Distortion like badbussmojo but with more gain?

[Phazma]

I am searching for a new go-to distortion that can sound smooth and musical on lower gain settings and turn into extreme, fuzzy clipping when maxed out.

Some Distortions I tried...

I have previously used Fabfilter Saturn with the Heavy Saturation algorithm which is so far the only plugin that delivers enough gain to get the sizzle out of every sound I throw into it. However it has this annoying auto gain compensation which attenuates sounds to around -30dB and I have to increase the level gradually until I reach the point that I want. And when I dial the distortion back it gets way to loud and the distortion behaves differently.

As I use heavy distortion a lot, I decided to search for an alternative. No tape emulations, no guitar pedals, just plain symmetric distortion like clippers and some simpler tube emulations provide. However most clippers lack the musical lower range and pretty much no clipper or tube has as much gain as I need.

I tried Devastor which is a strong contender and by setting the filters pre-distortion and boosting them it delivers the gain I need. However in that case it gets way to loud when the main gain is turned down. And it doesn't allow to type or easily snap its output volume to a specific value which to me is important.

TL;DR

The best one I tried was Bad Buss Mojo. I could tweak it so that with the gain at 0 it almost doesn't touch the incoming sounds, when boosting it distorts them musically and at 60dB it destroys them. Also by lowering the threshold knob I was able to gauge 60dB of distortion to output 0dBFS with the output volume at 0 (so I know when typing in the output value how loud of a signal to expect).

However with certain sonic materials the 60dB of gain still didn't suffice to make them as crispy as Saturn does. I could reach that level by further lowering the threshold but then the output knob is not gauged correctly anymore and I need other plugins/fader to bring the volume up.

I know I am too obsessive about these details but I hope someone can recommend me a plugin like BBM with more gain which allows the quick workflow I described.

[Softsynth]

I guess you tried this freebie. It should be in your collection anyway:
https://www.softube.com/saturationknob

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by Softsynth

I guess you tried this freebie. It should be in your collection anyway:
https://www.softube.com/saturationknob

Yes I have it but it is intended for more subtle tasks like making something sound warmer and more present. I am now searching for more sound-design oriented, extreme distortion. And I don't mean fancy waveshaping algorithms either, just simple distortion that cuts the waveforms when exceeding the ceiling and smoothly drives them towards that ceiling. It only gets complicated because I need way more gain than typical distortion plugins provide. Bad Bus Mojo comes very close but its 60dB just aren't enough for some sounds to bring out all the high frequency sizzle.

[jrk]

Originally Posted by Phazma

And I don't mean fancy waveshaping algorithms either, just simple distortion that cuts the waveforms when exceeding the ceiling and smoothly drives them towards that ceiling.

What do you believe are the important differences between "simple" distortion with the character you describe & "fancy waveshaping"?

I would have thought a few minutes spent with the stock "Graphical Waveshaper" would get you where you want to be. Especially if you get some crossover distortion in there. Once you've tweaked to taste, save a preset. Even better if you wrap it in some complementary EQ.

Of course, ReaComp - with the ratio turned up A & D and RMS turned (all, or nearly all) down - makes for some cracking distortion. Plus you've got the filters, so you can fine-tune the character quite a bit.

[Phazma]

Maybe fancy waveshaping is the wrong word, I meant distortion types that don't have a gradual behaviour but alter the waveform in radical ways. Could be foldback distortion, or waveshapers used with complex curves (as opposed to simple clipping).

Actually I have already tried doing what I want with waveshapers (I used the Melda one tough as it gives me more control over input/output than the stock one) but while it gets the extreme fuzz that I want, I can't get it to sound smooth on lower gain settings like I am able with Bad Buss Mojo for example.

Reacomp is the same thing. Actually that does just straight hard clipping. Certainly gets the super-distorted sound on very low treshold but otherwise doesn't sound that good. And it doesn't let me dial in an output gain and distort into it. I need to set the threshold very low and am stuck with whatever output gain the threshold gives me.

I know there are tons of workarounds to get all the sounds I want. I just hoped there was a simple plugin that gives me 2 knobs: a drive knob with a least 70dB of gain and an output knob. And the distortion engine itself could be some tube emulation or soft clipping or whatever that sounds nice and warm on lower settings and brutally distorts at the output ceiling if I crank it all the way.
With all the plugins that exist I just find it weird that no-one has created a plugin that does this. But anyway, I will keep working with BBM and if I need more distortion decrease the threshold and put a gain plugin afterwards to bring it back up.

[ashcat_lt]

ReaComp gets curvy if you increase knee. 6db is pretty close to more typical saturation curves, but it’s worth playing with. If you set automatic make-up on, then the Wet slider will set the level of the loudest peak output and adjusting threshold will mostly alter the distortion but leave levels about the same.

Have you tried editing the BBM code to let the gain control go higher?

[jrk]

Originally Posted by ashcat_lt

ReaComp gets curvy if you increase knee. 6db is pretty close to more typical saturation curves, but it’s worth playing with.

Yes I forgot to mention that. Yr a fan of ReaComp for dist/sat aren't you. I wouldn't have thought to use it like this before you mentioned it somewhere some time ago

Good tips re levels, also.

Originally Posted by Phazma

Maybe fancy waveshaping is the wrong word, I meant distortion types that don't have a gradual behaviour but alter the waveform in radical ways. Could be foldback distortion, or waveshapers used with complex curves (as opposed to simple clipping).

The point of a graphical waveshaper is that you can draw in whatever curve you like. It'll take a bit of experimentation, sure.

Otherwise, I'd vote for SGA1566 (Shattered Glass Audio) - it's not a one-knob (although you could choose to leave most of the knobs alone), and it is a cpu hog, but it sounds pretty good.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by ashcat_lt

ReaComp gets curvy if you increase knee. 6db is pretty close to more typical saturation curves, but it’s worth playing with. If you set automatic make-up on, then the Wet slider will set the level of the loudest peak output and adjusting threshold will mostly alter the distortion but leave levels about the same.

Have you tried editing the BBM code to let the gain control go higher?

Thanks for the answer, tomorrow I will give ReaComp another try to see how it behaves with the settings you suggest.

I am using the VST version of BBM, AFAIK I can not edit the code of it (would be a godsend). I have also checked out the 2 JS versions but they have different controls and honestly I don't get how they work. It seems I can mess with threshold, nonlinearity and knee but there is no gain control. So I would have to add one myself and configure the max gain and it should work like the VST version but with more gain?

[Softsynth]

Somebody suggested to me recently in one of these threads about distortion plugins that this one had a fairly linear build of distortion in comparison with others:
https://klanghelm.com/contents/products/SDRR.html

[Phazma]

@ashcat_It: I have done some more trying around, but ReaComp doesn't cut it for me. Increasing the knee size helps smoothening the sound (tough not as much as I would like) but only if the output limiter is switched off and so I am getting overshoots. Also with auto make-up on I can still not control the output volume the way I want.

@jrk: It might be possible to draw a curve in but I have no idea how a curve might look like which I'd like. While I am not an expert on the technical side so correct me if wrong, I suspect that the problem with the waveshaper is that you draw in a fixed curve and driving the input doesn't change the curve but just reads the sound through the curve. I tried the "Waveshaping Distortion" JS and it comes way closer to what I need and when I adjust the distortion % I can see the graph twisting, which doesn't happen in a waveshaper where I draw the curve in.

@Softsynth I have the free version of this (with the Desk algorithm) and it can get pretty fuzzy but not with the sound I need and not loud enough. Tube, Digi and Fuzz all sound like promising algorithms but there is no demo so i don't know if they deliver more gain than the Desk algorithm.


When it comes to control I got the best results with the Volume Adjustment JS. I tweaked the sliders like this to be able to boost 0-100dB into the output ceiling and 0.1 increments (for smooth automation) and adjust the output ceiling in 1dB steps:
slider1:0<0,100,0.01>Adjustment (dB)
slider2:0<-24,6,1>Max Volume (dB)

This, not surprisingly, still has a very harsh, hard-clipped sound.
However when putting the Bad Buss Mojo JS after it I was able to shape the out-coming signal to taste while having enough input gain.

So ideally I need a fusion of these FX, but my coding skills don't suffice for that. Could someone perhaps help me with it?

I would just need to add a gain control at the input [slider1:0<0,100,0.01>Adjustment (dB)] and a gain control at the output of BBM. While the Max Volume inside the Volume Adjustment conveniently acts as ceiling, I don't need that at the end of BBM as it seems to already internally limit to 0dB (and having a ceiling afterwards would destroy the sound). It would just need to be a transparent volume control with range 0 to -24 in steps of 1.0 (or actually 0.5 would be even better).

[mplay]

If you're demoing stuff, I'd suggest adding Acustica Audio's gainstation to the list. I only ended up buying the cheap version (boost), but am really enjoying it. I use it with very moderate settings on busses to add some saturation. I'm finding I need a lot less processing on my master bus that way. Also love it on softsynts and to me, I can get really over the top distortion without it making me grind my teeth and wanting to pull my hair out like most distortion plugs

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by mplay

If you're demoing stuff, I'd suggest adding Acustica Audio's gainstation to the list. I only ended up buying the cheap version (boost), but am really enjoying it. I use it with very moderate settings on busses to add some saturation. I'm finding I need a lot less processing on my master bus that way. Also love it on softsynts and to me, I can get really over the top distortion without it making me grind my teeth and wanting to pull my hair out like most distortion plugs

It looks interesting but I can't find any trial version to try it out..

[Phazma]

I just found the Soft Clipper jsfx by chkhld and that one works wonderfully for my purpose, once the slider ranges are adjusted to taste. The character (based on hyperbolic tangent clipping) is a bit different than BBM but equally as beautiful, maybe even smoother. Thanks for all your suggestions

[mplay]

Originally Posted by Phazma

It looks interesting but I can't find any trial version to try it out..

All their plugs can be demoed through Aquarius app

[ashcat_lt]

I’m not really trying to talk you into anything. As mentioned above, I do use ReaComp as saturation all the time. I usually go elsewhere for heavier distortions like you’re trying to do, but I do sometimes push it pretty hard just for convenience and efficiency. With ratio at infinity and all three time constants at zero you should not get overshoots. Unless you’ve got “weird knee” on (why would you do that?) the threshold will be the hard limit, automakeup will push that up to 0dbFS, and the wet slider then adjusts from there.

Edit - oh I guess if you use the filters, that might cause “overshoots” also...

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by ashcat_lt

I’m not really trying to talk you into anything. As mentioned above, I do use ReaComp as saturation all the time. I usually go elsewhere for heavier distortions like you’re trying to do, but I do sometimes push it pretty hard just for convenience and efficiency. With ratio at infinity and all three time constants at zero you should not get overshoots. Unless you’ve got “weird knee” on (why would you do that?) the threshold will be the hard limit, automakeup will push that up to 0dbFS, and the wet slider then adjusts from there.

Edit - oh I guess if you use the filters, that might cause “overshoots” also...

The thing is, I want to set an output ceiling and distort into that ceiling and ReaComp's auto-makeup doesn't boost the volume to the output (wet) level, after a certain threshold value the output starts decreasing. Here a GIF for comparison to (my tweaked version) of the afore mentioned soft clipper that works the way I like it: I set an output ceiling and have plenty of gain to drive into it while a smooth sounding function (like hyperbolic tangent appears to be) shapes the distortion towards the ceiling.

[jrk]

Originally Posted by Phazma

based on hyperbolic tangent clipping

tanh, Like every other soft clipper.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by jrk

tanh, Like every other soft clipper.

Yes, basically all I needed was a soft clipper with a hard ceiling and lots of gain :P

Thanks to all of you for the various suggestions!

[jrk]

Glad you got it sorted!