Control Surface Integration (CSI) Technical Feature Discussion

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by siniarch

The Plugin is DMGAudio Equilibrium.
FXParam 48 "Band1 Type" (is what I get when I have CSI write down all the FX Params)
When I turn the UI off on the plugin and I go down to that parameter on the right side where it tells you the value it says:
"1 Peak/HPF/LSh/HSh/LPF/Notch"

if I move from Peak to High Pass Filter, the line reads:
"2 Peak/HPF/LSh/HSh/LPF/Notch"

Same thing happens with the FXParam 47 (which is Band 1 Groups) which is supposed to let you know if the EQ Band is "STEREO, LEFT or RIGHT"
The values it returns are 64, 128, 192

I'm sure there are many others that will have this problem. With thing that are less than 4 items I could use my Radio screens, but anything more than that, and it will be very difficult to show parameter information. Maybe if we get a group of users complaining it will help.

EQuilibrium and other modular EQ's (Crave EQ, probably Pro-Q) can generally be a nightmare from a mapping perspective due to all the bands and options. I think it's just the nature of allowing for each band to be as flexible as they are and just figured it wasn't trivial to return the right value.

That said, you could always email DMG and suggest a change. I've been in touch with Dave a few times regarding issues/suggestions during the TrackComp beta and he was super responsive.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Yeah, pretty advanced FR, I'm sure you could easily handle it, but not everyone has your chops

Yeah, it's definitely pushing it a bit Still, the default could be to use the raw returned value.

If we could have a 'simple' system where we could specify a raw value (a 0.0 to 1.0 number or a string) and then give an alias to be displayed when that number or string is received from the host, that would do it.

Originally Posted by siniarch

If I tell it to write FXParamNameDisplay 48, then it displays: "Peak,HPF,LowShelf,HighShelf,LPF,Notch" Meaning, it doesn't switch from one to the other, it just shows all the names at once(of course this gets cut off after 6 characters.)

Alas, like Geoff said "welcome to the world of plugins" I'm afraid that some plugin authors take very little notice of what values are returned to the host by their creations and we're just stuck with the nonsense that some of them put out.

Originally Posted by Funkybot

EQuilibrium and other modular EQ's (Crave EQ, probably Pro-Q) can generally be a nightmare from a mapping perspective due to all the bands and options.

With all of these I just map 8 bands and leave it at that (I don't think I've ever used 8 bands in my life )

Equilibrium has a nice little gotcha in that the BandState parameter (#46 for Band1) contains 3 options, exists, off and on.

So to create a control to simply turn a band on or off, you have to be careful to exclude the "exists" option (remove is activated by 0.0, create by 0.33) or bands will disappear and re-appear instead of just being enabled/disabled.

Thus:

RotaryPushD1 FXParam 46 [ 0.5 1.0 ]

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

With all of these I just map 8 bands and leave it at that (I don't think I've ever used 8 bands in my life )

That's been my approach too: HP filter, low shelf, low bell, low mid bell, hi mid bell, hi bell, hi shelf, LP filter.

And save as default. Never use them all, but they're there.

[Gass n Klang]

solved

[siniarch]

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

So to create a control to simply turn a band on or off, you have to be careful to exclude the "exists" option (remove is activated by 0.0, create by 0.33) or bands will disappear and re-appear instead of just being enabled/disabled.

Thus:

RotaryPushD1 FXParam 46 [ 0.5 1.0 ]

This is what I figured out as well.

Lord knows Geoff has done so much already and is probably dealing with so many requests. It's truly a herculean effort and we are all guilty of asking for more.

So, I will try and work with it and perhaps contact some of the FX manufacturers to see if they can fix it on their side.

Geoff, when you do get to it, be it 2021 or 2022 or whenever that is, I think it can have a format such as what MixMonkey described above.

RotaryPushD1 FXParam 46 [ 0.5 1.0 ] [ "on" "off" ]

and it can be indicated that if the user doesn't provide the first BRACKETED NUMBERS, then the BRACKETED TEXT won't work.

But I'm just writing this as a suggestion for the future.

Thanks everyone for the help and as always Geoff for putting up with us and all our demands.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by siniarch

RotaryPushD1 FXParam 46 [ 0.5 1.0 ] [ "on" "off" ]

and it can be indicated that if the user doesn't provide the first BRACKETED NUMBERS, then the BRACKETED TEXT won't work.

But I'm just writing this as a suggestion for the future.

Thanks everyone for the help and as always Geoff for putting up with us and all our demands.

I would suggest that if the user doesn't provide the bracketed text, then the raw value is returned unchanged.

The first part of what you've written above is the current format for stepped values and actually this might be easier to implement than the continuous 0.0 to 1.0 of an encoder. People will have already worked out (by hook or by crook) what the stepped values need to be, this just ties a value display alias to each step.

[siniarch]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

That's been my approach too: HP filter, low shelf, low bell, low mid bell, hi mid bell, hi bell, hi shelf, LP filter.

And save as default. Never use them all, but they're there.

This is also what I'm doing. I was wondering what frequencies you suggest these bands would be as a default only of course. I'm building mine and I'm making the encoder push reset the bands to default values, and I'm patiently figuring out what number to indicate so the values go back to an exact number. For example: 0.1429=30hz, 0.209=50hz, 0.27025=80hz and so on.

I was thinking:
50hz............High Pass Filter
80hz or 100hz...Low Shelf
200hz...........Low Bell
400hz...........Low Mid Bell
1.5khz..........Hi Mid Bell
6khz............Hi Bell
9khz............Hi Shelf
14khz...........Low Pass Filter

What do you think of these?

Thanks.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by siniarch

... and I'm patiently figuring out what number to indicate so the values go back to an exact number. For example: 0.1429=30hz, 0.209=50hz, 0.27025=80hz and so on.

Treat yourself to a copy of BlueCat's PatchWork. Super useful for lots of plugin mapping conundrums

Your values look fine btw.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by siniarch

This is also what I'm doing. I was wondering what frequencies you suggest these bands would be as a default only of course. I'm building mine and I'm making the encoder push reset the bands to default values, and I'm patiently figuring out what number to indicate so the values go back to an exact number. For example: 0.1429=30hz, 0.209=50hz, 0.27025=80hz and so on.

I was thinking:
50hz............High Pass Filter
80hz or 100hz...Low Shelf
200hz...........Low Bell
400hz...........Low Mid Bell
1.5khz..........Hi Mid Bell
6khz............Hi Bell
9khz............Hi Shelf
14khz...........Low Pass Filter

What do you think of these?

Thanks.

Those seem like reasonable values. I'd keep the Low Pass Filter disabled by default however and put the Hi Pass Filter at minimum to start. I personally Hi Pass way more often than I Low Pass, so that one is on by default, but I don't want to start out where I'm cutting any audible frequencies by default. Low Pass stays off until I need it.

My setup is:

10hz...Hi Pass (This has a tiny bit of resonance. Q=1.09)
110hz...Low Shelf
220hz...Low Bell
400hz...Low-Mid
1.5k...Mid
4.5k...Hi Mid
7.5k...Hi Shelf
16k...Low Pass (but this is in an off state by default)

Using the DMG curves, IIR mode, Digital+ Compensation set to 64 and Digital+ Phase set to On, and Autogain enabled.

[drummer67]

WOW! I just discovered this today. Been playing with CSI and my XTouch One most of the afternoon. Now I'm trying to setup my tablet as an OSC device and i get to:

Step 5.11 "Where it says surface select MackieC4Emu.ost"

and there is no selection for MackieC4Emu.ost, only TouchOSCPad.ost, ands TouchOSCPhone.ost

Admittedly, I'm in way over my head! Help, please?

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by drummer67

WOW! I just discovered this today. Been playing with CSI and my XTouch One most of the afternoon. Now I'm trying to setup my tablet as an OSC device and i get to:

Step 5.11 "Where it says surface select MackieC4Emu.ost"

and there is no selection for MackieC4Emu.ost, only TouchOSCPad.ost, ands TouchOSCPhone.ost

Admittedly, I'm in way over my head! Help, please?

Maybe it's not still being included? I've attached it here.

[Gass n Klang]

Can I somehow set my controller (2x 8 faders) always show 1-16, 9-24 etc when using the bank select?

e.g: I use the track offset (channel left/right) and got channels 3-18 on my controller. If I click bank right it adds 8 (so i've got 11-26), but I'd rather like to have the next block of 8 so 9-24.
Is that possible? I think it is much clearer when using large projects.

[andyp24]

I've been trying to map DMG Equilibrium to the Console1 this afternoon.
Fortunately my standard default is 6 bands (HPF, low shelf, low-mid bell, hi-mid bell, hi shelf, LPF) which fits the controls of the Console1 quite well.

Using Shift (from another surface) plus encoders to step through filter model types etc

So far, working ok, but I can only imagine it would be much harder if I was trying to reflect the parameter names on the surface (instead, I'm just mapping buttons to open the GUI so I can see what I'm doing there, and reach for the mouse on any of the more obscure parameters I rarely touch). This seems a reasonable compromise to me.

I echo what was said before - I've been in touch with the two DMG devs on a few occasions and always found them very helpful and quick to respond.

Andy

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

Can I somehow set my controller (2x 8 faders) always show 1-16, 9-24 etc when using the bank select?

e.g: I use the track offset (channel left/right) and got channels 3-18 on my controller. If I click bank right it adds 8 (so i've got 11-26), but I'd rather like to have the next block of 8 so 9-24.
Is that possible? I think it is much clearer when using large projects.

Not sure I understand completely what you mean. What's "Track offset"?

I don't think we have the capability of say "Bank to the next block of 8 tracks"

I can think of a couple things that may help though:

1. If the above is a situation you are constantly in you could potentially just do

Modifier+WhateverYourBankButtonIs      TrackBank "6"

in your surface zone.

or

2. Potentially you have a template and a list of tracks that you'd normally like to put as the first slot? In that case, I would enable or force scroll link in your zone, and make a couple of scripts that select those tracks by name.

It's really easy, there's a script that allows the user to make scripts for this purpose:

Script: Lokasenna_Select tracks by name.lua

I assume it's in Reapack in the stock repository.

Makings scripts like this will allow you to map those scripts to buttons in CSI. This way you could jump to certain spots in your template.

[Nick Morris]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Nick, if you get a chance and are willing to test, can you check out FX on the Eucon just to confirm if you're experiencing the same bugs I reported earlier?

If you have a UAD and the LA-2A Collection, here's a zone to test out...

Zone "VST: UAD Teletronix LA-2A Gray (Universal Audio, Inc.)" "LA2AGray"
     SelectedTrackNavigator

     InvertFB+FX_SwitchUpper2Ch1 FXParam "6" "Bypass" [ 0.0 1.0 ]
     FX_Display2Ch1              FXParamNameDisplay "6" "LA-2A"

     FX_Rotary2Ch2       FXParam "0" "Thresh" "2"
     FX_Display2Ch2      FXParamNameDisplay "0" "Thresh"

     FX_Rotary2Ch3       FXParam "1" "Gain" "2"
     FX_Display2Ch3      FXParamNameDisplay "1" "Gain"

     FX_SwitchUpper2Ch4  FXParam "2" [ 0.0 1.0 ]
     FX_Display2Ch4      FXParamValueDisplay "2" "Comp/Limit" "2"
     
     FX_Rotary2Ch5       FXParam "4" "Meter" "1"
     FX_Display2Ch5      FXParamValueDisplay "4"

     FX_Rotary2Ch6       FXParam "3" "Emphasis" "0"
     FX_Display2Ch6      FXParamNameDisplay "3" "Emphasis"
ZoneEnd

...Basically, hit the Inserts button, if you need to, page over until you see the FX. Once there, move some rotaries, then let go and touch again. Does the rotary jump to zero on the next Touch? Now flip to faders, do the faders drop to zero when you release them? At any point, does the FX bar on the displays work?

I'm not really using the Artist Mix for FX either, but if they're not working we should test and confirm so it can be fixed. Would appreciate if you can check it out. If you don't have a UAD, I have a ton of effects, tell me what you have and I can probably whip up a zone. If you're busy, or I'm imposing, totally understand.

And happy New Year to all! Let's hope 2021 is a better year for planet Earth and it's inhabitants.

It works as you described. I wasn’t as experienced at creating the zones, just winging it when I tested eucon fx. Checking it again now and it is still the same. Needs to be fixed.

[Funkybot]

Thanks for taking the time to confirm the Eucon FX issues Nick!

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

So I have a feature request and a possible workaround question:

FR: To be able to have surfaces mirror eachother. Use case: Much like good ole' FB and MM (Funkybot and MixMonkey just in case nobody got that) I'm building an OSC template to partner with my surface. This is especially handy for the midi fighter twisters because they lack displays. However, since I am also using this as a mixing surface, CSI treats them (obviously) as two different surfaces so tracks 1 through 8 are on the Twisters and 9-16 on the OSC tablet. This happens even if I have unique names to the widgets (nice try FB ) Having the ability to mirror the surfaces would open up a possibility to make a huge meter bridge (which yeah that sounds pretty great to me!) with all the appropriate labels.

Workaround question:

Since this FR has come up in different forms and I fear it's sort of "not the CSI way" I have a potential workaround but I'll probably need Geoff to fill in the blanks (literally and figuratively).

You *can* use Touch OSC bridge to send midi from OSC. I set that up and sent that through bome's midi translator and just added touchosc bridge to my surface (effectively funneling all my surfaces down to one surface as far as CSI is concerned). In the mst I just added 8 faders like this to accommodate the new OSC Bridge midi faders:

Widget fader1
	Fader7Bit b9 00 7f
	FB_Fader7Bit b9 00 7f
WidgetEnd

Pretty proud of myself there that works really well. Huge meter bridge for my setup!

However, if I end up having to use this workaround, how can I interface with the labels for track name and all of that? Can I use existing widgets? I assume they need to be midi enabled but I'm not sure which settings I would even try in the touchOSC editor or how the .mst would look for those labels.

Did this get lost in the shuffle? Obviously no worries just curious. Even if we can't implement what I'm asking here, can anyone think of a way I can enable midi in OSC for display purposes?

If I wanted a displayupper/lower, what should I set the midi in the osc editor to be and what should my mst look like? I've been trying for the past few days, but I can't get any text to show up. The mst for displays look pretty different than any other widgets so it's hard to just piece together.

[Funkybot]

Wish I could help you out there, but I took a more straightforward approach where the OSC device just straight mirrors the MIDI device. Because I use it for FX, Reaper Actions, and Selected Track controls only, it works great in that context. Maybe someone else can figure out a workaround.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

Did this get lost in the shuffle? Obviously no worries just curious. Even if we can't implement what I'm asking here, can anyone think of a way I can enable midi in OSC for display purposes?

If I wanted a displayupper/lower, what should I set the midi in the osc editor to be and what should my mst look like? I've been trying for the past few days, but I can't get any text to show up. The mst for displays look pretty different than any other widgets so it's hard to just piece together.

Sorry, I got a bit sidetracked I'm afraid you might have come across a bit of a dead end regarding MIDI and OSC.

I experimented with the TouchOSC Bridge when I found out it could use a USB connection from iPad to Host but quickly found out that the only way to get display feedback on the iPad was to use OSC, which can't use the USB connection.

Whilst TouchOSC does a good job of sending and receiving regular MIDI commands that will work correctly with CSI, there's no equivalent of, say, "FB_MCUDisplayUpper" to put in your .mst. Without that you can't implement displays over MIDI on the iPad.

This is also true of other apps like MIDI Designer, which is a shame.

The only way I could think of trying (and I haven't explored this) would be to create a hybrid setup using OSC for displays and MIDI for controls. However, I'm not sure you can use the TouchOSC Bridge and OSC simultaneously.

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

The only way I could think of trying (and I haven't explored this) would be to create a hybrid setup using OSC for displays and MIDI for controls. However, I'm not sure you can use the TouchOSC Bridge and OSC simultaneously.

I did try this without success. Just to see if it would work. Unfortunately, even if I did get it to work, the osc would have to be a separate surface so "tracknamedisplay" would still display tracks 9-16 when my "midi osc meters" would be 1-8 as well as the mf twisters.

Thank you for the response though! That is definitely a shame!

I'm all good with workarounds, they are like puzzles I like solving but yeah unfortunately this takes me back to just having a feature request. Thanks MM and FB.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

I did try this without success. Just to see if it would work. Unfortunately, even if I did get it to work, the osc would have to be a separate surface so "tracknamedisplay" would still display tracks 9-16 when my "midi osc meters" would be 1-8 as well as the mf twisters.

Thank you for the response though! That is definitely a shame!

I'm all good with workarounds, they are like puzzles I like solving but yeah unfortunately this takes me back to just having a feature request. Thanks MM and FB.

Ok, so I was thinking about it some more: I can't solve your problem with channel displays on the OSC device because of how the TrackNavigator works, but, do you use your Twisters for FX control?

If so, we can make OSC displays work with that portion of your setup using Pages in CSI.

You could do this:

1. You got your Home page in CSI with your 2 Twisters setup for mixing

2. You can now add an OSC device to the same CSI page to run some Reaper actions or selected track actions...just an extra surface to do some specialized stuff - but NOT using the TrackNavigator. It's just an extra surface.

Now...

3. You create a new page in CSI called "FX Control" or something

4. In that page, you basically mimic my FXTwister setup (see the other CSI thread my post from a day or two ago)...

5. In that Page setup, you don't use the TrackNavigator, you've got an .mst for the Twister (or Twisters) you've got the OSC template that mirrors the device exactly. And remember, Pages allow you to use different .mst's/.zon files so there's not going to be any kind of conflict.

Need to go back to mixing? Just pop back to your home page.

I'm pretty sure that would work and get you displays for your Twister at least some of the time (for FX) which leaves you better off than you are today.

Hope that makes sense.

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Ok, so I was thinking about it some more: I can't solve your problem with channel displays on the OSC device because of how the TrackNavigator works, but, do you use your Twisters for FX control?

If so, we can make OSC displays work with that portion of your setup using Pages in CSI.

You could do this:

1. You got your Home page in CSI with your 2 Twisters setup for mixing

2. You can now add an OSC device to the same CSI page to run some Reaper actions or selected track actions...just an extra surface to do some specialized stuff - but NOT using the TrackNavigator. It's just an extra surface.

Now...

3. You create a new page in CSI called "FX Control" or something

4. In that page, you basically mimic my FXTwister setup (see the other CSI thread my post from a day or two ago)...

5. In that Page setup, you don't use the TrackNavigator, you've got an .mst for the Twister (or Twisters) you've got the OSC template that mirrors the device exactly. And remember, Pages allow you to use different .mst's/.zon files so there's not going to be any kind of conflict.

Need to go back to mixing? Just pop back to your home page.

I'm pretty sure that would work and get you displays for your Twister at least some of the time (for FX) which leaves you better off than you are today.

Hope that makes sense.

It does make sense yeah Thanks for spending some time thinking about this FB.

I don't think it's a route I'm willing to go down because it doesn't really give me the functionality I was looking for. In that case I'd prefer the separate OSC surface without using tracknavigator for use with my fx mappings. That works well and thank you for all your work on the guides you've put together!

But having this huge meter bridge and track info was definitely enticing.

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

Not sure I understand completely what you mean. What's "Track offset"?

I don't think we have the capability of say "Bank to the next block of 8 tracks"

I can think of a couple things that may help though:

1. If the above is a situation you are constantly in you could potentially just do

Modifier+WhateverYourBankButtonIs      TrackBank "6"

in your surface zone.

or

2. Potentially you have a template and a list of tracks that you'd normally like to put as the first slot? In that case, I would enable or force scroll link in your zone, and make a couple of scripts that select those tracks by name.

It's really easy, there's a script that allows the user to make scripts for this purpose:

Script: Lokasenna_Select tracks by name.lua

I assume it's in Reapack in the stock repository.

Makings scripts like this will allow you to map those scripts to buttons in CSI. This way you could jump to certain spots in your template.

Sorry for being unclear. I want my controller to always show ch 1-16, 9-24 or 17-32 and so on when clicking on the bank up or down button. So it shouldnt simply jump by the number of 8 channels but instead show the channel ranges listed above.

[Gass n Klang]

Is it possible to put a factor in front of a parameter? Pro-q does +/-30dB. +/-15 are more than enough in most cases. So is it possible to integrate a "0.5" to improve the controller resolution (or a 0.3 for +/-10dB)?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Thanks for taking the time to confirm the Eucon FX issues Nick!

Thanks to you and @NickMorris for testing.

Looks like we have to revisit EuCon yet again.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

Sorry for being unclear. I want my controller to always show ch 1-16, 9-24 or 17-32 and so on when clicking on the bank up or down button. So it shouldnt simply jump by the number of 8 channels but instead show the channel ranges listed above.

I'm confused, isn't going from 1-16 to 9-24 jumping by 8 channels ?

Please explain the difference.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

Did this get lost in the shuffle?

No it didn't, it's just a lot more complex when you think it through

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

But having this huge meter bridge and track info was definitely enticing.

Track info, yes, meter bridge, not so much

Take a look at the video starting around 1:24.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byqW...ature=youtu.be

See how, when switching Tracks the OSC (iPhone/iPad) lags the Midi (Console1) like crazy -- totally unacceptable for useable meter performance.

Maybe, as @MixMonkey points out, if we can get off WiFi and use USB OSC this might improve, but that has its own issues.

[Geoff Waddington]

OK, let's talk about an OSC display only implementation.

It gets complex real fast.

How do you state the fact that, even though the OSC is TrackNavigator based, it does not use its own TrackNavigator, but rather piggybacks on other TrackNavigators -- that's the crux of the problem.

You would have to do something to ensure that the OSC surface was listed AFTER the surface(s) with the Navigators it piggybacks off of, ugghh.

For instance, if there are 2 surfaces before the OSC surface, does it piggyback off of the first ? the second ? both ?

Maybe we just allow simple adjustment by having an offset parameter for all surfaces.

That will work, but now for users without a need for this feature, we have just complicated their life -- they have to take what was an automatic layout feature, and explicitly state the offset for every surface, even though they don't even use OSC.

Maybe I'm missing something obvious -- hope so.

Let the FR discussion begin

[andyp24]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

I'm confused, isn't going from 1-16 to 9-24 jumping by 8 channels ?

Please explain the difference.

If I understand his original post correctly, if the surface is currently showing tracks 3-10, pressing the Bank Right button will add 8 to the range so it now shows 11-18. But the OP would like the Bank Right button to jump to 9-16 instead.

In other words, a press of the Bank button jumps to the next "complete group of 8" (1-8, 9-16, 17-24 etc) and ignore any "offset" from the start of a "group of 8" which was active previously (presumably from use of a Channel Right or Left action).

So from all these starting positions

1-8 2-9 3-10 4-11 5-12 6-13 7-14 8-15

a press of Bank Right would map 9-16 onto the surface.

EDIT - the OP referred to a surface with 16 channels, rather than 8, sorry. But the logic is the same, I think.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by andyp24

If I understand his original post correctly, if the surface is currently showing tracks 3-10, pressing the Bank Right button will add 8 to the range so it now shows 11-18. But the OP would like the Bank Right button to jump to 9-16 instead.

In other words, a press of the Bank button jumps to the next "complete group of 8" (1-8, 9-16, 17-24 etc) and ignore any "offset" from the start of a "group of 8" which was active previously (presumably from use of a Channel Right or Left action).

So from all these starting positions

1-8 2-9 3-10 4-11 5-12 6-13 7-14 8-15

a press of Bank Right would map 9-16 onto the surface.

EDIT - the OP referred to a surface with 16 channels, rather than 8, sorry. But the logic is the same, I think.

Ah, thanks, got it.

@Gass n Klang is that what you mean ?

If so just don't use the one channel bank, matter of fact unmap it if you want

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

I'm confused, isn't going from 1-16 to 9-24 jumping by 8 channels ?

Please explain the difference.

haha, yes indeed. My point is: it would be nice if using the bank buttons ALWAYS would give me the above-mentioned channels on my controller. So: Even if I went to 2-17 (using the channel right button) I'd like to have 9-24 if I click the bank right button after that and NOT 10-25. In my opinion that would make large projects much clearer.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

haha, yes indeed. My point is: it would be nice if using the bank buttons ALWAYS would give me the above-mentioned channels on my controller. So: Even if I went to 2-17 (using the channel right button) I'd like to have 9-24 if I click the bank right button after that and NOT 10-25. In my opinion that would make large projects much clearer.

Cross post -- please see my reply above.

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Ah, thanks, got it.

@Gass n Klang is that what you mean ?

If so just don't use the one channel bank, matter of fact unmap it if you want

exactly what I mean. Not using the channel bank isn't a solution. If I'm on 17-32 and select channel 3 in Reaper, I've got the "offset"... Would be nice if the controller could jump to 1-16 instead

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Track info, yes, meter bridge, not so much

Take a look at the video starting around 1:24.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byqW...ature=youtu.be

See how, when switching Tracks the OSC (iPhone/iPad) lags the Midi (Console1) like crazy -- totally unacceptable for useable meter performance.

Maybe, as @MixMonkey points out, if we can get off WiFi and use USB OSC this might improve, but that has its own issues.

So I see the problem in the video. If I understand correctly when you didn't float the gui's the lag seemed to go away?

As far as a meter bridge though, check this out, it's running OSC on wifi.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1T8S...ew?usp=sharing


As far as the implementation of the displays on OSC. Funkybot normally does better with this so let's wait 'til his mind is on it.

If the offset thing works, maybe in the zone for the osc surface I can add

TrackNavigator -8

Now obviously I have no idea what the heck I'm talking about but this would solve the "complicating users life" problem as they won't have to change anything or even know it exists. This way you aren't actually piggybacking, it's still it's own thing, just offset. The order of the surfaces would still matter like always. So if you had.

1. Artist Mix
2. Artist Mix
3. OSC tablet

and you wanted your OSC surface to display both:

TrackNavigator -16

I suppose that if you had your table set for 8 channels like mine in the video and you wanted to "mirror" the first one, the above code would still work? Then if for some reason you wanted to mirror the 2nd surface then tracknavigator -8 would do it.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Gass n Klang

exactly what I mean. Not using the channel bank isn't a solution. If I'm on 17-32 and select channel 3 in Reaper, I've got the "offset"... Would be nice if the controller could jump to 1-16 instead

Ah, OK, you mean if you select in Reaper with the mouse, not using surface bank controls ?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by cjewellstudios

So I see the problem in the video. If I understand correctly when you didn't float the gui's the lag seemed to go away?

As far as a meter bridge though, check this out, it's running OSC on wifi.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1T8S...ew?usp=sharing

Please watch the video again more closely, even with the GUIs closed the Console 1 rotary rings change, then a bit later the iPad/iPhone catch up, much too late for accurate real time metering

The video you provide shows the meters responding, but since there is no sound, there is no way of knowing if they are in synch with the sound or lag it considerably -- that's the whole point.

[Gass n Klang]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Ah, OK, you mean if you select in Reaper with the mouse, not using surface bank controls ?

yep. I think it would be fine if the instruments did not move to other faders. This way you could use blocks of 8 (or 16 if you have 16 fader controller) and e.g. the acoustic guitar would always stay on fader 3. If your working on a project for several hours, you have a better chance to know which fader to grab before reading the display. Just the way it is on a live mixing desk.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

How do you state the fact that, even though the OSC is TrackNavigator based, it does not use its own TrackNavigator, but rather piggybacks on other TrackNavigators -- that's the crux of the problem.

You would have to do something to ensure that the OSC surface was listed AFTER the surface(s) with the Navigators it piggybacks off of, ugghh.

For instance, if there are 2 surfaces before the OSC surface, does it piggyback off of the first ? the second ? both ?

Let the FR discussion begin

My original idea was.a special Navigator. It’s called something like “MirrorTrackNavigator.”

How it works (in my mind):

1. If only one MirrorTrackNavigator on the CSI page, it’s just a standard TrackNavigator - literally no difference. It’s designed to work like any 8 or 16 channel track navigator, that’s it.

2. Now, if two or more surfaces have MirrorTrackNavigator zones, the first one on the page gets the channel assignment, the second surface that uses the same navigator type just mirrors the channel assignment of the first exactly. Move a fader on one, it’s reflected on the other. Bank one, it’s reflected on the other.

In this case: if one surface is for controls, and another has displays, they could be shared across the same channels and would remain in sync when banking. And like a TrackNavigator, the channel assignment would slot in wherever it appear on the Page. You only get one set of MirrorTrackNavigators per page to keep it simple and cover this special use-case. Unless you want to start numbrering groups of them (MirrorTrackNavigator2, 3, etc.) but I wouldn’t advise starting there for an edge-case scenario unless it’s so easy to add it’s worth it for flexibility.

I’m not sure if there are problems I haven’t thought of yet, but I was thinking something like could be a nice organized way of implementing mirrored channel zones while not deviating too far from the basic CSI paradigm.

[cjewellstudios]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Please watch the video again more closely, even with the GUIs closed the Console 1 rotary rings change, then a bit later the iPad/iPhone catch up, much too late for accurate real time metering

The video you provide shows the meters responding, but since there is no sound, there is no way of knowing if they are in synch with the sound or lag it considerably -- that's the whole point.

There is sound

My daughter was asleep and my furnace was on but it is there if you turn it up

Edit: yeah I can see what you are saying now but if you can pick the audio out of my video, it looks pretty damn close to me, no noticeable lag.

Edit 2: I can record another one later with the audio an appropriate volume