Old 01-17-2020, 02:48 PM   #1
Valle
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Default Waves goes SO out the window

Man … I am 50 years old, and still SO stupid. I guess we all are, more or less.

After a long time of headaches, hair pulling, and many, many naughty words shouted out in the air … I’m giving up on Waves plugins (not completely, but for the most). I have spent so much money on their plugins it hurts my morals. I still love their plugins, but man … the crash causing, the loading time and – for crying out loud – their ass paining “central” …

So, after demo’ing for some time, I spent a great deal of money on Fabfilters stuff. And I swear, the purchase process, the downloading, the installing and lastly the activation took all in all FIVE freaking minutes! That was NEVER the case with Waves whenever I bought a new plugin – it took forever, with hangs and re-installings and I don’t know what … And wherever I turned for tips, help or support, it was always “my system’s” fault …

So, one must wonder: why didn’t you try FabFilter before?

Because I am stupid as fuck!

Aaah. So there!
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Old 01-17-2020, 02:53 PM   #2
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Yes, the FabFilter stuff is, well, fab
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Old 01-17-2020, 03:26 PM   #3
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FabFilter
Voxengo
Klanghelm
StillWell (discount for Reaper owners)
Valhalla
TBProAudio

Waves are so much pain... i got three plugins from them left on my system and that's it.
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Old 01-18-2020, 07:59 AM   #4
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I have to sadly agree with you. I'm an X-Noise fanboy from way back. Love how it works and how straightforward it is.

But I work across two machines. I was tired of not having X-Noise available wherever I wanted it. I even bought two licenses, hoping to smooth it out. But Waves Central is impossible.

I ended up purchasing Brusfri, a similar noise reduction plugin. It might be a smidgen less effective than X-Noise. But it's easy to use and I have a simple DLL I can access across my machines. Life is good.

Did the same with L1, replaced it with LoudMax and I can't tell the difference.

No more Waves Central required.

I understand the whole defend-against-piracy thing. But uncomplicated ease of use is a huge factor for me. So I had to leave my Waves stuff behind.

Last edited by DarrenH; 01-19-2020 at 04:44 AM.
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Old 01-18-2020, 09:28 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by adXok View Post
FabFilter
Voxengo
Klanghelm
StillWell (discount for Reaper owners)
Valhalla
TBProAudio

Waves are so much pain... i got three plugins from them left on my system and that's it.
Good list of devs who have good stuff and use non-intrusive CP, except I have no experience with TBProAudio. Do they have an easy CP that can be activated offline? You could add ToneBoosters to this list as well...

...About 4 years ago, one $9 on-sale plugin and 10 minutes with Waves Central convinced me to completely remove all traces of their software and never have anything to do with Waves again.
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Old 01-18-2020, 10:14 AM   #6
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Well aware of many unhappy Waves Users, yet many years with Waves on Windows Desktop PC(s)/ Reaper, and all run really well. Never purchased Waves Updates, but always update Waves Central. Always run VST3 versions as recommended by Waves Support.
Shame that so many have notable issues. Many of their VST (some VSTi) plugins rank well versus industry competition __ imho.

(edit) have also had very good, live, Waves telephone Support (here in western USA)

Also toss Plugin Alliance in the mix .... using many VST quite often and they seem very effective (of course, virtually all purchased at major Promo prices / Waves as well! )

Last edited by sostenuto; 01-18-2020 at 11:01 AM.
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Old 01-18-2020, 10:58 AM   #7
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FabFilter
Voxengo
Klanghelm
StillWell (discount for Reaper owners)
Valhalla
TBProAudio

Waves are so much pain... i got three plugins from them left on my system and that's it.
Voxengo is just great...

I too dumped Waves. I'm not into cookie jar or unreasonable license schemes. I want to be able to clone or rebuild without ever having to interact with some assclown that locks their crap to a specific machine. You license software to people - not a machine.

TB rocks as well. I have Melda stuff that's pretty cool. Tokyo Dawn ...

And Fab of course...

DMG, Blue Cat... but what I found was that a lot of free stuff really does as well, if not better, than some of the paid plugins.
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Old 01-18-2020, 09:31 PM   #8
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just how stupid is "fuck" anyway?
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Old 01-18-2020, 10:36 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Valle View Post
Man … I am 50 years old, and still SO stupid. I guess we all are, more or less.

After a long time of headaches, hair pulling, and many, many naughty words shouted out in the air … I’m giving up on Waves plugins (not completely, but for the most). I have spent so much money on their plugins it hurts my morals. I still love their plugins, but man … the crash causing, the loading time and – for crying out loud – their ass paining “central” …

So, after demo’ing for some time, I spent a great deal of money on Fabfilters stuff. And I swear, the purchase process, the downloading, the installing and lastly the activation took all in all FIVE freaking minutes! That was NEVER the case with Waves whenever I bought a new plugin – it took forever, with hangs and re-installings and I don’t know what … And wherever I turned for tips, help or support, it was always “my system’s” fault …

So, one must wonder: why didn’t you try FabFilter before?

Because I am stupid as fuck!

Aaah. So there!
Yeah, I gave up on Waves also..Just hate their delivery and install procedures..They should take notes from Plugin Alliance...!
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Old 01-19-2020, 11:48 AM   #10
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I've also given up on Waves. There were a couple that I really really like, but their licensing is a nightmare.

I've got a few months left before I can try to recover my licenses again. And, I decided a long time ago that I just won't bother.

Yeah...it's my fault. But, it's so much easier to just look up a code in my email.

Unlike a lot of people, I don't really have a problem with iLok or eLicenser. I just wish there were fewer standards. But, at this point, the licensing is the thing that will flat-out remove a plug-in from consideration. There are too many options for everything to deal with that BS.
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Old 01-20-2020, 10:45 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by woogish View Post
just how stupid is "fuck" anyway?
Fair question. Perhaps as Donnie Brasco whould have round it off:

So stupid – fuggetaboutit!
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Old 01-20-2020, 01:31 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Valle View Post
Man … I am 50 years old, and still SO stupid. I guess we all are, more or less.

After a long time of headaches, hair pulling, and many, many naughty words shouted out in the air … I’m giving up on Waves plugins (not completely, but for the most). I have spent so much money on their plugins it hurts my morals. I still love their plugins, but man … the crash causing, the loading time and – for crying out loud – their ass paining “central” …

So, after demo’ing for some time, I spent a great deal of money on Fabfilters stuff. And I swear, the purchase process, the downloading, the installing and lastly the activation took all in all FIVE freaking minutes! That was NEVER the case with Waves whenever I bought a new plugin – it took forever, with hangs and re-installings and I don’t know what … And wherever I turned for tips, help or support, it was always “my system’s” fault …

So, one must wonder: why didn’t you try FabFilter before?

Because I am stupid as fuck!

Aaah. So there!
I've been using Waves since 2003 and I haven't had any issues. Makes me wonder if you can use a computer correctly or not?
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Old 01-21-2020, 09:26 AM   #13
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I have insomnia.

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I sleep fine. Are you sure you know how to use a bed?
Not sure if that was a joke or not...
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Old 01-21-2020, 10:39 AM   #14
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don't forget both iZotope and Melda, both excellent
and for tasks like noise reduction, iZotope RX7 is hard to beat...
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Old 01-21-2020, 01:00 PM   #15
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Have lots of wavs plugins - bought on sale - not recenty updated - there's a procedure to install offline older V9 plugins. It's tricky. Mayby I'll write out a protocol / procedure and post it here. Step by step. Never had a problem with Waves. Plugin Alliance. Softube. Arturia. iLok.
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Old 01-21-2020, 01:35 PM   #16
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+1 for FabFilter and many of the other companies mentioned. Also good and no-hassle are

Toneboosters (amazing bang for the buck!)
Genuine Soundware (also great bang for buck!)

currently having a great time with Apulsoft as well, but I've only been on board with them for a few weeks. Seems awesome.
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Old 01-21-2020, 01:42 PM   #17
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don't forget both iZotope and Melda, both excellent
and for tasks like noise reduction, iZotope RX7 is hard to beat...
Acon is quite good for noise reduction as well. I've used both a bit recently and in some cases, I've found Acon to work better.

I was close to going in on Waves, but managed to hold off because I can't stand the Waves Central process. Every time I see one of these threads, I'm happier I've stayed away.
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Old 01-21-2020, 06:30 PM   #18
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I don't have issues with Waves plugins or Central. Win 10 here.
What I could suggest is get the "shady" edition and use what you have purchased.

Fair use I say.
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Old 01-22-2020, 02:55 AM   #19
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Waves sucks, it's a waste of time.

There install procedure is plain a pain. Having to be connected to the internet just to use there product is beyond reasonable.
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Old 01-22-2020, 02:57 AM   #20
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I understand the whole defend-against-piracy thing. But uncomplicated ease of use is a huge factor for me. So I had to leave my Waves stuff behind.
In this age of convenience many anti-piracy efforts drove a lot of people away from using the software. I met cases where legit owners used ckracked copies because install was easier, no dongle required, and they worked way faster without crashes.
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:42 AM   #21
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I've been using Waves since 2003 and I haven't had any issues. Makes me wonder if you can use a computer correctly or not?
Nice try, kiddo!

Plus, I don't believe you.
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Old 01-22-2020, 08:44 AM   #22
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I don't have issues with Waves plugins or Central. Win 10 here.
What I could suggest is get the "shady" edition and use what you have purchased.

Fair use I say.
I'm not sure what a/the "'shady' edition" is or means ...
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Old 01-22-2020, 10:07 AM   #23
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Waves sucks, it's a waste of time.

There install procedure is plain a pain. Having to be connected to the internet just to use there product is beyond reasonable.
None of your other plugins require internet access?
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Old 01-22-2020, 12:25 PM   #24
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Waves isn't in the fame because they make a great product for home musician, they're in it because they make a product for the true professional and for live use that doesn't have real competition yet.

All the issues with registration and crashing can be almost always attributed to the environment they're run in. If you only run them in the waves rack/soundgrid systems within the environment (OS) that's accepted and certified by waves, they're rock solid.

Start changing stuff like installing OS updates or DAW updates and WAVES updates without testing them first, you do that on your own risk.

Professionals who rely on that stuff to work 24/7 don't do that stuff for production environment until the updates and changes have been tested and certified for reliability... and many don't ever need to update their software or environment since it's no connected to the internet and it's designed to do one thing and one thing only, reliably and efficiently... and they can afford to dedicate a whole computer for one task.

Fab stuff on the other hand has been built for the "consumer environment" from the get go... and it shows. They might not have stuff like waves rack that you can run in your live show with dedicated hardware and low latency, but it's really good and easy to use and manage.

Yeah... not the answer one's looking for, but nobody said that waves should be the be all end all for all the producers and musicians out there... I wonder where that myth started.
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Old 01-22-2020, 02:41 PM   #25
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For me there is quite a lot of fiction in this post
Pro Tools users over the last three years have been in the swamp so to speak more than once and their history is peppered with gremlins as are many others, none is immune. There are many plugin manufacturers today making superb vst,s not only for the elite but beginners as well.

Grinder


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Waves isn't in the fame because they make a great product for home musician, they're in it because they make a product for the true professional and for live use that doesn't have real competition yet.

All the issues with registration and crashing can be almost always attributed to the environment they're run in. If you only run them in the waves rack/soundgrid systems within the environment (OS) that's accepted and certified by waves, they're rock solid.

Start changing stuff like installing OS updates or DAW updates and WAVES updates without testing them first, you do that on your own risk.

Professionals who rely on that stuff to work 24/7 don't do that stuff for production environment until the updates and changes have been tested and certified for reliability... and many don't ever need to update their software or environment since it's no connected to the internet and it's designed to do one thing and one thing only, reliably and efficiently... and they can afford to dedicate a whole computer for one task.

Fab stuff on the other hand has been built for the "consumer environment" from the get go... and it shows. They might not have stuff like waves rack that you can run in your live show with dedicated hardware and low latency, but it's really good and easy to use and manage.

Yeah... not the answer one's looking for, but nobody said that waves should be the be all end all for all the producers and musicians out there... I wonder where that myth started.
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Old 01-23-2020, 02:37 AM   #26
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None of your other plugins require internet access?
I avoid all plugins that require internet connection in order to use them.
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Old 01-23-2020, 03:13 AM   #27
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eUFQ...ature=emb_logo

Will be perfect for Reaper
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Old 01-23-2020, 06:58 AM   #28
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I've been using Waves since 2003 and I haven't had any issues. Makes me wonder if you can use a computer correctly or not?
Likewise. Exactly!
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Old 01-23-2020, 07:29 AM   #29
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And guess what DAW he is using?
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Old 01-23-2020, 09:05 AM   #30
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I wonder where that myth started.
It's not and has never been a myth. It's called: successful marketing
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Old 01-23-2020, 11:30 AM   #31
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So I guess I opened the right thread. I have lots of waves products. Here is my dilemma.
I used to do everything from my laptop. Things were slow, everything. So recently I purchased a tower and monitor. things are fast, everything. However I still take my laptop to work and do editing on it. But, all my waves licenses are on my new tower. So when I load a project on my laptop and there is a waves plugin in the project my laptop looks for the plugins and then it crashes. Next time I boot Reaper it asks if I want to load the project that failed. I say no and Reaper opens up to a New Project. At this point no problem and I'm almost there. Once Reaper is running I open a project and load it without fx. Everything is good.
I know if the waves licenses were on my laptop everything would work fine. Here's my question:
Can anyone relate to this scenario and how would you suggest I get around the problem? I have lots of money invested in waves products and don't plan on giving up on them. and the truth is, other than loading a bit slow, I haven't had any problem with them until now.
Thanks,
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Old 01-23-2020, 12:00 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by DarrenH View Post
I ended up purchasing Brusfri...
Big fan of that plugin.
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Old 01-23-2020, 12:17 PM   #33
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Default So I guess you won't want to buy my two Waves ADB dongles??

Way back when Waves was pretty much the only game in town I bought The TDM Bundle (C1, Q1...) and later TDM Bundle II (Renaissance, PS22...) , about $5k all together. The following year I got a new computer and "downgraded" to a computer that would run the new "native" Waves plugs. I couldn't see an upgrade path on their web site so i called them on the phone and guess what? No upgrade path. At all. I'd have to spend another $5K for the plugins I had already been using for IRC about a year. But hey! We're the only game in town!
Many years later I wanted a new delay that had tempo sync (wow!) so I got involved with them again and started to encounter all the issues that I see people complaining about to this day. I have at least 4 daws and none can find the Waves 9 folder or whatever where the delay resides so I've never even used it once. They were a visionary and remarkable company when new and i really built a lot of my business around those plugs. But now? GTFO- ridiculous that I would give them the time of this post when there is an amazing world of astounding plugs out there that won't make you tear your hair out.
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Old 01-24-2020, 11:46 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icchan View Post
Waves isn't in the fame because they make a great product for home musician, they're in it because they make a product for the true professional and for live use that doesn't have real competition yet.

All the issues with registration and crashing can be almost always attributed to the environment they're run in. If you only run them in the waves rack/soundgrid systems within the environment (OS) that's accepted and certified by waves, they're rock solid.

Start changing stuff like installing OS updates or DAW updates and WAVES updates without testing them first, you do that on your own risk.

Professionals who rely on that stuff to work 24/7 don't do that stuff for production environment until the updates and changes have been tested and certified for reliability... and many don't ever need to update their software or environment since it's no connected to the internet and it's designed to do one thing and one thing only, reliably and efficiently... and they can afford to dedicate a whole computer for one task.

Fab stuff on the other hand has been built for the "consumer environment" from the get go... and it shows. They might not have stuff like waves rack that you can run in your live show with dedicated hardware and low latency, but it's really good and easy to use and manage.

Yeah... not the answer one's looking for, but nobody said that waves should be the be all end all for all the producers and musicians out there... I wonder where that myth started.
I want to call BS on that one. You're not wrong, but it's not nearly the difference it used to be.

I mean..yes, Soundgrid is pretty cool. So was Pro Tools TDM and HD and now HDX. But, the fact remains that the stuff isn't actually necessary for very many professional applications these days.

SoundGrid is another example of Waves being (kind of) the only game in town at one point in time, especially the version/products designed for Live Sound. It was the only way to get that kind of latency and performance using pro-quality plugins for a live show, unless you wanted to drag around a Pro Tools TDM/HD rig for FoH sound. It was also (AFAIK) the first to use network audio.

But, that hasn't been the case for a long time. I think it was over 10 years ago when I saw a video about Depeche Mode's engineer using Ableton Live for FoH. And, there are other professional/production-ready options for network audio (RedNet/Dante, plus open source products).

Even huge acts have a choice...The UAD stuff works at least as well as HDX and Soundgrid, and it's not particularly hard to buy/build a computer and set it up for near zero latency processing without dedicated DSP. Regardless of how you do it, if it's critical infrastructure for a big budget tour, you have at least 2 full rigs and don't screw with them when you don't have to.

And if you still want dedicated DSP and don't have that budget, it's gotten cheaper with options built into mixers from Presonus, Tascam, and a bunch of others...they don't provide emulations of specific boxes, but I've heard some damn good live sound that uses them. And, they're still more flexible than what comes on a medium format live sound console (which also generally sound pretty good). And, they're within the reach of most gigging musicians.
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Old 01-25-2020, 02:40 PM   #35
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It‘s work to manage their plugins, and it used to be a LOT harder just a year or two ago. Juggling the shells, the different versions, the installers, the management software which was a complete clusterfuck at first and the wonderfully less problematic fucking cracks, I am kind of wondering why I still like to use the plugins for a few seconds.

They work. And these days they‘re cheap too. Back when I first used them they cost an incredible amount, but there were no native versions back then.

If you have v11 plugins only, you‘re usually fine. Everything else should be approached carefully.

Fabfilter tools are not consumer products. They‘re work horses. Price has little to do with the quality of the algorithms these days.
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Old 01-25-2020, 03:39 PM   #36
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FabFilter
Voxengo
Klanghelm
StillWell (discount for Reaper owners)
Valhalla
TBProAudio

Waves are so much pain... i got three plugins from them left on my system and that's it.
Ditto for me! Plus Rea of course which are excellent too. I'd add Soundtoys which I do think are really special and I'd recommend keeping an eye out for their fairly regular sales where you can get great bargains. Also some of the P&M plugs are good and pop up on offer. I had a free Waves plug on an offer and it didn't work properly (and looked weird I recall) so I decided there are plenty of other plugs and haven't bothered with them since.
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Old 01-26-2020, 02:25 AM   #37
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(grin) So Waves continues to be Marmite.

I`m just glad I am one of the apparently lucky few who figured out how to operate the waves plugins & the shell system.

The Heart Doctor`s posts on this subject "way back when" got me there.
Once you have it all correctly installed initially & remember to do a clear/rescan when you install new waves plugs just to be on the safe side, no big deal.

FWIW I have had far more issues over the years with IK Multimedia`s products.

For those of you who are giving up, I feel for ya - especially if you spent a lot of money on them.
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Old 01-26-2020, 06:38 AM   #38
DarrenH
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the wonderfully less problematic fucking cracks

No moral issue here with someone purchasing software but using a crack, just so they don't have to futz with the copy protection or "management" layers

Last edited by DarrenH; 01-26-2020 at 06:50 AM.
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Old 01-26-2020, 07:07 AM   #39
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So I guess I opened the right thread. I have lots of waves products. Here is my dilemma.
I used to do everything from my laptop. Things were slow, everything. So recently I purchased a tower and monitor. things are fast, everything. However I still take my laptop to work and do editing on it. But, all my waves licenses are on my new tower. So when I load a project on my laptop and there is a waves plugin in the project my laptop looks for the plugins and then it crashes. Next time I boot Reaper it asks if I want to load the project that failed. I say no and Reaper opens up to a New Project. At this point no problem and I'm almost there. Once Reaper is running I open a project and load it without fx. Everything is good.
I know if the waves licenses were on my laptop everything would work fine. Here's my question:
Can anyone relate to this scenario and how would you suggest I get around the problem? I have lots of money invested in waves products and don't plan on giving up on them. and the truth is, other than loading a bit slow, I haven't had any problem with them until now.
Thanks,
I seem to be offering this advice at least once a week these days. Transfer your licences onto a dedicated usb stick. All you need is about 1gb as the licences take up very little space. Install the plugs onto both your desktop and your laptop via Waves Central then whichever machine you want to use, plug the USB drive in and reaper/waves will find and use the licence files. Been doing this on my two machines for years & since Waves Central it has become a doddle to do.

https://www.waves.com/support/move-licenses

This will help you do it.
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Old 01-26-2020, 01:33 PM   #40
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I seem to be offering this advice at least once a week these days. *************
https://www.waves.com/support/move-licenses

This will help you do it.
Soooo easy ..... do it often between (2) Win10 Pro Desktop PC /Reaper DAW(s).

Waves _ OVox Vocal ReSynthesis out and @ $70. right now. )
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