some clue about mixing

[UncleEti]

[I] am a reasonnably good guitarist : nothing fancy, a bit of folk, a bit of jazz. Yes I know what is a 7min5m;let's say "experienced fire camp level". ANy kind of fire camp.
When I record with reaper a multipart song (guit, voc, midi): I have always placement mistakes in my guitar play. SLight latency, but also all the tiny problem which are OK when let's say I play in live (around a fire). So, I wonder how to use Reaper for improving that. I have tried up to the heights of my knowledge - still quite small- to improve things, messing around (up ?) with transients so far. On the end, my strummings are in perfect timing but my song looks like a sound avatar of Dracula, screws included. I cannot spend too much time improving my guitar playing. I am someone ordinary with job and stuff. Is there a middle way to work out with Reaper fixing these kinds of problems ?
Hope I am clear enough (being French). Thanks for any suggestion.

[Fex]

Dracula didn't have screws, IIRC. Perhaps you're thinking of Frankenstein's little friend?

I've concluded that the ability to edit with digital precision makes some of us too critical of our own performances, spotting 'flaws' which others would never notice (especially in context with other instruments). Guitars aren't supposed to be perfectly in time; they're supposed to sound like 'real' instruments played by human beings. If you're a good enough musician to know what a diminished 5th is, then your timing's probably better than you think, and if you take further steps to edit it, you'll risk it starting to sound unnatural. Just comp a good recording from two or three good takes. Better still, get someone with some objectivity to do it for you.

[UncleEti]

Sounds like wisdom, what you say.
Working out a whole take transient by transient generates a musical catastrophe (I meant good ol'Franky)..

I am not a bad guitarist but, following the tracks of "chanson française (Brel, Brassens, Piaf, Nougaro etc,) I have tendency to put in front the vocal part, paying great attention to texts,(French poetry rules, and particularly the question of vocalizing or not "e" - is a whole story in itsel) and often I get lost by respect to rythm, guitar trying to stick to syllables and not the opposite.
That 's why, even if I think you're right, I might use another possibility of REaper, the loops, which are very good rhythm teachers.

Thx

[Fex]

One thing I often do to keep both timing and pitch as tight as possible is to run the offending part through Melodyne. The result will often sound like perfectly tuned, perfectly timed garbage. However, subsequent edits/takes which use that garbage as a guide are often rather good.

[UncleEti]

Even looping too much is bad by respect to natural sounding. But good I think for reproducing guitar accompaniment on a long song.
The secret in my case is : keep simple. Better a 12 measures take with a let's say a basic but well played arpeggio than ill-applied guitar virtuosity (the awful effect of "nearly good").

I did not know Melodyne. I will try to find a demo. Looks interesting but costs more than my guitar !

Thanks.

[grinder]

greetings UncleEti,
I hear what you are saying about having a day job, I am a self employed artist and work because I enjoy what I do as well as being good at it and I also play and write heaps of music early in the morning and late at night.
I say forget the garbage, we all pay our dues and if you want to play good guitar it is essential you "enjoy" playing, focus both mentally and physically on the groove having a relaxed demeanour as you do it.
Tense... forget about great sound.
It is only when you feel and know what you are doing in a groove that you can diverge, with some it is instinctive but normally only experience in the basics will bring the skills. It is not only timing (as has been said)but the way in which a note or a chord is played (expressed) that will bring tears to the heart. Sometimes "Thump" is good Sometimes "Thaaaaump" is better.
Great singers, great trumpet players, great guitarists are never great players only because they have perfect pitch and timing.
The way we express ourselves is a huge part of the magic. Play heaps of guitar, as much as you can.
As a footnote, I used to teach guitar to those who would take the time to practise. I had a student who asked "I want to know everything you know and do in 6 months..." He was a troubled soul, however he came to my house many years later and apologized for this remark. Few of us gain most things in ten minutes life is a teacher and it can be long or short. My advise make the most of it and get practising to make the most of your skills.
I must go to the garage and make a pulpit!

Grinder

[UncleEti]

Nice words. It's quite true. I allow myself to recenter on the title of my post :
ANy clue about mixing ?

[ivansc]

The styles you are trying to copy are as you know very idiosyncratic and frankly they didn't even try to keep to a strict tempo, so why worry?

Get your vocal right and the rest will follow.

Sauf pour les morceaux comme 'Nougayork'! For that you need to have a good groove.

What are you adding as MIDI? If it is just bass and drums maybe you should do them first, then record vocal and finally move drum and bass hits to fit the vocal before you do the guitar?

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I allow myself to recenter on the title of my post :
ANy clue about mixing ?

Slightly more specific questions would help....

Most rough mixes sound a lot better as soon as you put everything except bass instruments through a high pass filter. You could put a single instance of ReaEQ with the 'Mud Free' preset on a separate track, and then route everything except the bass and drums through that (instead of sending them directly to the master), but if you put a separate EQ on each track, it will be easier to tweak later.

Guitars often benefit from a little compression.

Why don't you post something so we can advise you better?

[grinder]

For me and I am getting better with this
Remember what key you have arranged the song in (many key's through the number are more difficult) and arrange your eq ideas to suit that key. As has been said use high pass filters on almost everything.
With the bass different types of slope can give you a totally different bottom end and scoop the bass with eq about mid range to let the other Instruments sound. Have a look at different plugin pre-sets off good plugin eq's and see what they are about. Stick a visual real time eq graph (I am using visulizer at this time ) and see where the instruments come up and adjust accordingly.

Grinder

[UncleEti]

Thank you guys. Now, it makes quite a bit to read - since I will read everything - I think I will answer that on saturday.
I'll try to post something too.
Nice forum.

[UncleEti]

Sorry,I can't reply to every one of you so far because I had a busy day, and I did not read carefully what you said. But here is my first song with reaper.
Voir le Fichier : taking_refuge_10.mp3
It's the musical rendering of a Buddhist text (well...) but even, of course, if I don't mind a French speaker or two, I am pleased to show it to English speakers who will not bother too much about the meaning !

The bass (midi) has been written just this afternoon till the 12th bar. (Midi is fantastic for composing I believe). After it 's a bit of a mess.
Even in the finished part, the beginning, there is an E which sounds out of tune. How can a midi sound sound out of tune? I am just discovering the messages, like velocity, expression, stuff : I have seen pitch (I mean, in the Editor midi window. Maybe that 's what I should use.
Later I will substitute a real bass to the midi. I had serious problems not to put the voice toooo much in front but it's still fairly there (and being 59 years old, I know my voice is not so big).
I am using Miroslav Philarmonik. I put strings, but I don't have monitors (only off the shelf loud speakers, good but small). It's a bit at random, so to speak, not very precise or energetical, I have to find a way. Tried to put some expression, still.

Thanks for helping me(don't be too tough).
Etienne

[UncleEti]

I forgot. I have to put some percussion, but I have never done that. I have to start somewhere.Maybe with the readrum of Reaper, what do you think?

[Fex]

Originally Posted by grinder

As has been said use high pass filters on almost everything.

To clarify, I offered this as a quick and dirty way to improve a rough mix. For a finished mix, I'd probably use a low shelf instead.
If I ever finished mixes. Which I don't.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Even in the finished part, the beginning, there is an E which sounds out of tune. How can a midi sound sound out of tune?

MIDI can't be out of tune, because MIDI is not audio, it's just code; it is quite important to understand that distinction. However, I often use MIDI to trigger bass samples, and many of my favourite bass samples are out of tune. This doesn't bother me particularly, because I always use Melodyne to force the bass to 100% true pitch centre, whether I think it's out of tune or not. I'm not good at judging pitch at low frequencies, and I find that arrangements sound generally sharper when the bass is spot on. If you would like to post some audio of your bass, I'll treat it for you, and you can judge for yourself.

Most instruments don't need any pitch correction, and many have more character for for being a little out of tune. Your voice, for example, sounds better for it's fragility; pitch correction would ruin it.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Thanks for helping me(don't be too tough).
Etienne

I like your style a lot, and I think you've done a great job of recording this, especially considering the delicacy of the material.
One minor gripe - it ends a bit abruptly.
I'm not sure that this piece even needs bass and percussion. If you add bass, you'll probably need to tame the bottom end of the guitar, which is a shame. But if you must....

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Later I will substitute a real bass to the midi.

You should certainly do that. I think you should use real percussion instruments, too....

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I have to put some percussion, but I have never done that. I have to start somewhere.Maybe with the readrum of Reaper, what do you think?

I've never heard of Readrum, and it doesn't show in my plugins list! My favourite tool for temporary percussion is a soundfont set with a General MIDI percussion set. Since you need to have a plugin to handle soundfonts, and then load the desired soundfont into the plugin, it takes a little more setting up than the average plugin, but it's worth the effort. I could see you having a lot of fun with soundfonts.

GM Drums Soundfont, various kits (try the brushes):
ftp://ftp.personalcopy.net/pub/pc_drums_42.exe

Soundfont player VST:
http://www.prodyon-virtual-gear.com/..._v1.70_DLL.rar

[UncleEti]

Originally Posted by Fex

MIDI can't be out of tune, because MIDI is not audio,

Actually, I was using a bass note one if not two octavos too high, so is was sounding bad. There is a map somewhere of instruments and their tessiture (C2,C3,etc) but I lost it by now. I should have a look.I shoud even make a bill of it.

Originally Posted by Fex

If you would like to post some audio of your bass, I'll treat it for you, and you can judge for yourself.
...
I'm not sure that this piece even needs bass and percussion. If you add bass, you'll probably need to tame the bottom end of the guitar, which is a shame.

Thnks for the offer. But I think you're right when you say I probably do not need a bass. I paid big attention to my guitar arpeggios and basses, and it's true a couple of time, I had muted the bass without noticing ! ALso, not playing bass would help the song not to sound too much like an 70'ts slow, which was not my project[/QUOTE]

.I've never heard of Readrum, and it doesn't show in my plugins list!

Sorry being approximative. Readrum is freely downloadable template track with GM drum instruments. Please refer to Reaper Manual if you are interested, but I don't think you need that, following your subsequent advices since you say .

My favourite tool for temporary percussion is a soundfont set with a General MIDI percussion set. ... I could see you having a lot of fun with soundfonts.

Hum, it seems I should do that !
Generally speaking, I will try to use your advices. In particular, using high pass filter.I am still a bit fighting with "sends, receives, ..etc.
Hope yourself manages to finish a mix and put it to listen. If you do that send a MP !

Thanks again for your positive support

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I am still a bit fighting with "sends, receives, ..etc

The ease of routing with Reaper is what attracted me to it in the first place. It's well worth mastering this. In general, I don't keep modulation effects on the same channel (track) as the sound source. A reverb, for example, is a lot easier to tame if you have it on a separate channel, 100% wet.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Hope yourself manages to finish a mix and put it to listen.

I mix just well enough to know how bad my mixing is. When I finish tracking, I turn the project over to someone who knows what he's doing!

[UncleEti]

"When I finish tracking, I turn the project over to someone who knows what he's doing!"

Oh, I see. You 're some kind of professional. Can you tell me in what field ?

Other wise, about this routing. If memory serves (I am at the office, no Reaper there), you can route signals to many channels : not only 1/2,but 3/4 and so forth. Does it refer to hardware - like you want to use a soundcard with lots of outputs - or does it refer to Midi channels, or what ?

Thanks a lot.

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Oh, I see. You 're some kind of professional. Can you tell me in what field ?

Whether I'm any kind of professional is debatable, but I'm not a professional in any field pertaining to music. You don't need to be a professional in order to get your stuff mixed by somebody competent.

I put a lot of time and thought into composition and arrangement; I prefer it if it doesn't all come out sounding like arse.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Other wise, about this routing. If memory serves (I am at the office, no Reaper there), you can route signals to many channels : not only 1/2,but 3/4 and so forth. Does it refer to hardware - like you want to use a soundcard with lots of outputs - or does it refer to Midi channels, or what ?

Um.... yes.... and you might want to run some VSTs through multiple audio pairs, if you're getting different voices from one VST instance. But that's not really what I meant.

(In fact, I typically use only two outputs from my soundcard, being left and right. And in practise, I rarely assign MIDI channels any more: a VST playing MIDI will either be on the same track as the MIDI, or it will have the MIDI track routed to it, on all MIDI channels, or on MIDI channel 1 by default.... so MIDI channels have become largely irrelevant to me. I would prefer to run percussion on MIDI channel 10, per convention, but Phenome, which is one of the few plugins I use which does make worthwhile use of different MIDI channels and different audio outs, only uses MIDI channels 1 through 8, AFAIK.)

What I actually had in mind wasn't audio pairs or MIDI channels, but just the ease of routing one Reaper "track" to one or more others, all of them typically going out through audio 1&2. (People whose audio engineering experience starts with a DAW get confused when I use the word "channels" to refer to what they think of as "tracks". As far as I'm concerned, if it's not recorded yet, it's not a track.)

A lot of us, when we start playing with modulation effects, will assume that chains are supposed to be set up in a straight line; A > B > C.
For me, as a guitarist, this was Guitar > Stomp box > Amplifier.
This works splendidly, and it took a while before it occurred to me that there was any other way of doing things. I had a lot of fun with a four track cassette recorder all through the 90s; I put reverb on pretty much everything. But I never could get any one of those reverbs to sit right in the mix....

A lot of beginners will put way too much reverb on a signal. There's a huge psycho-acoustic element to this - the reverb level will sound right to the noob when he's setting it up, but later, he'll notice that reverb is swamping the mix. So, he'll take it right down, and then fade it gradually back up until it sounds right.... and later notice that it's swamping the mix again.... and so on. With a little more experience, he'll get into the habit of dialing the reverb back a bit from where it first sounds right. However....
With your effects in a straight line, it's incredibly difficult to get a reverb sounding right in the first place. If a vocal is too quiet in the mix, you turn up the vocal track, obviously, but this also has the effect of turning up the reverb, swamping the mix. So, you turn down the reverb, and the vocal's too quiet again. So you turn it back up, but tone down the wet/dry balance.... and the vocal's too dry.

What you want, of course, is the vocal on one channel, and the reverb on another. If the vocal's too quiet, you turn the vocal track up, and more of the vocal hits the reverb, but the ratio between the source signal and the reverb is preserved. There's never any need to mess with the wet/dry balance, because the reverb channel is only a reverb channel, and does not need to have any dry signal in it at all. There's still some juggling to do balancing the dry vocal with the reverb, but it is now possible, at least, now that making a substantial change to either one doesn't make such a drastic change to the other.

Then there's a question of how many reverbs to use, when mixing a band arrangement, or similar. It did eventually occur to me that the bass usually didn't need reverb, and neither did most of the drum kit, but it was a breakthrough moment when I realised that, if I wanted reverb on the vocal, the snare and the guitar, then the number of reverb units I needed in my mix was one, not three. All three source signals can be routed to one reverb and the balance of each can be adjusted on the reverb "track" itself.

The principle of keeping effects on different channels to the source signal is applicable to pretty much everything. It's unlikely that I would want to route anything through my guitar distortion other than the guitar, but there's are many reasons to keep the guitar signal dry on a separate track, even if it's not going in the mix.

Things get complicated when you start mixing drum parts. Typically, I'll be dealing with between four and eight wavs covering a drum kit, and have to route them through dozens of channels before they end up on the drum bus. I've started applying the same principles to loops - with EQ and gating, you can break a single stereo drum recording into it's component parts, and treat them separately.

There are a couple of reasons why you might want to keep MIDI on a separate track from the plugins processing that MIDI, when multiple instruments are playing the same MIDI part. For one thing, some plugins don't feed MIDI through to the next in the chain. Also, there might be occasions when you want one plugin to process more than one MIDI track - for example, a piano VST might take it's bass notes from the same MIDI track as the bass VST does, but also play other notes.

I'm sure you can do this stuff on any DAW, but it's intimidating at first. Reaper makes it very, very easy.

What really sold me on Reaper was the ease of juggling effects within a chain. When I was using Cubase SX3, I found this time consuming. I'd have a guitar feeding a delay, and I'd add chorus.... then it would occur to me that it might be better if the guitar hit the chorus before it hit the delay, but that entailed removing the chorus, removing the delay, adding the chorus, adding the delay, and setting them both back up the way I wanted them again. If there's an easier way to do it, I couldn't figure it out. Maybe I should have read the manual, but there's an awful lot of it.... and when I want to make music, I want to make music, not to read manuals.

The first time I used Reaper, I tried juggling an effects chain by grabbing an effect, dragging it, and dropping it where I wanted it. To my delight, this actually worked.

I started porting all my projects more or less immediately.

[UncleEti]

You will have to admit, If I can't listen to what you do, wether it sounds like arse or not doesn't make a difference, but, as French moviedirector Jean Renoir said one time "Everybody has a reason".


SO thanks you for all this information. , I did my best to get it. I sent a ReaEQ plugin to all my tracks except,as you advised me, the bass.
At least I hope : What I did in my guitar track TPC is : IO>send to new track>send to track 7 reaEQ.Is it OK ?

You're teaching me in your last post so much that I think I will need quite a bit of thinking before to assess what you show me. The truth is I am investigating at random, just out of pure fascination. Maybe I go too quick.
Sorry for being ball and chain but can I ask a question ? I downloaded the 2 links you told me. Now I have a new vsti, Phenome 1.17, but there is no sound. I tried to point to the appl data/loca/temp where the other file landed on, but nothing happens. It seems I need a Factory Library. I made some search on the webpage of the guy (Mr Lunz?) and it appears that's something you have to buy : FactoryData. Did I get it right ?
Thanks

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I sent a ReaEQ plugin to all my tracks except,as you advised me, the bass.
At least I hope : What I did in my guitar track TPC is : IO>send to new track>send to track 7 reaEQ.Is it OK ?

Yup. Two things, though:

1)

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I sent a ReaEQ plugin to all my tracks

No, you sent all your tracks to a ReaEQ plugin
There's a nice preset for cutting mud.

2) You'll usually want to switch the Master/parent send off on the source track, so that only the EQd signal is heard (there are exceptions to this).

Originally Posted by UncleEti

You're teaching me in your last post so much that I think I will need quite a bit of thinking before to assess what you show me. The truth is I am investigating at random, just out of pure fascination. Maybe I go too quick.

Right - there's no end to the learning process, and it can be bewildering, so stay focussed on your goals, and acquire new information only as you need it.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Now I have a new vsti, Phenome 1.17, but there is no sound. I tried to point to the appl data/loca/temp where the other file landed on, but nothing happens. It seems I need a Factory Library. I made some search on the webpage of the guy (Mr Lunz?) and it appears that's something you have to buy : FactoryData. Did I get it right ?

I'm sorry, I'd forgotten just how complicated this was to set up! I hope you find it worth the effort - I know I did.

You don't need to buy anything in order to use the VST - the other file is a drum library, which will work perfectly well.

If you're going to use soundfonts, you will want a directory for them. You can create this anywhere you like - perhaps it's a good idea to create it in the same place as your VST folder (perhaps not actually in your VST folder, since soundfonts aren't VSTs, but it's up to you). You can call the new folder anything you like - a good name would be "Soundfonts". Extract pc_drums_42.exe to your new Soundfonts folder, not to the silly default location.

Unfortunately, however, the extracted file is still compressed, by a protocol specifically for soundfonts. You'll need an extractor to open it.
(Sorry, I'd forgotten about that! Stick with it....)

Download the extractor program:
http://www.softpedia.com/progDownloa...oad-73091.html
(They recommend extracting the zip to your 'Program files' tree, but I recommend extracting it to your soundfont folder.)

Use SFPACK.EXE to open PC Drums 42a.sfpack - you can do this either way, but if you double click PC Drums 42a.sfpack and point Windows at SFPACK.EXE, you can tell windows to always open .sfpack files with SFPACK.EXE, and so never have to go through this again!

After all that, you should have PC Drums 42a.sf2 in the 'pc drums' folder in your 'Soundfonts' folder. Then you need to point Phenome at PC Drums 42a.sf2 - Phenome's browser isn't the best in the world, so you might need a little help even with that, but see how you go!

The following are not necessary right now, but anyone playing with soundfonts might find them useful later:

SfArk is another compressor/extractor for soundfont files -
http://www.brothersoft.com/sfark-sou...ion-10466.html

and if you want get in deep, you can build your own libraries with Vienna -
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multime...t-Studio.shtml

[UncleEti]

Fex, you're just a kind person.
Tomorrow is another day but all this looks very interesting.

Thanks a lot.

[Fex]

No problem. When you get it up and running, Google for soundfonts. There is another world of virtual instruments out there beyond VST.

[UncleEti]

Sigh....one hour and half and no success.
I open Phenom ok. Then I click on setup. But it's hell on wheel for pointing out to where I had installed PC drum 42a.sfpack.
Finally I succeeded half by copying, half by writing the end of the url by hand. But nothing happened (no sound). And after having closed, then open again the VSTi, anyway it as all to be done again. The address had disappered.
I am on win7. It's true I had error messages, after having install the SFPACK.EXE. Something like "no extension shell found" more or less.
If, wanting to point to PC drum 42a.sfpack, I use the browser it opens till it reaches the file itself, but if I go on, it comes back to c:\
Maybe I did not use the right tree ?
Thks

[Fex]

Oh dear.... I didn't mean to ruin your whole day....

Let's back up a little - did you eventually manage to extract PC Drums 42a.sf2 from PC drum 42a.sfpack? Because there's no point in trying to get Phenome to do anything until you have an .sf2 to work with.

If not, lets try setting the sfpack issue aside for now - grab the sf2 from my dropbox.
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/53664537/PC%20Drums%2042a.sf2

I don't think the tree is relevant.

[UncleEti]

Thanks for the file. I have thrown my handkerchieves box. I think I got previously a corrupted download. My file was there but without extension.
It worked immediately.
So, now I can open Ph. 1. 17, and I can open the first line : channel 1>EDIT>etc.... And I have sounds.I am not sure quite sure how to use all 7 channels, but well, it's on its way now.
Can I ask you again something :Is there a way to have the name of the instruments appearing? For example, how shall I find the brushes ?
A Belgian guy (French speaker) made a whole personnal Reaper config. making appearing a window, once MIDI editor is open, with a button for each Drum instrument. I think it's for sf instruments.
http://www.thestraws.be/site-officiel
Click on "annexe bookmark. That's it.
I have asked him how it works with SF player and SF.Waiting his answer.
But maybe there is another way to identify every whistle and bell ?

Here it's a gloomy, misty but peaceful day in SW-France. Take care.

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I have thrown my handkerchieves box.

I fear that this remark may have lost something in translation....

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I think I got previously a corrupted download. My file was there but without extension.

I think it would be worth coming back to this later. You will get a little more out of the whole soundfont thing if you can unpack compressed soundfont files.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

So, now I can open Ph. 1. 17, and I can open the first line : channel 1>EDIT>etc.... And I have sounds.I am not sure quite sure how to use all 7 channels, but well, it's on its way now.

Splendid. I have thrown you in at the deep end of the pool. You're smart, I knew you'd cope. You can't count, though - there are eight channels.

Instead of adding a track and clicking FX, try adding Phenome with
Track > Insert virtual instrument on new track
(or you can find the same thing in the Insert menu.)
You will be asked if you want to add a bunch of tracks, with different audio pairs. Say yes.
You can disarm the Record button and turn Record Monitoring off.

Put the drums on channel 1. This is heresy, but channel 10 isn't available in Phenome AFAIK.

Next, grab yourself another soundfont. This is a very, very sexy bass:
http://soundfonts.homemusician.net/b.../ns_jbass.html

You can write drum parts on MIDI channel one and Bass parts on MIDI channel 2 in a single MIDI part in Reaper. It might be easiest to do this on the main Phenome track.
I'm pretty sure you'll figure that out very quickly, but let me know if there's a problem.

The bass and drum parts should be playing through the main Phenome track at this stage, which is not ideal. Where it says 'Multi' at the top right, change 'Main' to 'Out 3' for channel 2 (one of my teachers would never let me assign MIDI channel 2 to track 2, or anything else called 2, if there was a choice - it helps you to avoid confusing MIDI channels with other things). The bass should now be coming through a separate audio pair. In the mixer, change the name of the track called "Out 3" to "Bass".

Download a bunch of soundfonts. Have some fun.

You're French, so you'll be needing an accordion:
http://soundfonts.homemusician.net/o...accordian.html

Originally Posted by UncleEti

Can I ask you again something :Is there a way to have the name of the instruments appearing? For example, how shall I find the brushes ?

I lied about the brushes. Actually, I didn't lie, I just got confused between two of my favourite soundfont sets. I like PC drums because it's simple, and sounds pretty good.... for rock purposes. Soooooooooooorry....

Ah, well - Fluid is a must-have anyway, because it's a complete General MIDI set - one of the best I've found.
http://www.sf2midi.com/soundfonts/fi...-sf2-1401.html
This includes many drum sets. There's your brushes.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

A Belgian guy (French speaker) made a whole personnal Reaper config. making appearing a window, once MIDI editor is open, with a button for each Drum instrument. I think it's for sf instruments.

It won't be for soundfonts specifically; you can make soundfonts yourself, and they don't have to conform to any map. However, the Belgian guy's config will almost certainly be for the General MIDI standard, so it will work for soundfonts which conform to that standard. While Phenome doesn't use MIDI channel 10, the Fluid and PC drums soundfonts do conform, for the most part, to the standard.

Originally Posted by UncleEti

maybe there is another way to identify every whistle and bell ?

Here's a list:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_MIDI#Percussion

[Fex]

This is my General MIDI drum map. You might need to tweak it for specific sets.

If you copy this, paste it into notepad, and save it as something like
GM_Drums.txt
you can load it into Reaper and have the instrument names written on the keys in Reaper's MIDI editor.

// MIDI note name map generated by Reaper
86	Above 81 are optional
84	Bell Tree
83	Sleigh Bells
82	Shaker
81	Open Triangle
80	Mute Triangle
79	Open Cuica
78	Mute Cuica
77	Low Wood Block
76	Hi Wood Block
75	Claves
74	Long Guiro
73	Short Guiro
72	Long Whistle
71	Short Whistle
70	Maracas
69	Cabasa
68	Low Agogo
67	Hi Agogo
66	Low Timbale
65	Hi Tiimbale
64	Low Conga
63	Open Hi Conga
62	Mute Hi Conga
61	Low Bongo
60	Hi Bongo
59	Ride Cymbal 2
58	Vibraslap
57	Crash Cymbal 2
56	Cowbell
55	Splash Cymbal
54	Tambourine
53	Ride Bell
52	Chinese Cymbal
51	Ride Cymbal 1
50	High Tom
49	Crash Cymbal 1
48	Hi-Mid Tom
47	Low-Mid Tom
46	Open Hi-Hat
45	Low Tom
44	Pedal Hi-Hat
43	High Floor Tom
42	Closed Hi-Hat
41	Low Floor Tom
40	Snare 2
39	Clap
38	Snare 1
37	Side Stick
36	Bass Drum 1
35	Bass Drum 2
34	HardHit Snare
33	Bass Drum 3
32	Drumsticks
31	Snare 3
30	Castanets
29	Snare roll
28	Brush hit & circle
27	Brush hit soft
26	Brush circle
25	Brush hit hard
24	Zap/Click
23	Below 35 are optional

In Reapers MIDI window,
File > Customize note names > Load note names from file

[UncleEti]

OK, it fits.
Gene Krupa should be (could have been)afraid.
That was quite a bit of work for you.
Thanks a lot.

[Fex]

No problem.

Go Google "soundfonts."

Also, check out this VST.... it's a cello; I think you'll do something interesting with it.
http://soundkeysvst.free.fr/

[UncleEti]

I had it ; but still, I realized it was what I wanted more than a bass.

It's hell on wheel to find a jazz brush vst(i) free or not too expensive. What's your solution ?

[shemp]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

I had it ; but still, I realized it was what I wanted more than a bass.

It's hell on wheel to find a jazz brush vst(i) free or not too expensive. What's your solution ?

Jamstix has a good brush kit. But it ain't free and it ain't super easy to use. I have Version 2 (I didn't upgrade) and it takes a while to grasp it's very powerful programming "brain".... Worth checking out IMO though.

[ivansc]

I use Splitsticks from where I do not know but I found it via this forum!

Does rods and brushes rather well.

[Tazzie]

Thanks for your post UncleEti, I was not able to hear your song but the title inspired me to give you the link to some Dharma songs I have been working on, with Reaper of course! My songs are all rather unfinished and like many others I always seem to be juggling my time between work and my musical ambitions. I have tried to stay away from Ambient style of which there is plenty of examples around, preferring to try to express my Buddhist experiences in a more Rock Blues style, any how check it out!
http://soundcloud.com/endless-hiway
Glad to hear from another Buddhist musician, and by the way Endlees Hiway
is another name for the ocean of samsara.
Wishing you Joyeux Noell Buddhist style.
Tazzie

[Fex]

Originally Posted by UncleEti

It's hell on wheel to find a jazz brush vst(i) free or not too expensive. What's your solution ?

To be honest, when machine drums are found in my music, they are intended to sound like drum machines. Every other week I see a VST advertised as "sounds exactly like a real drummer!"

They don't.

My solution would be to program the part on the brush kit in fluid, and then tell a drummer, "play that".

[UncleEti]

Actually, today I had the garderner. I chatted with him and he is a drummer too.
Merry Xmas if you like these things. Or, Merry Crisis and Happy New Fear. Take the one you like.

[Tazzie]

I was able to listen to your song and I should say firstly,your voice seems perfectly suited to the poetic chanting style you have chosen. I understand French only superficially, but of what I did comprehend, it all contributed to a very pleasing and peaceful chant. I am really not especially qualified to advise you on technical issues, however I have noticed that some Bass whether Midi or analogue sometimes sounds out of pitch in the lower registers. I think its the same phenomenon that makes it more difficult to get the low E string in tune on a guitar, for example. I also use Miroslav orchestra and I have barely come to grips with it, but this is my limitation however. One thing I should mention is that Miroslav can cause reaper to crash at times so I would advise you to convert Miroslav Midi track(s) to audio ASAP and then remove the Miroslav VsTi from the project before saving. Another Freeware that I find almost as useful as Miroslav is E-mu Proteus VX. It has some very sweet orchestral samples and a myriad of other styles as well. Download from E-Mu, http://www.creative.com/emu/proteusvx/ . GtG drum sampler is another good freeware
http://myvst.com/vst-instruments/dru...er-ii-freeware.

Bye for now and keep up the good work

Tazzie

[UncleEti]

@ Tazziz

Hi Tazzie, nice to be in touch with someone sharing such a specific interest : conveying Dharma trough music !

Originally Posted by Tazzie

have tried to stay away from Ambient style of which there is plenty of examples around, preferring to try to express my Buddhist experiences in a more Rock Blues style, any how check it out!
http://soundcloud.com/endless-hiway
Tazzie

Translating Dharma feeling trough music is difficult for me. I always finish producing some kind of slow soft music which is not what I had in mind. Did you listen today to the webroadcast of H.H.K.'s teaching ? There was this Indian classical band singing Saraha and Tilopa's songs. That's the first time I became aware that the most relevant musical root for Dohas is Indian musical tradition. Tibetan music is nice but even more foreign to our culture (I find Steve Tibbets endaevour by this respect quite inspiring )

[UncleEti]

@Tazzie
Thank you for your kind appreciation of my music ! What you do is quite special too !

Originally Posted by Tazzie

I have noticed that some Bass whether Midi or analogue sometimes sounds out of pitch in the lower registers.

Problem with midi samples is they sound wrong if you use them too far away from their natural range (like a bass in C4, let's say) But it's true my guitar is not so good, and I am somewhat lazy too for putting new strings.

Originally Posted by Tazzie

One thing I should mention is that Miroslav can cause reaper to crash at times so I would advise you to convert Miroslav Midi track(s) to audio ASAP and then remove the Miroslav VsTi from the project before saving.

Honestly I never had any crash with Miroslav. Still,I rarely use more than 2 or 3 tracks in the same time. Also, do you mean you convert Miroslav Ph files in another format ? They have those strange extensions : stip, sth, etc... How do you do that ?
I will check with pleasure the URLs you gave me.Always ready for that.
Lucky man, it's summer for you, winter for me. Or maybe you would be happy with some snow, who knows ? A good example of the relativity of illusory appearances.
Merry Dharmic Christmas, Tazzie !

[Fex]

You two really need to meet this guy:
http://freevst.blogspot.com/2007/10/delay-lama.html

[UncleEti]

The good sign that a Tibetan monk is ready to sing infra-bass, like rgu-tö colledge does for example, is when his throat bleeds. Your monk looks a bit too easy going to my taste, but thank you for meaning well (keep doing that, no need to be a Buddhist).