Old 07-13-2019, 09:31 AM   #1
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Default Melodyne ARA Corruption (Findings)

Gonna split off from the other threads so that it's not messing with other people's bug reports.
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Old 07-13-2019, 11:56 AM   #2
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Here I'm demonstrating:

1. A working .RPP, then hitting Save.
2. Notice the .RPP-bak is generated.
3. Open the newly-saved .RPP
4. Melodyne reanalyses. Open/Close the FX and you get the actual error displayed.
5. Open the .RPP-bak, everything is fine.

What is happening during save that is corrupting?

Last edited by ferropop; 07-13-2019 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 07-13-2019, 12:22 PM   #3
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Oh and if instead of SAVE I choose SAVE NEW VERSION OF PROJECT, that new file is completely fine.
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Old 07-13-2019, 12:33 PM   #4
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Note: I cannot reproduce this in fresh Reaper Portable. Is there anything I can provide that might shed some light?
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Old 07-13-2019, 12:40 PM   #5
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If you can't reproduce it in a portable install, could you run the action "File: Export configuration" and mail the config file to support at cockos?
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Old 07-13-2019, 02:36 PM   #6
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Done! From ferro@ferropop.com
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Old 07-13-2019, 02:53 PM   #7
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Any scripts running? Same sws version installed for portable vs your main install?
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:41 PM   #8
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Quote:
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Any scripts running? Same sws version installed for portable vs your main install?
Same SWS version yeah, 2.10.0 #1.
I'm going through all the actions to see if any scripts are running, but so far nothing.
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Old 07-13-2019, 04:49 PM   #9
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Backed up, doing a Reset Configuration to Factory Defaults, and testing. Then I'll reintroduce one old Configuration item at a time and see what happens...
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Old 07-13-2019, 07:47 PM   #10
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Justin/Schwa:

Starting with a fresh unsaved project, adding a .WAV file, adding Melodyne to that track, then Save with the "Copy all media to project directory"... is it possible that there's discrepancy between the new "copied" .wav source in the .RPP and the location Melodyne is expecting to find that same WAV?

...when you haven't saved yet, Reaper will put that .WAV file in the root/temp folder and that's where Melodyne is analyzing it. Upon Saving with Copy all Media to Project Directory, it's then physically copying that WAV file to a new location, and I'm wondering whether that's why Melodyne is freaking out and reanalyzing the file? Does it for some reason see it as a new sourcefile (because it's technically in a new location) and then resets the edits?

Last edited by ferropop; 07-13-2019 at 07:56 PM.
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Old 07-13-2019, 08:35 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop View Post
Justin/Schwa:

Starting with a fresh unsaved project, adding a .WAV file, adding Melodyne to that track, then Save with the "Copy all media to project directory"... is it possible that there's discrepancy between the new "copied" .wav source in the .RPP and the location Melodyne is expecting to find that same WAV?

...when you haven't saved yet, Reaper will put that .WAV file in the root/temp folder and that's where Melodyne is analyzing it. Upon Saving with Copy all Media to Project Directory, it's then physically copying that WAV file to a new location, and I'm wondering whether that's why Melodyne is freaking out and reanalyzing the file? Does it for some reason see it as a new sourcefile (because it's technically in a new location) and then resets the edits?
Interesting.

After moving my problem projects to a different folder, re-editing, cleaning up my directory to just what is used in that specific project, everything then stays BUT youíre right as soon as saving takes place in any other way, itís totally screwed.

The way I know my project is going to fail is this:

As soon as my project opens - if the ďARA analysisĒ taskbar comes up - I know with certainty that my edits in melodyne will be gone when I open the plugin.
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Old 07-13-2019, 09:41 PM   #12
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Chris do you use a custom temp directory? I do, a folder called Incomplete so the pre-save working files don't clog up my project folder. Connected?
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Old 07-13-2019, 10:49 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop View Post
Chris do you use a custom temp directory? I do, a folder called Incomplete so the pre-save working files don't clog up my project folder. Connected?
Well that, sir, is a good idea!
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Old 07-14-2019, 08:06 AM   #14
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Ok so you're not also doing that then? I thought maybe that could be connected. Devs?
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Old 07-14-2019, 09:36 AM   #15
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Quote:
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Ok so you're not also doing that then? I thought maybe that could be connected. Devs?
I was not doing that BUT itís a great idea for me in general. Thanks!
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Old 07-16-2019, 12:11 PM   #16
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Hey guys, thought I'd chime in.

I've fixed my problem (as far as I can tell). The fact that it wasn't happening on a Portable install was a huge red flag, and implied it was something in my config. This is what I did:

1. Backed up my Reaper config.
2. Completely uninstalled reaper, and deleted the %appdata%\Reaper folder where ~10 years of configuration stuff resided.
3. Renamed the config backup to .zip and extracted.
4. Reinstalled Reaper
5. One by one (testing between each one), copied config files from the extracted backup into %appdata%\Reaper until my config was as close to normal as possible using the absolute minimum number of old config files. ie, I let the VST cache rebuild itself naturally but copied in Reaper.ini, swsautocolor config, custom mappings etc.

So far so good. Thank you for the time you've put into making ARA as seamless as possible.
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Old 07-16-2019, 12:31 PM   #17
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I'm happy you're not seeing the problem any more, but we'd sure like to know what part of the configuration was triggering it!
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Old 07-16-2019, 12:40 PM   #18
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Me too, I'm thinking of doing the same process on the Portable install and figuring out which file breaks it.
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Old 07-16-2019, 09:46 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Me too, I'm thinking of doing the same process on the Portable install and figuring out which file breaks it.
I did it. No luck for me. Nice to get a fresh install though!
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Old 07-17-2019, 10:35 AM   #20
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Quote:
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I did it. No luck for me. Nice to get a fresh install though!
Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.

Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
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Old 07-17-2019, 12:07 PM   #21
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Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.

Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
Yep. I did. However, the behavior isn't exactly the same now. I still get that stupid corrupt document message on some of my projects but it seems that the edits are all in the right places.

However, it doesn't inspire confidence that what I'm doing will be safe.

Of course I'll keep moving forward though and see if this shakes out to be an "old project" problem as I bring new clients in.

I will be keeping a very close eye on this issue.
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Old 07-18-2019, 11:15 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop View Post
Wow really, I wonder why this worked for me.

Chris7t6 did you try the portable install to compare?
So I redid the procedure with the portable install per your suggestion.

It seems to have worked! For future and current sessions. Not past sessions unfortunately.

After I edit and save, everything is there and solid when I reopen. VERY VERY HAPPY!

One thing I've found; The "save minimal undo states" should never be used with Melodyne. It breaks your edits the first time you "undo" anything.

Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-19-2019 at 12:09 AM.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:51 AM   #23
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Quote:
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So I redid the procedure with the portable install per your suggestion.

It seems to have worked! For future and current sessions. Not past sessions unfortunately.

After I edit and save, everything is there and solid when I reopen. VERY VERY HAPPY!

One thing I've found; The "save minimal undo states" should never be used with Melodyne. It breaks your edits the first time you "undo" anything.
That's amazing man, I wonder what is in both our configs that was messing things up? Hoping to put in some time this weekend to figure it out and give Cockos some meaningful results.
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Old 07-20-2019, 10:47 PM   #24
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That's amazing man, I wonder what is in both our configs that was messing things up? Hoping to put in some time this weekend to figure it out and give Cockos some meaningful results.
Yeah. I have no idea. I know what I DIDNíT use from my old config but thatís about it. I have all the successful config saved along with what was added in the name. Once I got enough of my settings back, I stopped restoring and just finished by setting some preferences. I saved that config and it seems to be fine.

And I DO know that if I use my old config now it breaks everything. As long as I donít save under that config, everything is fine. As soon as I put my new working config back, everything works again.

If anybody at Cockos is interested in my old and new config to compare, lemme know.
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Old 07-21-2019, 05:28 AM   #25
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Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
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Old 07-21-2019, 11:02 PM   #26
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Quote:
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Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
Ok, Schwa. I'll get that packed up in the next day and sent to you.
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Old 07-21-2019, 11:21 PM   #27
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Yeah. I have no idea. I know what I DIDNíT use from my old config but thatís about it. I have all the successful config saved along with what was added in the name. Once I got enough of my settings back, I stopped restoring and just finished by setting some preferences. I saved that config and it seems to be fine.

And I DO know that if I use my old config now it breaks everything. As long as I donít save under that config, everything is fine. As soon as I put my new working config back, everything works again.

If anybody at Cockos is interested in my old and new config to compare, lemme know.
AND MY BLISS HAS ENDED!! The project I'm working on has been performing wonderful. Bout 15 minutes ago, Melodyne started the same crap. Corrupt. I just don't understand. I'm going to try ANOTHER reinstall of Reaper and throw that working config in to see what happens.

SUPER BUMMER.
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Old 07-21-2019, 11:47 PM   #28
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Ok. After clearing my machine of the last install, I opened my rpp in the initial reaper config state, saved and closed.

I then reopened to make sure Melodyne was going to "stick"

It did save correctly, so I saved again and then imported my latest problem free config. Saved, blah, blah...

Anyways, now everything seems to be fine again.

Guys, I'm not kidding when I say i did nothing to my program or data folder between my last fresh install and this latest failure.

What I DID do however was install the 5.981 x64 from the pre release directory.

I'm now back at 5.80.
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Old 07-22-2019, 04:34 AM   #29
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Wanted to say , feel sorry for you trouble guys but thanks for documenting it and working through it with Schwa so that others here will benefit too.

Hope it gets sorted out asap!
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Old 07-22-2019, 08:04 AM   #30
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Just to say I'm having the same problems...that error about the document structure or whatever, and then all my edits are lost. I've resorted to basically just rendering the edits as soon as they're done. Unfortunately I can't dive into to this deeply at the moment, but I'm keeping a keen eye on this. Thanks for your efforts.
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Old 07-22-2019, 10:53 AM   #31
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Quote:
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...
I wonder if making backup (ex: with timestamp) more frequently and then when it's broken and comparing the good and the bad might help figuring out what trigger it? Sorry Just a thought I had
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Old 07-22-2019, 10:58 AM   #32
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I wonder if making backup (ex: with timestamp) more frequently and then when it's broken and comparing the good and the bad might help figuring out what trigger it? Sorry Just a thought I had
That is a good idea.

I'll try that. Some projects still just won't work. Wearing a bald spot on my chin at this point!!
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Old 07-22-2019, 12:45 PM   #33
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Yes of course! The old config files, along with steps to reproduce the problem, would be much appreciated.
Ok. I have two sessions by the same artist. One reliably works. One reliably doesn't despite changes made.

I'd like to upload my configs and the sessions.

How do I do this so that it gets to the right folks?
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Old 07-22-2019, 01:59 PM   #34
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https://forum.cockos.com/attachment....1&d=1563828998

UPDATE: The below info has also been confirmed in the portable install as well.

This one for instance gives me the "document corrupt" message, However, it's only that last guy in the track list that won't stay put.

I've run across this exact thing with other projects.
Attached Images
File Type: png One of these Kids.PNG (38.2 KB, 136 views)

Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-22-2019 at 02:31 PM. Reason: MORE FINDINGS
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Old 07-23-2019, 03:18 AM   #35
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I'm having the same problem for some time now and started a thread back in may about it.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=221137

This post to say that, I've always managed to find a working version (with all Melodyne data correct and not complaining) in the last backups (I have auto backup set to 2 minutes).

Which is why it seems unlikely that this problem is config related, as some RPP projects work and some don't including backups.

However, I did try to delete all my .ini files this morning, to no avail, I got the same error from Melodyne.
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Old 07-23-2019, 10:36 AM   #36
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I'm having the same problem for some time now and started a thread back in may about it.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=221137

This post to say that, I've always managed to find a working version (with all Melodyne data correct and not complaining) in the last backups (I have auto backup set to 2 minutes).

Which is why it seems unlikely that this problem is config related, as some RPP projects work and some don't including backups.

However, I did try to delete all my .ini files this morning, to no avail, I got the same error from Melodyne.
Thanks for chiming in!!

At this point it still feels like a mystery to me. Melodyne is a huge part of my process. Iím now looking at other options besides Melodyne but thereís nothing out there that seems even close.

Pretty big bummer. We have put so much time into this problem and at this point there is really not even a reliable work around.
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Old 07-24-2019, 05:41 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris7t6 View Post
Thanks for chiming in!!

At this point it still feels like a mystery to me. Melodyne is a huge part of my process. Iím now looking at other options besides Melodyne but thereís nothing out there that seems even close.

Pretty big bummer. We have put so much time into this problem and at this point there is really not even a reliable work around.
Thank you for your input!

It reminds me that I forgot to say that I've noticed that "corrupted" RPP files sometimes have a significantly lighter filesize than correct ones. This helps me find a good candidate within the backups.

This is what led me to think that it's a save (or auto-save) problem rather than a config one.
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Old 07-24-2019, 08:09 PM   #38
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Quote:
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Thank you for your input!

It reminds me that I forgot to say that I've noticed that "corrupted" RPP files sometimes have a significantly lighter filesize than correct ones. This helps me find a good candidate within the backups.

This is what led me to think that it's a save (or auto-save) problem rather than a config one.
UPDATE: The below seemed like it might have done the trick for a minute. However, it did not stick.

That's got me thinking. Should we disable auto saves for a while and see if something is happening there? Is that a dumb idea ( other than the obvious reason of course... )?

Last edited by Chris7t6; 07-24-2019 at 09:06 PM. Reason: UPDATE:
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Old 07-25-2019, 03:25 AM   #39
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Quote:
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UPDATE: The below seemed like it might have done the trick for a minute. However, it did not stick.

That's got me thinking. Should we disable auto saves for a while and see if something is happening there? Is that a dumb idea ( other than the obvious reason of course... )?
Yes, the fact that some backup files are ok and some aren't seems to point to a more general save issue.

I also tried to play with the plugins "compatibility settings" params but without success.

I also would be tempted to try and disable third party extensions (SWS and Eucon), but I can hardly work without them and currently have no time for testing.
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Old 07-25-2019, 04:24 PM   #40
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When saving a project with "Move all media to project directory" ticked, while still having the Melodyne window open, Reaper gets stuck at the save progression box until the Melodyne window gets closed.

I guess this is expected behavior (or maybe it's just happening to me) but anyway I just wanted to make sure.
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