Old 01-24-2017, 10:33 AM   #161
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that would be amazing, but I can't even imagine how cockos would do it.
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Old 01-24-2017, 10:38 AM   #162
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that would be amazing, but I can't even imagine how cockos would do it.
Well, considering Izotope RX has implemented that (freeform spectral selection and processing) and I also managed pretty quickly to do a prototype implementation of that, it shouldn't be too difficult for Cockos either...
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Old 01-24-2017, 10:41 AM   #163
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Well, considering Izotope RX has implemented that (freeform spectral selection and processing) and I also managed pretty quickly to do a prototype implementation of that, it shouldn't be too difficult for Cockos either...
just seems like magic to me and wow would it really help me out.
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Old 01-24-2017, 11:01 AM   #164
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just seems like magic to me and wow would it really help me out.
Of course the more intricate and more automatic the selections need to get, the more difficult it will be to implement for the developers and will approach "magic".
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Old 01-24-2017, 12:10 PM   #165
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samplitude has had spectral display/editing for years. it's the thing i miss most about it. for a time i had both reaper and samplitude on my box and would export things just to do spectral editing, then re-import to reaper. when i built a new box i let samplitude go. would be really great to see reaper acquire this kind of functionality. not looking for magic myself. i'll handle that. ;-)
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Old 01-24-2017, 12:18 PM   #166
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that would be amazing, but I can't even imagine how cockos would do it.
Open source code and app are available. The app, SPEAR, despite being just a POC, works very well. I actually use it. See:

http://www.klingbeil.com/spear/downloads/
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Old 01-24-2017, 12:48 PM   #167
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Open source code and app are available. The app, SPEAR, despite being just a POC, works very well. I actually use it. See:

http://www.klingbeil.com/spear/downloads/
Where's the source code and how is it licensed? (I actually emailed the developer back in 2015 about open sourcing it or getting access to the source code but never heard anything back...)
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Old 01-24-2017, 12:50 PM   #168
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there's this too:

http://isse.sourceforge.net/

also open source. i found it's concepts good but execution very clunky.

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Old 01-24-2017, 01:09 PM   #169
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Where's the source code and how is it licensed? (I actually emailed the developer back in 2015 about open sourcing it or getting access to the source code but never heard anything back...)
It used to be here:

http://digital.music.cornell.edu/spear-spectral-editor/

Can't check, as there seems to be a routing problem between me and Cornell atm. The Cornell server is up, so maybe you're luckier than I am...

Don't know about the license.
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Old 01-24-2017, 02:41 PM   #170
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https://twitter.com/JustinFrankel/st...73856125849606

Yeah! Looking like an awesome start!

Before the deluge of FR's on this gets rolling, here's one: iZotope RX can not select a frequency range across a long stretch of time. E.g. if you have an hour long clip and want to remove a low constant hum, you grab the vertical range select tool and try to select it, and it will tell you that the region is too large, and you have to chunk it up to get it done. Very frustrating. It'd be super great if Reaper could do this!

I know it's not even in pre-release yet and i'm being premature, but just wanted to suggest it in case it was an early architectural consideration.
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Old 01-24-2017, 02:47 PM   #171
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want to remove a low constant hum, you grab the vertical range select tool and try to select it, and it will tell you that the region is too large
Hmm, but if it's constant, why would one need a spectral editor for that, why not just use an EQ plugin?
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Old 01-24-2017, 02:57 PM   #172
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https://twitter.com/JustinFrankel/st...73856125849606

Yeah! Looking like an awesome start!
Omg.....my eyes got an erection
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Old 01-24-2017, 03:01 PM   #173
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Hmm, but if it's constant, why would one need a spectral editor for that, why not just use an EQ plugin?
Good point; it is sometimes convenient to have the harmonic overtone selection as well. It's also a little easier/faster to surgically remove in a spectral view. But yeah, good point. :-) (RX also can infill/synthesize from surrounding areas rather than just attenuating, but i'm not sure from memory if that works or even makes sense on the frequency axis.)

Speaking of notch EQ'ing, I've always wondered about phase shift and spectral editing; is it all linear phase because it's Fourier-based?
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Old 01-24-2017, 03:34 PM   #174
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iZotope RX can not select a frequency range across a long stretch of time.
i think spectro has this issue too. don't recall having ever run into it with samplitude.

as for just using an eq or some other tool, i think that, for me anyway, it's a workflow question. once i've moved into a certain work environment, such as spectral for cleanup of some kind of media, i want to try to complete that task from within that environment as much as possible. it can become messy having to toggle between multiple tools when, in theory anyway, i should be able to do it with one.

thanks,
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Old 01-24-2017, 03:37 PM   #175
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https://twitter.com/JustinFrankel/st...73856125849606

Yeah! Looking like an awesome start!
agreed!
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Old 01-24-2017, 03:40 PM   #176
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hum/noise removing, Reaper can do already now. ReaFIR.
Yeah -- lots of ways to skin that cat. I just noted the limitation in RX and it bothered me; was hoping it could be avoided in reaper. And maybe it's not easy to implement for whatever reason.
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Old 01-24-2017, 04:33 PM   #177
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is it me or it looks like the resolution of spectro peaks are little increased on that gif? they are much sharper (yeeeeeey if my eyes do not lie!)
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Old 01-24-2017, 04:40 PM   #178
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Very excited too for the non destructive realtime spectral editing.
I guess it can have some settings to increase window size, window type, scale(linear log, mel) etc. and saved with the presets? This could consume much more CPU, or maybe this higher resolution settings could work only for selected item or selected track?
awesome!
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Old 01-24-2017, 04:59 PM   #179
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WOW!

That Justin GIF is amazing!

I'm hoping that we will at some point be able to free draw though or do angled ones too for getting rid of noises that ascend/descend in pitch

Even without it though, it's super powerful!
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Old 01-24-2017, 09:13 PM   #180
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I never thought Justin had a Twitter account. Makes sense but never thought about it. Now I know where I'll send all my hate in those random and sporadic moments when REAPER crashes within 140 characters
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Old 01-24-2017, 09:30 PM   #181
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I never thought Justin had a Twitter account. Makes sense but never thought about it. Now I know where I'll send all my hate in those random and sporadic moments when REAPER crashes within 140 characters
I smell a script..

" Reaper just crashed - send Justin a mean tweet? "

" OK "

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Old 01-27-2017, 03:28 AM   #182
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At the moment one can only switch to Peaks / Spectral Peaks / Spectrogram globally, right?

I think it would be necessary to be able to choose the mode on a per track basis (probably items as well).
I'm working on a bigger (not huge) project at the moment, and in spectrogram mode the navigation get's pretty sluggish when zoomed in a bit.
Would be cool to only have it for the desired track(s), if possible.

And yes, that GIF in Justin's tweet looks very promising!
(I'm dreaming about variable circular / oval shapes with fades from/to the untreated area...)
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Old 01-27-2017, 04:46 AM   #183
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At the moment one can only switch to Peaks / Spectral Peaks / Spectrogram globally, right?
You can already select a "per track"display of spectral peaks. Right click on a track's control panel and choose "prevent spectral peaks" from "performance options". I know, I looked over that too. And the info is a little dispersed in the manual. But it is still experimental.

Quote:
I'm working on a bigger (not huge) project at the moment, and in spectrogram mode the navigation get's pretty sluggish when zoomed in a bit.
I was quite amazed with performance, on my measerly dual core machine. Maybe you should explore some tuning before you enable this on a large existing project?
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Old 01-27-2017, 07:35 AM   #184
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You can already select a "per track"display of spectral peaks. Right click on a track's control panel and choose "prevent spectral peaks" from "performance options". I know, I looked over that too. And the info is a little dispersed in the manual. But it is still experimental.



I was quite amazed with performance, on my measerly dual core machine. Maybe you should explore some tuning before you enable this on a large existing project?
Thanks for the hint!

But i also found the 'prevent spectral peaks' command after a while. Anyway, that does only allow using either 'normal' peaks or the globally chosen 'spectral peaks / spectrogram'.
Ideally i'd have the opportunity to have spectral peaks on most of my tracks, but spectrogram view on some... you know what i mean? I think i haven't been clear in my post.

Basically, choosing any of the 3 view modes for any track would be cool.

For the performance: I'm using a mac mini (2.3 ghz quad core i7, 16 gb ram). Maybe it's mac related?
I mean it's not really sluggish, but it's definitely slowing down, scrolling isn't fluid any more. I never had any performance issues before (REAPER actually runs much smoother than Pro Tools) and i won't complain - i just thought it might be better if not all the tracks had to carry the extra load of the spectrogram, when i only need it on one track.
Or maybe it's the length of the files? It's an album recording, 10 songs with sets of about 16 tracks in lengths between 3 and 9 minutes...

But yeah, probably i haven't tweaked my system settings to the best (and i wouldn't know how :-).
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Old 01-27-2017, 08:59 AM   #185
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Lou.

Make sure you rebuild all peaks if that project was done before spectral peaks started as it won't have set up the level of detail versions and might be causing it. hopefully that's why..
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Old 01-27-2017, 11:40 AM   #186
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I've been busy over the last few days and haven't had a chance to post here but I have also noticed sluggishness at some zoom levels with the spectrogram view even after rebuilding peaks.
This is only at some of the middle zoom settings. It is fine here when zoomed in or zoomed out.

I'm on Win 10 x64.
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Old 01-27-2017, 12:48 PM   #187
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I've been busy over the last few days and haven't had a chance to post here but I have also noticed sluggishness at some zoom levels with the spectrogram view even after rebuilding peaks.
This is only at some of the middle zoom settings. It is fine here when zoomed in or zoomed out.

I'm on Win 10 x64.
Just curious. is that with or without video tracks?

I only ask as Just in did some work so that video tracks would be low res peak by default but maybe they don't have this function in with spectral peaks yet which might cause the slow down? maybe..
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Old 01-27-2017, 12:54 PM   #188
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Just curious. is that with or without video tracks?

I only ask as Just in did some work so that video tracks would be low res peak by default but maybe they don't have this function in with spectral peaks yet which might cause the slow down? maybe..
I haven't yet tried spectrogram display in a video project.
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Old 01-27-2017, 01:15 PM   #189
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I don't notice any sluggishness at any zoom level.
But I think it could be a nice idea to increase spectrogram resolution when you zoom in. At least for the last selected track. Or to the item that is selected for spectral editing.. Still don't know how it works.. I'm really curious for next pre. I had too much expectations with pre4 hehe. Hopefully we can see soon what is in Cockos mind. They usually have great ideas on how to do the best.
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Old 01-27-2017, 02:41 PM   #190
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Thanks for the hint!

But i also found the 'prevent spectral peaks' command after a while. Anyway, that does only allow using either 'normal' peaks or the globally chosen 'spectral peaks / spectrogram'.
Ideally i'd have the opportunity to have spectral peaks on most of my tracks, but spectrogram view on some... you know what i mean? I think i haven't been clear in my post.
Mmmm...

Have no time to experiment right now. When I checked that feature, it switched between wave view and spectral for me. But I have to admit I've yet only checked the spectrogram view...

Quote:
Basically, choosing any of the 3 view modes for any track would be cool.
Yes. This is very new. Spectral editing is far more important to me than view. But we'll have to be patient as this isn't simple stuff to code, I think.

Quote:
For the performance: I'm using a mac mini (2.3 ghz quad core i7, 16 gb ram). Maybe it's mac related?
I'm on a 2.5 GHz Core2Duo Mac...

Quote:
I mean it's not really sluggish, but it's definitely slowing down, scrolling isn't fluid any more. I never had any performance issues before (REAPER actually runs much smoother than Pro Tools) and i won't complain - i just thought it might be better if not all the tracks had to carry the extra load of the spectrogram, when i only need it on one track.
Or maybe it's the length of the files? It's an album recording, 10 songs with sets of about 16 tracks in lengths between 3 and 9 minutes...

But yeah, probably i haven't tweaked my system settings to the best (and i wouldn't know how :-).
Maybe start a new project to experiment and see when it starts to be sluggish?
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Old 01-27-2017, 04:41 PM   #191
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Mmmm...

Yes. This is very new. Spectral editing is far more important to me than view. But we'll have to be patient as this isn't simple stuff to code, I think.
Of course! I didn't mean to be impatient here... just thought i contribute to this thread with some input between the praises.

I'm really excited about the rising of this big chunk of new features which will take REAPER to the next level. I admit i'm flashed by the visual impact of Spectrogram alone - so the ability to edit this way natively is just over the top. Great, great stuff, really.

I'll explore the performance drop with my system...
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Old 01-27-2017, 05:37 PM   #192
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I'll explore the performance drop with my system...
It's definitely not a Mac only thing. As I mentioned above, I'm on Windows 10 on an i5 and am having scrolling issues. If I zoom right out, things are fine. Then, as I zoom in, scrolling gets more and more sluggish to the point it is almost unresponsive at a certain point. Then, if I continue to zoom in, things improve again until it is good.
This is only with spectrogram display mode (peaks and spectral peaks are fine) and happens on any size project even after a peaks rebuild.

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Old 01-28-2017, 04:58 AM   #193
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Now it's more powerful:
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Old 01-28-2017, 08:39 AM   #194
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It's definitely not a Mac only thing. As I mentioned above, I'm on Windows 10 on an i5 and am having scrolling issues. If I zoom right out, things are fine. Then, as I zoom in, scrolling gets more and more sluggish to the point it is almost unresponsive at a certain point. Then, if I continue to zoom in, things improve again until it is good.
This is only with spectrogram display mode (peaks and spectral peaks are fine) and happens on any size project even after a peaks rebuild.
Make sure the media is all plain .wav files and it might improve it.
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Old 01-28-2017, 08:46 AM   #195
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Indeed!

Also guys, don't forgot the "reaper way"... "right click everything!"

There are some powerful options when right clicking on the top bar of a spectral edit window.

You can even solo that area for it to become permentally like that!

You can even copy via control and dragging!
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Old 01-28-2017, 10:29 AM   #196
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Make sure the media is all plain .wav files and it might improve it.
Yep. Works fine with wav but, as posted HERE, the vast majority of my projects use either flac or wavpack format.
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Old 01-30-2017, 09:32 AM   #197
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It would be nice to have copy/paste so that a portion of the spectrum could be repeated, even shifted.

Also a lasso tool would be good.

Fading from left/right edge only would be handy.
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Old 02-05-2017, 05:43 PM   #198
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If you have some resources on the math behind such a thing, I'll happily take a look.
Not sure if anyone answered this already, but look into the Chirp-Z transform. It might just do what you need. It will let you have a larger window size for lower frequencies, and smaller for higher frequencies. Also lets you get away from power of 2 window lengths.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirp_Z-transform

Cheers

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Old 02-05-2017, 05:54 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by DrFrankencopter View Post
Not sure if anyone answered this already, but look into the Chirp-Z transform. It might just do what you need. It will let you have a larger window size for lower frequencies, and smaller for higher frequencies. Also lets you get away from power of 2 window lengths.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirp_Z-transform

Cheers

Kris
that sounds amazing!
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Old 02-06-2017, 09:21 AM   #200
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If you have some resources on the math behind such a thing, I'll happily take a look.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFrankencopter View Post
Not sure if anyone answered this already, but look into the Chirp-Z transform. It might just do what you need. It will let you have a larger window size for lower frequencies, and smaller for higher frequencies. Also lets you get away from power of 2 window lengths.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chirp_Z-transform

Cheers

Kris
Quote:
Originally Posted by musicbynumbers View Post
that sounds amazing!
+1!!!
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Thanks devs for adding the abillity to use single click to change a single velocity And single right click to remove a single note without dragging.
much appreciated.
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