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Old 12-19-2021, 01:19 PM   #1
cemark
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Default Me too: Relab LX480 crashes Reaper

Saw that other users have reported Reaper-crashes with Relab's LX480.

I picked up the 480 Essentials dirt cheap, and it installed and loaded fine. I tried it, and it sounds wonderful. Then, I forgot all about it.

Today, I tried to use it in a project. What happens is this: It works for a couple of minutes, then the channel it's on auto-mutes. Seconds later, Reaper crashes.

I have submitted a ticket at PA.

Any other tips or tricks?

I'm on Windows 10.
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Old 12-19-2021, 03:58 PM   #2
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Me too, it can work for some time or just crash randomly in few minutes.
Win 7 here
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Old 12-19-2021, 06:59 PM   #3
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Go back to their v1.0. I had the original version, and it worked fine. It started to crash when I upgraded, so I reverted back. But I have no problems with the earlier version. Nice reverb, I wanted to be able to use it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cemark View Post
Saw that other users have reported Reaper-crashes with Relab's LX480.

I picked up the 480 Essentials dirt cheap, and it installed and loaded fine. I tried it, and it sounds wonderful. Then, I forgot all about it.

Today, I tried to use it in a project. What happens is this: It works for a couple of minutes, then the channel it's on auto-mutes. Seconds later, Reaper crashes.

I have submitted a ticket at PA.

Any other tips or tricks?

I'm on Windows 10.

Last edited by drichard; 12-20-2021 at 12:50 AM.
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Old 12-19-2021, 07:11 PM   #4
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I run windows 7 pro 64bit and it runs okay for me.
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Old 03-17-2022, 03:40 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
Go back to their v1.0. I had the original version, and it worked fine. It started to crash when I upgraded, so I reverted back. But I have no problems with the earlier version. Nice reverb, I wanted to be able to use it.
How did you go back to v1?
I only see v2 in my `downloads` area at Relab..
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Old 03-18-2022, 12:05 PM   #6
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Hmmm. I just tried it, and also only see v2 in my Downloads area. I probably already had the old version on my system and simply reinstalled. However, Relab support is quite helpful, and if you contact them they will probably make the older version available to you.

If you contact them, perhaps you could ask if a fix for this bug is coming. They should be aware of it, I sent several Emails back and forth to them when it first happened.

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How did you go back to v1?
I only see v2 in my `downloads` area at Relab..
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Old 03-18-2022, 01:24 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
Hmmm. I just tried it, and also only see v2 in my Downloads area. I probably already had the old version on my system and simply reinstalled. However, Relab support is quite helpful, and if you contact them they will probably make the older version available to you.

If you contact them, perhaps you could ask if a fix for this bug is coming. They should be aware of it, I sent several Emails back and forth to them when it first happened.
Yeah, I contacted support 2+ weeks ago regarding LX480 crashing Reaper. Never heard back, and it seems a LOT of people are having the same problem.

I`ll reach out to them again. Thx m8
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Old 03-19-2022, 12:47 AM   #8
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Same here. According to Relab Reaper is not supported
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Old 03-19-2022, 12:55 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TBProAudio View Post
Same here. According to Relab Reaper is not supported
Interesting standing point for a plugin developer...

I mean if there is one thing which is working in this world, then it's Reaper.
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Old 03-19-2022, 01:57 AM   #10
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Wouldn't a well coded VST be universal and work in all DAWs?
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Old 03-19-2022, 06:30 AM   #11
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Normally yes. Saying "Reaper is not supported" means either: "we don't test on Reaper", or: "Reaper crashes with our product, which could very well mean our product is buggy, but we don't intend to debug it".
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Old 03-19-2022, 07:24 AM   #12
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Completely weird. Their other products work fine in Reaper. I have Sonsig, VSR24, and Rev6000 and have never had a problem. And v1.0 of LX480 Essentials works fine. I still use it. Somehow they broke it with Reaper after that first version, and their failure to acknowledge the problem is frustrating.

Maybe if Reaper users bombard them with requests to fix it they will.

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Same here. According to Relab Reaper is not supported
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Old 03-19-2022, 09:20 AM   #13
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I don't think I've ever experienced a crash with LX480 Complete. But that's just me. If I were experiencing said crash though I would:

1. Try the various plugin compatibility / sandboxing settings in Reaper and see if any improve that

2. Report it to Relab - note: random crashes are the most difficult to diagnose so include as much information as possible

3. Simultaneously submit a Reaper crash log to the Reaper devs in case they can see what's causing it and resolve it on their end

Sometimes issues like that require the plugin developer to fix it, sometimes it can be fixed in the DAW, as end-users, we just know we get an occasional crash.
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Old 03-19-2022, 02:27 PM   #14
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When I was experiencing the crash with LX480 Essentials, it was quite easy to reproduce. It happened every time. As a retired software engineer I'm well aware of how difficult it is to fix random bugs, but this one should be easy.

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Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
I don't think I've ever experienced a crash with LX480 Complete. But that's just me. If I were experiencing said crash though I would:

1. Try the various plugin compatibility / sandboxing settings in Reaper and see if any improve that

2. Report it to Relab - note: random crashes are the most difficult to diagnose so include as much information as possible

3. Simultaneously submit a Reaper crash log to the Reaper devs in case they can see what's causing it and resolve it on their end

Sometimes issues like that require the plugin developer to fix it, sometimes it can be fixed in the DAW, as end-users, we just know we get an occasional crash.
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Old 03-19-2022, 11:34 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
When I was experiencing the crash with LX480 Essentials, it was quite easy to reproduce. It happened every time. As a retired software engineer I'm well aware of how difficult it is to fix random bugs, but this one should be easy.
How were you able to reproduce the crashes?

EDIT: Nevermind; I solved my problem. See my following post..

Last edited by panspOrmia; 03-20-2022 at 02:32 PM.
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Old 03-20-2022, 07:56 AM   #16
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I simply instantiated an instance of the plugin and Reaper crashed immediately. A hard crash, in which I was immediately kicked out to the OS. Reaper was vaporized. It can't get much easier to reproduce than that. V2.0 never worked in Reaper, though the AAX version worked perfectly in Pro Tools. v1.0 works fine in Reaper.

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How were you able to reproduce the crashes?

Last edited by drichard; 03-20-2022 at 08:01 AM.
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Old 03-20-2022, 08:04 AM   #17
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Is there a version 2 of essentials? It was released less than a year ago.

Working fine for me on Win 10, I'll have to check the version number tonight.
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Old 03-20-2022, 08:13 AM   #18
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There is a version 2. If you're running it and it works, great. But if you're running v1.0, make sure you still have the installation download of v1 before installing v2 in case it fails on your system, as it does on mine. v1 works perfectly here, and it sounds great. But v2 blows Reaper up instantly.

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Is there a version 2 of essentials? It was released less than a year ago.

Working fine for me on Win 10, I'll have to check the version number tonight.
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Old 03-20-2022, 08:15 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
There is a version 2. If you're running it and it works, great. But if you're running v1.0, make sure you still have the installation download of v1 before installing v2 in case it fails on your system, as it does on mine. v1 works perfectly here, and it sounds great. But v2 blows Reaper up instantly.
Thanks, I'll make sure I check my version number!
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Old 03-20-2022, 12:27 PM   #20
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About a year ago or so I demoed the complete version and liked it a lot but didn't really put it to any great test. It seemed fine then. I decided I only needed the Essential version and bought it when on sale. It worked fine for a bit and then Reaper crashed, which it NEVER does unless there's a buggy plugin in the session. I I removed LX480 and all is well in the session. Perhaps a couple of months later Reaper crashed again in a similar way when working on an older session. I forgot that I had inserted LX480 into that session and removing it was a fix. Running Win 7 64 Pro.

Clearly this is an issue for Relab.
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Old 03-20-2022, 02:33 PM   #21
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Default SOLVED! LX-480 Essentials now working in Reaper 64bit.

I`ve solved my problem with LX-480 Essentials crashing Reaper 64bit (Windows 7 Pro).

I bought JBridge (what a nifty piece of software) and `bridged` the LX-480 into a VST 2.4 (64bit) wrapped plugin. LX-480 now works without crashing Reaper! The sliders still have that annoying `lag`, but it functions and sounds great.

NOTE: Relab emailed me to say Reaper is not supported (I call bs to that). Reaper is so well-written.. it rarely (if ever!) crashes on me. I suspect LX-480 Essentials is poorly coded.

Anyhoo, I love the sound of the LX-480.. so it`s been worth the effort to get it working. Via JBridge, I also now have all my favorite 32bit plugins (Smart Electronix, arcDev, Jack Dark, K Brown, H.G. Fortune, Inear Display, etc) working in Ableton Live as well. wOOt!
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Old 03-20-2022, 02:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drichard View Post
I simply instantiated an instance of the plugin and Reaper crashed immediately. A hard crash, in which I was immediately kicked out to the OS. Reaper was vaporized. It can't get much easier to reproduce than that. V2.0 never worked in Reaper, though the AAX version worked perfectly in Pro Tools. v1.0 works fine in Reaper.
I tried that, to no avail. For me, the crashing was random.

Either way, problem now solved (for me anyway). See my previous post..
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Old 10-31-2022, 12:09 PM   #23
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I'm curious if there's any further developments about the crashing issue? There's an updated version of the LX 480 but can't tell if the Essentials version has seen any updates or fixes.
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Old 10-31-2022, 03:05 PM   #24
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I'd like to hear from anyone successfully using the full version of this plugin too. I tried an early version and loved the sound, but the random crashes it caused in Reaper rendered it unusable. It's sale price has me wondering if the issues have been fixed
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Old 10-31-2022, 11:22 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Bruceqld View Post
I'd like to hear from anyone successfully using the full version of this plugin too. I tried an early version and loved the sound, but the random crashes it caused in Reaper rendered it unusable. It's sale price has me wondering if the issues have been fixed

Both Complete V3.1.4 and V4 latest run without crashes.
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Old 11-01-2022, 08:53 AM   #26
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ReLab Essentials 2.0.0, dated April 20, 2021
Windows 11 Pro, Build 22621 - most recent
Reaper 6.69

Used last night to render my bass part of Jingle Bell Rock. Worked flawlessly.

The recording is for a "mosaic" Christmas project for work (I work in an IT consultancy). Arrangement by Paul Cook.

On a side note there are some really nifty modulations in that piece of music. It's nice to dive into something relatively simple but written by really competent folks.
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Old 12-03-2023, 09:01 PM   #27
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Default LX-480 v4 crashing REAPER - maybe solved?

I've been having this problem for ages with the Relab Development LX-480 v4 and sometimes with their Sonsig reverb as well. It has been giving me so much trouble that I usually avoid using my Relab plugins. Until now... ?

There are maybe several atypical bits about my configuration that I thought I'd share to see if maybe there's something in common with others experiencing this issue:

1. My LX-480 v4 licenses are originally from the LX-480 "Complete" (prior to the release of the v4 product). So the licenses might be slightly different than those issued to customers that bought the LX-480 v4 not as an upgrade. I don't normally have any issues with Relab seeing their licenses... but I wanted to consider this as a possibility.

2. My LX-480 v4 and Sonsig licenses have been bound to one of my physical iLOK devices. The crashes most often happened when the screen saver was running while I have stepped-away - and it seems that they happen at approximately 1hr intervals (around 1hr, 2hr or 3hr of REAPER in an idle state).

3. I run my Mac OS X with File Vault (encrypted drive) on. Maybe that's a factor as well, perhaps especially when screen is locked...? Although I do have auto-save/timed-backups turned off in REAPER.

Anyhow, I just tried moving the Relab iLOK licenses over to the computer-based iLOK licenses... and so far/so good: I am so far not seeing crashes but I need to do more testing. I will update here if this situation changes.

I wonder if the iLOK device can become inaccessible under certain circumstances when the screen is locked- or if something about the Relab Development plugins causes license checks at around 1hr intervals... ?
I also wonder if it's normal for plugins with iLOK to periodically check
for current license validity during a session - or maybe that's a Relab thing.
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Old 12-04-2023, 05:35 AM   #28
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I stopped using my LX-480. I have no time for products that act up.

Now I am on a new computer, and I might just try to install this one again. Then again, there are one or two other great sounding reverbs out there ...
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Old 12-04-2023, 07:56 AM   #29
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Default LX-480 v4 still crashing

Unfortunately the Relab plugins are still crashing REAPER... moving the iLOK licenses from the iLOK physical device to the computer did not appear to help: the crash took longer but it did happen with an idle project containing only LX-480v4 on a single track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tmart View Post
I've been having this problem for ages with the Relab Development LX-480 v4 and sometimes with their Sonsig reverb as well. It has been giving me so much trouble that I usually avoid using my Relab plugins. Until now... ?

There are maybe several atypical bits about my configuration that I thought I'd share to see if maybe there's something in common with others experiencing this issue:

1. My LX-480 v4 licenses are originally from the LX-480 "Complete" (prior to the release of the v4 product). So the licenses might be slightly different than those issued to customers that bought the LX-480 v4 not as an upgrade. I don't normally have any issues with Relab seeing their licenses... but I wanted to consider this as a possibility.

2. My LX-480 v4 and Sonsig licenses have been bound to one of my physical iLOK devices. The crashes most often happened when the screen saver was running while I have stepped-away - and it seems that they happen at approximately 1hr intervals (around 1hr, 2hr or 3hr of REAPER in an idle state).

3. I run my Mac OS X with File Vault (encrypted drive) on. Maybe that's a factor as well, perhaps especially when screen is locked...? Although I do have auto-save/timed-backups turned off in REAPER.

Anyhow, I just tried moving the Relab iLOK licenses over to the computer-based iLOK licenses... and so far/so good: I am so far not seeing crashes but I need to do more testing. I will update here if this situation changes.

I wonder if the iLOK device can become inaccessible under certain circumstances when the screen is locked- or if something about the Relab Development plugins causes license checks at around 1hr intervals... ?
I also wonder if it's normal for plugins with iLOK to periodically check
for current license validity during a session - or maybe that's a Relab thing.
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Old 12-04-2023, 11:02 AM   #30
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I saw a Youtube review of Relab 480 recently and they concluded their review saying it was unstable, I didn't notice the host they were using though since I clicked to the conclusion.

That said, the UAD Lexicon 224 is a bit for bit of the 480's predecessor and imo it sounds superb. Personally I like it way better than the Relab 480 I demoed and deleted. And the UAD stuff is all stable (I have their Signature bundle which is everything but two preamps that they offer in native).

I don't know if the UAD "Guitar player" bundle is still going, but it could be had for $49 and included the 224 and several other good plugins, to give an idea of price if you hit it right.

[edit] FWIW, I didn't experience a crash with the Relab 480, but I only used it for about 30 minutes before deleting it. I just didn't think it sounded very good compared to the UAD 224. As always, jmo, ymmv, etc, etc...

Last edited by sekim; 12-04-2023 at 11:08 AM.
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Old 12-04-2023, 06:39 PM   #31
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Default It seems Relab Development plugins just don't work, unless they do

Thanks for the update & tip. My experience is also that Relab plugins are unstable - although at least what I've found is that if you keep the REAPER project busy, then they seem to stay up. Ironically it's when the project "isn't doing anything" (I know that's not actually true) that they seem to crash. I would have likely purchased the UAD version had I not already wasted the cash elsewhere. An expensive mistake.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sekim View Post
I saw a Youtube review of Relab 480 recently and they concluded their review saying it was unstable, I didn't notice the host they were using though since I clicked to the conclusion.

That said, the UAD Lexicon 224 is a bit for bit of the 480's predecessor and imo it sounds superb. Personally I like it way better than the Relab 480 I demoed and deleted. And the UAD stuff is all stable (I have their Signature bundle which is everything but two preamps that they offer in native).

I don't know if the UAD "Guitar player" bundle is still going, but it could be had for $49 and included the 224 and several other good plugins, to give an idea of price if you hit it right.

[edit] FWIW, I didn't experience a crash with the Relab 480, but I only used it for about 30 minutes before deleting it. I just didn't think it sounded very good compared to the UAD 224. As always, jmo, ymmv, etc, etc...
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Old 12-04-2023, 07:21 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmart View Post
Thanks for the update & tip. My experience is also that Relab plugins are unstable - although at least what I've found is that if you keep the REAPER project busy, then they seem to stay up. Ironically it's when the project "isn't doing anything" (I know that's not actually true) that they seem to crash. I would have likely purchased the UAD version had I not already wasted the cash elsewhere. An expensive mistake.
A long time ago, there was an issue with some plugins at zero volume resolving bigger and bigger numbers until they crashed. I remember there was even a fixer plugin to remedy the issue by introducing noise at an undetectable level to the human ear, but present enough to keep the plugin busy with bigger numbers.

Anyway, some of the posts sound a lot like that antiquated problem of a plugin continuously resolving silence.
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Old 12-06-2023, 08:01 AM   #33
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Thanks... that might be a good lead. I can try adding some vinyl noise or something to see if it stays alive. But I'm nearly ready to give up on Relab altogether.

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A long time ago, there was an issue with some plugins at zero volume resolving bigger and bigger numbers until they crashed. I remember there was even a fixer plugin to remedy the issue by introducing noise at an undetectable level to the human ear, but present enough to keep the plugin busy with bigger numbers.

Anyway, some of the posts sound a lot like that antiquated problem of a plugin continuously resolving silence.
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Old 12-06-2023, 09:04 AM   #34
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Quote:
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Thanks... that might be a good lead. I can try adding some vinyl noise or something to see if it stays alive. But I'm nearly ready to give up on Relab altogether.
I remember now it is referred to as "denormalization", if that's what the issue with this plugin is.

It looks like someone may have coded a JS plugin to add inaudible noise to prevent the next plugin in the chain from having denormal issues.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=210572
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Old 12-19-2023, 05:28 AM   #35
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Has anyone tried the VST3 version of this. Is it now stable in Reaper?
(I have noticed Reaper is still not a recommended/compatible DAW on the Relab site!)
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Old 12-19-2023, 09:05 PM   #36
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The VST3 LX480v4 is what I was generally trying to use. It does work- and I do like the sound of it, but in my experience it will crash REAPER eventually - but usually within 1-2 hours of any project with it loaded on some track. Even if the plugin is bypassed. Remove the plugin and no crashes.

My understanding from Relab's support team is that they believe the instability is actually due to some underlying issue with iLOK. And yet I have hundreds of iLOK'ed plugins and seem to only have these issues with Relab's. If it's an iLOK issue, somehow it seems to be peculiar to how Relab has implemented iLOK: I just can't repro the problem with other plugins whose licenses are managed by iLOK.

I won't be making any further Relab purchases unless they make the products that I've already bought from them usable. Currently I just can't use them reliably.

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Has anyone tried the VST3 version of this. Is it now stable in Reaper?
(I have noticed Reaper is still not a recommended/compatible DAW on the Relab site!)
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Old 12-20-2023, 12:25 AM   #37
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Thanks tmart.
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Old 12-20-2023, 11:21 AM   #38
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Anyone that likes the Lexicon sound you could try the classic 224.
UADs 224 was made using the original 224 code.
It's in a "guitar bundle" pack with several other decent plugs for £48, including 201 Space Echo; they call it a guitar pack but it could be for anything. I picked it up for £39 on its own recently. For £9 more this is a tidy deal:

https://www.pluginboutique.com/produ...itar-FX-Bundle

Or wait until they give it away with your cornflakes!

It does mean all that malarkey with a substantial installer and iLok though.
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Old 12-20-2023, 01:35 PM   #39
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Yup -I agree. I did purchase the UAD 224 and am happy with it... it doesn't get my money back from the unusable Relab LX480, but it's a great reverb.

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Anyone that likes the Lexicon sound you could try the classic 224.
UADs 224 was made using the original 224 code.
It's in a "guitar bundle" pack with several other decent plugs for £48, including 201 Space Echo; they call it a guitar pack but it could be for anything. I picked it up for £39 on its own recently. For £9 more this is a tidy deal:

https://www.pluginboutique.com/produ...itar-FX-Bundle

Or wait until they give it away with your cornflakes!

It does mean all that malarkey with a substantial installer and iLok though.
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Old 12-20-2023, 01:38 PM   #40
tmart
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Join Date: Feb 2021
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Default Relab LX480v4 still crashing even with vinyl noise

This was a good idea to try with some noise... but sorry to say that the LX480v4 (AU on this test) still crashed REAPER.

Given that Relab has told me that iLOK issues are most likely the cause for instability, I'm guessing that there's something about a periodic license check that might be happening - and perhaps failing in a bad way. Maybe Relab just does its license check differently than other plugin vendors... and perhaps that's why I see this problem with all of the Relab Development plugins.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo View Post
I remember now it is referred to as "denormalization", if that's what the issue with this plugin is.

It looks like someone may have coded a JS plugin to add inaudible noise to prevent the next plugin in the chain from having denormal issues.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=210572
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