CSI: Devices, Setup, Help -- thread now closed -- use the new CSI v3 thread

[Cragster]

Hi all. Hey I wanted to ask if there is some kind of autosave function going on in CSI? It's been a while but it seems when I have more than one project tab open the one that I'm working on the other one constantly needs to be saved without even modifying it. Even if I have two projects open say I work on one save it switch to the other project work on that save it and then try to close Reaper it will not let me close because that other project needs to be saved again. Is this something in c s i? If it is can I turn it off? Thanks for anyone help

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by Cragster

Hi all. Hey I wanted to ask if there is some kind of autosave function going on in CSI? It's been a while but it seems when I have more than one project tab open the one that I'm working on the other one constantly needs to be saved without even modifying it. Even if I have two projects open say I work on one save it switch to the other project work on that save it and then try to close Reaper it will not let me close because that other project needs to be saved again. Is this something in c s i? If it is can I turn it off? Thanks for anyone help

Do you have any Reaper scripts running in the background? I don't think this would be CSI. Unless you have a jittery fader or something.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by gordio692

I have been away from CSI for a while. I downloaded the latest release, 1.12. I am using an x-touch. I noticed that there is h\no longer an x-touch.mst file or an x-touch zones folder. Are we just using the mcu surface now? where are all the FX zones? I copied the reaeq.zon file to the new FX zones folder and made the change to the second line of code to "selectedTrackFxMenuNavigator," but it doesn't work. When I press the plugin button and then push the first encoder, all of the faders just go all the way down. I'd really appreciate a nudge in the right direction. The home setup works fine. I'm using Windows 11, with Reaper 6.33.

I think you're perfectly ok either:

1. Using the old X-Touch files and just modifying them for the updated syntax
2. Using the included MCU files with the X-Touch

Regarding the FX.zon's, any existing zones should still work but I don't recall CSI including any fx.zon's. As far as I know, you mostly had to roll your own fx.zon's. Did you delete your old CSI folder? If you had fx.zon's, I'd expect them to still work.

[Cragster]

Originally Posted by Funkybot

Do you have any Reaper scripts running in the background? I don't think this would be CSI. Unless you have a jittery fader or something.

I thought I remember Geoff doing a build a while back where CSI auto saves your place when closing reaper. Or something to that effect . I dont remember exactly what it was. That's when this started for me. Projects need to be saved without even modifying them in any way.
Meaning when I start reaper and have 2 project tabs .The project tab that's not open needs to be saved without it even being open. It's not a big deal just a little nuisance is all.was just hoping it was something I could stop from happening.
And if I have a bunch of tabs going and try to close reaper they all need to saved before reaper will quit.and they all were saved when I left them.something is modifying projects while they are tabbed and not open.
Lol I hope I explained that correctly. It's just a weird thing that started after that one build.

If none has this issue or cant shes any light on it it's cool. I can live with it. Thanks all for any help

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Cragster

I thought I remember Geoff doing a build a while back where CSI auto saves your place when closing reaper. Or something to that effect . I dont remember exactly what it was. That's when this started for me. Projects need to be saved without even modifying them in any way.
Meaning when I start reaper and have 2 project tabs .The project tab that's not open needs to be saved without it even being open. It's not a big deal just a little nuisance is all.was just hoping it was something I could stop from happening.
And if I have a bunch of tabs going and try to close reaper they all need to saved before reaper will quit.and they all were saved when I left them.something is modifying projects while they are tabbed and not open.
Lol I hope I explained that correctly. It's just a weird thing that started after that one build.

If none has this issue or cant shes any light on it it's cool. I can live with it. Thanks all for any help

Actually they are modified, you are right it is about saving place.

Make a copy of your .rpp file so if anything goes wrong it happens to the copy

Open the copy with a text editor and go right to the very end.

You will see something like this:

  <EXTENSIONS
  >
  <EXTSTATE
    <CSI
      BANKINDEX 0
      PAGEINDEX 0
      PINNEDTRACKS 5-5_6-6_7-7_8-8_
    >
  >

So you might think you made no changes but CSI/Reaper detects that you have changed pages/banks, etc., and wants to save the changes to the .rpp file.

I am on and off about this feature -- if everyone voted to remove it I'd be fine with that -- it does tend to cause confusion for little gain !

[Funkybot]

I think this one blew right by me. So it remembers what page/bank you were on and any pinned tracks? Seems like a nice to have but not critical IMO. I'm neutral.

[Albert vt]

I am a newbie and very frustrated when I record a vocal on a track with reverb added save it and then play it back there is no reverb. I dedicate a track to vocal and another too reverb with the settings from reverberate then route the vocal track to the reverb track. Then I save it play it back and there is no reverb. Please help what am I doing wrong?

[Cragster]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Actually they are modified, you are right it is about saving place.

Make a copy of your .rpp file so if anything goes wrong it happens to the copy

Open the copy with a text editor and go right to the very end.

You will see something like this:

  <EXTENSIONS
  >
  <EXTSTATE
    <CSI
      BANKINDEX 0
      PAGEINDEX 0
      PINNEDTRACKS 5-5_6-6_7-7_8-8_
    >
  >

So you might think you made no changes but CSI/Reaper detects that you have changed pages/banks, etc., and wants to save the changes to the .rpp file.

I am on and off about this feature -- if everyone voted to remove it I'd be fine with that -- it does tend to cause confusion for little gain !

Thanks for reply Geoff and Funkybot. At least I know its CSI. I thought it was but wasnt 100% sure.
I'm sure it's a usable feature for folks so I'll live with it. I could definitely do without it but it's all good. Like I said a little annoying but I've gotten used to it

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by Albert vt

I am a newbie and very frustrated when I record a vocal on a track with reverb added save it and then play it back there is no reverb. I dedicate a track to vocal and another too reverb with the settings from reverberate then route the vocal track to the reverb track. Then I save it play it back and there is no reverb. Please help what am I doing wrong?

I think this is probably the wrong forum to get an answer.

I would suggest posting this in the newbieland forum, likely will get a better response.

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Actually they are modified, you are right it is about saving place.

Make a copy of your .rpp file so if anything goes wrong it happens to the copy

Open the copy with a text editor and go right to the very end.

You will see something like this:

  <EXTENSIONS
  >
  <EXTSTATE
    <CSI
      BANKINDEX 0
      PAGEINDEX 0
      PINNEDTRACKS 5-5_6-6_7-7_8-8_
    >
  >

So you might think you made no changes but CSI/Reaper detects that you have changed pages/banks, etc., and wants to save the changes to the .rpp file.

I am on and off about this feature -- if everyone voted to remove it I'd be fine with that -- it does tend to cause confusion for little gain !

Personally, I'm a big fan of CSI remembering Pinned Tracks If you use pinning to organise a project on the surface(s), you only have to do it once, rather than everytime you reload the project.

Also, in a general sense, I think the entire system should recall as it was left when last saved. Just my 2c.

[gordio692]

Everything is working now. I had changed the second line of the zon to "selectedTrackFxMenuNavigator," which didn't work. I reverted back to "SelectedTrackNavigator" and it works. Of course I needed to change "RotaryPush" to "Shift+Rotary" and comment out all the "RotaryPush NoAction" statements to enable fx slots, but that is it. Now I can start creating some of my own mappings.

Originally Posted by Funkybot

I think you're perfectly ok either:

1. Using the old X-Touch files and just modifying them for the updated syntax
2. Using the included MCU files with the X-Touch

Regarding the FX.zon's, any existing zones should still work but I don't recall CSI including any fx.zon's. As far as I know, you mostly had to roll your own fx.zon's. Did you delete your old CSI folder? If you had fx.zon's, I'd expect them to still work.

[iNX]

Hello,

after the installation, I can't find the "CSI Edit Mode" in the action list. How to import this?

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by iNX

Hello,

after the installation, I can't find the "CSI Edit Mode" in the action list. How to import this?

Have you tried typing "CSI" into the search field?

[Funkybot]

I'm not at my PC but I think Edit Mode was the old action for creating .zon files. If so, that one has been long depreciated. Typing CSI will show all related actions.

[iNX]

Originally Posted by MixMonkey

Have you tried typing "CSI" into the search field?

It's seem it was the old documentation, works perfectly with my xtouch, use the MCU.mst file, I've tried an other dedicated file Xtouch but nothing working.

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by iNX

It's seem it was the old documentation, works perfectly with my xtouch, use the MCU.mst file, I've tried an other dedicated file Xtouch but nothing working.

It sounds like you upgraded from a very old version of CSI to a more recent version. There were lots of changes to the .zon files since the version with the "CSI Edit Mode" action. If you're looking for a starting point, I'd suggest starting off with the MCU zone folder, then customizing to fit your needs. You should also check out the wiki, particularly this page:

https://github.com/GeoffAWaddington/...on-1.1-Changes

[buschag]

Finally got my new computer up and running. I was gonna dive into CSI today but it looks like things are getting reworked in the main CSI thread. Do you think I should hold off until they are done? Or will it not change that much to wait on starting CSI?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by buschag

Finally got my new computer up and running. I was gonna dive into CSI today but it looks like things are getting reworked in the main CSI thread. Do you think I should hold off until they are done? Or will it not change that much to wait on starting CSI?

I would wait, we are in the middle of changing a lot of stuff

[buschag]

Wilco! Look forward to diggin in.

[datavision]

Hi!

I have a Radikal SAC 2.2 that I'd like to try to map up. It has a Mackie mode that I'm thinking could be used. However, I'm a little lost where to start creating zones and stuff for this device. Could it work with the MCU as a base even for this?

Anyone with suggestions are very welcome!

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by datavision

Hi!

I have a Radikal SAC 2.2 that I'd like to try to map up. It has a Mackie mode that I'm thinking could be used. However, I'm a little lost where to start creating zones and stuff for this device. Could it work with the MCU as a base even for this?

Anyone with suggestions are very welcome!

The Zones and .mst files for the MCU will definitely be the best place to start. With the unit set to Mackie mode, see what functionality you get and whether any controls are excluded when in Mackie mode.

If you want to go deeper down the rabbit hole, you could consider building an .mst file for the unit in its 'native mode' Essentially that means going through the controls and making a note of what MIDI messages are sent out when each control is operated.

When you're finished you should have a list of all the controls on the surface and the corresponding MIDI messages they send out. From this list you can build an .mst file that matches the surface legending to the MIDI. This makes customising the Zones easier than having everything 'interpreted' through the Mackie mode.

[airon]

I can only second what MixMonkey said.

I did the same for the Faderport 16 and it was well worth my time. Take a look at the CSI 1.1 archive, in CSI/Surfaces/Midi/MCU.mst to get a decent overview of what that looks like.

The Wiki should tell you what all the widgets mean.

That control surface looks pretty good. The SOS review was quite favorable, and it seems to be fine to use as a midi controller via USB so you should be well in business.

This download archive has all the specs too, so I see no reason you can't make this work. Funny enough, they had a visual editor for hooking up hardware controls to plugins, which of course won't be usable for Reaper and CSI. But the concept is neat. It's on page 30 of the manual from the archive.


May I suggest you get yourself some MIDI MONITOR software, such as the free MIDI-OX to study what the console sends out. That is way easier than starting directly with using the device with an empty MST and zone filder in CSI.

The first thing I'd be checking out are the faders.

In native mode they might be of higher resolution. The midi mix mode might be the standard low midi resolution, which is better than nothing.

[datavision]

Thank you Airon and MixMonkey. I'd say it's the widgets I'm not fully grasping what they do and are for, and how I know I choose the right widget for each knob/fader etc..

Also, if I'd map the Jog Wheel, do I have to set the start and end values so the software would know what kind of knob it is, or is that handled by CSI in some other way?

Going to read more into the wiki and the docs of the SAC again.

[buschag]

I know CSI is being tweaked but I was thinking about getting my devices mapped out and ready to go. Does anyone know if the files on siniarch’s site are up to date? I was thinking about downloading the xtouch file to start looking at how to setup the surfaces. Also I have a livid code. Would it be possible to start with a MFT file as a template and just add another 16 encoders and a few buttons?

[Mavriq]

I know there are several Feedback Processors that can receive a color from the zone file. Mostly this is for devices that support RGB. I have 2 devices that have multi color pads. They are identically to FB_TwoState except that they have 16 different color codes IE:

90 28 35 White
90 28 0C Green
90 28 00 Off

Is there a way to send these from a zone file?

[MixMonkey]

Originally Posted by buschag

I know CSI is being tweaked but I was thinking about getting my devices mapped out and ready to go. Does anyone know if the files on siniarch’s site are up to date? I was thinking about downloading the xtouch file to start looking at how to setup the surfaces.

Probably best to use the MCU file in the download and start from there.

Also I have a livid code. Would it be possible to start with a MFT file as a template and just add another 16 encoders and a few buttons?

MFT?

[buschag]

Midi fighter twister… the code is basically two of those in one unit. 32 led ring push encoders. And a few extra push buttons

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by buschag

Midi fighter twister… the code is basically two of those in one unit. 32 led ring push encoders. And a few extra push buttons

It may use different MIDI messages though. Your best best may be to just create a new MST. It's not too hard and doesn't take too long. You can certainly look at the MFTwister.mst file to see how it's done. You can use CSI's Input Monitor (see the action list) or use something like MIDI-OX or BOME MIDI Translator to see what messages each control sends.

[buschag]

Cool. Thanks. Will give it a go

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by buschag

Cool. Thanks. Will give it a go

Let us know if you run into trouble. It's a cool looking controller.

[buschag]

Yeah I found one pretty cheap…. But they are kinda rare

[Funkybot]

Originally Posted by buschag

Yeah I found one pretty cheap…. But they are kinda rare

Yeah, I found one on Reverb after I saw your post.

https://reverb.com/item/49562558-livid-code-white-wood

[Mavriq]

Originally Posted by gvanbrunt

I know there are several Feedback Processors that can receive a color from the zone file. Mostly this is for devices that support RGB. I have 2 devices that have multi color pads. They are identically to FB_TwoState except that they have 16 different color codes IE:

90 28 35 White
90 28 0C Green
90 28 00 Off

Is there a way to send these from a zone file?

There is a bit of a hack to make this work. You can use a reg button, with a FB_MFT_RGB for Feedback.

Widget ColorButton
   Press 90 38 7F 80 38 7F
   FB_MFT_RGB 90 38 7f
WidgetEnd

Then in your zone file you do this:

Zone "Buttons"
   ColorButton    Play { 0 3 255 0 100 255 }
ZoneEnd

just as you would if you were using a Midi Fighter Twister controller

The first triplet is for color off and second is on. (not sure why that is as it is the opposite everywhere else)
Behind the scenes CSI will translate the RGB to a 2 digit hex number that is applied as the midi value. For example if you have

Play { 0 3 255 0 50 255 }

in your zone and define the button in the mft from above
the feedbank sent will be

90 38 05

The 50 is translated to 05.

You can get an idea of numbers from here.

There does seem to be a bug however. You can't send a number number between 1 and 21 for the blue number.

IE { 0 3 255 0 10 255 }

Will not send any feedback at all. It essentially prevents you from sending the number 1 or 2. This would appear to affect the midi fighter twister as well.

It appears to be related to this section of code:

int GetColorIntFromRGB(int r, int g, int b)
{
    if(b == 0 && g == 0 && r == 0)
        return 0;
    else if(b > 224 && g > 239 && r > 239)
        return 127;
    else if(b == 255 && r == 0)
    {
        for(int i = 1; i < 22; i++)
            if(g > colorMap7[i - 1][1] && g <= colorMap7[i][1])
                return i;
    }

in case Geoff wants to take a look at it.

[Funkybot]

Great post Geoff [gvanbrunt]!

Geoff Waddington has also indicated he'll be adding a new action called "SendMIDI" that will allow users to send arbitrary MIDI values [as defined in the .zon file] to their hardware.

So in the near-future, this should be possible for example...

Zone "Home"
OnInitialization SendMIDI { 90 28 35  90 29 00 }

Or...

SomeButton        SendMIDI { 90 28 35 }

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by gvanbrunt

It appears to be related to this section of code:

int GetColorIntFromRGB(int r, int g, int b)
{
    if(b == 0 && g == 0 && r == 0)
        return 0;
    else if(b > 224 && g > 239 && r > 239)
        return 127;
    else if(b == 255 && r == 0)
    {
        for(int i = 1; i < 22; i++)
            if(g > colorMap7[i - 1][1] && g <= colorMap7[i][1])
                return i;
    }

in case Geoff wants to take a look at it.

I seem to recall the MFT having a limited set of values that actually do anything.

If you can compile and test this with your unit I can code up one specifically with your working value set.

[Mavriq]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

I seem to recall the MFT having a limited set of values that actually do anything. I seem to recall it being more complicated before, so it may have changed.

I went over the doc. It basically takes a number from 0 to 127 (page 4). So the whole rgb thing for it might no longer make sense. I do seem to remember it being more complicated a while back.

If you can compile and test this with your unit I can code up one specifically with your working value set.

I don't really need to send the number 1 or or 2 so I can make this work for me as is.

That said, the SendMidi action may fix my issue, as well as making the FB_MFT_RGB feedback obsolete. That is if it can be sent as feedback. For example if you could do this:

SomeButton Play { 90 28 03 90 28 00   }

Or something like that, it would allow it to work with both my units that have multi colored pads.

Or even better something like this:

Zone "Channel"
  TrackNavigator
  Fader|                SoftTakeover7BitTrackVolume
  Shift+But1Ch|         TrackSelect
  Control+But1Ch|       TrackMute
  Option+But1Ch|        TrackRecordArm { 90 28 04 90 28 00 }
  Alt+But1Ch|           TrackSolo
ZoneEnd

Then I could have 1 row of buttons in a channel strip flash red when rec armed etc. And the rest just be the default like in the situation above.

<edit>
I should mention I can compile and test anything you want me to.

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by gvanbrunt

I went over the doc. It basically takes a number from 0 to 127 (page 4). So the whole rgb thing for it might no longer make sense. I do seem to remember it being more complicated a while back.


<edit>
I should mention I can compile and test anything you want me to.

Yeah, had a quick look at that doc, CSI was supporting only the colour setting modes, not the flashing, strobing, etc. modes.

If you want to code something up yourself, please feel free, it is open source for a reason

[Mavriq]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

If you want to code something up yourself, please feel free, it is open source for a reason

Once I have some time I'll get to know the code a bit better. Very rusty at c/c++ haven't done in 20 years... I'll brush up and can help out once I do.

Edit I did some more poking and this already works if you use a FB_MFT_RGB:

Zone "Channel"
  TrackNavigator
  Fader|                SoftTakeover7BitTrackVolume
  Shift+But1Ch|         TrackSelect
  Control+But1Ch|       TrackMute      { 0 0 255 0 79 255 }
  Option+But1Ch|        TrackRecordArm { 0 0 255 0 40 255 }
  Alt+But1Ch|           TrackSolo
ZoneEnd

In my case one is flashing red the other is yellow. So what could work for both the current MFT and myself is if I create a a new Feedback Processor similar to the MFT but accepts a standard midi message for both the on and off states.

Something like:

SomeButton Play { 90 28 03 90 28 00   }

instead of the RGB. Thoughts?

[Geoff Waddington]

Originally Posted by gvanbrunt

Once I have some time I'll get to know the code a bit better. Very rusty at c/c++ haven't done in 20 years... I'll brush up and can help out once I do.

Edit I did some more poking and this already works if you use a FB_MFT_RGB:

Zone "Channel"
  TrackNavigator
  Fader|                SoftTakeover7BitTrackVolume
  Shift+But1Ch|         TrackSelect
  Control+But1Ch|       TrackMute      { 0 0 255 0 79 255 }
  Option+But1Ch|        TrackRecordArm { 0 0 255 0 40 255 }
  Alt+But1Ch|           TrackSolo
ZoneEnd

In my case one is flashing red the other is yellow. So what could work for both the current MFT and myself is if I create a a new Feedback Processor similar to the MFT but accepts a standard midi message for both the on and off states.

Something like:

SomeButton Play { 90 28 03 90 28 00   }

instead of the RGB. Thoughts?

Have to think about it a bit, but I'm sure we can come up with something workable.

In the meantime, check out control_surface_midi_widgets.h, feedback processor section, for some examples of what is needed for a feedback processor.

[Mavriq]

Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington

Have to think about it a bit, but I'm sure we can come up with something workable.

In the meantime, check out control_surface_midi_widgets.h, feedback processor section, for some examples of what is needed for a feedback processor.

Thanks Geoff. That part looks relatively straightforward. It's the actual midi part that I'll have to dig a bit to see how it works.