Mackie Control Klinke Update (v0.8.3)

[bcab17]

Originally Posted by TheWhistler

You can delete the midi message you have assigned for a specific task in the action window.
If you can change the midi CC or channel in the Arturia, the you are lucky.
Simply give it a different channel and you are good to go again.

It is like playing a sound module from two different keyboards sending to the same midi channel.
They will both trigger the same module on the same channel. If the hit the same note they will interfere.



I think you can´t solve the problem like this. The midi implementation is (afaik) part of the script/device that makes the devices communicate with Reaper. They spit out CCs themselves that are grabbed by the script and handed over to Reaper to perform specific tasks.

In my understanding, some of them are not yet bound to do something specific hence, they can be assigned.

Thank you! I've tried changing the cc number on the keyboard to an unassigned number, but that didn't work. It caused the keyboard to lose ALL control of Reaper. Of course, I may have done something wrong...

[TheWhistler]

That´s what I suspected. It is part of the script and needs to be as intended.
Why don´t you delete the setting in the X-Touch.
How important is the task for your workflow that interferes with the Arturia. It was nudging items, right?
It´s these situations where you can set up a working method.

[bcab17]

Originally Posted by TheWhistler

That´s what I suspected. It is part of the script and needs to be as intended.
Why don´t you delete the setting in the X-Touch.
How important is the task for your workflow that interferes with the Arturia. It was nudging items, right?
It´s these situations where you can set up a working method.

Thanks for your reply. You make a good point. It is a convenience to have that action mapped to the X-Touch (I wouldn't have done it otherwise)...but I can live without it.

Someone else suggested that changing the MIDI channel of the keyboard could avoid any cc conflicts, but even with my limited MIDI knowledge, I don't think that would work. The Arturia has pre-mapped controls for their software. The keyboard faders that are used to adjust their synth parameters have specified CC numbers (and unless I missed something, it appears that they can't be changed). So, no matter what MIDI channel is coming into Reaper, as long as any shortcuts I add to Reaper actions are automatically assigned a CC number (and that number can't be changed in Reaper...as far as I know), there will always be CC conflicts (or maybe CC "duplicates" is a better choice of words).

On the other hand, I wouldn't mind trying to change MIDI channels (just to see what happens)...on the Arturia it's easy, and when I use it to play/record a virtual instrument track in Reaper, I would just select the appropriate MIDI input channel for that track. However, I would need to have Reaper receive the CC messages on that different MIDI channel, as well, and I have no idea how to do that.

[TheWhistler]

Maybe I am getting you wrong, but are you aware of the fact that you CAN unbind the knob you set up to nudge items from your X-Touch as well as from your Keylab?

BTW I had a quick look in the Keylab MK2 manual.
There is lot´s of control and options for midi setup.
As I understand the manual chances are you have a lot more flexibility there in user mode.
As describe there you have a Reaper DAW preset (which you can´t change) and 10 user presets (that you CAN change) and set up with every controller/midi message you might think of.

You mentioned that you don´t have that much of an idea about midi.
That´s what I would recommend - dive a bit into it. It does not hurt and helps a lot.

Midi is quite easy to understand and once you got it you can see what is possible and what is not with you tools.

You will get much more out of your equipment if you dive into it.

[bcab17]

Originally Posted by TheWhistler

Maybe I am getting you wrong, but are you aware of the fact that you CAN unbind the knob you set up to nudge items from your X-Touch as well as from your Keylab?

BTW I had a quick look in the Keylab MK2 manual.
There is lot´s of control and options for midi setup.
As I understand the manual chances are you have a lot more flexibility there in user mode.
As describe there you have a Reaper DAW preset (which you can´t change) and 10 user presets (that you CAN change) and set up with every controller/midi message you might think of.

You mentioned that you don´t have that much of an idea about midi.
That´s what I would recommend - dive a bit into it. It does not hurt and helps a lot.

Midi is quite easy to understand and once you got it you can see what is possible and what is not with you tools.

You will get much more out of your equipment if you dive into it.

I'm unsure of what is meant by "unbind". I did go into Reaper actions and deleted the shortcuts for the X-Touch that had the conflicting CC numbers, which are pre-assigned for the keyboard. That got rid of the conflicts but reduced the functionality of the X-Touch.

I have gone into the Arturia MCC software and tried making some changes and saving them to different user presets. I tried setting up a different midi channel, but Analog Lab is designed to use midi channel 1 (so the keys worked fine, but not the controllers). I tried changing the CC number of the keyboard faders with the conflict, and that stopped the faders from controlling the instrument parameters in Analog Lab altogether.

Setting up the user presets on the keyboard is quite confusing. It seems earies to do it in their MCC software. However, MCC can't be open at the same time as Reaper, which would make the midi learn process much easier for me.

[TheWhistler]

Originally Posted by bcab17

I'm unsure of what is meant by "unbind". I did go into Reaper actions and deleted the shortcuts for the X-Touch that had the conflicting CC numbers, which are pre-assigned for the keyboard. That got rid of the conflicts but reduced the functionality of the X-Touch.

That´s what I meant. Delete the midi CC for the chosen action.

Originally Posted by bcab17

Setting up the user presets on the keyboard is quite confusing. It seems earies to do it in their MCC software. However, MCC can't be open at the same time as Reaper, which would make the midi learn process much easier for me.

As I don´t hava Keylab I can´t say anything about this. But a short glance at the manual seemed to be quite promising.

[Klinke]

Originally Posted by nofish

It seems auto-mapping of FX on the master track doesn't work in this version.
When I'm in plug-in mode and select master track (which contains some FX) it displays "You must select a single track." (works fine on regular tracks).

Or am I doing something wrong?

No, currently this is not possible, but I will check if this can be implemented without much effort.

[Klinke]

Originally Posted by Dehenry

Hi Klinke, so great to see you still support your plugin - thanks a lot!

I use your plugin with the Behringer X-Touch. I have a question regarding a change in behaviour of v0.9 in plugin mode. If a fader or encoder is moved, the display switches to a view where only bank no., parameter name and parameter value of the parameter that is currently changed are shown across all displays of the X-Touch. After a few seconds the view jumps back to normal mode where the parameters assigned to each fader/encoder are shown. I prefer the display view to be stable and not jump back and forth everytime I change a parameter. In v0.8.3.4, if fake fader touch is enabled and the main fader is touched once, moving other faders or the encoders does not cause the view mode to switch anymore. Instead, only the 6 character alias of the parameter that is being changed is replaced by its value for a few seconds, which I liked. This doesn't work in v0.9 anymore. Would it be possible to make the stable view an option?

It is already an option. Press Shift and Option while in Plug-Mode, and change the "Touch details" option.

Originally Posted by Dehenry

And as we are approaching Christmas, I have two more points on my wish list:

Is there a way to make the clip indicator LEDs on the level meters work?

Would it be possible to make the level meters drop faster or even have the ability to adjust that in the options? Again, I think with CSI they react more quickly.

I'll have a look at that. The problem with the clip indicator is that as far as I understand it, the QCon ProX only has the level meter, but no clip indicator of its own, so I can't test that out very well. With the level meter drop speed, the actual implementation is simple, except I haven't changed anything in the Preferences dialog in a long time.

[Klinke]

Originally Posted by bcab17

Big fan of the X-Touch with Klinke extension. I just added my first MIDI keyboard controller (Arturia Keylab MKII). Both the X-Touch and the MKII are setup in Reaper Preferences-Control Surfaces. In MIDI Devices, nothing is enabled for the X-Touch, and the Keylab is enabled for MIDI In and Control.

Enabling the Keylab as Control Surface and MIDI In and Control is
not a good idea in most cases. The problem is that the Control
Surface extensions, which are based on the Mackie Control protocol,
responds to many different MIDI commands, even note-ons/note-off,
so playing the keyboard can arm your tracks, etc. The protocol
assumes that the MIDI connection on this port is used all by
itself to communicate with the controller, and therefore even
uses multiple MIDI channels.

If you still want to do that, here is a list of MIDI events you
should avoid if you want to control anything directly in Reaper:
http://www.jjlee.com/qlab/Mackie%20C...MIDI%20Map.pdf

What exactly is your goal? In one of the posts it sounds like you
want to control VST synth parameters via CC, why can't you do
that via the FX mode of the extension?

[Dehenry]

Originally Posted by Klinke

It is already an option. Press Shift and Option while in Plug-Mode, and change the "Touch details" option.

I'll have a look at that. The problem with the clip indicator is that as far as I understand it, the QCon ProX only has the level meter, but no clip indicator of its own, so I can't test that out very well. With the level meter drop speed, the actual implementation is simple, except I haven't changed anything in the Preferences dialog in a long time.

Awesome - many thanks and sorry for not properly reading the updated manual!

[sonicbrian]

Originally Posted by Klinke

I have just updated the Mackie Control extension and suggest all users to update to this version. It does not contain new features (beside a more official support of the 2nd controller hack), but different improvements and bug fixes, an improved manual and a lot of new FX maps.
You can find the update in the download section of the bitbucket repository:
https://bitbucket.org/Klinkenstecker..._mcu/downloads

And I want to use the opportunity to announce that I do not plan to invest a lot of time into the extension in the future. Currently I'm involved in a live playing/improvisation oriented project and therefore I'm using Usine in combination with an own Looper-Software, which I'm currently developing. So the development of the MCU extension is cut down to only important issues (like this update ;-)).

Hello, I hope you are well in these strange times and thank you for all your work.
I recently bought a Korg Nanokontrol 2 to have some xtra control during mixing, and have stumbled upon the well known issue of track grouping. I have read that the Klinke control surface version of Mackie fixes that, but although I have installed it as specified, when I go to control/osc/web in preferences, it doesn't even give me the option of adding the Klinke version. What am I missing here?
Thanx in advance!

[Klinke]

I uploaded v0.9.0.5 yesterday, as usual you can download it from https://bitbucket.org/Klinkenstecker...mcu_klinke.zip

New:

It is now possible to control plug-ins on the master track. You
must select the master track via a self-assigned action or the
mouse, since there is no master track select button on the
hardware.

Bugfixes:

The track count for bank switching was incorrect if Anchors were
set in the Track Settings dialog, but the "Use Anchor" option was
set to No.

Fix for possible crashes when reopening a dialog.

[tomo34]

Thanks Klinke so much for your work on this project!

[darkswan]

Digging .9.0.5 release w my x touch

[chinpou]

Thinking of using Wineskin to run “windows” reaper on my mac just so I can use Klinke. Any Mac users try that?
Looked through the klinke manual last night and it seems ideal for me vs moss/csi.

[nightscope]

It is now possible to control plug-ins on the master track.

Awesome.

ns

[Scratchypots]

I've been using my Korg NanoKontrol2 with the Klinke (v0.9.0.5) and when I set the the record mode to "time select autopunch" and hit the record button on the Nano the record mode reverts back to "Normal" and start recording.
Not sure when this changed but I do remember this used to work for me. Anybody have a similar issue or a solution?

[sammybatu]

I am just bouht Nano and download Klinke....it works great!
Thank you Klinke!

[msoficial]

Is there any way to use it on Linux?

Thanks

Originally Posted by Klinke

I uploaded v0.9.0.5 yesterday, as usual you can download it from https://bitbucket.org/Klinkenstecker...mcu_klinke.zip

New:

It is now possible to control plug-ins on the master track. You
must select the master track via a self-assigned action or the
mouse, since there is no master track select button on the
hardware.

Bugfixes:

The track count for bank switching was incorrect if Anchors were
set in the Track Settings dialog, but the "Use Anchor" option was
set to No.

Fix for possible crashes when reopening a dialog.

[rothchild]

Originally Posted by msoficial

Is there any way to use it on Linux?

Thanks

Yes, in theory, but it's non-trivial.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=253828

If you do get it working I'd certainly like to hear about it.

[Dehenry]

Would it be possible to get support for the multi-color displays on the X-Touch (with FW 1.22) as in DrivenByMoss and CSI?

[de3ds]

Exactly which folder, and how to get it recognised that this is in the folder?

[EpicSounds]

First time trying this extension with x-touch universal

The pan button is always flashing and My controller display below the knobs is saying "please read the installation part of the manual".

I don't see anything in the install section telling me what to do next.

[EpicSounds]

A lot of people recommended Klinke extension to me but I can't get it to work at all.

A little help please?

[richbike]

Hi
Have you got it to work with your bcf2000

[LugNut]

Hi,

@epic sounds...did you get it going?
I don't have an xtouch, but I use klinkes....older version,and my hui board with midi translator pro in between.
You have helped many people with Reaper, so I hope someone with an xtouch helps you out.

9/10 times I've ever had a problem its a midi routing problem.

GL

Guido

[EpicSounds]

Originally Posted by LugNut

Hi,

@epic sounds...did you get it going?
I don't have an xtouch, but I use klinkes....older version,and my hui board with midi translator pro in between.
You have helped many people with Reaper, so I hope someone with an xtouch helps you out.

9/10 times I've ever had a problem its a midi routing problem.

GL

Guido

thanks. I walked away from it for a week, connected everything again and it seems to work right now. might have been the USB port I used before, or restarting everything.

I still have that message on the displays sometimes but other functions work.
I've got volume and pan, sends, and fx. Transport, markers, auto modes are all ok.
I figured out adding reaper actions to the global view buttons. I still need to explore the more unique advanced features, but I've already got a lot to show off finally.

[EpicSounds]

I made a video about my experience with the Klinke extension and the X-Touch universal. Partly a tutorial, partly a review, partly just making it up as I go. Hope its helpful.

https://youtu.be/hx2SR7zZx7c

more thoughts on the blog post

https://reaperblog.net/2022/11/xtouch-klinke/

[UltraByte]

thanks to Klinke for creating and ReaperBlog for covering the extension.
made me switch from fader-1 which i was unhappy with (really annoying with large projects) and its exactly what i was looking for (edit: originally i mentioned stability issues but this could be narrowed down to an USB cable not sitting well in the X-touch socket)

i tried the moss extension for the x-touch too but its way too gimmicky(a lot of half baked ideas that dont really work out in the field and whose key assignments on the control surface makes you wonder if its ever being used by anyone for production). so moss, it colors tracknames nicely on the x-touch with 1.22 firmware but whats really important is behavior regarding Sends like implemented in Klinke. allows controlling multiple sends at the same time as for reverb space generation and such.

Klinke really feels like its created from people using it productively. like a no bs kind of implementation. (no hard feelings to moss which does great work for bitwig too, just not my cup of tea regarding x-touch).

Also i havent checked how Klinke was coded (edit its C++. no surprise than to feel it faster i guess. also explains why its more work to port it. lucky windows world) but it feels faster and more responsive than moss. This can also be important. Moss is maybe java/js looking at the files.

only things i would like is to be more stable.[edit: my stability issue could be narrowed down to an USB cable with play thus the issues stopped after it was replaced. The Klinke extension is spot on for my requirements, logic structured and very fast and performant. 100% Kudos !] i had it (similar to what happened in reaperblogs video) hang at least once every one or two sessions when quickly modifying many sends (and pressing mute unmute on multiple trakcs quicky if thats what triggers it. im not sure about the cause or i would write a dedicated bug report)

[tomo34]

Originally Posted by UltraByte

Klinke really feels like its created from people using it productively.

This is the best summary of this extension.

[Klinke]

Originally Posted by UltraByte

only things i would like is to be more stable. i had it (similar to what happened in reaperblogs video) hang at least once every one or two sessions when quickly modifying many sends (and pressing mute unmute on multiple trakcs quicky if thats what triggers it. im not sure about the cause or i would write a dedicated bug report)

Thank you for your very kind words. Regards this stability i'm not sure if this is a problem on my side or of the X-touch firmware. Does anybody else did run into this problem?

And when this happen, does it help to open the Control Surface Settings dialog via Reaper Preferences/"Control/OSC/web" and then pressing the Edit-button or was it necessary to turn the X-touch off and on? Editing the Control Surface Settings will reload the extension, so when this helps it's a good indicator that the problem is caused by the extension, when the X-touch must be turned off and on it's likly a problem of the X-touch firmware.

Edit: I assume the the X-touch stops working like in the reaperblogs video, or did you have any crashes? EpicSounds writes "plus I had trouble with installation and crashes," and if someone has real crashes that is caused by the extension, please add an issue to the repository or send me an e-mail (for whatever reason, I don't get always an notification when someone write a post in the forum (remark to myself: Check and improve the spam-filter)).

[UltraByte]

it didnt happened anymore over the last day but if it will i will try to open the settings to get an indication about the root cause.
Alas it could be very mundane and unrelated to both Klinke or x-touch. I noticed that the usb cable plugged into the x-touch connector got some play. I exchanged the cable and if that was the culprit (ie no issues during the next days) i will edit the original post as it would have been a mere connection issue.

In case of new controller lockups regardless the exchanged cable, i will follow the suggested way to help determine on which side the issue resides.

[edited original post]: the stability issues were indeed caused by the USB cable. (insert facepalm)

[TheWhistler]

Originally Posted by Klinke

This stability i'm not sure if this is a problem on my side or of the X-touch firmware. Does anybody else did run into this problem?

Used it quite often last year when mixing my bands album.
Not once did the X-touch or the extension hang.
Only thing is with midi devices in Reaper.
I had a hang/crash on my Elekton Digitone (which was all Digitone related) which as well caused it´s driver to crash while in use.
This made the whole midi system not work and hickup so it didn´t even help to restart Reaper.
Had to restart the whole machine (Win 10) which is quite stable normaly.
I had a chat with the service guys of iConnectivity who told me that only Reaper does this when you shut a devie while running the DAW.
Maybe this is somehow related.

As I had the Digitone problemes sorted (accidentally midi feedback ) everything was finde again.

[Tedsorvino]

Hi I was looking for a dedicated Klinke MCU pro template (either jpg, png or psd) byt I only found several ones for the Mcu universal on the reaper stash page. I only found a blank one in the forum. Any idea if such a file exists?
Thanks

[CJPN]

Originally Posted by Tedsorvino

Hi I was looking for a dedicated Klinke MCU pro template (either jpg, png or psd) byt I only found several ones for the Mcu universal on the reaper stash page. I only found a blank one in the forum. Any idea if such a file exists?
Thanks

I created (linked below - attachments aren't working for some reason) a complete template for the Universal. I intend to contact Mackie to see whether they'd share a CAD/Pdf/whatnot for the Pro and update said template for the square buttons.

-CJPN

Edit: I have updated the overlays. Please see this post: https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=243

[Tedsorvino]

Originally Posted by CJPN

I created (linked below - attachments aren't working for some reason) a complete template for the Universal. I intend to contact Mackie to see whether they'd share a CAD/Pdf/whatnot for the Pro and update said template for the square buttons.

-CJPN

https://ultramfcd.com/UltraBridge/Le...rlayReaper.zip

Good job, but still another overlay for the old MCU. As you saw I asked for the Pro one. Hopefully Mackie or somebody else will help us out.

[CJPN]

Originally Posted by Tedsorvino

Good job, but still another overlay for the old MCU. As you saw I asked for the Pro one. Hopefully Mackie or somebody else will help us out.

Did the MCP ship with any Lexan overlays, as was the case with the original MCU? If so, I can recreate the button positioning from a high-res (600dpi) scan of such an overlay. That's exactly how I created the MCU overlay.

Edit: Merely to get the button cut-outs sub-mm accurate.

[Tedsorvino]

Originally Posted by CJPN

Did the MCP ship with any Lexan overlays, as was the case with the original MCU? If so, I can recreate the button positioning from a high-res (600dpi) scan of such an overlay. That's exactly how I created the MCU overlay.

Edit: Merely to get the button cut-outs sub-mm accurate.

That would be great. I think this post-thread may have the solution we ‘re looking for. https://forums.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=205281

If we use that template in combination with yours, we may have the perfect mcu pro klinke overlay.
What do you think?

[CJPN]

Excellent sleuthing! Will check the dimensions first thing tomorrow. Either way, looks very promising.

[CJPN]

To save some effort if the template doesn't import with mm-accuracy, could you take a measurement from the left-side of the FLIP button to the right-side of the F8 button on the actual hardware, please? In mm, thanks.

Edit: And from the top of the SMTPE/Beats button to the bottom of the button below M3.