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03-23-2019, 09:43 AM
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#41
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stews
I don't know about this bit of gear specifically but BFD does use a mixture - most of the sounds are sampled audio recordings but some things like cymbal bleed and tom resonance are synthesised because that's more suitable to recreating those aspects of the sound realistically.
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I didn't know that. I wonder if other drum samplers use synthesis for some elements.
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
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03-23-2019, 10:53 AM
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#42
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 9,055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashcat_lt
@Glennbo - Like I said, and especially since the OP is pretty specifically wanting to use this with AD, it better play like a ****ing dream for that price!
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I used the sounds in my V-Drums only for about a year, but it was such a hassle for recording. To get the sounds out of the V-Drums and into the DAW as individual tracks, I had to run the song multiple times, for each part of the drum kit I wanted as a separate audio track. To convert the midi drums to audio tracks on a three minute song would take no less than 20 minutes to solo the midi track of kick, capture the audio, then solo the snare, then the toms, hihat, overheads, and finally room ambience. This was all to capture individual tracks of audio that isn't as good as the sounds contained in Superior Drummer.
Now compare all that with recording a track of midi from my V-Drums that has Superior Drummer 2 on it. It's *one* step. Record the midi track and I instantly have multiple audio tracks in REAPER that are higher quality that what's in the V-Drums brain, and are ready to mix down to stereo without having to run the song multiple times to get individual tracks in REAPER.
Only if I were going to use a pad controller live would I even consider using the internal sounds. For DAW I prefer to capture midi and have the luxury of using the best sounds I have available.
EDIT:
Also I have almost two grand in my V-Drums ($1500 for the kit plus four additional dual zone Roland pads) and they haven't had an audio cable plugged in ever since I've lived in my current house and I've lived here fifteen years now.
__________________
Glennbo
Hear My Music - Click Me!!!
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03-23-2019, 11:31 AM
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#43
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo
I used the sounds in my V-Drums only for about a year, but it was such a hassle for recording. To get the sounds out of the V-Drums and into the DAW as individual tracks, I had to run the song multiple times, for each part of the drum kit I wanted as a separate audio track. To convert the midi drums to audio tracks on a three minute song would take no less than 20 minutes to solo the midi track of kick, capture the audio, then solo the snare, then the toms, hihat, overheads, and finally room ambience. This was all to capture individual tracks of audio that isn't as good as the sounds contained in Superior Drummer.
Now compare all that with recording a track of midi from my V-Drums that has Superior Drummer 2 on it. It's *one* step. Record the midi track and I instantly have multiple audio tracks in REAPER that are higher quality that what's in the V-Drums brain, and are ready to mix down to stereo without having to run the song multiple times to get individual tracks in REAPER.
Only if I were going to use a pad controller live would I even consider using the internal sounds. For DAW I prefer to capture midi and have the luxury of using the best sounds I have available.
EDIT:
Also I have almost two grand in my V-Drums ($1500 for the kit plus four additional dual zone Roland pads) and they haven't had an audio cable plugged in ever since I've lived in my current house and I've lived here fifteen years now.
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Wouldn't it be nice...
Something like a raspberry pi with plenty of i/o to use as standalone low latency drum module. Then what is recorded gets piped into the main daw (using the same drum software) for editing and mixing.
__________________
It's time to take a stand against the synthesizer.
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03-23-2019, 11:44 AM
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#44
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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That is how I hope to use the Handsonic
Money yes a big heap but if it is a tactile surface and cruisy to play,
well that will be worth it.
I use my early Roland keyboard at the moment I think it should be a step up from that. The layout is looking good to me. At the end of it money is not
the point it is for me whether it will satisfy me as I play if I have made a mistake I will find out soon enough.
I am on a limited income so I know the value of a dollar that said
most of my spending is calculated and very little of it has ever been off the mark. I have superior 2 and BFD3, percussion as well.
Might be a marriage made in Heaven.
Grinder
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03-23-2019, 12:21 PM
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#45
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,271
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I was running my drum triggers through my D4 and sending MIDI to Reaper through my interface and triggering Superior Drummer, but I wanted to save a space in my live rack, so I switched to just running the triggers themselves to spare line inputs and using the JS trigger plugin instead.
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03-23-2019, 01:36 PM
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#46
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 3,201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo
I used the sounds in my V-Drums only for about a year, but it was such a hassle for recording. To get the sounds out of the V-Drums and into the DAW as individual tracks, I had to run the song multiple times, for each part of the drum kit I wanted as a separate audio track. To convert the midi drums to audio tracks on a three minute song would take no less than 20 minutes to solo the midi track of kick, capture the audio, then solo the snare, then the toms, hihat, overheads, and finally room ambience. This was all to capture individual tracks of audio that isn't as good as the sounds contained in Superior Drummer.
Now compare all that with recording a track of midi from my V-Drums that has Superior Drummer 2 on it. It's *one* step. Record the midi track and I instantly have multiple audio tracks in REAPER that are higher quality that what's in the V-Drums brain, and are ready to mix down to stereo without having to run the song multiple times to get individual tracks in REAPER.
Only if I were going to use a pad controller live would I even consider using the internal sounds. For DAW I prefer to capture midi and have the luxury of using the best sounds I have available.
EDIT:
Also I have almost two grand in my V-Drums ($1500 for the kit plus four additional dual zone Roland pads) and they haven't had an audio cable plugged in ever since I've lived in my current house and I've lived here fifteen years now.
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I did have occasoinal problems with the drum mix, especially overloud cymbals. I worked around it by recording the midi on a separate track from the original audio, then loading a track template that would split the midi into individual tracks for each drum instrument, and using a velocity scaling plugin with controls showing in the mixer, on each track, to allow remixing the kit. Once the mix was set, I could route the midi back to the kit and record the audio. Or sometimes route it to SMDrums or various other VSTi drums.
This ended up being a temporary thing. Now that the drum setup is tweaked I don't use it much any more. But I still record the midi along with the audio as a safety backup.
It would be awesome if the Vdrums had separate mono audio outputs, one for each instrument (one each for hat & kick, plus 2 per cymbal, 2 per tom & snare, etc.), for the different hit zones on each. It would simplify stuff a bunch, at the expense of using a crapload of interface inputs. Just like micing up a kit
Last edited by Philbo King; 03-23-2019 at 01:47 PM.
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03-23-2019, 04:32 PM
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#47
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 9,055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainwreck
Wouldn't it be nice...
Something like a raspberry pi with plenty of i/o to use as standalone low latency drum module. Then what is recorded gets piped into the main daw (using the same drum software) for editing and mixing.
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I've got REAPER and Pianoteq running on my Pi, and with a small USB audio and midi interface like a Presonus AudioBox it could make a great portable rig for modeled or synthesized instruments, but because a Raspberry Pi has only 1GB of RAM, sampled instruments would have to be small, like soundfonts or something.
__________________
Glennbo
Hear My Music - Click Me!!!
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03-23-2019, 04:44 PM
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#48
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 9,055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philbo King
I did have occasoinal problems with the drum mix, especially overloud cymbals. I worked around it by recording the midi on a separate track from the original audio, then loading a track template that would split the midi into individual tracks for each drum instrument, and using a velocity scaling plugin with controls showing in the mixer, on each track, to allow remixing the kit. Once the mix was set, I could route the midi back to the kit and record the audio. Or sometimes route it to SMDrums or various other VSTi drums.
This ended up being a temporary thing. Now that the drum setup is tweaked I don't use it much any more. But I still record the midi along with the audio as a safety backup.
It would be awesome if the Vdrums had separate mono audio outputs, one for each instrument (one each for hat & kick, plus 2 per cymbal, 2 per tom & snare, etc.), for the different hit zones on each. It would simplify stuff a bunch, at the expense of using a crapload of interface inputs. Just like micing up a kit
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If my V-Drums had individual outputs I might have used the internal sounds longer, but once I bought EZ-Drummer and saw how well it's implementation was for tracking the V-Drums, it was all over. Then Superior Drummer 2 came out with even better tracking of things like hihat control, choking cymbals, and even foot splashes on the hihat where you pop the pedal, causing the cymbals to clap together then separate much like orchestral cymbals. On top of that, Superior Drummer's library of sounds were so much better sounding than the V-Drums built in sounds, I never looked back and record only midi when I do use my pad drums.
For the last year or so I've been using real drums again and perfecting the mic'ing technique using four mics. I've actually been considering selling my V-Drums and taking back the space they consume in my studio since I haven't been using them. I have a desktop Akai pad controller I could still use if I need pads.
__________________
Glennbo
Hear My Music - Click Me!!!
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03-24-2019, 07:06 AM
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#49
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo
I've got REAPER and Pianoteq running on my Pi, and with a small USB audio and midi interface like a Presonus AudioBox it could make a great portable rig for modeled or synthesized instruments, but because a Raspberry Pi has only 1GB of RAM, sampled instruments would have to be small, like soundfonts or something.
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Wow a raspberry pi can run pianoteq? What kind of latency?
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03-24-2019, 09:24 AM
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#50
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 9,055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stews
Wow a raspberry pi can run pianoteq? What kind of latency?
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I've only messed around with it using JACK audio with the onboard sound which sounds freeking great and is playable, but very laggy.
That said, you can plug in a class compliant USB audio device into a Raspberry Pi, and get low enough latency to play through it live or do studio audio production.
__________________
Glennbo
Hear My Music - Click Me!!!
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03-24-2019, 10:50 AM
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#51
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 20,859
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo
I've only messed around with it using JACK audio with the onboard sound which sounds freeking great and is playable, but very laggy.
That said, you can plug in a class compliant USB audio device into a Raspberry Pi, and get low enough latency to play through it live or do studio audio production.
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Is that something to do with audio latency for the raspberry pi with linux in general?
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03-24-2019, 12:58 PM
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#52
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Planet Earth
Posts: 9,055
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brainwreck
Is that something to do with audio latency for the raspberry pi with linux in general?
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Using the on-board sound from the Raspberry Pi is pretty much like using the on-board sound from an Asus motherboard. The best you'll get will be high latency even using JACK or ASIO4ALL.
But in both cases, connecting up a class compliant USB audio interface will drop the latency to what the USB device can process.
Pianoteq has a doc about tweaking the Linux on a Pi to get the lowest latency possible, and it's the very same tweaks I did on my DAW, swapping out the kernel to a low latency one, increasing the user privileges for setting higher priorities, and unlimited memory use. At some point I plan to pop for a cheap 2 channel USB interface with midi ports, I just haven't done it yet. Been blowing money on plugins and other stuff.
Oh, and to get back on topic, I did plug my Akai MPD26 into the Raspberry Pi, it was recognized and functioned right away. Then I plugged my M-Audio Keystation midi out into the Akai's midi in, and was playing Pianoteq in REAPER from my keyboard through a desktop drum pad controller.
__________________
Glennbo
Hear My Music - Click Me!!!
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03-24-2019, 04:28 PM
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#53
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,392
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Was playing with my son's toy today which is kind of like a bongo drum but when you hit certain parts of it it plays different sounds.
Was good fun - made me think "I bet that Roland thing they were talking about on the Reaper forum would be great fun"
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03-25-2019, 09:06 PM
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#54
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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Well
I think myself and the Roland Handsonic 20 are going to create quite well indeed
Good Choice? I would say the choice.
Ergonomics lead to pleasure for the hands and spirit.
Ability to try different things by feel.
Fits into BFD3 like a glove
Or should I say BFD3 sends out it's midi learn and catches the unit in
the palm of it's electronic tentacles.
Yes a lot of money for most of us however the type of arrangements I can make with this and like to make are right in this domain.
I will take a bit of time to really get to terms with this but really pleased I have it.
Thanks to those who bolstered my reasoning
And also those who perhaps realized that yes you can go broke over gear
like this!
Bravery Bravery and very happy indeed.
Grinder
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03-26-2019, 05:28 AM
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#55
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinder
Well
I think myself and the Roland Handsonic 20 are going to create quite well indeed
Good Choice? I would say the choice.
Ergonomics lead to pleasure for the hands and spirit.
Ability to try different things by feel.
Fits into BFD3 like a glove
Or should I say BFD3 sends out it's midi learn and catches the unit in
the palm of it's electronic tentacles.
Yes a lot of money for most of us however the type of arrangements I can make with this and like to make are right in this domain.
I will take a bit of time to really get to terms with this but really pleased I have it.
Thanks to those who bolstered my reasoning
And also those who perhaps realized that yes you can go broke over gear
like this!
Bravery Bravery and very happy indeed.
Grinder
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If you want something and can afford it you just have to pay what it costs.
Hope you have a great time with it!
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03-26-2019, 10:54 AM
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#56
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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Thanks stews yes this will make my life easier
lot less time patching a drum track together just
that alone is worth the purchase.
Grinder
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04-24-2019, 01:55 AM
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#57
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 2,905
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Just thought I would write a very small review on the Roland Handsonic 20
I am very happy with this unit even the basic midi trigger role.
This unit is so easy to use, change the drums in the software of your choice andthe Handsonic triggers them.
The unit opens me up to play what I want and freely.
I have more vibe in my production.
This is a step forward and up for me.
Grinder
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