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Old 09-27-2022, 12:41 PM   #1
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Default v6.68+dev0927 - September 27 2022

v6.68+dev0927 - September 27 2022
  • * Includes feature branch: razor edits on master track envelopes
  • * Includes feature branch: selected media item appearance changes
  • * Includes feature branch: track grouping manager dialog
  • * Includes feature branch: CLAP plugin support
  • * Includes feature branch: track media/razor edit grouping
  • * Includes feature branch: improve experimental silent-track CPU reduction option to include FX tail length
  • * Includes feature branch: media item fixed lanes
  • * Includes feature branch: internal pin management overhaul for future extension
  • + API: add support for GetSetProjectInfo_String("RENDER_TARGETS_EX"), which returns the list double-null separated ("RENDER_TARGETS" is semicolon-separated)
  • + MIDI: fix retroactive record incorrect start time [t=270558]
  • + Notation editor: fix caption for "Enter Text" dialog
  • + Parent send: allow arbitrary channel counts for master/parent send
  • + Render: support rendering stems pre-fader from render dialog
  • # Razor edits: fix save/load and undo/redo when using razor edits on master track
This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode
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Old 09-27-2022, 12:47 PM   #2
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+ Parent send: allow arbitrary channel counts for master/parent send

Wow! That's super useful for both parent and sends. Very configurable!
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Old 09-27-2022, 12:55 PM   #3
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Something's suddenly up with Auto Crossfades at Split.

They are Huge in comparison to last build.

Anyone else?

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Old 09-27-2022, 01:03 PM   #4
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What length do you have set for preferences/project/media item defaults/overlap and crossfade items when splitting?

Are the crossfades different from that length?
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Old 09-27-2022, 01:12 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by schwa View Post
What length do you have set for preferences/project/media item defaults/overlap and crossfade items when splitting?

Are the crossfades different from that length?
Rolled back a few pres, then back to dev0927 and indeed after resetting that value it seems to be holding now. I'm using Split With Crossfade as a custom action constantly so I noticed instantly that it was behaving differently - not sure what tickled it with this pre.

Anyhow thank you it seems to be syncing with that value now!
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Old 09-27-2022, 01:45 PM   #6
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v6.68+dev0927 - September 27 2022[*]+ Notation editor: fix caption for "Enter Text" dialog
It works now.
I also think that the term "whole note trill" is wrong. It does not mean anything. I don't know which name is correct but it needs to be fixed.
https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...72&postcount=3
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:04 PM   #7
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It's a trill that is displayed for the length of the whole (as in entire) note. "Entire note trill" ?
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:23 PM   #8
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Whole note trill is entirely understandable IMO. It's a trill with a whole note duration. Easy.

Or maybe it was meant as "whole TONE trill", which is a different thing (and yeah looking at the linked screenshot, that's exactly what it is!)

(Also, you'd usually write "grace note" not "gracenote" )
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:25 PM   #9
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Well the note is not necessarily a whole note, so I get the wording confusion.
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:28 PM   #10
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trill_(music)#Notation

OK so looks like the wavy trill is just another way to mark it, and is equivalent to just writing tr. and has no relation to note duration... Or I'm misunderstanding something. But yeah it seems that wavy trill can also span multiple notes, which is again clashing with "whole note" term tbh.




EDIT: Just checked MuseScore, and they call the wavy trill just "Trill line".

Last edited by EvilDragon; 09-27-2022 at 02:35 PM.
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:43 PM   #11
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Hello, here is the difference between what you call 'trill' and 'whole note trill'. I don't think this is related to the length of the note but rather to the interval between the first note and the small note. the first case, we have a semitone and in the second a tone.
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Old 09-27-2022, 02:56 PM   #12
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in French, I translated by :

- Upper semitone trill : trille au demi-ton supérieur
- Upper tone trill : trille au ton supérieur

I'm not sure of the official name in musical vocabulary.

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Old 09-27-2022, 03:13 PM   #13
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I just noticed a small, not very serious problem. a line is missing from the small notes when they are above and below the staff


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Old 09-27-2022, 03:31 PM   #14
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there is another way to see the trill too if you do according to the keysnap. Then the trill would follow the key. But it would also be necessary in this case to be able to make a chromatic trill when one wishes it. surely it must be like this on music notation software
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Old 09-27-2022, 10:34 PM   #15
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+ API: add support for GetSetProjectInfo_String("RENDER_TARGETS_EX"), which returns the list double-null separated ("RENDER_TARGETS" is semicolon-separated)

Does anyone know what this means?
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Old 09-28-2022, 12:35 AM   #16
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there is another way to see the trill too if you do according to the keysnap. Then the trill would follow the key. But it would also be necessary in this case to be able to make a chromatic trill when one wishes it. surely it must be like this on music notation software
in this case, it would also be necessary to have available a trill in the upper tone, so it comes down to the same thing with what we have now.
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Old 09-28-2022, 12:47 AM   #17
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+ API: add support for GetSetProjectInfo_String("RENDER_TARGETS_EX"), which returns the list double-null separated ("RENDER_TARGETS" is semicolon-separated)

Does anyone know what this means?
This allows for you to use the RENDER_TARGETS API and correctly handle file paths with semicolons (allowed on NTFS). I use this for my Render script actually, although I haven't had anyone complain since I'm sure semicolons in filenames aren't very common.
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Old 09-28-2022, 02:39 AM   #18
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Quote:
  • + Parent send: allow arbitrary channel counts for master/parent send
I have questions. :-)

Let's say the parent channel has 10 channels and the child has 10 channels. At the moment, you can route 1-10, 2-10, 3-10, etc. to the parent. I'm not sure I understand the use case, nor why not 1-9, 1-8, 2-6, etc. if these kinds of partial ranges are supported.

If the parent has 10 channels and the child has 4 channels, the situation makes a little more sense: 1-4, 2-5, 3-6, etc. but at the end you get 7-10, 8-10, 9-10 which again feels weird.

Much more interesting and IMO useful is creating a manual send from a 10 channel source to a 10-channel destination. There you have a menu for mono, stereo and multichannel sources to mono, stereo and multichannel destinations. That's fantastic.

I did find a bug though. If you have a 4-channel source and a 10-channel destination, you get these options, in which the nonexistent channels 11 and 12 are referenced:

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Old 09-28-2022, 02:57 AM   #19
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I kinda agree with sockmonkey on the routing dropdown, I dont see where I would need a 3-6 kinda routing, for what scenario this has been designed ?

I also feel that this dropdown menu is way too big. A bit disturbing.
It at least there could be sub entry for Mono, Stereo and Other, it would be more easy to navigate.
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Old 09-28-2022, 03:05 AM   #20
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I kinda agree with sockmonkey on the routing dropdown, I dont see where I would need a 3-6 kinda routing, for what scenario this has been designed ?

I also feel that this dropdown menu is way too big. A bit disturbing.
It at least there could be sub entry for Mono, Stereo and Other, it would be more easy to navigate.
Or better have two dropdown lists, where we can enter range like 1-1, 1-3, 2-6 etc.
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Old 09-28-2022, 04:32 AM   #21
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En passant X-Raym le lien Changelog de ton scripte est brisé.
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Old 09-28-2022, 08:55 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by musicbynumbers View Post
[*] * Includes feature branch: track media/razor edit grouping
Mouse modifier "Move item loop section contents ignoring snap" doesn't work on all track edit grouped tracks (neither on grouped/selected items), only for the currently touched item.
Could this be added please?
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Old 09-28-2022, 09:30 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa View Post
It's a trill that is displayed for the length of the whole (as in entire) note. "Entire note trill" ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by tohubohu View Post
in French, I translated by :

- Upper semitone trill : trille au demi-ton supérieur
- Upper tone trill : trille au ton supérieur

I'm not sure of the official name in musical vocabulary.
So here we are talking about trills that oscillate between either 0 and +1 semitones or 0 and +2 semitones. Is that correct?

"Whole note" implies note length (4x 1/4 note), so it is my very non-expert belief that it should be referred to as whole tone trill.
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Old 09-28-2022, 09:40 AM   #24
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Hello, here is the difference between what you call 'trill' and 'whole note trill'. I don't think this is related to the length of the note but rather to the interval between the first note and the small note. the first case, we have a semitone and in the second a tone.
These are currently called in Reaper:
  • Trill
  • Whole note trill

The preffered wording would be something like:
  • Trill half-tone
  • Trill whole-tone

Because what is currently called "Trill" is not a diatonic trill but a forced half-tone trill.

While we're at it, adding a diatonic trill would be nice. This would be called
  • Trill diatonic
and it would always go to the closest note in the key, no matter if it is a half-tone or a whole-tone apart.

The advantage of having the diatonic trill would be the case when the notes that already have a trill assigned are moved up and down in pitch within the scale. Currently I need to set different types of trill each time when I move the notes (ar at least check them). Another case would be when setting a trill to a chord. Currently I need to think about what type to set to each particular not in the chord. With a diatonic trill, I would just select all the notes and assign them this one and it's done with 2 clicks and without unnecessary thinking.
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Old 09-28-2022, 09:58 AM   #25
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# Razor edits: fix save/load and undo/redo when using razor edits on master track
hmm, here save/auto-load of last active RE selection isn't working on master, tried with/without .RPP-UNDO. Save/load still works on regular tracks.

Undo/redo is fine.
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Old 09-28-2022, 11:00 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bFooz View Post

The preffered wording would be something like:
  • Trill half-tone
  • Trill whole-tone
Good suggestion, though I think this is would be even better:
  • Trill semitone
  • Trill tone
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Old 09-28-2022, 11:04 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman View Post
Good suggestion, though I think this is would be even better:
  • Trill semitone
  • Trill tone
Half-step trill, whole-step trill are more common terms
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Old 09-28-2022, 11:53 AM   #28
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all terms will be better than what there is right now.
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Old 09-28-2022, 11:55 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bFooz View Post
While we're at it, adding a diatonic trill would be nice. This would be called
  • Trill diatonic
and it would always go to the closest note in the key, no matter if it is a half-tone or a whole-tone apart.

The advantage of having the diatonic trill would be the case when the notes that already have a trill assigned are moved up and down in pitch within the scale. Currently I need to set different types of trill each time when I move the notes (ar at least check them). Another case would be when setting a trill to a chord. Currently I need to think about what type to set to each particular not in the chord. With a diatonic trill, I would just select all the notes and assign them this one and it's done with 2 clicks and without unnecessary thinking.
What you say is great but this is a new feature. There are already a lot of things to fix!
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Old 09-28-2022, 12:01 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
Half-step trill, whole-step trill are more common terms
Agreed, that's also what most sample libraries use.
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Old 09-28-2022, 02:28 PM   #31
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Ha dunno, a bunch of sample libraries use HT/WT (half-tone/whole-tone) as shorthands... As far as I can see those are the most widely used terms.

Although by default in Reaper, semitone is used across the board, so it should be "semitone trill" and "whole tone trill". It's definitely NOT a "whole note trill".
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Old 09-28-2022, 03:18 PM   #32
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I have rarely heard "half-tone". Semitone is UK, half-step is USA English. "Whole-step" and "whole-tone" are interchangeable.

I'm sure Justin and schwa being American won't get confused, but I want to emphasize that the adjective should never come after the noun as Xasman and bFooz have suggested.
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Old 09-29-2022, 03:10 AM   #33
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  • + Render: support rendering stems pre-fader from render dialog
Thank you!!!
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Old 09-29-2022, 05:01 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
I have questions. :-)

I did find a bug though. If you have a 4-channel source and a 10-channel destination, you get these options, in which the nonexistent channels 11 and 12 are referenced:

Save that the destination channel count is incremented to match 9-12, which makes sense.
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Old 09-29-2022, 05:19 AM   #35
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Save that the destination channel count is incremented to match 9-12, which makes sense.
That would only make sense (to me) if I were clearly notified that this is what's going to happen, which is currently not the case.
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Old 09-29-2022, 06:36 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sockmonkey72 View Post
Half-step trill, whole-step trill are more common terms
In my experience the terms "semitone" and "tone" are much more common (as well as being more succinct).*

Also, it seems to me that both "semitone" and "tone" can refer equally to both harmonic and melodic intervals. To me, "half-step" or "whole-step" tend rather to describe melodic intervals - but admittedly, that's possibly just my perception (because of the word "step", which seems to imply forward motion).

Quote:
Originally Posted by MonkeyBars View Post
...I want to emphasize that the adjective should never come after the noun as Xasman and bFooz have suggested.
It's a form of indexing and when indexing, the noun always comes first. For example, here's an extract from the index of Gould's "Behind Bars" (p.674):



* BTW., I do feel the choice here should be guided by music theory conventions and not by whatever some sample library or other may or may not use.
Attached Images
File Type: png index.png (147.0 KB, 804 views)

Last edited by Xasman; 09-29-2022 at 06:50 AM.
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Old 09-29-2022, 06:53 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman View Post
In my experience the terms "semitone" and "tone" are much more common.
IMO the most importatnt thing is to specify in the name that one is "semi/half" and the other one is "whole".
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Old 09-29-2022, 06:57 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman View Post
In my experience the terms "semitone" and "tone" are much more common (as well as being more succinct).*

Also, it seems to me that both "semitone" and "tone" can refer equally to both harmonic and melodic intervals. To me, "half-step" or "whole-step" tend rather to describe melodic intervals - but admittedly, that's possibly just my perception (because of the word "step", which seems to imply forward motion).



It's a form of indexing and when indexing, the noun always comes first. For example, here's an extract from the index of Gould's "Behind Bars" (p.674):



* BTW., I do feel the choice here should be guided by music theory conventions and not by whatever some sample library or other may or may not use.
When I was a conservatory student (in the US), half-step/whole-step trills were music-theoretically acceptable, common usage. Whereas "whole tone" was generally reserved for discussions of compositional systems of the early 20th century. This stuff is clearly culturally, nationally different, so reference to industry practice isn't crazy.
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Old 09-29-2022, 07:14 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bFooz View Post
...and the other one is "whole".
The term "whole" is redundant in this sense though. "Tone" is all that's needed since the fact that it's "whole" is implied. If the interval is less than a tone, then the word "tone" will be prepended, i.e. "quartertone" or "semitone" - or even "half-tone" if you really must! Conversely, an interval wider than one tone automatically acquires a different intervallic name anyway (such as minor third, major third, etc.).

Of course, we could use similar intervallic names for tone and semitone but the terms "tone" and semitone" are useful in that they don't require any harmonic context (unlike, for example, major second/diminished third or minor second/augmented unison)

Last edited by Xasman; 09-29-2022 at 07:28 AM.
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Old 09-29-2022, 12:08 PM   #40
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what about

1,0594630943592952645618252949463

and

1,0594630943592952645618252949463²

That would be unambiguous.
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