Old 05-22-2019, 01:53 PM   #1
Coachz
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Default Roland Legacy Synths patches change

I was over a friends house and he has the Roland legacy keyboard vstis and he was saying that the patches keep changing. He has multiple instances of these in a project and he showed me that after restarting the project or freezing these tracks and opening them, the synths show the right patches but they play the wrong ones and double clicking on the patch fixes it.

Needless to say his mixes are being heavily screwed up. I told him I'd see if you guys had any ideas. We tried sending program changes but they don't seem to accept them.

Last edited by Coachz; 05-22-2019 at 03:00 PM.
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:40 PM   #2
Glennbo
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If the patches always revert to whatever the default patch is, it might be one the reset options on the midi device setup page in REAPER.
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Old 05-22-2019, 03:57 PM   #3
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Here?

https://www.bing.com/images/search?v...3,4,6,8&sim=11
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Old 05-22-2019, 04:46 PM   #4
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Yeah. Seems like the zeroing of CC data caused me problems with some actual Roland hardware, so the midi scheme may be similar in the plugin versions.

If the patches are not reverting to their default then it may be something else like one of the midi data cross-talk issues that some folks see when they have multiple tracks in a record ready state.
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Old 05-23-2019, 03:59 AM   #5
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We tried disabling Midi Devices / Reset on Play but no luck. Then we tried disabling the 3 settings for Audio/Playback Reset Midi CC/Pitch: playback start, playback stop and playback loop/skip but no luck. What in the world can be causing this ? There are no controllers loaded either fyi.

We also tried disabling Plug-ins/VST: "don't flush synthesizer plug-ins on stop/rest" and "don't send note-offs or pitch reset messages on stop/reset"

The plugins are being reset to the first patch.

Last edited by Coachz; 05-23-2019 at 04:30 AM.
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Old 05-23-2019, 04:34 AM   #6
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Have you checked the Event List (of course you have!), but look for rogue resets of PC changes. Also, look out for maybe a rogue channel lurking in the data stream as well. Maybe export one of the midi tracks and post it here for us to peek at? Ruling the file out is a good first step, eh?

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Old 05-23-2019, 05:01 AM   #7
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My midi file is just a few notes I played in as a test so it's not much but is attached. The eventlist was uneventful. :-(

Attached Files
File Type: mid test.MID (145 Bytes, 13 views)
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Old 05-23-2019, 06:53 AM   #8
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Clearly NOT the midi file!

I am assuming you have tried disabling all the other "reset" options ..

Particularly Reset by : "all notes off" ???

dB
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Old 05-23-2019, 08:05 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bob View Post
Clearly NOT the midi file!

I am assuming you have tried disabling all the other "reset" options ..

Particularly Reset by : "all notes off" ???

dB
Yes, I tried disabling all the resets. More reasons for me to hate midi. :-)
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Old 05-23-2019, 08:30 AM   #10
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In prefs audio/playback have you fiddled with the midi related items there?

dB
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Old 05-23-2019, 08:36 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bob View Post
In prefs audio/playback have you fiddled with the midi related items there?

dB
sadly yes.....
https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...01&postcount=5
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Old 05-23-2019, 11:15 AM   #12
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Just a thought as it's hiding in the "audio" section …

Nothing in the Roland setup? Any weird .ini file around for it you might be able to hack?

What a PITA!

dB
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Old 05-23-2019, 12:14 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bob View Post
Just a thought as it's hiding in the "audio" section …

Nothing in the Roland setup? Any weird .ini file around for it you might be able to hack?

What a PITA!

dB
Nope. Their setup doesnt have anything of use. So weird that they reset to the 1st patch every time Reper loads. Really a great way to hose a mix making them useless.
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Old 05-23-2019, 01:44 PM   #14
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I guess the only way out is to replace the Roland stuff with something else. Being an old user of the hardware - sc55, sc7, sc88 etc - I know there's that Roland sound which some like.

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Old 05-23-2019, 02:33 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachz View Post
My midi file is just a few notes I played in as a test so it's not much but is attached. The eventlist was uneventful. :-(
What happens if you embed a patch change in your midi data, will the Roland stuff respond to that? I remember when I used a Roland SC880 dual Sound Canvas that I always used program change messages in my data. I'd have them fire off in the first frame before any note data.
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Old 05-23-2019, 03:01 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennbo View Post
What happens if you embed a patch change in your midi data, will the Roland stuff respond to that? I remember when I used a Roland SC880 dual Sound Canvas that I always used program change messages in my data. I'd have them fire off in the first frame before any note data.
No response though the other synth vstis change patches just fine with the program change in the midi data.
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Old 05-24-2019, 02:10 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Bob View Post
I guess the only way out is to replace the Roland stuff with something else. Being an old user of the hardware - sc55, sc7, sc88 etc - I know there's that Roland sound which some like.

dB
Or treat them more like real synths and freeze them before closing the project and never unfreeze them.

As a workaround, could you save the patches as presets and then recall them if you need to refreeze?
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Old 05-24-2019, 04:08 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Judders View Post
Or treat them more like real synths and freeze them before closing the project and never unfreeze them.

As a workaround, could you save the patches as presets and then recall them if you need to refreeze?
The permanent freeze seems to be the only option atm or get rid of them which I think is a better option. The synths highlight the correct patch when you go into the browser so that's no problem reselecting it but they just play the 1st patch. It's just so wierd.
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Old 05-24-2019, 04:20 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coachz View Post
The permanent freeze seems to be the only option atm or get rid of them which I think is a better option. The synths highlight the correct patch when you go into the browser so that's no problem reselecting it but they just play the 1st patch. It's just so wierd.
Have you sent a support ticket?
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Old 05-24-2019, 04:21 AM   #20
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Are you using vst3 by chance? Try using vst2 or if using 2 try 3 and see if that helps.
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Old 05-24-2019, 05:38 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Brown View Post
Are you using vst3 by chance? Try using vst2 or if using 2 try 3 and see if that helps.
holy crap. That fixed it. Back to VST2 !!! To the front of the class for you and thanks to everyone who helped !!


Last edited by Coachz; 05-24-2019 at 07:16 AM.
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Old 05-24-2019, 12:32 PM   #22
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Great to know it's solved … vst3 as been a source of a lot of issues!

dB
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Old 05-24-2019, 12:44 PM   #23
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Quote:
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Great to know it's solved … vst3 as been a source of a lot of issues!

dB
And I thought VST3 was the hot thing ! Go figure.

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Old 05-24-2019, 04:28 PM   #24
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Glad we could help.
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