Old 01-07-2013, 10:19 AM   #1
pelleke
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Default New Source/Destination editing actions!

Dear mortals, I would like to announce my new custom actions I created to do Source/Destination editing.

For hasty or lazy people: watch this vid! http://youtu.be/utSTd8huEoM

Insipred by the earlier work done by gembez, Art Evans and panphonic, I would like to share my custom actions with the rest of the world. I've been using them now to edit one project, and I am definitely happy with the way it went.

If you have any questions or remarks, or if you have found a bug, please let me know and I will look at it!

A few key features:

- A set-up action that creates a Destination project tab, asks you to save it (which you can cancel). It duplicates the tracks of the source project, and copies some other data that would otherwise be left away, such as the FX chain on your master track.
- Source and destination are in separate projects, which give them the advantage of having separate timelines, zoom factors and time selections. Also, it gives you a lot better screen real estate, so you don't have to hide tracks to make it work.
- Three points edits and four points edits. Both are done using the same action.
- These actions don't depend on markers so you can use your markers independently, any way you want.
- These actions do not depend on showing and hiding tracks from your TCP
- Two edit actions, one of which automatically adds crossfades to your edits, with a configurable length.
- Although untested, automation envelopes should also be copied.

Installation instructions:
- Get an up-to-date version of Reaper. I've created and tested these on Reaper v4.31.
- Get an up-to-date version of SWS extensions installed.
- Download the custom actions from this thread.
- Start Reaper, open your actions window and import the actions using the Import/Export button.
- Assign useful shortcuts to the actions. I use F10 for Edit, Opt-F10 for Edit without crossfades, and Cmd-Opt-F10 for Set up S/D.
- Configure the auto cross-fade length. Go to Extenseions - Command Parameters, and set the "Seconds (Edit cursor)" value to half the desired crossfade length. (i.e. for 30 ms crossfades, set to 0.015)

Setting up S/D editing:
- If you have multiple project tabs open, make sure your source is on the leftmost tab and that this tab is currently selected. Also, make sure all tracks are visible in TCP. Consider minimizing them instead.
- Execute the set-up action. It creates a new tab, copies the source tracks and the master FX chain, and asks you to save it. I recommend you to save it right away, but you can also cancel the dialog. After that, it reselects the source project.

Editing:
- To edit, you always need a time selection in your source project. Make a time selection around the audio that you desire to copy to your destination.
- If you are doing a 4 point edit, set the time selection in your destination to the desired region you want to replace.
- If you are doing a 3 point edit, remove the time selection in your destination project (if present) and set your playhead to the desired edit location.
- Execute the Edit action.

Notes:
- Three point edits are done by overwriting the content behind the destination playhead with the selected source audio. It only overwrites as long as the source selection's duration. If there is still audio behind the pasted material, a crossfade is created as if it was a four point edit. (In my workflow this situation is really rare, and I thought this behaviour would be the most useful)
- Four-point edits depend on ripple editing being activated in the destination project. It's automatically activated during set-up, but if you switch it off during your editing session, four point edits will break.
- Although these actions themselves do not depend on TCP visibility, I only tested this having all tracks visible. If you want to hide tracks during your S/D editing session, consider minimizing them as an alternative. If you really need to do this, make sure you hide them in both your source project and your destination project. At least, items and envelopes on hidden tracks are known not to be copied. If you have tracks hidden during set-up, they may not appear in your destination project. (Haven't tested this.)
- The Destination project is a copy as identical from the source as I could get it. The only things I know are not copied, are the values of the master fader and panpot, and the measurement units in the timeline. Will look at those in a future version.
- The actions expect the source to be on the leftmost open project tab, and the destination on the rightmost open project tab. I only tested this in an envrionment with two open tabs, but it should work OK with more, although if you want to use a tab in the middle as your source, you've got to move it to the left first.
- When the action makes the crossfade, it may be possible that a little very low (slowly played back) audio is audible. I suspect the SWS action that moves the cursor around is actually doing that, but I am not 100% certain about it. At least, it doesn't do any harm to your project.
- I haven't tested these on Windows, but I expect everything to work. Could anybody please confirm this?

I am eagerly waiting for your replies!
Attached Files
File Type: reaperkeymap Source-Destination Editing.ReaperKeyMap (989 Bytes, 1289 views)
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Old 01-07-2013, 10:28 AM   #2
Sambo Rouge
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Nice work Pelle ---- lots of effort gone in here. Many thanks.
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Old 01-09-2013, 01:43 AM   #3
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phenomenal work. Thank you.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:19 AM   #4
pelleke
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Thanks, people! Did you actually give it a go? (And is one of you guys using Windows?)

I already have the next feature request: two people mentioned (independently from each other) that it would be useful to be able to audition both involved takes on that spot, as if you hadn't cut. (That is, be able to listen to the pieces of "tape" you didn't use.) I'm already thinking that one out. I myself think it would be useful to have an action that - after it's done with the edit - automatically fires up the crossfade editor to immediately edit the fade on the left hand side, and maybe plays it once.
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Old 01-09-2013, 09:51 AM   #5
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Nice.
(I'll not test before when I need something like this)
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Old 01-09-2013, 02:02 PM   #6
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I have not tried it yet, but I've prepared a blog post to promote it, will go up tomorrow.

At the moment I don't have a need for 3 and 4-point edits but there have been a few times in the past where it would have been useful.

I'm on a Mac.
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Old 10-05-2014, 10:09 AM   #7
Guigui Ze Chti
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Default Envelope points are not following while working with Crossfade Editor

Good morning,

This is my first post and please forgive me if this is not the right place to post it.

First of all, bravo and thank you for the amazing Source/Destination editing action, this is so practical for classical music editing!

Here is my question:
When I'm moving content with the crossfade editor, I realize that my envelope volume points are not moving with the content even if I enable rippling mode and envelope points moving with media items. I don't have this problem when I'm manually dragging an item as it makes all following items + envelope to follow.

Thank you very much for your help!

Guillaume
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Old 01-07-2015, 04:05 PM   #8
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Does anyone know why the source destination youtube video has been taken down?
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Old 01-15-2015, 05:13 AM   #9
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Video back up. Sorry for the inconvenience!
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Old 10-07-2015, 07:24 AM   #10
gregswinford
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Default Reaper 5

Sorry to resurrect an old thread!

I have found your custom actions for 3- and 4-point source-destination editing amazingly useful for classical stereo and multi-channel editing. However, I've just upgraded to Reaper 5.03 and SWS 2.8.1 and have spotted a small bug, which I thought I'd flag up. I'm not expecting it to be fixed in any way, just thought it might benefit other users to know about it.

When I run the 'S/D edit' action with a time selection starting at the beginning of the project, Reaper jumps to the second tab as normal, but the item isn't copied. The cursor does jump forward though. In the source project tab, all items move forward in time the same amount as the time selection. If the time selection starts after the beginning of the project, all appears normal.

Thanks again for developing these custom actions, which make Reaper a great choice for classical editing.
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Old 10-07-2015, 07:27 AM   #11
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Oh, that's good to know.

I haven't recorded anything for quite some time (I think I'm still using 4.xx), but I'll look into this to see if I can fix it.
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Old 02-16-2016, 01:10 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gregswinford View Post
Sorry to resurrect an old thread!
Don't worry. This is amazing stuff and definitely worth to be resurrected. Otherwise I wouldn't have seen it!

Thanks, pelleke
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Old 09-03-2017, 09:26 AM   #13
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Loving pelleke's actions for source destination editing - thanks again for posting! When monitoring with a large sample size I've been wondering about the accuracy of my selection. Does setting the punch in/out points with hotkeys during playback correspond with what I hear (i.e. the delayed audio) or do I need to preempt the delay?
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Old 09-11-2017, 10:44 AM   #14
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mhh it doesn't work any longer for some reason I don't know. Could anybody check these actions using the latest SWS installer? I haven't tried for a longer time but I think it worked before.
Set up S/D is no problem but editing doesn't work correctly. The items are not copied correctly an sometimes there is an extra track created.
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Old 09-11-2017, 11:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gass n Klang View Post
mhh it doesn't work any longer for some reason I don't know. Could anybody check these actions using the latest SWS installer? I haven't tried for a longer time but I think it worked before.
Set up S/D is no problem but editing doesn't work correctly. The items are not copied correctly an sometimes there is an extra track created.
We just finished editing a project this evening with no problems. Make sure ripple for all tracks is enabled in the destination project.
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Old 09-27-2017, 10:11 AM   #16
partitura
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Default also having problems

I'm also trying to setup these actions and having similar problems.
Reaper 5.50c (most recent)
SWS extensions - (most recent)

I can use the setup action to create the destination project with no difficulties.

However, when I try to initiate a 3 or 4 point edit from within the destination window, at the location of the time selection in the source window, it inserts a silent area the length of the time selection, and pushes all the audio further to the right on the track. Nothing at all happens in the destination window.

Very strange. If anyone has any ideas, I'd love to hear them!
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Old 09-28-2017, 12:48 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by partitura View Post
I'm also trying to setup these actions and having similar problems.
Reaper 5.50c (most recent)
SWS extensions - (most recent)

I can use the setup action to create the destination project with no difficulties.

However, when I try to initiate a 3 or 4 point edit from within the destination window, at the location of the time selection in the source window, it inserts a silent area the length of the time selection, and pushes all the audio further to the right on the track. Nothing at all happens in the destination window.

Very strange. If anyone has any ideas, I'd love to hear them!
Did you check ripple in the destination project?

The bug you describe seems to occur when the cursor in the source project is located after (or it may be during, can't remember) the selection to be edited. Not sure why it does this but it can be solved by clicking before the selection.

It's a frustrating quirk so a fix would be appreciated!
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Old 11-23-2018, 11:20 AM   #18
mjfe2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pelleke View Post
Dear mortals, I would like to announce my new custom actions I created to do Source/Destination editing.
These actions are amazing Pelleke! I added 'rewind a bit' and 'play' to the edit function so I can listen back immediately.

However, recently I've been finding the copy/paste function doesn't always work and the edit more often pastes the previously copied audio from the last edit.

When it does this I have to move the cursor within the source project, which seems to make it work again, but does anyone know why it doesn't copy first time?
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Old 02-04-2019, 08:18 AM   #19
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This source destination editing functionality is crucial for me, but unfortunately Pelleke's macros have been broken for a long time. I don't know which upgrade of Reaper or SWS did it, but this process that used to work so beautifully no longer work properly. Instead of the selected area of the source being edited into the designated area of the destination, I just end up with a hole in my source and nothing added to the destination.

I wrote to Pelleke, but he does not seem to be around anymore so I can't turn to him to see if he can fix it. Is there anyone who would be willing to look at his macros and see why they don't work anymore? I wish the Reaper development team would add this functionality to Reaper, but people have been asking for this for years and it still hasn't happened.
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Old 02-04-2019, 08:56 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FMNY View Post
This source destination editing functionality is crucial for me, but unfortunately Pelleke's macros have been broken for a long time. I don't know which upgrade of Reaper or SWS did it, but this process that used to work so beautifully no longer work properly. Instead of the selected area of the source being edited into the designated area of the destination, I just end up with a hole in my source and nothing added to the destination.

I wrote to Pelleke, but he does not seem to be around anymore so I can't turn to him to see if he can fix it. Is there anyone who would be willing to look at his macros and see why they don't work anymore? I wish the Reaper development team would add this functionality to Reaper, but people have been asking for this for years and it still hasn't happened.
Assuming you’ve turned ripple edit off in source and on in dest, this seems to be a bug that we’ve encountered too. Does it work if you move the edit cursor to within or just before your time selection within the source project? The ‘hole’ appears for us when the edit cursor ends up after the time selection though it’s not consistently a problem...
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Old 04-04-2019, 05:13 AM   #21
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Anyone else having problems with Reaper's built-in 'undo' function?

It tends to undo the entire S/D edit and often removes the time selection too, whereas I would expect the time selection to remain in place because this was a prior process.

Then when I select re-do the time selection returns but the edit is not available on the re-do list.

I think I've asked this before but does undo/redo not work 'across' multiple project tabs properly?
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Old 04-04-2019, 05:23 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjfe2 View Post
Anyone else having problems with Reaper's built-in 'undo' function?

It tends to undo the entire S/D edit and often removes the time selection too, whereas I would expect the time selection to remain in place because this was a prior process.

Then when I select re-do the time selection returns but the edit is not available on the re-do list.

I think I've asked this before but does undo/redo not work 'across' multiple project tabs properly?
Thanks to your earlier message I've got source destination editing working again. The problem for me was having to turn off ripple editing in the source. That was an unexpected solution because in the past you could have or maybe even needed to have ripple editing on in both source and destination. Once I turned ripple editing off in the source everything started working properly again.

Regarding the undo window I haven't been experiencing the problem you mention. You probably already know this, but you need to be in the destination window when you press the F10 key in order for the custom action (i.e. the edit) to show up properly in the undo window. This is also new behavior to me, because in the past the custom action went in the undo list regardless of whether you were in the source window or the destination window when you pressed F10

With those two little adjustments I've done hours of hours of source destination editing in reaper over the past weeks without any issues.
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