VST for edrums (live) Best value/reliability

[bd32]

I'm considering using my DIY pads going through an EDRUMin pad to midi interface for live playing. I've looked at some of the drum VST's and many seem quite expensive for my resources. Currently I'm using SSD5 free version going through Reaper and it works pretty well although it's just offering a small group of snares etc per kit. I'd just need some more kits and also need percussion like congas, bongos, cowbells, timbales etc.I don't need any "midi grooves" etc just the sounds for edrums live playing. I've read that one can go through an Ipad? Would I be able to get away with just that or would I need a separate sound card. I just use 1 or 2 channels in the PA. Currently I have a fairly powerful laptop and a Focusrite external sound card. Thanks

[Pink Wool]

Addictive drums 2 - if you get them on sale!

My friend bought the "custom 3 kits of choice" package for around 100 eur. They also have a nice percussion kit with lots of different flavours!

https://www.xlnaudio.com/products/ad...ion_percussion

[bd32]

Originally Posted by Pink Wool

Addictive drums 2 - if you get them on sale!

My friend bought the "custom 3 kits of choice" package for around 100 eur. They also have a nice percussion kit with lots of different flavours!

https://www.xlnaudio.com/products/ad...ion_percussion

Good to know but I'd still need to buy a well equipped regular drum setup as well so that would run quite a bit more,right? I think you have to already have Addictive Drums 2 to use the percussion ones. Thanks

[masonsjax]

I got an email this week promoting a rent-to-own sale on SSD. It's tempting. I'm a fan of the free version as well.
https://stevenslatedrums.com/ssd5/

[bd32]

Originally Posted by masonsjax

I got an email this week promoting a rent-to-own sale on SSD. It's tempting. I'm a fan of the free version as well.
https://stevenslatedrums.com/ssd5/

Yes, I got one too. I'm trying to figure out what the main difference is between this and Superior Drummer, BFD and Addictive Drums. Those are very expensive for not that many kits. Are they that much better or do they have options that SSD doesn't?

[Pink Wool]

Originally Posted by bd32

Good to know but I'd still need to buy a well equipped regular drum setup as well so that would run quite a bit more,right? I think you have to already have Addictive Drums 2 to use the percussion ones. Thanks

Each kit will work seperately (meaning; on their own). They contain the whole "sample library" as well as the "sampler". No need to buy something extra! You can even get one kit now and the rest later, if you buy the pack!

[MST]

All to different, and personal taste makes uncertainty endless..

My take is,, drum presets often are geared to soft, or hard playing, so bad dynamics with the samples, and the toms,, almost always ugly for many reasons, seldom beautiful deep like I love them, and the cymbals,, tend to act as unwanted noise in the background, the crashes muh,, and the magical interactive singing of metal,, not there!

Not naming brands, cause my most hated sound might be the most loved by others.
That being said, I was enthusiastically hitting everything around me for a while on Addictive Drums, cheap and effective, dangerously Addictive.

But my dreams where fulfilled with Superior Drummer, really natural beautiful stuff, but,, heavy in price and on you're system.
After that I stopped looking.

[LugNut]

Hi,

I would look for a deal on used superior drummer 2 with some expansions.
Especially progressive sdx and evil drums and/or music city. Other sdx expansions don't know what a real rim shot is:-)
Good for all genres , extremely reliable, and sounds/plays like real drums.
Believe me, I know.
Now the amount of pa and monitoring speakers, that's the crux of live edrumming.

The rim shot issue is that in many older sdxs when you hit the rim of the snare
you get a dixieland type of rim shot. And when you hit the center of the snare hard you get the real rim shot. You can do some midi tricks within sd2 to fix the issue, but its a pain. There are some ezdrummer exp that are also good such as funk drummer. Clyde stubbefield and Jabo.

Gl

Edit..ssd5 is also good..I play it on an ekit at rehearsals at my keyboard mans house...responds really well. Sounds good.

[bd32]

Good to read these comments. I guess how much of a load the VST puts on the laptop is a factor I hadn't thought about. I only tried using a laptop and VST a few times, years ago, when something went wrong on a gig and I couldn't get it working in time. I didn't try it again after that. So if one of these uses a lot more pc power than the others it would be good know. Thanks.

[LugNut]

Hi,
I saw your post at vdrum forum.
What are the specs of the laptop? I believe you have an rme interface?
Superior 2 will run on lower spec computers than some of the newer vsts.
The audio front box looks very cool. I have his older software. He's a very smart guy.
A dedicated drum module is always going to be more reliable, but the sounds aren't as good as vsts.
Do you already gig with edrums?

[bd32]

Originally Posted by LugNut

Hi,
I saw your post at vdrum forum.
What are the specs of the laptop? I believe you have an rme interface?
Superior 2 will run on lower spec computers than some of the newer vsts.
The audio front box looks very cool. I have his older software. He's a very smart guy.
A dedicated drum module is always going to be more reliable, but the sounds aren't as good as vsts.
Do you already gig with edrums?

No live playing these pandemic days. I used an RME Multiface years ago and had quite a few problems with it's built in obsolescence. It started as PCMCIA, then I had to get a huge express card adapter and then there was no way to convert it to USB. Regardless, it broke anyway. So I'm using a Focusrite 6i6 now. Laptop is i7, 250ghz, 16GB Ram, Win10-Home. I think it can handle a fair amount. I won't do much individual tweaking.Not so up on that. I don't need a zillion kits but I'd like a good choice among drums for a few kits, a quality percussion section.
Maybe this is a little off the initial topic, but not completely. Is anyone playing live with edrums going through edrumin into only an iPad and then into the mixer or do you have to have an external multi-track sound card. I only need 1 or at most 2 channels in a live situation.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by Pink Wool

Each kit will work seperately (meaning; on their own). They contain the whole "sample library" as well as the "sampler". No need to buy something extra! You can even get one kit now and the rest later, if you buy the pack!

It seems their Custom set says:
Your choice of 3 drum kits
+ additional content
$169.95
So, maybe that means you could get two regular kits and this latin percussion for 170? I'll have to check about that. You sure get a lot more kits with SSD for $120 but I'm reading about people being hesitant about the iLok protection. Maybe that's common to most of them? Oops...now I see Addictive Drums chooses three regular kits for you, no choice in it.

[LugNut]

Hi,

As far as iPad as sound source, it more roll your own as far as drum kits. I have beat maker 3 which is an awesome sampler/daw. Up to 127 velocity layers, no round robin. Bring your own samples.
Drum perfect pro...I have it...the included drums aren't that good, but it has round robin...multiple velocity layers but doesn't shine unless you use your own samples.
As far as audio interface or not, you could go out your headphone jack, if your iPad has one.
I use an I connectivity audio4+. Works great with an 8 gen iPad.

GL

Edit..forgot to include audio layer....a sampler that can read exs and sfz files. Don't have it yet.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by LugNut

Hi,

As far as iPad as sound source, it more roll your own as far as drum kits. I have beat maker 3 which is an awesome sampler/daw. Up to 127 velocity layers, no round robin. Bring your own samples.
Drum perfect pro...I have it...the included drums aren't that good, but it has round robin...multiple velocity layers but doesn't shine unless you use your own samples.
As far as audio interface or not, you could go out your headphone jack, if your iPad has one.
I use an I connectivity audio4+. Works great with an 8 gen iPad.

GL

Edit..forgot to include audio layer....a sampler that can read exs and sfz files. Don't have it yet.

Good to have that perspective. I don't have mac stuff but I guess a lot of musicians do. I checked out the programs you mentioned.Just looking for quality but mainly am wary about any possibility of crashing or delays live.One review on Drum Perect Pro complained about crashing but they replied saying they would be updating it. That was in 2020. Thanks

[LugNut]

Hi,
When it comes to sampler reliability on iOS, its beat maker 3 imho. Never had a crash using it as a sampler.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by LugNut

Hi,
When it comes to sampler reliability on iOS, its beat maker 3 imho. Never had a crash using it as a sampler.

Reliability is a big one. I'm still all PC and Android in what I have but I wondered about a portable solution.Thanks.

[mschnell]

You can't beat Drummica, as it's super high quality and free

-Michael

[Pink Wool]

Originally Posted by bd32

It seems their Custom set says:
Your choice of 3 drum kits
+ additional content
$169.95
So, maybe that means you could get two regular kits and this latin percussion for 170? I'll have to check about that. You sure get a lot more kits with SSD for $120 but I'm reading about people being hesitant about the iLok protection. Maybe that's common to most of them? Oops...now I see Addictive Drums chooses three regular kits for you, no choice in it.

I don't know where you're getting the "chooses kits for you"? From their website:

"Select any 3 ADpaks, any 3 MIDIpaks and any 3 Kitpiece Paks to build a drum library that is just right for you! There is no need to choose all your content at once. Pick what you like now and come back for the rest when you're ready."

https://www.xlnaudio.com/products/ad...drums_2_custom

You most certainly HAVE TO choose the kits yourself!

[LugNut]

Hi,
Op I thought you already had an iPad. Frankly, I wouldn't trust any computer based system w/o a backup for a paying gig. At least a hardware module as backup.
I use my iPad setup in a hybrid kit with a Yamaha multi 12. So if the iPad goes then its just the multi pad, and if that goes I still have my acoustics.
IMHO your laptop would be good with some decent software.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by Pink Wool

I don't know where you're getting the "chooses kits for you"? From their website:

"Select any 3 ADpaks, any 3 MIDIpaks and any 3 Kitpiece Paks to build a drum library that is just right for you! There is no need to choose all your content at once. Pick what you like now and come back for the rest when you're ready."

https://www.xlnaudio.com/products/ad...drums_2_custom

You most certainly HAVE TO choose the kits yourself!

Aha! I was looking at
https://www.xlnaudio.com/products/ad...ictive_drums_2
but didn't notice the other offers. Thanks for pointing that out!

[bd32]

Originally Posted by LugNut

Hi,
Op I thought you already had an iPad. Frankly, I wouldn't trust any computer based system w/o a backup for a paying gig. At least a hardware module as backup.
I use my iPad setup in a hybrid kit with a Yamaha multi 12. So if the iPad goes then its just the multi pad, and if that goes I still have my acoustics.
IMHO your laptop would be good with some decent software.

I take your point. Just the other night I tried to get SSD and/or Battery going through Reaper. I had a rewarding session with those two the night before.I spent a long time trying to trigger sounds without being able to hear anything. I finally was in the midi options and started clearing out what looked like multiple entries for the sound card midi, edrumin, keyboard midi etc. I was just kind of guessing to be honest. Some that I got rid of had !!!NA Enabled. Anyway by doing that I finally was able to hear sounds. That wouldn't do in a live situation. Even though I've tried to figure it out I'm still pretty much at beginner level as far as midi goes. I think it's like math for me,it just doesn't come intuitively. I haven't tried the stand alone drum apps yet, I've just gone through Reaper as VST's. Maybe that will be the safest way to go. Thanks.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by mschnell

You can't beat Drummica, as it's super high quality and free

-Michael

I'll have to keep working at getting that set up. Thanks

[mschnell]

What is the problem ?

-Michael

[bd32]

Originally Posted by mschnell

What is the problem ?

-Michael

Thanks for the question. Tonight I went to the "Native Access" app. It said there were 13 "not installed" Kontakt 6 player was among them. I thought I had installed it earlier but I reinstalled. It says it downloaded 588 mb and said it was installing, then said it was installed. I then looked for it in the start menu and in Reaper VST area. Nothing. I then went back to "Native Access" app. It again listed it as not installed. I thought I'd not finished it or something so said install it again. Again it said it downloaded 588mb. It said it installed it. I looked again and found nothing. I then looked once more at "Native Access" app and it showed it as "not installed". I looked in programs that can be uninstalled in Win10 and not a trace.?

After I posted this I did some more reading and came across this. https://www.native-instruments.com/f...access.436681/
Not usually doing things like this much but I guess I'll study it a bit and maybe give it a try later. I seem to have plenty of space on the C drive. It sure seems like a strange way to install and not even a hint of a problem in the install like an error message....
I tried grabbing the install folder from download and got it. When I ran the setup it went all the way but showed "failed" at the end.

[mschnell]

Sorry, but no idea on that. Supposedly you need to ask NI.
-Michael

[ivansc]

Originally Posted by bd32

I'll have to keep working at getting that set up. Thanks

Interesting... I thought it stopped being free when N.I. stopped allowing you to get the "upgrade" deal to full-on Kontakt once you had it.
If it really is still free and is still a proper library, it`ll work 100% in Kontakt player.

Re Superior Drummer, I would recommend SD3 as it cones with a massive amount of drum samples.
You don`t have to use all of them, but it does offer you a vast variety of playability & realistic behaviour.
On the other hand, so does EZDrummer 2! Take that for a test drive & see what you think.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by mschnell

Sorry, but no idea on that. Supposedly you need to ask NI.
-Michael

Well, glad others got it going!

[bd32]

Originally Posted by ivansc

Interesting... I thought it stopped being free when N.I. stopped allowing you to get the "upgrade" deal to full-on Kontakt once you had it.
If it really is still free and is still a proper library, it`ll work 100% in Kontakt player.

ERe Superior Drummer, I would recommend SD3 as it cones with a massive amount of drum samples.
You don`t have tu use all of them, but it doesx offer you a vast variety of playability & realistic behaviour.
On the other hand, so does EZDrummer 2! Take that for a test drive & see what you think.

My problem with Drummica was I couldn't install Kontakt Player. So I never got further than that.

[ivansc]

Sorry - only just noticed you dilemma with Kontakt player installation!

If I were you , I would cut to the chase. Uninstall/delete everything you already have, preferably using an uninstaller like the IoBit free Uninstaller.
Same for Native access, then download Native Access again & install it.

Once you have Native Access installed, go back to N.I. and re-download the Kontakt 6 Player version. Once this is installed, you should find everything is working OK.
How do I know this? For the hell of it, I just uninstalled MY Native Access & did a full reinstall with no issues.

Just to make one thing 100% clear. YOU have to make sure that what you order in terms of the Kontakt version is indeed the player. If you put in just Kontakt 6 it will assume you are buying the full program.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by ivansc

Sorry - only just noticed you dilemma with Kontakt player installation!

If I were you , I would cut to the chase. Uninstall/delete everything you already have, preferably using an uninstaller like the IoBit free Uninstaller.
Same for Native access, then download Native Access again & install it.

Once you have Native Access installed, go back to N.I. and re-download the Kontakt 6 Player version. Once this is installed, you should find everything is working OK.
How do I know this? For the hell of it, I just uninstalled MY Native Access & did a full reinstall with no issues.

Just to make one thing 100% clear. YOU have to make sure that what you order in terms of the Kontakt version is indeed the player. If you put in just Kontakt 6 it will assume you are buying the full program.

Appreciate the tip. I'm trying that uninstaller. I tried it on Native Access. It seemed to uninstall it although it balked for a minute as it said it couldn't find some temp file. I just went ahead. Now I'll see if any progress was made. Thanks.

[bd32]

Originally Posted by bd32

Appreciate the tip. I'm trying that uninstaller. I tried it on Native Access. It seemed to uninstall it although it balked for a minute as it said it couldn't find some temp file. I just went ahead. Now I'll see if any progress was made. Thanks.

After using IoBit free to uninstall I couldn't reinstall Native Access. It just said it failed and "false" and to check my settings. No hint past that. I did a screen grab as I was trying the install a 2nd time. Just a wild guess if it's something to do with this? Also, I uninstalled IoBit free as it was too intrusive outside of uninstallation functions. Thanks.
PS Had further problems with this.After that uninstall Battery didn't show up in my vst selections in Reaper. Neither did SSD5 free. I got SSD5 back by doing an update. I still have standalone Battery but haven't figured out any way to get Battery VST back in Reaper. Native Instruments continues to be impossible for me to do anything with on the web. I thought about reinstalling Battery. I found what was supposed to be the download link but never came close to getting the install files downloaded.