Old 11-26-2022, 08:45 AM   #41
matnoir
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I'm afraid that wouldn't do as Space Controller basically is a multi-channel panner that can be remotely controlled. So it will not provide the desired metadata for objects.

In Reaper, you can however link its parameters to the Dolby Atmos Music Panner, but that will just allow you to use your phone instead of your mouse, which is more fun but less accurate...

I demonstrated this in a video when the plugin was released :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPzeoSMBaI

Quote:
Originally Posted by plush2 View Post
It's likely to be just slightly less work but Space Controller by Sound Particles allows for copy and paste from their panner to any Atmos supporting panner. I think the idea is you can do your object based panning using that in your preferred setup and then copy and paste to publish the mix.

It would be track by track.
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Old 11-26-2022, 09:38 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matnoir View Post
I'm afraid that wouldn't do as Space Controller basically is a multi-channel panner that can be remotely controlled. So it will not provide the desired metadata for objects.

In Reaper, you can however link its parameters to the Dolby Atmos Music Panner, but that will just allow you to use your phone instead of your mouse, which is more fun but less accurate...

I demonstrated this in a video when the plugin was released :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPzeoSMBaI
From the Space Controller manual under the heading "Copy/Paste automation into Dolby Atmos objects"


Quote:
Space Controller works with Dolby Atmos Beds. Since plugin architectures do not support
object metadata, Space Controller is currently not compatible with objects. However, Space
Controller has dedicated automation parameters to copy directly into the Dolby Atmos Music
Panner or Pro Tools, Nuendo and Logic Pro native panners that send objects position metadata
to the Dolby Atmos Render
This is the workflow I was referring to. The only advantage being that one could complete all their panning (object and bed) in Reaper and then transfer to Davinci to create the Atmos deliverable. I'm intrigued by the linking through OSC approach, at the same time I can see why the accuracy of the method using Space Controller would be unwieldy.

Last edited by plush2; 11-26-2022 at 09:44 AM.
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Old 11-27-2022, 05:30 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by matnoir View Post

But there's hope. There have been rumours that at first Cockos rejected Dolby's integration as the legal part was not in line with Cockos' philosophy. It seems that Dolby is still interested in having Reaper directly importing/exporting Dolby ADM (after all, it's just about getting some textual metadata in the right format), so things might brighten up in a not too distant future.
Is there a chance the cockos team will collaborate with dolby to come up with a dolby surround encoder for reaper? Or is that wishful thinking?
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Old 11-27-2022, 08:02 AM   #44
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That's the big question. Other products have integrated Dolby Atmos encoding, and this is a rare situation where Reaper is one of the products lagging other DAWs. Nuendo, Cubase, Ableton, and Davinci Resolve all have integrated Atmos encoding / rendering into the app itself. MY knowledge of how other apps work is a bit spotty, so don't quote me on it, but it appears Pro Tools has a hack where they can do real time encoding using a standalone Dolby encoding application running at the same time synced with timecode, but that only works on a Mac. (Reaper may be able to do the same thing on Mac?) PT on PC requires the audio to be output to a second PC where the encoder can run, if my understanding is correct. Someone please correct me if any of the above is wrong.

Reaper and Studio One have yet to announce integrated encoding, so we'll see what happens. As someone mentioned above, it might have something to do with licensing from Dolby.

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Originally Posted by oceanboat View Post
Is there a chance the cockos team will collaborate with dolby to come up with a dolby surround encoder for reaper? Or is that wishful thinking?
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Old 11-27-2022, 08:18 AM   #45
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I'm going to be doing Atmos audio for the most part, though I may want to do music videos with Atmos sound some time down the road. I have a working process in place, using Reaper for the bulk of the mixing, exporting mixed stems, and then doing object panning and final rendering in Davinci Resolve. Not ideal, but it seems to work pretty well, albeit not nearly as convenient as doing it all in Reaper would be. DAWs that have now integrated Atmos encoding include Cubase, Nuendo, Ableton, and Resolve. And of course Pro Tools can do it using the separate rendering app. But I'm keeping abreast of what's happening with other surround formats, in case there is reason to use them.

I did some reading on MPEG-H yesterday, and it's worth keeping an eye on it as a viable format. Sony360 is said to be using MPEG-H as their integrated format, and of course Sony is huge. Korea adopted MPEG-H as their over-the-air surround format, and Brazil just decided on MPEG-H as well. Several receiver manufacturers (Denon and a few others, can't remember them all) offered firmware upgrades to some of their surround receivers to support MPEG-H. Atmos still has the bulk of the market so far, but MPEG-H has some technical advantages, and might gain traction over time.


Quote:
Originally Posted by matnoir View Post
I must confess that I did not try the Fraunhofer suite, since I got it as I had no time for that. From their documentation, I'm afraid that it can convert dolby adm files but not the other way around.

FAQ : https://mpegh.com/info/#1604315177908-df8dc760-69ae
Tools : https://www.iis.fraunhofer.de/en/ff/...tware/mas.html

What are the actual deliverables that you need ? Music only for Apple/Amazon/Tidal or films (as you mentioned Resolve Studio) ?
ADM files come in various flavors, but they are pretty well standardized.

At present, I'm afraid that "true" Dolby format will need Dolby software (or Pro Tools or Nuendo I believe).

But there's hope. There have been rumours that at first Cockos rejected Dolby's integration as the legal part was not in line with Cockos' philosophy. It seems that Dolby is still interested in having Reaper directly importing/exporting Dolby ADM (after all, it's just about getting some textual metadata in the right format), so things might brighten up in a not too distant future.
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Old 11-27-2022, 08:21 AM   #46
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https://forums.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2468058

Last edited by pepe44; 11-27-2022 at 08:37 AM.
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Old 11-27-2022, 08:22 AM   #47
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To me, that seems less convenient than simply using Resolve's surround panner to generate the Atmos metadata. And I don't plan to do a lot of complex object panning anyway. I'm doing music, I won't have helicopters flying overhead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by plush2 View Post
It's likely to be just slightly less work but Space Controller by Sound Particles allows for copy and paste from their panner to any Atmos supporting panner. I think the idea is you can do your object based panning using that in your preferred setup and then copy and paste to publish the mix.

It would be track by track.
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Old 11-27-2022, 09:59 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
To me, that seems less convenient than simply using Resolve's surround panner to generate the Atmos metadata. And I don't plan to do a lot of complex object panning anyway. I'm doing music, I won't have helicopters flying overhead.
I defer to your opinion. I haven't used either workflow myself. I was just presenting the one possibility I was aware of.
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Old 11-27-2022, 02:01 PM   #49
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I appreciate your thought, and I may try it at some point. It's always good to have alternatives.

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Originally Posted by plush2 View Post
I defer to your opinion. I haven't used either workflow myself. I was just presenting the one possibility I was aware of.
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Old 11-27-2022, 03:23 PM   #50
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If cockos create a separate ATMOS encoder plugin and sell it separately, that might be an acceptable trade off.
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Old 11-27-2022, 04:27 PM   #51
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I don't think that can happen. Atmos is licensed and controlled by Dolby, who control the encoder technology. However, it might be possible for Reaper to incorporate a Dolby licensed encoder capability into the renderer, much like they do with ffmpeg. Just speculating.

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If cockos create a separate ATMOS encoder plugin and sell it separately, that might be an acceptable trade off.
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Old 12-12-2022, 08:56 AM   #52
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What is the price tag of Dolby Media Encoder? The price is not shown in the dolby website.
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Old 12-12-2022, 11:50 AM   #53
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The Dolby mastering suite, which includes a number of tools, is $995. I believe there is a PC version. The Dolby Media Encoder is roughly $400, but is Mac only.

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What is the price tag of Dolby Media Encoder? The price is not shown in the dolby website.
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Old 12-14-2022, 12:53 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
The Dolby mastering suite, which includes a number of tools, is $995. I believe there is a PC version. The Dolby Media Encoder is roughly $400, but is Mac only.
according to the sweetwater website, the dolby production suite is mac only and might require a pro tools software.

i've read your previous posts that da vinci resolve contains atmos rendering. this might be a good solution since i can use the video editing part of resolve. can da vinci resolve do the atmos rendering with the windows version?
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Old 12-14-2022, 01:52 AM   #55
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It does, and it works nicely. I'm on a PC with Windows. But you don't get Atmos support in the free version, you need to buy the Studio version. Their paid license includes updates for life, so you don't have to upgrade every year or so. Resolve is an incredible video editor, absolutely top notch. A bit buggy now and then, and picky about the video card and driver you use with it, but it's a very deep and complex piece of software so I forgive those faults. Be sure you meet the hardware requirements before buying it. You can test compatibility with the free version.

If you're on a budget sometimes you can find someone selling an unused license on EBay. (They include a license with some of their hardware products, and some people don't need a second license.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by oceanboat View Post
according to the sweetwater website, the dolby production suite is mac only and might require a pro tools software.

i've read your previous posts that da vinci resolve contains atmos rendering. this might be a good solution since i can use the video editing part of resolve. can da vinci resolve do the atmos rendering with the windows version?
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