does in Rawfx. That bit I really like. A LOT.

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 01:00 PM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 07:15 AM   #3851
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I'm tempted to just hardwire the output path to CSI/Zones/ZoneFXFiles and have done with it.

That way it will always have a path to save down and you'll have to move the outputted .zon file into whatever folder structure you've created. What do you think?
Yup, that's why i did it that way originally.

It also helps with support:

"Look in the CSI/Zones/ZoneFXFiles folder".

As opposed to:

"Where did you save the .zon file".
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Old 08-09-2019, 07:20 AM   #3852
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What Geoff said.... Lol
That's what I was trying to get at, all the while going around in circles, with everything else.
Now I'm dizzy.

Also keeping all the excel files is around 70kb extra per plug in.

I think I'll stick with using C4Fxconfig as an in between the 2 small sized files.
Just need to remember the/my frailties.

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 12:52 PM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 12:53 PM   #3853
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Also keeping all the excel files is around 70kb extra per plug in. That could soon start to pile up. I think I'll stuck with using C4Fxconfig as an in between the 2 small sized files.
Just need to remember the frailties.
Not to mention the lurking issues -- too easy for the excel file and .zon file to get out of synch.

Hey @MixMonkey, you tired of us leaning on you for features yet ?

Was just thinking a cool way around all of this -- well not so cool for you, with the amount of grunt work it entails

Provide an option to load a .zon file, it's just the reverse of writing it out, and you could automatically load the underlying .raw file at the same time.

I would call that Configurator feature complete and very slick (with the inevitable tweaks of course )
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Old 08-09-2019, 12:59 PM   #3854
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Diving into Folders (pun intended).

Since there are a dearth of rotaries on the more modern surfaces, let's beat up our old friend Select once again.

Code:
	Option+Select|  FolderDive
If there is a Folder, the Select Button will light up as soon as you press Option, indicating you can drill down into the Folder.

Just starting the thinkin' process
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Old 08-09-2019, 01:04 PM   #3855
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Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Not to mention the lurking issues -- too easy for the excel file and .zon file to get out of synch.

Hey @MixMonkey, you tired of us leaning on you for features yet ?
I'm secretly hoping he's working away at all the suggestions and is going to astound us with his awesomeness, we shouldn't have to rely on you all the time Geoff. lol

Quote:
Was just thinking a cool way around all of this -- well not so cool for you, with the amount of grunt work it entails

Provide an option to load a .zon file, it's just the reverse of writing it out, and you could automatically load the underlying .raw file at the same time.

I would call that Configurator feature complete and very slick (with the inevitable tweaks of course )
That would all be rather cool
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Diving into Folders (pun intended).

Since there are a dearth of rotaries on the more modern surfaces, let's beat up our old friend Select once again.

Code:
	Option+Select|  FolderDive
If there is a Folder, the Select Button will light up as soon as you press Option, indicating you can drill down into the Folder.

Just starting the thinkin' process
I take it you mean if the Folder's children tracks are hidden? That sounds pretty cool, would it work in reverse to collapse a folder? Kind of a Toggle?

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 01:09 PM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 01:50 PM   #3856
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MIX MONKEY, IF there's a way of doing the Clear and reset I suggested in an earlier, it would be so helpful.

I just made a few Zones, and all is fine, it's when you get to the EQ's,
Changing Frequency to Freq on them is fine, but having to close C4FXConfig and then reopen it gets taxing.

Maybe I'm being lazy but it would be so much cooler to be able to just reset everything, if it's actually possible that is.
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Old 08-09-2019, 02:12 PM   #3857
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I take it you mean if the Folder's children tracks are hidden? That sounds pretty cool, would it work in reverse to collapse a folder? Kind of a Toggle?
Yeah, I think that's what Folder mode is -- hiding child tracks.

Maybe others don't see it that way, so let me sketch a solution and you folks can jump in and tell me the better way

Track mode -- everything shows on surface.

Folder mode -- all child tracks are hidden.

Option+Select drills down to next level -- children of that level now show on surface.

Once again Option+Select will drill down to the next level for any tracks that have children of those children, etc.

Now we just need to designate a Back button to traverse back through the levels.

As usual, comments/suggestions more than welcomed...
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Old 08-09-2019, 02:40 PM   #3858
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MIX MONKEY, IF there's a way of doing the Clear and reset I suggested in an earlier, it would be so helpful.

I just made a few Zones, and all is fine, it's when you get to the EQ's,
Changing Frequency to Freq on them is fine, but having to close C4FXConfig and then reopen it gets taxing.

Maybe I'm being lazy but it would be so much cooler to be able to just reset everything, if it's actually possible that is.
Explain the difference between Clear and Reset again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Not to mention the lurking issues -- too easy for the excel file and .zon file to get out of synch.

Hey @MixMonkey, you tired of us leaning on you for features yet ?

Was just thinking a cool way around all of this -- well not so cool for you, with the amount of grunt work it entails

Provide an option to load a .zon file, it's just the reverse of writing it out, and you could automatically load the underlying .raw file at the same time.

I would call that Configurator feature complete and very slick (with the inevitable tweaks of course )
Having spent the day battling the nightmare world of Apple Sandboxing and losing, I have realised that the easy bit of the Configurator is its internal workings and the difficult bit is dealing with the two OS filesystems.

I'm not anti the idea of being able to load a .zon file and edit it, but I'd like to get what we have at the moment straightened out. Here's a few points:

i) At the moment the VBA code doesn't retain the file path for saving when you save and re-load the Configurator.xlsm file as you would want to do to re-arrange a map. You have to reload the raw fx to re-instate the path.

ii)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Yup, that's why i did it that way originally.

It also helps with support:

"Look in the CSI/Zones/ZoneFXFiles folder".

As opposed to:

"Where did you save the .zon file".
Actually, as Freex has discovered, it bases it's save path entirely on the raw FX load path, so if you've loaded the raw fx file from a sub-folder in ZoneRawFXFiles, it will expect that folder to be present when the .zon is saved. Cool for Freex, but probably pretty confusing for anyone else as it prevents the Configurator.xlsm files from being easily exchanged, as they won't save properly unless the directory structures are the same.

iii) Notwithstanding the ability to load .zon files and re-edit them, the best workflow is to keep the SomeFX.xlsm and not worry about the raw fx file after it has been loaded in. When I've sorted out the saving issues, the Excel files should be portable and cross platform.

iv) As far the disk space used, come on guys a 100KB Excel file, really? The average algo plugin is 10-15MB (some Acustica plugins are 1-2GB!) These aren't going to fill the disc up.
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:15 PM   #3859
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Hi. Sorry to interrupt the flow of testing and developing.

Firstly, I want to say thanks to Geoff, and everyone else involved in developing this, for all the effort they are putting in to this for everyone; if I understand it correctly when this is done users will be able to customise any control surface to suit their needs, making it the mother of all CS integration software. I'll be sure to make a donation once everything's been thrashed out.

Anyway, I've read a great deal of this thread and have to admit that the vast majority of it goes completely over my head, so I have a couple of questions:

Firstly, I was wondering if it’s going to be possible to assign things to control surface buttons on the fly while mixing (and if so how quickly)?

The other thing I was wondering, and this is where I probably really show my ignorance, is whether it would be possible to assign mouse functionality to the control surface, ie one button for left click, one button for right click, and maybe jog wheel or other buttons to be able to scroll through menus and things.

Sorry if that question's stupid, and keep up the good work!
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:25 PM   #3860
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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
Having spent the day battling the nightmare world of Apple Sandboxing and losing, I have realised that the easy bit of the Configurator is its internal workings and the difficult bit is dealing with the two OS filesystems.
True dat

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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
I'm not anti the idea of being able to load a .zon file and edit it, but I'd like to get what we have at the moment straightened out. Here's a few points:

i) At the moment the VBA code doesn't retain the file path for saving when you save and re-load the Configurator.xlsm file as you would want to do to re-arrange a map. You have to reload the raw fx to re-instate the path.
Isn’t it just starting here:

MyPath = "C:\Users" + Range("D2").Value + "\AppData\Roaming\REAPER\CSI\Zones\ZoneFXFiles “

Choosing the .zon file to load, loading it, then:

ReadPath = Replace(MyFiles, "ZoneFXFiles", "ZoneRawFXFiles")
ReadPath = Replace(ReadPath , “zon", “txt")

and loading the raw file ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
ii)Actually, as Freex has discovered, it bases it's save path entirely on the raw FX load path, so if you've loaded the raw fx file from a sub-folder in ZoneRawFXFiles, it will expect that folder to be present when the .zon is saved. Cool for Freex, but probably pretty confusing for anyone else as it prevents the Configurator.xlsm files from being easily exchanged, as they won't save properly unless the directory structures are the same.
Yes, it does rely on the hard coded paths, still not sure that's a bad thing

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Originally Posted by MixMonkey View Post
iii) Notwithstanding the ability to load .zon files and re-edit them, the best workflow is to keep the SomeFX.xlsm and not worry about the raw fx file after it has been loaded in. When I've sorted out the saving issues, the Excel files should be portable and cross platform.

iv) As far the disk space used, come on guys a 100KB Excel file, really? The average algo plugin is 10-15MB (some Acustica plugins are 1-2GB!) These aren't going to fill the disc up.
Yeah, I don't think the file size is much of a consideration.
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:34 PM   #3861
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Firstly, I was wondering if it’s going to be possible to assign things to control surface buttons on the fly while mixing (and if so how quickly)?
Depends on what you mean by on the fly.

If you mean actually picking an Action to assign to a button in real time, like Midi learn, the answer is no.

If you have set up your various combinations in advance you can, through Pages, Zones, and Modifiers, change button behaviour instantly from one predefined behaviour to another.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GB99 View Post
The other thing I was wondering, and this is where I probably really show my ignorance, is whether it would be possible to assign mouse functionality to the control surface, ie one button for left click, one button for right click, and maybe jog wheel or other buttons to be able to scroll through menus and things.

Sorry if that question's stupid, and keep up the good work!
There are no stupid questions.

We MIGHT be able to do some of what you suggest, guess we would have to see if implementing stuff this way really was any better workflow wise -- some things are better left in the screen/mouse world and all that...
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:35 PM   #3862
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Explain the difference between Clear and Reset again
Clear, would take all params off the template but leave any user defined Alias,
While keeping the rawFx data. Like a do-over. Working on the premises that you would change Alias at the end, once you're happy with the layout.
So if you were half-way thru and thought "NO this won't work", you could just clear and start again.

Reset, would take all params off, clear all user Alias, and clear RawFx data.
Ready for the next rawFx to be loaded.
So you don't have to keep closing and reopening the file to get back to fresh.

Maybe the names should be the other way, or maybe just have the clear but it also takes the alias back to the default=IFBLANK.

Quote:
I'm not anti the idea of being able to load a .zon file and edit it, but I'd like to get what we have at the moment straightened out. Here's a few points:

i) At the moment the VBA code doesn't retain the file path for saving when you save and re-load the Configurator.xlsm file as you would want to do to re-]arrange a map. You have to reload the raw fx to re-instate the path.
IT'S A FEATURE, LOL, YOU GET USED TO IT plus you only need it IF you use subfolders

Quote:
ii)
Actually, as Freex has discovered, it bases it's save path entirely on the raw FX load path, so if you've loaded the raw fx file from a sub-folder in ZoneRawFXFiles, it will expect that folder to be present when the .zon is saved. Cool for Freex, but probably pretty confusing for anyone else as it prevents the Configurator.xlsm files from being easily exchanged, as they won't save properly unless the directory structures are the same.
My thought procession for keeping the same file structure is.
If someone is inclined to want and therefore add sub folders in the rawFX folder, then they are equally inclined to want the same folders for the same reasons in the FxZone folder.
In a word Organisation.

Quote:
iii) Notwithstanding the ability to load .zon files and re-edit them, the best workflow is to keep the SomeFX.xlsm and not worry about the raw fx file after it has been loaded in. When I've sorted out the saving issues, the Excel files should be portable and cross platform.
The ability to reload and adjust FxZone file would be lovely, but it's not the be all end all to reload and recompile the FxZone again. Thanks to the C4FXconfig. So if it's something way down the line, or even another version completely so be it.


Quote:
iv) As far the disk space used, come on guys a 100KB Excel file, really? The average algo plugin is 10-15MB (some Acustica plugins are 1-2GB!) These aren't going to fill the disc up.

The excel file is about 80KB not huge by any means, on average, but when compared to the rawFX and FXzone files, 1-10KB that's a bit of a jump.
I'm content to use it as the in between, if i need to rejig a file I can reload the raw and go from there.

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 04:04 PM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:40 PM   #3863
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This is one of those paradoxical threads that the more I read of it, the less I understand.

About 50 pages ago, I had (or thought I did) a fair idea of what CSI would do, and hoped to be able to get my hands on it soon.

Now it seems further away than before (Geoff has advised that my initial control surface, the X32, will be better suited to OSC than MIDI) - there is still no sign of OSC support as far as I can see, whilst the apparent scope of the project grows ever more complex.

I appreciate the enormity of the task, and the huge efforts some of you are putting into testing the regular updates, but is it possible yet to give us some kind of road-map to this becoming a released product which can be grasped by users who don't have time in (thankfully) busy work schedules to spend dozens of hours with trial-and-error to get a system that can be used "for real".

I genuinely don't mean to sound negative - Geoff, your coding skills and inventiveness amaze me. But I guess at this stage, I keep returning to catch up with this thread and getting no further forward. What I need perhaps is to be told "come back in 3 months, when I add OSC" or "come back in 2 years when it's release-ready"....

Is that possible? Even approximately?

Andy
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:54 PM   #3864
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This is one of those paradoxical threads that the more I read of it, the less I understand.

About 50 pages ago, I had (or thought I did) a fair idea of what CSI would do, and hoped to be able to get my hands on it soon.

Now it seems further away than before (Geoff has advised that my initial control surface, the X32, will be better suited to OSC than MIDI) - there is still no sign of OSC support as far as I can see, whilst the apparent scope of the project grows ever more complex.

I appreciate the enormity of the task, and the huge efforts some of you are putting into testing the regular updates, but is it possible yet to give us some kind of road-map to this becoming a released product which can be grasped by users who don't have time in (thankfully) busy work schedules to spend dozens of hours with trial-and-error to get a system that can be used "for real".

I genuinely don't mean to sound negative - Geoff, your coding skills and inventiveness amaze me. But I guess at this stage, I keep returning to catch up with this thread and getting no further forward. What I need perhaps is to be told "come back in 3 months, when I add OSC" or "come back in 2 years when it's release-ready"....

Is that possible? Even approximately?

Andy

I feel like that too A LOT, with this thread, but I feel that's just because things have moved (IMHO) miles in the past few weeks, really a lot of cool features have been added, and I think Geoff is happy that the architecture of the code is now robust enough to take forward.
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Old 08-09-2019, 03:58 PM   #3865
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Originally Posted by andyp24 View Post
This is one of those paradoxical threads that the more I read of it, the less I understand.

About 50 pages ago, I had (or thought I did) a fair idea of what CSI would do, and hoped to be able to get my hands on it soon.

Now it seems further away than before (Geoff has advised that my initial control surface, the X32, will be better suited to OSC than MIDI) - there is still no sign of OSC support as far as I can see, whilst the apparent scope of the project grows ever more complex.

I appreciate the enormity of the task, and the huge efforts some of you are putting into testing the regular updates, but is it possible yet to give us some kind of road-map to this becoming a released product which can be grasped by users who don't have time in (thankfully) busy work schedules to spend dozens of hours with trial-and-error to get a system that can be used "for real".

I genuinely don't mean to sound negative - Geoff, your coding skills and inventiveness amaze me. But I guess at this stage, I keep returning to catch up with this thread and getting no further forward. What I need perhaps is to be told "come back in 3 months, when I add OSC" or "come back in 2 years when it's release-ready"....

Is that possible? Even approximately?

Andy
Ahh, such is the nature of R&D software projects, please accept my apologies we're not further along, I did convey a false sense of a timeline for OSC a while back.

Here's where we stand, roadmap wise, today:

FXMenu is in testing.
Folder tracks are in design.

After that we will go from pre alpha to alpha.

At that point we will add OSC.

Then other features will be added until every one agrees we are "feature complete" for a beta.

Then we go beta.

Massive testing from hell occurs with thousands of users

CSI 1.0
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:00 PM   #3866
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I feel like that too A LOT, with this thread, but I feel that's just because things have moved (IMHO) miles in the past few weeks, really a lot of cool features have been added, and I think Geoff is happy that the architecture of the code is now robust enough to take forward.
Yes, a large part of why we can move at a substantial pace right now is that we kept going back, hammering the architecture into the shape it needs to be for reasonable forward progress.
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:23 PM   #3867
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Clear, would take all params off the template but leave any user defined Alias,
While keeping the rawFx data. Like a do-over. Working on the premises that you would change Alias at the end, once you're happy with the layout.
Done Actually, being able to keep the alias setup and reset everything else is the biggie. Think about it, you have a favourite way to set up the controls for an EQ,say. Regardless of manufacturer, those controls are going to be in the same place on the surface. So you keep that setup and assign parameters from each EQ to that.

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Reset, would take all params off, clear all user Alias, and clear RawFx data.
Ready for the next rawFx to be loaded.
Done

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IT''S A FEATURE, LOL, YOU GET USED TO IT plus you only need it IF you use subfolders
Unfortunately, it's a 'feature' that breaks the portability of the files.

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My thought procession for keeping the same file structure is.
If someone is inclined to want and therefore add sub folders the the rawFX folder, then they are equally inclined to want the same folders for the same reasons in the FxZone folder.
In a word Oganisation.
I'm seeing the raw FX files as disposable as soon as they've been loaded into the Configurator and the ZoneFXFiles folder probably won't be the final resting place for FX.zon files, a folder inside the Zones/C4 folder will be. I'm all for organisation, but I do most of it with the Finder/Explorer.
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:35 PM   #3868
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Unfortunately, it's a 'feature' that breaks the portability of the files.
If a user doesn't use sub folders then no harm no foul.

A simple statement in the userguide will address this, If you decide to use sub folders in rawFXfiles, you most create the same folder names in the ZoneFXfiles folder, before starting to configure files.

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I'm seeing the raw FX files as disposable as soon as they've been loaded into the Configurator and the ZoneFXFiles folder probably won't be the final resting place for FX.zon files, a folder inside the Zones/C4 folder will be. I'm all for organisation, but I do most of it with the Finder/Explorer.

I'd agree to an extent with your thoughts on the raw files, but unless there is a FXzone loader then the raw files are always going to be handy. (save turning on FXparam)
Unless you pertain to keeping excels of all FXzones. My initial thoughts on the FXConfig was that it was the UI to create the FXZones, not a means to store and edit them as lots of excel files.
I guess it depends on individual thoughts on the nature of the beast.

ZoneFXFiles will definitely not be the last resting place of the fxzone files. but its a very good standard bank to keep them safe. and as Jeff said easy for the user guide.
Also for users using pages option, it's good to have a central bank of all your FXZonefiles.

Last edited by Freex; 08-09-2019 at 04:42 PM.
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:42 PM   #3869
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I'm seeing the raw FX files as disposable as soon as they've been loaded into the Configurator and the ZoneFXFiles folder probably won't be the final resting place for FX.zon files, a folder inside the Zones/C4 folder will be. I'm all for organisation, but I do most of it with the Finder/Explorer.
I agree the raw files are disposable if you go with the strategy of keeping the .xlsm files, I think it's either/or for synch safety

BTW, there's been a lot of traffic here today, did you see post #3860 re:loading both files ?
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:47 PM   #3870
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If a user doesn't use sub folders then no harm no foul.
Except that it isn't 'no harm no foul' It's why you have to reload the rawfx file everytime you reload the Excel and why, if you tried to share that Excel with someone else, it wouldn't Create Zone on their system unless they copied your folder structure.


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I'd agree to an extent with your thoughts on the raw files, but unless there is a FXzone loader then the raw files are always going to be handy. (save turning on FXparam)
Unless you pertain to keeping excels of all FXzones.
That's exactly what I'm suggesting, keep the Excel files. That's what you've put the effort into arranging and they contain the raw fx file parameters.
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:48 PM   #3871
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BTW, there's been a lot of traffic here today, did you see post #3860 re:loading both files ?
Me or Freex?
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:56 PM   #3872
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Me or Freex?
Sorry, you.

I think there's a way you can let them pick the .zon file and load the raw based on that, as long as we go with hardwired -- see post #3860

I tend to think folks -- as you say -- will manage/organize the files any way they want, but the "central repository" will remain /ZoneFXFiles/.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:25 PM   #3873
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Sorry, you.

I think there's a way you can let them pick the .zon file and load the raw based on that, as long as we go with hardwired -- see post #3860
The loading is fine as it is, picking and loading the raw file works great. It's saving the .zon file that's the problem because of the Apple Sandboxing.

I read whole Rob de Bruin thing about Sandboxing and unfortunately he's right (https://www.rondebruin.nl/mac/mac034.htm) Trying to save into the ZoneFXFiles folder on Mac is problematic to say the least. The OS puts up the 'grant access' box but the actual 'grant access' button is always greyed out, even if you give Excel full disk access in Security and Privacy.

The problem with the original file loading/saving system you sent me is that the path contained in the Global Variable MyFiles is lost when you re-load the .xlsm file. To get it back you have to re-load the raw fx file. I've tried saving the path inside Excel, but when I try to use it to save I run into the Sandboxing issue.

Incidentally, as a side issue the raw fx files and the .zon files themselves aren't cross platform because of the differing EOL formats. If you try to load a raw FX files into Windows that's been created on Mac, all the parameters will end up in one cell because Excel on Windows expects to see CR+LF, not just LF. Sure, it's trivial to convert them, but do we really want to be explaining that to everyone that wants to try it?

The best bet for cross platform success is the .xlsm format.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:55 PM   #3874
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The loading is fine as it is, picking and loading the raw file works great. It's saving the .zon file that's the problem because of the Apple Sandboxing.

I read whole Rob de Bruin thing about Sandboxing and unfortunately he's right (https://www.rondebruin.nl/mac/mac034.htm) Trying to save into the ZoneFXFiles folder on Mac is problematic to say the least. The OS puts up the 'grant access' box but the actual 'grant access' button is always greyed out, even if you give Excel full disk access in Security and Privacy.
Hmm...

I am loading and saving no problem at all, after allowing Excel access the very first time.
Excel 16.27 (19071500)
Mojave 10.14.6
The latest .xlsm you posted (last evening ?)

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The problem with the original file loading/saving system you sent me is that the path contained in the Global Variable MyFiles is lost when you re-load the .xlsm file. To get it back you have to re-load the raw fx file. I've tried saving the path inside Excel, but when I try to use it to save I run into the Sandboxing issue.
I'm confused, are you saying the hardwired VBA code is changing ?

[edit] Wait a minute, I think I see.
Yes MyFiles is indeed blank when you load, but the action of choosing the .zon file will set it properly, as long as the directories are hardwired.

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Incidentally, as a side issue the raw fx files and the .zon files themselves aren't cross platform because of the differing EOL formats. If you try to load a raw FX files into Windows that's been created on Mac, all the parameters will end up in one cell because Excel on Windows expects to see CR+LF, not just LF. Sure, it's trivial to convert them, but do we really want to be explaining that to everyone that wants to try it?
I will fix the file output routine to send both CR+LF and see if Mac still is OK, I think that one is solvable.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:11 PM   #3875
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OK, the raw file lines are now terminated with CR+LF, seems fine on Mac...
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:12 PM   #3876
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I'm confused, are you saying the hardwired VBA code is changing ?

[edit] Wait a minute, I think I see.
Yes MyFiles is indeed blank when you load, but the action of choosing the .zon file will set it properly, as long as the directories are hardwired.
I think you mean choosing the raw fx file and yes it does set MyFiles properly, but it doesn't persist when you re-load the Excel file (without reloading the raw fx file) as you would want to do to make changes to the layout. There should be no need to re-load the raw fx file- you've already got all the parameters in Excel.

I've tried saving the MyFiles path and using it when the Excel file is re-loaded, but that's when I run into the Sandboxing issue.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:22 PM   #3877
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I think you mean choosing the raw fx file and yes it does set MyFiles properly, but it doesn't persist when you re-load the Excel file (without reloading the raw fx file) as you would want to do to make changes to the layout. There should be no need to re-load the raw fx file- you've already got all the parameters in Excel.
Nope, I am saying there would be an option to load a .zon file.

That option would present a file dialog aimed at /ZoneFXFiles/.

When you choose a .zon file to load, MyFiles will get properly set.

Then you simply do the replace magic and load the raw file.

No need to ever save the .xlsm.

So, this would give the user 2 options:

1) Save the .xlsm and use that for modification -- nothing wrong with this approach

2) Never save the .xlsm, use the chosen .zon file to trigger loading the raw file -- nothing wrong with this approach either

[edit]The reason I'm leaning on this is i think users will come to view the Excel worksheet as an app that reads raw files to generate .zon files, and can also read .zon files for modification.
They can remain blissfully unaware there is an intermediary file that could be saved (the Excel .xlsm file).
It's also one less file for them to worry about.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:35 PM   #3878
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Nope, I am saying there would be an option to load a .zon file.

That option would present a file dialog aimed at /ZoneFXFiles/.

When you choose a .zon file to load, MyFiles will get properly set.

Then you simply do the replace magic and load the raw file.

No need to ever save the .xlsm.

So, this would give the user 2 options:

1) Save the .xlsm and use that for modification -- nothing wrong with this approach

2) Never save the .xlsm, use the chosen .zon file to trigger loading the raw file -- nothing wrong with this approach either

[edit]The reason I'm leaning on this is i think users will come to view the Excel worksheet as an app that reads raw files to generate .zon files, and can also read .zon files for modification.
They can remain blissfully unaware there is an intermediary file that could be saved (the Excel .xlsm file).
It's also one less file for them to worry about.
Sorry, you've lost me

EDIT: just saw your edit, so this is after the .zon loading functionality is added?
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:42 PM   #3879
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Sorry, you've lost me

EDIT: just saw your edit, so this is after the .zon loading functionality is added?
Yes, basically Sub SaveZoneFile() in reverse with a file picker front end.

i know it's a pain grunt work job, but I think it will feel really natural.
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Old 08-09-2019, 06:56 PM   #3880
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Yes, basically Sub SaveZoneFile() in reverse with a file picker front end.

i know it's a pain grunt work job, but I think it will feel really natural.
I'll take a look at it, but only after I've ironed out the wrinkles in what exists at the moment.
I agree it would be good

I'll give you a report on the cross platform issues, I seem to remember that .zons I made on Windows (manually, ages ago) wouldn't work on Mac, but let me check it out.

How bothered are you about things not being fully cross platform?
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